Date   

Re: Stock Car Question

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Tom Madden wrote:
Sawdust was commonly used if there were sawmills in the area. My father in law cut, harvested & stored pond ice in the Poconos (PA) into the late 1960's and always used sawdust for insulation. Sold ice to tourists out of his service station through the summer.
This does not necessarily have anything to do with ice for reefers. Sawdust clogs the drains, usually a bad thing. Consumer ice is a different story.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Stock Car Question

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Tim O'Connor wrote:
My recollection is that straw is often used in conjunction with ice in storage. Perhaps to prevent those 300lb blocks from turning themselves into 3,000lb blocks? Surely the straw could simply be brushed or washed off the ice?
The PFE people I interviewed said NO straw, sawdust or anything else was used in storage houses. Photos of interiors of those structures confirm this.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Stock Car Question

pullmanboss <tcmadden@...>
 

Jerry Glow wrote:

I suspect it may but thought the use of sawdust was more common.
Sawdust was commonly used if there were sawmills in the area. My father in law cut, harvested & stored pond ice in the Poconos (PA) into the late 1960's and always used sawdust for insulation. Sold ice to tourists out of his service station through the summer.

Tom Madden


FGE underframe paint

D. Scott Chatfield
 

I rescued an old Golden Spike kit for an FGE reefer from an abusive home. It has the underframe parts painted either the same freightcar red as the ends and roof or simply left unpainted metal. I can't tell from the few photos I have whether those parts should be red or black. Also, somewhere along the line I got the impression that the roof should be unpainted galvanized or painted silver for post-1950 FGE cars. Was this true for mechanical reefers? The model's lettering indicates it was built at Alexandria in 1956 and reweighed in 1960.

Thanks for any help. I know this is the same prototype that WrightTrak did a few years ago but I always wanted one of these Golden Spike kits ever since I saw them in Walthers catalogs when I was a kid in the early '70s.

Scott Chatfield


Re: Stock Car Question

Armand Premo
 

Heck,The Rutland used to send hay and cedar posts in their stock cars.Armand Premo

----- Original Message -----
From: jerryglow@...
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Wednesday, November 16, 2011 11:27 AM
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Stock Car Question



I suspect it may but thought the use of sawdust was more common.

Jerry Glow

--- In STMFC@..., Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:
>
>
> My recollection is that straw is often used in conjunction with
> ice in storage. Perhaps to prevent those 300lb blocks from turning
> themselves into 3,000lb blocks? Surely the straw could simply
> be brushed or washed off the ice?
>
> In the town where I live there are several large ponds (lakes) and
> in past times the ice was harvested each winter and put into storage
> for use throughout the year. The rail line (now a trail) ran on a
> causeway dividing one of the ponds in two.
>
> Tim O'Connor
>
>
>
>
>
> > And if straw was used, you can be sure the ice was not intended
> >to be used in reefers. Straw would clog the bunker drains. You might
> >be thinking that surely reefers weren't iced in winter, and that's
> >true, but the natural ice could be stored for summer use. Just not
> >with straw.
> >
> >Tony Thompson
>


Re: Stock Car Question

jerryglow2
 

I suspect it may but thought the use of sawdust was more common.

Jerry Glow

--- In STMFC@..., Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:


My recollection is that straw is often used in conjunction with
ice in storage. Perhaps to prevent those 300lb blocks from turning
themselves into 3,000lb blocks? Surely the straw could simply
be brushed or washed off the ice?

In the town where I live there are several large ponds (lakes) and
in past times the ice was harvested each winter and put into storage
for use throughout the year. The rail line (now a trail) ran on a
causeway dividing one of the ponds in two.

Tim O'Connor





And if straw was used, you can be sure the ice was not intended
to be used in reefers. Straw would clog the bunker drains. You might
be thinking that surely reefers weren't iced in winter, and that's
true, but the natural ice could be stored for summer use. Just not
with straw.

Tony Thompson


Re: Fox Valley (and ExactRail) B&O Wagontop

Tim O'Connor
 

How common were cars with the original doors in the 1950's? I
have only seen one photo of a car with its original doors in this
time period, compared to many photos of cars with replacement doors.

Tim O'Connor

You've got the dates right in your email ;^) I suppose this means that
you're asking that timeless question... how quickly did prototype steam
era freight car paint schemes get changed? Actually, the answer is
pretty easy... "It depends" There ya go! Problem solved <G>.

OK, seriously. Prototype cars were repainted approximately every 5-10
years depending on the economics and perspective of the home road and of
course, relying on the car to make it home at some point. For your 1957
era, if you have just a single one of these, I'd go for the mid
1955-1957 "Billboard 13 Great States" scheme from Chris' B&O boxcar
lettering PDF. Obviously, the reweigh date should be between mid 1955
and your modeling date. As noted previously, that scheme is not listed
for the FVM or the Exactrail car. Alternatively, you could go with the
Mid 1946 - Mid 1955 "Post War 13 Great States" and weather the car a bit
more. That would be exactrail SKU 90051

Note that the blue and green schemes listed are both express boxcar
schemes for use in passenger service.

Regards
Bruce Smith


Re: Stock Car Question

Tim O'Connor
 

My recollection is that straw is often used in conjunction with
ice in storage. Perhaps to prevent those 300lb blocks from turning
themselves into 3,000lb blocks? Surely the straw could simply
be brushed or washed off the ice?

In the town where I live there are several large ponds (lakes) and
in past times the ice was harvested each winter and put into storage
for use throughout the year. The rail line (now a trail) ran on a
causeway dividing one of the ponds in two.

Tim O'Connor

And if straw was used, you can be sure the ice was not intended
to be used in reefers. Straw would clog the bunker drains. You might
be thinking that surely reefers weren't iced in winter, and that's
true, but the natural ice could be stored for summer use. Just not
with straw.

Tony Thompson


Re: F&C PRR GR Gondolas - backdating

talltim10
 

Thanks, I've read good things about Tahoe trucks, so I've mailed Brian.
I've realised that I need to be a bit more specific when I post queries, I'm fairly good at researching proto info, but coming from UK, when it comes to the smaller model manufacturers I'm in the dark!
Tim David


Re: F&C PRR GR Gondolas - backdating

brianleppert@att.net
 

Joel,

Tahoe Model Works does not yet have a web sit, but if you, or anyone else, would like information, please contact me OFF-LIST at

brianleppert@...

and I can email all the TMW catalog flyers.

Brian Leppert
Tahoe Model Works
Carson City, NV

--- In STMFC@..., "Joel Holmes" <lehighvalley@...> wrote:

Hi Ben,

Does Tahoe Model Works have a web site?

Joel Holmes


Friends of the Freight car T shirt

Andy Carlson
 

Hi,

I picked up an extra large sized FOTFC shirt at "Son-of-Naperville" last month.
The person who I thought wanted it declined. If anyone wants it for $25.00, plus
$5.00 priority mail shipping, contact me off-list at <midcentury@...>
Thanks,
-Andy Carlson
Ojai CA


Re: F&C PRR GR Gondolas - backdating

Joel Holmes <lehighvalley@...>
 

Hi Ben,

Does Tahoe Model Works have a web site?

Joel Holmes

Tim David asked:
"Also, any recommendations for the best trucks to use?"

According to a PRR Truck Classification List dated June 5, 1922, Class GR
gons were equipped with Class 2D-F1 Arch Bar trucks or 2D-F2 Crown trucks.
http://prr.railfan.net/trucks/D70003-B.pdf

I recommend Tahoe Model Works TMW-103/203 for the Class 2D-F1 Arch Bar
Trucks; and the Walthers Andrews truck (933-1004) as the best stand-in for
the 2D-F2 50-ton Crown trucks.


Ben Hom


Re: F&C PRR GR Gondolas - backdating

Benjamin Hom
 

Tim David asked:
"Also, any recommendations for the best trucks to use?"

According to a PRR Truck Classification List dated June 5, 1922, Class GR gons were equipped with Class 2D-F1 Arch Bar trucks or 2D-F2 Crown trucks.
http://prr.railfan.net/trucks/D70003-B.pdf

I recommend Tahoe Model Works TMW-103/203 for the Class 2D-F1 Arch Bar Trucks; and the Walthers Andrews truck (933-1004) as the best stand-in for the 2D-F2 50-ton Crown trucks.


Ben Hom


Re: Stock Car Question - now Ice

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Bill Welch wrote:
However the same 300 blocks of ice used in the bunkers . . .
I think Ben Heinley was talking about natural ice, usually cut in much smaller blocks than 300-lb. manufactured ice blocks. And of course (as Bill knows) the 300-lb. blocks were NOT used in bunkers but were split at least into quarters and usually smaller, for bunker icing.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: F&C PRR GR Gondolas - backdating

talltim10
 

Can anyone answer this one?

--- In STMFC@..., "talltim10" <talltim@...> wrote:

Also, any recommendations for the best trucks to use?

Thanks, Tim David


Re: Stock Car Question - now Ice

Bill Welch
 

However the same 300 blocks of ice used in the bunkers would have also been ground and sprayed into cars for those crops, mainly vegetables, that were "top iced" so this ice too should have been as free as possible of bacteria I would think. The few photos I have of ice being moved around on the FGE/WFE/BRE System shows it being done in refrigerator cars, both those in active freight service and those downgraded to "Ice Service."

Bill Welch

--- In STMFC@..., "np328" <jcdworkingonthenp@...> wrote:

Ben, there are two type of ice, potable and all other.
Potable ice has to meet the same standards of "fit for human consumption" as drinking water, and this was the ice kept for railroad dining cars, etc. All other ice would be suitable for the bunker of a reefer as it would never contact the product.
However if the ice was sequestered properly in the straw, it might well remain "fit for human consumption", even if in a stock car. As others on this list have pointed out, stock cars were cleaned quite often and so would be less filthy than we imagine them to be.
James Dick - St. Paul

--- In STMFC@..., "benjamin" <bheinley@> wrote:
The DRGW used to haul ice in the winter from Rollinsville to Denver in stock cars. The ice was bedded in straw for the trip. The pictures that my father-in-law took were published in one of the one of the historical society magazines dealing with the DRGW and or the Moffit line a few years ago. The big question is were the cars steam cleaned before handling the ice? Could have been a little extra "local" flavor in your mixed drink otherwise!
I'm sure other roads did the same where hard freeze mountain areas were close to cities with warmer weather. California? East coast states?
Ben Heinley


Re: New Haven Ice car

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Steve Bishop wrote:
I am considering using a Tichy PFE Class R-40-4 reefer as a stand in for the New Haven Ice car I-74. According to the New Haven Guide to Freight and Passenger Equipment, I-74 was former PFE 90551, an R-40-8.
Can anyone tell me what the visible differences would be between these two classes?
Steve, they were very similar cars. Certainly most modelers could not tell the difference. Most of the differences, in fact, were internal. The R-40-8 cars were a little taller, but only be about 2.5 inches. (For more information, including photos, see the PFE book; see any post-WW II ORER for dimensions).

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Stock Car Question

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Ben Heinley wrote:
The DRGW used to haul ice in the winter from Rollinsville to Denver in stock cars. The ice was bedded in straw for the trip. The pictures that my father-in-law took were published in one of the one of the historical society magazines dealing with the DRGW and or the Moffit line a few years ago. The big question is were the cars steam cleaned before handling the ice? Could have been a little extra "local" flavor in your mixed drink otherwise!
And if straw was used, you can be sure the ice was not intended to be used in reefers. Straw would clog the bunker drains. You might be thinking that surely reefers weren't iced in winter, and that's true, but the natural ice could be stored for summer use. Just not with straw.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


New Haven Ice car

Stephen Bishop
 

Dear Colleagues:

I am considering using a Tichy PFE Class R-40-4 reefer as a stand in for the New Haven Ice car I-74. According to the New Haven Guide to Freight and Passenger Equipment, I-74 was former PFE 90551, an R-40-8.

Can anyone tell me what the visible differences would be between these two classes?

Thanks very much.

Steve Bishop


Re: Re; Pig Iron

water.kresse@...
 

I know I asked this question some time back . . . . but was there a guideline for loading materials like pig iron on the floors of a freight cars?  I've heard stories from retirees talking about seeing "broken" cars filled with pig-iron where folks got lazy and loaded it more at the center of car at the doorway.  It is only common sense to load them concentrated over the bolsters and not to full cap'y.  I heard the rule was 80 percent max with a balanced load, but I don't have anything in writing.



Al Kresse

----- Original Message -----


From: "Aidrian Bridgeman-Sutton" <smokeandsteam@...>
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Monday, November 14, 2011 9:59:01 PM
Subject: [STMFC] Re; Pig Iron

Several possibilities exist, but none are easy styrene solution for
the time frame you have in mind; I assume you’re in HO so here are
some possibilities based on my own interests in the area around
Birmingham AL

Gondolas were typically used for pig ron loading with the pigs tending
to be loaded over the bolsters; low sided gons were especially useful.

SOU low sided steeel gons are the obvious choice. For the 30s only the
Speed witch resin kit is appropriate – the Smoky Mountain kit
represents cars as they were rebuilt in the post war period.

I have a photo of a SAL composite gon with pig iron and Sunshine do a
resin kit of such a beast. I’m not sure that composite construction
would have lasted long in this service, but it certainly happened

CofG used cut down USRA cars as noted inana earlier response – the
problem is that while I have copies of diagrams for these I have never
seen a photo

ACL didn’t serve Birmingham in its own right until after WW2 but they
also had a class of low side steel gons that can be kit bashed from
the old ERTL gon

Aidrian
--
Beer has no effect on concrete, but unless the concrete is specially
treated the taste of the beer could be affected. (Military Engineering
Vol XIV, Concrete, WO Code No 8626, 1952.)


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