Re: Horizontal Brake Wheels highlighting Tichy parts


 

On Sat, Jul 14, 2018 at 08:17 AM, Gene Green wrote:

Bill,
First, your photos are always excellent.  Kudos!
To Bill, Gene and all. Yes Bill, can you give me some tips on photos off list, I would like to post more photos with the new IO format.
The horizontal wheel hand brakes are mostly non-existent in HO scale so far as I know.  Good hand brakes for flat and tank cars are sorely needed.  There is more to those hand brakes than merely stabbing a shaft into the deck (flats) or running board (tanks) and putting a 16 inch hand wheel on top.
There are several reasonable to good horizontal wheels that have been done in HO scale plastic. Some are: the RC/SPH&TSOC. SP F-70-7 flatcar has a Superior 566 gear with the associated scalloped edge wheel. The RC, now Intermountain? 42' flatcar has a very well done 16" 6 spoke wheel ( the lower one on Cal Scale set in the first photo posted by Peter Ness ). Three wheels are in the parts set for the Tangent 6K three dome tank car, quite good. These are a few and I will have to go into my notes for the wheel #s. Eric gives a partial list of other horizontal wheels, I have most of these kits and will have to give their real model #s to the list down the road.
 
—Are the manufacturers of the Tichy representations known?  In your photo with "14" visible the spoke pattern of the one on the left resembles early Equipco hand wheels when viewed from above as in your photo.  The Equipco hand wheels were dished, however, and the Tichy hand wheel is not.  Universal had a 5-spoke hand wheel which the right hand wheel 'sort of' represents but . . .   The Universal hand wheel was also dished but not very much.

This would be a good question to ask Don, I believe he is on the list. To the best of my knowledge, Equipco did have a flat, round rim horizontal wheel. I have a scalloped rim Equipco, it is dished.

—Are the two Tichy rim variations prototypical or a tooling error?  Don't know.  Both are plausible but the rim of malleable (cast) hand wheels was typically a 'U' cross-section.

Bill, do you mean spoke differences? Gene is correct that by and large U sections were used ( U faces up with drainage holes ), H sections also, see my photo of a NYC wheel on this tread, there are others in H section, both RR specific and manufacturer based. If spokes, I think tooling errors. Second photo closer to what I have in the backyard.
 
—Are there other accurate Horizontal brake wheels available in 1/87th scale? I know Precision Scale offers some variations—are they Prototypical and if so what do they represent?   I am not at all familiar with what the brass importers might have or have had available so I won't answer.

See above. Most wheels done in brass on import models are fantasy. Some kind of round thing with some kind of spokes, rarely close to a prototype. PSC wheels, usable, not fine.
 
—Are there significant Horizontal Brake wheels that need to be done?  Oh, my goodness, YES!!!!  Your question only asks about hand wheels but I always think in terms of the entire hand brake of which the hand wheel is only one part.  I have made drawings of twenty 15-inch and 16-inch (yes, there were both) hand wheels I either have in my collection or to which I had safe, legal access long enough to take the necessary measurements, make the CAD drawing on site and then check drawing against actual hand wheel.  I've only scratched the surface.  I have a number of hand wheels upon which I find no manufacturer identification, at least none that I recognize as such.  Railroads may have also made their own hand wheels, especially malleable hand wheels.  At least Equipco had a forged hand wheel (stamped) in later years.  I tend to ignore anything built after 1950 so there may well be others. 

I also have wheels with no manufacturer marks of any kind and I have RR specific malleable horizontal wheels. There are RR specific vertical wheels too. NP had several unique geared vertical wheel combinations.
 
Addressing hand wheels only we need:
1 Ellcon-National
4 Equipco
2 Superior (there was a 15- & 16-inch.  One could serve for both, I suppose)
1 Universal
2 URECO (one of which is identical to an Equipco except for the markings)
 
So far as I have determined, Superior and URECO never offered a forged hand wheel.
 
Horizontal wheel hand brake mechanisms needed include:
3 ACF for tank cars (all are quite similar to one another so maybe we could change that to one)
2 Ellcon-National (malleable & forged versions of the same brake)
1 Equipco
3 Superior (one of which is THE GATX tank car hand brake)
2 Universal
2 URECO
 
I think many modelers tend to assume that all horizontal wheel hand brakes were Plate A, that is, chain wound around shaft.  Not the case at all from the late 1930s to the present.  Horizontal wheel hand brakes, just like vertical wheel hand brakes, were GEARED hand brakes.

Gene, you have been preaching of the need for a long time, think some may be starting to notice what is really on cars?
Gene has given a pretty good list of needed types though a couple have been available on specific models. Getting them as parts is the problem.  And Yes, the whole thing, wheel and GEAR.
There are a few earlier geared units, mostly on tank cars, that were used before the 1930s. The Barriger Library photos show some of these early gears if you take the time to notice as you go through photos.
One entry point link:  https://www.flickr.com/photos/barrigerlibrary/35034446102/in/photostream/
Going through will get you started on some types of geared horizontal wheel hand brakes.
Some of the other library collections are useful also.

Dan Smith, please chime in here.  If you, or anyone else, can add to or correct what I have written, please do so.

Dan who?

Regards,
Dan Smith

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