Date   

B&O M-53 was Re: B&O, GM&N

Jim Mischke
 

Vince,


Your brown Fox Valley M-53 in early 13 Great States lettering (1945-46) is accurate, although not crisply documented.

B&O changed to the Linking 13 Great States logo and commercial bright red oxide paint in roughly the same time frame in 1945. Very roughly. Photos suggest that the new stencil drawings were distributed and implemented well before the supply of home brew freight car brown paint was exhausted at every car shop. So one definitely has a choice of color with the earliest 13 Great States scheme. Fox Valley Models was aware of this choice and chose brown.

Indeed, there are some suspiciously dark boxcars found running about in 1950's lettering schemes. Mixing the old freight car brown paint was easy to do, maybe this was done in a pinch. Car shop formen were yelled at worse for missing the daily quota than for violating the current painting and lettering orthodoxy.

The Barkan B&O boxcar lettering scorecard (link below) makes sense out of our once collective choas, yet it does not account for transitions and variations, many found since it was published.


http://borhs.org/Logos/CBarkan/BOBoxcarStenciling1920-60s.pdf





Jim Mischke

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, steel77086@... wrote:

Rich,

I'm a bit confused. I've just received a couple of the Fox cars with the 13
Great States herald in brown paint. Do you mean to say that the 13 Great
States herald was ONLY
applied to the "red" cars and NOT the brown?? I thought the Fox Valley
cars were
all correct.

Vince Altiere


In a message dated 10/22/2011 12:53:50 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
SUVCWORR@... writes:


The "red" paint began with the 13 great states lettering scheme in 1946.
These cars are in the second run scheduled for release in the Spring of
2012.

Rich Orr



-----Original Message-----
From: Don <riverman_vt@...>
To: STMFC <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sat, Oct 22, 2011 12:07 pm
Subject: B&O M-53 was Re: [STMFC] B&O, GM&N



--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, SUVCWORR@ wrote:
Regarding the B&O M-53 -- the brown color is correct for the paint schemes
for
hich it is used Pre WWII and during the war. The red color was adopted
post
WII and is being used by FVM with the appropriate P/L schemes.

The brown cars did run into the 50's until being repainted.

Equally important for those of us modeling the mid to late 1940's
pproximately when was the brighter red first used? I, too, have noted the
ifference and it can add variety to a freight train but I do not wish to
use it
nd than find it did not come into general use until after 1948.
Thanks for any assistance, Don Valentine

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Re: ATSF flat car decals

charles slater
 

The Ft-G, I, J, L, M not TOFC version, Ft-N are all available from Sunshine Models. The Ft-L and N are not an AAR type car but a 50 foot car that was cut in half and lengthened to 53-6 and 10 feet wide in the 1946. The few Ft-L and N class cars were the first on the Santa Fe to go into TOFC service in 1954.
Charlie Slater




To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
From: timboconnor@comcast.net
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 2011 02:47:27 -0400
Subject: [STMFC] Re: ATSF flat car decals







Wow, Ben! And think, I've never even heard of the East Coast SFH&MS --
how did you learn about them? :-)

The Ft-5 & Wt-3 from the below list are the only GSC flats in the bunch.

The Ft-G was an early 40' steel flat.

The Ft-I and Ft-J are (were?) Sunshine kits, with inboard fishbellies
(or however you'd describe them)

Do you know if the Ft-M is the TOFC version? -- many of these cars were
converted in 1957. They're interesting because they were 44'6" cars which
is shorter than most other TOFC conversions, and carried only 1 trailer.
Two Ft-M's were rebuilt in 1964 to carry B-52 tail fins, when they were
already 40 years old!

I'm not sure what an Ft-L is -- perhaps a 50 ton AAR flat? Some of them
were converted to TOFC service (e.g. 92759).

The Ft-V/Wt-V is the 70 ton AAR flat (Intermountain/Sunshine).

Wt-x of course are maintenance of way cars.

Tim O'Connor

The East Coast Santa Fe Historical and Modeling Society introduced an
extensive line of decals for ATSF flat cars at their East Coast meet in May:

Ft-G 90512, 90532, 90548, 92040, 93257, 93750, 94610.
Ft-I 96901, 96915, 96935, 97000
Ft-J 93151, 93169, 93225, 93250
Ft-M 97001, 97006, 97025, 97028, 97063, 97069, 97356
Ft-O 90501, 90536, 90545, 90615
Ft-L 90001, 91315, 91348, 91465, 93865, 93876, 93899
Ft-V 91500, 91511, 91558, 91563, 91576, 91589, 91627
Ft-5 93862, 93895, 93901, 93922
Wt-G 19005, 19065, 189658, 190095, 190985, 191305, 191440, 191497,191552, ...
Wt-M 93161, 190305, 199392, 199393, 199394, 199395, 199396, 199583, 199588, ...
Wt-L 190701, 191807, 191809, 191810, 201026, 203000
Wt-V 191500, 191506, 191604
Wt-3 191064, 207093

Ben Hom






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Thanks, per Brake Applicances - Location and, ? RPM show

reubeft
 

Thanks, for the response and setting this non-rr guy straight. Also having not attend the RPM show the last two years. Were the attendees happy with the new arrangements or the old style (Sunshine RPM). Thinking about next year. Also is Lisle better than Naperville?
Reuben @ Poplarville, MS


Re: Weathering clinic handout

Tim O'Connor
 

Yep, I use Dupont V-3608s. I don't know the difference between the two
(3602 and 3608). Both are low-VOC thinners.

Tim O'Connor

Much talk about thinners. I have been using DuPont V-3602S acrylic
lacquer thinner with all solvent based paints (haven't tried Trucolor
paints yet) for years. Have sucessfully mixed Scalecoat and Floquil.
It is available in auto paint stores.

Lee Thwaits


Re: Dan Holbrook's Lisle presentation "Car Service Rules: 1940-1960"

Tim O'Connor
 

Tony, I think Andy was being ironical... and I can say that here,
because iron is used in freight car construction.

Tim O'

Andy Carlson wrote:
Enough of this rules stuff. when will the Sheriff restore order? We
need to return to FREIGHT CARS!
Um, Andy, don't know how to break this to you, but those rules are
about the handling of FREIGHT CARS. Perhaps we will have to await a
ruling from the powers that run the list, but it seems on-topic to me.

Tony Thompson


Re: Dan Holbrook's Lisle presentation "Car Service Rules: 1940-1960"

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Andy Carlson wrote:
Enough of this rules stuff. when will the Sheriff restore order? We need to return to FREIGHT CARS!
Um, Andy, don't know how to break this to you, but those rules are about the handling of FREIGHT CARS. Perhaps we will have to await a ruling from the powers that run the list, but it seems on-topic to me.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Weathering clinic handout

Richard Hendrickson
 

On Oct 25, 2011, at 8:30 PM, Lee Thwaits wrote:

Much talk about thinners. I have been using DuPont V-3602S acrylic
lacquer thinner with all solvent based paints (haven't tried Trucolor
paints yet) for years. Have sucessfully mixed Scalecoat and Floquil.
It is available in auto paint stores.
Lee, I use DuPont 3812S enamel reducer with Testors Modelmaster and
other enamels, but with Dullcote I have had excellent results using
ordinary paint store lacquer thinner.

Richard Hendrickson


Re: Weathering clinic handout

Lee Thwaits <leethwaits@...>
 

Much talk about thinners. I have been using DuPont V-3602S acrylic lacquer thinner with all solvent based paints (haven't tried Trucolor paints yet) for years. Have sucessfully mixed Scalecoat and Floquil. It is available in auto paint stores.

Lee Thwaits


Re: Dan Holbrook's Lisle presentation "Car Service Rules: 1940-1960"

Andy Carlson
 

Enough of this rules stuff. when will the Sheriff restore order? We need to
return to FREIGHT CARS!

-Andy Carlson
Grinning from ear-to-ear.
Ojai CA





________________________________
From: lnbill <fgexbill@tampabay.rr.com>
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tue, October 25, 2011 6:02:18 PM
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Dan Holbrook's Lisle presentation "Car Service Rules:
1940-1960"


I like the challenge involved. It adds realism into what otherwise is either
fantasy or an intellectual exercise. Well done Dan!

Bill Welch

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "lstt100@..." <lstt100@...> wrote:

Bill, Tony and list members,

Yes, the quiz's are difficult. However, I wanted Lisle attendees to get a
"taste" of what Jerry Stewart and I faced every day when we had to make
decisions on "where" to apply freight cars on orders.

Dan Holbrook



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Re: Lisle RPM

seaboard_1966
 

Guys

Let me say that I was deeply disappointed that WrightTRAK was not able to make the Lisle show. Let me explain exactly what has transpired.

First off, Gary is buried up to his, well you all know, in work. We have taken the casting of our product in-house and Gary is doing all that at his place down in Georgia. As he works his way into this perhaps things will smooth out. But, for right now, he is up to his butt in alligators

Secondly, last winter, Feb. 1st to be exact, I was personally involved in a head on collision that resulted in me being seriously injured and then off of work for 5 1/2 months. I had to sell my vacation time back to NS during that period of time. This left with me just a few personal days that I simply could not use right now. Due to the accident I need to work every day that I can to work enough days to qualify for next years vacation.

Rest assured that we WILL be at next years meet with new product.

We are currently working on the SAL Ventilated box car with wooden ends as well as getting the MOPAC version of the International Car Company caboose done and available. NO release dates have been set for either of these projects.

Again, sorry we were NOT there.

Denis Blake
WrightTRAK Railroad Models.
--------------------------------------------------
From: "mopac1" <mopac1@classicnet.net>
Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2011 3:41 PM
To: <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [STMFC] Lisle RPM

While on the subject of the Lisle RPM Conference this year, what did Joe
have to say about it over breakfast on Sunday?

Due to the layout of the facility, it has hard to get a feel for how many
attended. Did Joe give any numbers on attendance?

The vendors seemed to be fewer in number this year, with a few staples
missing, WrightTRAK, Bill Raia, Modelers Choice among them.

Gene Semon



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Re: Dan Holbrook's Lisle presentation "Car Service Rules: 1940-1960"

Bill Welch
 

I like the challenge involved. It adds realism into what otherwise is either fantasy or an intellectual exercise. Well done Dan!

Bill Welch

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "lstt100@..." <lstt100@...> wrote:

Bill, Tony and list members,

Yes, the quiz's are difficult. However, I wanted Lisle attendees to get a "taste" of what Jerry Stewart and I faced every day when we had to make decisions on "where" to apply freight cars on orders.

Dan Holbrook


Re: Dan Holbrook's Lisle presentation "Car Service Rules: 1940-1960"

lstt100
 

Bill, Tony and list members,

Yes, the quiz's are difficult. However, I wanted Lisle attendees to get a "taste" of what Jerry Stewart and I faced every day when we had to make decisions on "where" to apply freight cars on orders.

Dan Holbrook


Modeler's Choice

lstt100
 

Company is still in business. Randy did purchase a new laser.

Yes, the freight cars were too new for this list. I did much of the research and tired of spending more time writing instructions for kits and less of my own time building models and working on my layout.

Begging the moderators forgiveness for being "out of era".

Dan Holbrook


Lisle and NYC paint color

Mark
 

Glad to hear that Lisle went well, someday.

Have plans to paint some New York Central hopper cars and would like to know if any have a suggestion on the red color they used and best choice to use.

Mark Morgan


Norfolk and Western lettering

octoraro1948 <octoraro1@...>
 

On the N&W B-1 box cars, when was Norfolk ampersand Western changed to Norfolk AND Western?

Lou Whiteley
Lawrenceville, NJ


Re: Weathering clinic handout

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Joe Nevin wrote:
Tony - Let me add my thanks as ell. Just one question, when you cut the Dullcoat 50/50 do you use Testor's thinner, or something else?
I don't thin it, but Richard does. I know he uses lacquer thinner.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Weathering clinic handout

Richard Hendrickson
 

On Oct 25, 2011, at 3:43 PM, joseph nevin wrote:

Tony - Let me add my thanks as ell. Just one question, when you cut
the Dullcoat 50/50 do you use Testor's thinner, or something else?
I can answer that one. Dullcote is a lacquer, and can be thinned
with ordinary lacquer thinner purchased at your local hardware store
for a lot less than you'll pay for Testor's thinner.

Richard Hendrickson


Re: Weathering clinic handout

joseph nevin
 

Tony - Let me add my thanks as ell. Just one question, when you cut the Dullcoat 50/50 do you use Testor's thinner, or something else?

Joe

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, Jim Betz <jimbetz@...> wrote:

Hi,

Tony - thanks for making this available!

All - on my computer (Win7) I had to download and open the
file using Adobe to get it to print correctly.
- Jim


Re: Lisle RPM

Brian Ehni <behni@...>
 

Not that I've heard. Cut back severely, yes, because their laser is shot,
and a new one is expen$ive, but still selling the wheel mask AFAIK. And if
they get a new laser (or access to one) they can be back in business pretty
quick. However, their freight cars are too modern for this list, I believe.


Thanks!
--

Brian P. Ehni

From: Bill Welch <fgexbill@tampabay.rr.com>
Reply-To: STMFC List <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 2011 21:46:33 -0000
To: STMFC List <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Lisle RPM






Gene

I think Modeler's Choice closed its doors. Bill Raia was there Saturday
only.

Bill Welch

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com <mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com> , "mopac1"
<mopac1@...> wrote:

While on the subject of the Lisle RPM Conference this year, what did Joe
have to say about it over breakfast on Sunday?

Due to the layout of the facility, it has hard to get a feel for how many
attended. Did Joe give any numbers on attendance?

The vendors seemed to be fewer in number this year, with a few staples
missing, WrightTRAK, Bill Raia, Modelers Choice among them.

Gene Semon








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Re: Prototype for MDC/Athearn 41 foot gondola

Tim O'Connor
 

Good references:

Mainline Modeler 9/1992 -- Mont Switzer modeling article
Mainline Modeler 6/1992 -- another modeling article
Mainline Modeler 4/1991 -- prototype information and drawings

The 44000-44999 series had radial ends, not "peaked" ends. IOW the
peaks were not additions to the top of the ends as they sometimes were
on hopper cars or gondolas. The earlier 40000-43999 series had angular
ends. The above articles cover the later 36000, 37000 cars.

The book "Chessie's Road" from the C&OHS has a fine 1948 builder photo
of C&O 36300.

Tim O'Connor

-------------------------------------------

C&O 44000 series, built 1936
CAPY 100000
LD LMT 126500 (typical)
LT WT 42500 (typical)

in steam era, LD LMT + LT WT = 169000 for this particular car

marked CU FT 1880 (2300 heaped)
IL 40-6
I want to say builder was ACF?


Data very similar for 36000 series, built 1948 by Pressed Steel Car Co. (More
modern ends on these cars than on previous groups... MDC did this style.)
Scott Pitzer

79701 - 79720 of 183637