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Re: Floquil Special Oxide Red
Thanks Pierre. I will try that paint. I am not in Lisle, Illinois because I had to trade down to a part time job with no decent time off plus low pay as a result of the recession. All that experience and college means nothing now...
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
Victor
--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Pierre" <pierre.oliver@...> wrote:
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Wright Track Seaboard Air Line Ventilator Box Car Kit
gary laakso
This kit arrived today and the car body is an exceptionally fine one piece casting. It includes a disc with the 5 pages of instruction of which more than 2 pages are prototype photos. I doubt that I will spend 15% of the normal kit time devoted to cleaning the castings. This one is going to move up the assembly list!
gary laakso south of Mike Brock vasa0vasa@earthlink.net
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WP 21379
StephenK
I have a photo in my files (downloaded from the net, but I don't remember where!) of a 40 PS-1 boxcar, Western Pacific 21379. It has the orange feather on the right side, along with the "Rides like a Feather" slogan. The road number and Capacity data are restenciled in white, and it is heavily weathered. Here is what I don't understand: There is a Frisco Lines herald on the left, above the WP and car number. I have a Kadee car that I would like to weather, and I am thinking about this scheme, but I wold like to know where the prototype came from.
Any ideas? Steve Kay
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B&O M-53 was Re: B&O, GM&N
Randy Hammill
Hi, Fenton -
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It depends on the era of the photo. The New Haven steel Box Cars were delivered with black doors. When they were shopped the doors were repainted with the body color. I don't recall if all of the steel box cars delivered in the '40s received the black doors, but the majority did. Note that repainting began by the late '40s, so by 1947-48 you'd be seeing a mix of black doors and oxide red. I'm not sure I've seen any pictures in the '50s with black doors, but that doesn't mean there weren't any by then. I'd have to dig a bit more for specifics. Randy Hammill http://newbritainstation.com Modeling the New Haven Railroad 1946-1954
--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, O Fenton Wells <srrfan1401@...> wrote:
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Re: Kadee Bracket Grab Iron Hole Locations
Paul Lyons
Hi Schuyler,
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
Thought you would be Lyle! CBC says 8" max from the end to the bracket; 24" min. to 32" max fromt the centerline of the coupler to the bottom grab. That seems strange and I am doing some more research to see if that changed somewhere along the lin. Paul
-----Original Message-----
From: Schuyler Larrabee <schuyler.larrabee@verizon.net> To: STMFC <STMFC@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sat, Oct 22, 2011 11:20 am Subject: RE: [STMFC] Kadee Bracket Grab Iron Hole Locations I'm glad you posted Paul, as I have yet to receive Dennis' post on this (Thank you Yahoo . . .) I have what might be an ignorant question: Is the vertical dimension between the two grabs at the left end of the car side uniform from car to car? And is the dimension from the bottom of the car side a uniform dimension from one car to another? SGL From: Paul Lyons Sent: Saturday, October 22, 2011 1:54 PM Dennis, Thanks for all the effort! I hope you have the dimension between the mounting pin holes on the side grabs and just forgot to put it on the drawing? Or perhaps, it is the same dimension as the end grab? Paul Lyons -----Original Message----- From: soolinehistory <destorzek@mchsi.com <mailto:destorzek%40mchsi.com>; > To: STMFC <STMFC@yahoogroups.com <mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com>; > Sent: Sat, Oct 22, 2011 8:49 am Subject: [STMFC] Kadee Bracket Grab Iron Hole Locations As Promised, I have surveyed the mounting holes on a Kadee PS-1 body and have uploaded dimensioned sketches to the FILES section at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/STMFC/files/Kadee_PS-1_Grab_Iron_Holes/ All dimensions are decimal inches, to four places where necessary. The ordinate dimensions are relative to the center of the grab iron; it is up to whoever develops a drilling jig to properly relate them to other features on the car body. The first sheet also shows the typical condition at the mounting pin / hole interface. Whoever devised the old joke about putting a square peg in a round hole obviously didn't design plastic parts, because that is exactly what Kadee has done. The mounting pegs are .017" squares with a long tapered lead; they are designed to be pressed into .020" diameter holes. A look at the drawing shows that this combination yields appx. .002" of interference at the corners of the peg, while the unfilled portions of the hole provide a place for the displaced material.This is good design practice, but it does point out that the grabs must be properly oriented before they are pressed in place; ones the corners dig into the circumference of the hole, it will be either difficult or impossible to twist them straight. If this is a problem, the holes can be increased to .024" diameter, and CA used to fill the gaps and lock the mounting peg in place. Those who were hoping to use the really fine Kadee boxcar ladders on other projects are going to be disappointed, unless they have a drill that drills rectangular holes. Kadee has chosen, wisely, as far as I'm concerned, to make the mounting pegs rectangular, .024" x .044". This allows a much stronger mounting than round pegs could provide, and ensures that the ladders remain straight, but the difficulty of generating the rectangular slots in a model that wasn't molded with them in place is going to preclude using these ladders on other projects. Because of this, I haven't bothered to post the slot dimensions. These are indeed wonderful parts. The grab irons and ladder rungs measure just .010" in diameter, smaller than the .012" wire that is commonly used in HO scale for these parts. The minimum diameter for these parts on the prototype is 5/8", which scales to .007", but some prototype parts are made from larger stock. The Kadee rung scale to just a bit larger than 7/8", not far from the mark. Dennis Storzek [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ======= Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.18570) http://www.pctools.com <http://www.pctools.com/?cclick=EmailFooterClean_51> ======= ======= Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.18570) http://www.pctools.com/ ======= [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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Re: Kadee Bracket Grab Iron Hole Locations
Dennis
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
One could try drilling a small round hole, and then using a 4-sided steel reamer of a slightly larger dimension and just forcing it into the round hole. Because the material is styrene it should deform and provide a nearly square hole for the ladder mounting pins. (I assume people are doing this with styrene carbodies. Don't know if resin would deform the same way.) Tim O'Connor
Those who were hoping to use the really fine Kadee boxcar ladders on other projects are going to be disappointed, unless they have a drill that drills rectangular holes. Kadee has chosen, wisely, as far as I'm concerned, to make the mounting pegs rectangular, .024" x .044". This allows a much stronger mounting than round pegs could provide, and ensures that the ladders remain straight, but the difficulty of generating the rectangular slots in a model that wasn't molded with them in place is going to preclude using these ladders on other projects. Because of this, I haven't bothered to post the slot dimensions.
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Re: Kadee Bracket Grab Iron Hole Locations
Schuyler Larrabee
I'm glad you posted Paul, as I have yet to receive Dennis' post on this
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
(Thank you Yahoo . . .) I have what might be an ignorant question: Is the vertical dimension between the two grabs at the left end of the car side uniform from car to car? And is the dimension from the bottom of the car side a uniform dimension from one car to another? SGL From: Paul Lyons Sent: Saturday, October 22, 2011 1:54 PM Dennis, Thanks for all the effort! I hope you have the dimension between the mounting pin holes on the side grabs and just forgot to put it on the drawing? Or perhaps, it is the same dimension as the end grab? Paul Lyons
-----Original Message-----
From: soolinehistory <destorzek@mchsi.com <mailto:destorzek%40mchsi.com> > To: STMFC <STMFC@yahoogroups.com <mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Sat, Oct 22, 2011 8:49 am Subject: [STMFC] Kadee Bracket Grab Iron Hole Locations As Promised, I have surveyed the mounting holes on a Kadee PS-1 body and have uploaded dimensioned sketches to the FILES section at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/STMFC/files/Kadee_PS-1_Grab_Iron_Holes/ All dimensions are decimal inches, to four places where necessary. The ordinate dimensions are relative to the center of the grab iron; it is up to whoever develops a drilling jig to properly relate them to other features on the car body. The first sheet also shows the typical condition at the mounting pin / hole interface. Whoever devised the old joke about putting a square peg in a round hole obviously didn't design plastic parts, because that is exactly what Kadee has done. The mounting pegs are .017" squares with a long tapered lead; they are designed to be pressed into .020" diameter holes. A look at the drawing shows that this combination yields appx. .002" of interference at the corners of the peg, while the unfilled portions of the hole provide a place for the displaced material.This is good design practice, but it does point out that the grabs must be properly oriented before they are pressed in place; ones the corners dig into the circumference of the hole, it will be either difficult or impossible to twist them straight. If this is a problem, the holes can be increased to .024" diameter, and CA used to fill the gaps and lock the mounting peg in place. Those who were hoping to use the really fine Kadee boxcar ladders on other projects are going to be disappointed, unless they have a drill that drills rectangular holes. Kadee has chosen, wisely, as far as I'm concerned, to make the mounting pegs rectangular, .024" x .044". This allows a much stronger mounting than round pegs could provide, and ensures that the ladders remain straight, but the difficulty of generating the rectangular slots in a model that wasn't molded with them in place is going to preclude using these ladders on other projects. Because of this, I haven't bothered to post the slot dimensions. These are indeed wonderful parts. The grab irons and ladder rungs measure just .010" in diameter, smaller than the .012" wire that is commonly used in HO scale for these parts. The minimum diameter for these parts on the prototype is 5/8", which scales to .007", but some prototype parts are made from larger stock. The Kadee rung scale to just a bit larger than 7/8", not far from the mark. Dennis Storzek ======= Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.18570) http://www.pctools.com <http://www.pctools.com/?cclick=EmailFooterClean_51> ======= ======= Email scanned by PC Tools - No viruses or spyware found. (Email Guard: 7.0.0.21, Virus/Spyware Database: 6.18570) http://www.pctools.com/ =======
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Re: Odd Box Car?
Steve
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
An SP car numbered 61843 in 1937 would have been a 50 foot single sheathed automobile box car. Is that what you saw? Tim O'Connor
While looking though the November, 1937 issue of Railroad Magazine, I spotted this tidbit on page 130:
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Re: B&O M-53 was Re: B&O, GM&N
Great photo John. This brings up an interesting question for a novice
freight car fan. The picture shows a New Haven boxcar. I was told by someone that the doors on these cars were painted black. This one is not. Do I have incorrect info? Any knowledgeable NH fans out there that can set me straight? Fenton Wells On Sat, Oct 22, 2011 at 2:11 PM, boyds1949 <e27ca@verizon.net> wrote: ** -- Fenton Wells 3047 Creek Run Sanford NC 27332 919-499-5545 srrfan1401@gmail.com [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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B&O M-53 was Re: B&O, GM&N
John King
Here is a link to a photo in (I think)the University of Indiana collection showing an M-26 in the first 13 great states lettering. In this case, the color is definitely a version of the oxide red.
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
http://webapp1.dlib.indiana.edu/collections/cushman/full/P06941.jpg I have a slide, taken in 1946 at Brunswick, that shows a couple of M-15s in the same lettering but in what appears to be brown paint. I guess it depended on how much old paint was still in the barrel. John King
--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, SUVCWORR@... wrote:
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Re: Kadee Bracket Grab Iron Hole Locations
Paul Lyons
Dennis,
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
Thanks for all the effort! I hope you have the dimension between the mounting pin holes on the side grabs and just forgot to put it on the drawing? Or perhaps, it is the same dimension as the end grab? Paul Lyons
-----Original Message-----
From: soolinehistory <destorzek@mchsi.com> To: STMFC <STMFC@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sat, Oct 22, 2011 8:49 am Subject: [STMFC] Kadee Bracket Grab Iron Hole Locations As Promised, I have surveyed the mounting holes on a Kadee PS-1 body and have uploaded dimensioned sketches to the FILES section at: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/STMFC/files/Kadee_PS-1_Grab_Iron_Holes/ All dimensions are decimal inches, to four places where necessary. The ordinate dimensions are relative to the center of the grab iron; it is up to whoever develops a drilling jig to properly relate them to other features on the car body. The first sheet also shows the typical condition at the mounting pin / hole interface. Whoever devised the old joke about putting a square peg in a round hole obviously didn't design plastic parts, because that is exactly what Kadee has done. The mounting pegs are .017" squares with a long tapered lead; they are designed to be pressed into .020" diameter holes. A look at the drawing shows that this combination yields appx. .002" of interference at the corners of the peg, while the unfilled portions of the hole provide a place for the displaced material.This is good design practice, but it does point out that the grabs must be properly oriented before they are pressed in place; ones the corners dig into the circumference of the hole, it will be either difficult or impossible to twist them straight. If this is a problem, the holes can be increased to .024" diameter, and CA used to fill the gaps and lock the mounting peg in place. Those who were hoping to use the really fine Kadee boxcar ladders on other projects are going to be disappointed, unless they have a drill that drills rectangular holes. Kadee has chosen, wisely, as far as I'm concerned, to make the mounting pegs rectangular, .024" x .044". This allows a much stronger mounting than round pegs could provide, and ensures that the ladders remain straight, but the difficulty of generating the rectangular slots in a model that wasn't molded with them in place is going to preclude using these ladders on other projects. Because of this, I haven't bothered to post the slot dimensions. These are indeed wonderful parts. The grab irons and ladder rungs measure just .010" in diameter, smaller than the .012" wire that is commonly used in HO scale for these parts. The minimum diameter for these parts on the prototype is 5/8", which scales to .007", but some prototype parts are made from larger stock. The Kadee rung scale to just a bit larger than 7/8", not far from the mark. Dennis Storzek [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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Re: Revisions to NYC Toledo Division Freight Consists Files
SUVCWORR@...
Finding PRR wheel reports and consist lists is nearly impossible. The PRR considered these to be proprietary and that falling into the "wrong" hands could give competitive advantage to other roads. The SOP was to destroy the lists and reports once no longer needed for car movement.
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
Rich Orr
-----Original Message-----
From: rdepennsyfan <pattirobpatti1@verizon.net> To: STMFC <STMFC@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sat, Oct 22, 2011 10:24 am Subject: [STMFC] Revisions to NYC Toledo Division Freight Consists Files Group, I have uploaded a revised List of Cars for the NYC Toledo Division reight train consists, which adds more suggestions for HO scale models to epresent these cars. I have also corrected several several AAR car esignations (i.e., changed "XM" to "XML"; "TPI" to "TPA"; etc.) based on the anuary 1957 ORER. Finally, I removed the text files for the "model" versions of each train. These iles duplicated the information found in this Excel spreadsheet and were just aking up space at this point. I hope you still find this information useful and look forward to it generating ore discussion of car distribution as a source of freight train modeling nformation. Rob Erickson P.S. I'm still hoping somebody will come up with wheel reports/consist lists or PRR Buffalo Division freight trains from the 1949-1952 era. ;-) ------------------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Links Individual Email | Traditional http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
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SOUTHERN Boxcars
Allen Cain <allencain@...>
Hi,
I am getting ready to start on some SpeedWitch kits using the Branchline 1500 Undec 40 ft boxcar with 8 ft doors using Ted's conversion parts. I also have some Branchline 1514 kits of the Southern cars that I intend to build using Ted's conversion parts to correct the ends, doors and roof walk. Hopefully someone can steer me toward a good match for the paint used on the Branchline 1514 kits so that when I install the SpeedWitch ends and doors I can get a reasonably good match to the original Branchilne paint. I would like to retain the Branchline lettering and logo on these cars and avoid stripping them (may have to abandon this if the SpeedWitch decals are dramatically different from the Branchline lettering on the 1514 kits). Any and all help would be appreciated. Allen Cain
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Re: B&O M-53 was Re: B&O, GM&N
SUVCWORR@...
The "red" paint began with the 13 great states lettering scheme in 1946. These cars are in the second run scheduled for release in the Spring of 2012.
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
Rich Orr
-----Original Message-----
From: Don <riverman_vt@yahoo.com> To: STMFC <STMFC@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Sat, Oct 22, 2011 12:07 pm Subject: B&O M-53 was Re: [STMFC] B&O, GM&N --- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, SUVCWORR@... wrote: Regarding the B&O M-53 -- the brown color is correct for the paint schemes for hich it is used Pre WWII and during the war. The red color was adopted post WII and is being used by FVM with the appropriate P/L schemes. The brown cars did run into the 50's until being repainted. Equally important for those of us modeling the mid to late 1940's pproximately when was the brighter red first used? I, too, have noted the ifference and it can add variety to a freight train but I do not wish to use it nd than find it did not come into general use until after 1948. Thanks for any assistance, Don Valentine ------------------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Links Individual Email | Traditional http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
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Kadee Bracket Grab Iron Hole Locations
Dennis Storzek
As Promised, I have surveyed the mounting holes on a Kadee PS-1 body and have uploaded dimensioned sketches to the FILES section at:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/STMFC/files/Kadee_PS-1_Grab_Iron_Holes/ All dimensions are decimal inches, to four places where necessary. The ordinate dimensions are relative to the center of the grab iron; it is up to whoever develops a drilling jig to properly relate them to other features on the car body. The first sheet also shows the typical condition at the mounting pin / hole interface. Whoever devised the old joke about putting a square peg in a round hole obviously didn't design plastic parts, because that is exactly what Kadee has done. The mounting pegs are .017" squares with a long tapered lead; they are designed to be pressed into .020" diameter holes. A look at the drawing shows that this combination yields appx. .002" of interference at the corners of the peg, while the unfilled portions of the hole provide a place for the displaced material.This is good design practice, but it does point out that the grabs must be properly oriented before they are pressed in place; ones the corners dig into the circumference of the hole, it will be either difficult or impossible to twist them straight. If this is a problem, the holes can be increased to .024" diameter, and CA used to fill the gaps and lock the mounting peg in place. Those who were hoping to use the really fine Kadee boxcar ladders on other projects are going to be disappointed, unless they have a drill that drills rectangular holes. Kadee has chosen, wisely, as far as I'm concerned, to make the mounting pegs rectangular, .024" x .044". This allows a much stronger mounting than round pegs could provide, and ensures that the ladders remain straight, but the difficulty of generating the rectangular slots in a model that wasn't molded with them in place is going to preclude using these ladders on other projects. Because of this, I haven't bothered to post the slot dimensions. These are indeed wonderful parts. The grab irons and ladder rungs measure just .010" in diameter, smaller than the .012" wire that is commonly used in HO scale for these parts. The minimum diameter for these parts on the prototype is 5/8", which scales to .007", but some prototype parts are made from larger stock. The Kadee rung scale to just a bit larger than 7/8", not far from the mark. Dennis Storzek
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Odd Box Car?
Steve Vallee
Dear Group...
While looking though the November, 1937 issue of Railroad Magazine, I spotted this tidbit on page 130: Boxcar No. 61843 bearing both SP oval and Wabash initial turned up here. stenciled on the side was "Leased from Wabash from the Sou. Pac. Ry." it is used exclusively for carrying auto parts out of Detroit.---RAY DUNIGAN,996 Link Ave., Springfield, O. Anyone out there have a photo of this car or want to try to model this car? Steve Vallee
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Revisions to NYC Toledo Division Freight Consists Files
rdepennsyfan
Group, I have uploaded a revised List of Cars for the NYC Toledo Division freight train consists, which adds more suggestions for HO scale models to represent these cars. I have also corrected several several AAR car designations (i.e., changed "XM" to "XML"; "TPI" to "TPA"; etc.) based on the January 1957 ORER.
Finally, I removed the text files for the "model" versions of each train. These files duplicated the information found in this Excel spreadsheet and were just taking up space at this point. I hope you still find this information useful and look forward to it generating more discussion of car distribution as a source of freight train modeling information. Rob Erickson P.S. I'm still hoping somebody will come up with wheel reports/consist lists for PRR Buffalo Division freight trains from the 1949-1952 era. ;-)
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New file uploaded to STMFC
STMFC@...
Hello,
This email message is a notification to let you know that a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the STMFC group. File : /NYC Toledo Div. Consists/List of Cars-rev4.xls Uploaded by : rdepennsyfan <pattirobpatti1@verizon.net> Description : Listing of cars found in the posted NYC Toledo Div. consists You can access this file at the URL: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/STMFC/files/NYC%20Toledo%20Div.%20Consists/List%20of%20Cars-rev4.xls To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit: http://help.yahoo.com/l/us/yahoo/groups/original/members/web/index.html Regards, rdepennsyfan <pattirobpatti1@verizon.net>
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Re: Floquil Special Oxide Red
Pierre <pierre.oliver@...>
Victor,
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
Why aren't you in Lisle? Scalecoat Oxide Red or Floquil Oxide Red are both good choices that I use. Pierre Oliver
--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "wabash2813" <reporterllc@...> wrote:
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Re: Floquil Special Oxide Red
Rossiter, Mark W <Mark.Rossiter@...>
If nothing else, the Special Oxide Red is a pretty good match for the
factory paint on the Red Caboose PRR X-29's. I used it to paint the A-line stirrups, etc. that I added. - - Mark
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