Date   

Re: Buffalo Creek

dmamfahr <mamfahr@...>
 

The only models that I have:

Branchline #1601, 40' AAR box with a 7' door

and Kadee did a few road numbers.

Thanks to everyone who replied to my question about the BCK boxcars. I can now confidently purchase the 0.3 cars that I will need to accurately represent Buffalo Creek's fleet on UP's trains of 1956! ;-)

Take care,

Mark Amfahr


Re: Re-issue of Branchline wood reefers by Atlas

Bruce Smith
 

On Jan 17, 2012, at 12:29 PM, spsalso wrote:

Atlas has stated that it is a re-issue of the Branchline car.

I ask about this model because I'm far from an expert in the wood-reefer field. I don't know the difference(s) between FGEX, Union, NATX......

And there isn't a lot of material on this kind of car online, as opposed to, say, 50' steel boxcars.

Or am I just missing a perhaps available source?

I note that the model has a fish-belly center sill--Fruit Growers appear to not.

There are also corner re-enforcements on the model--these are kinda rare on most of the wood reefer photos I've looked at (the reefers in color book).
Ed,

Bill Welch may be able to definitely tell us, but this is definitely NOT a common FGE reefer if it is one at all. The problem with FGE is that they had several major styles and then lots of "lost sheep" that came in from member roads. Unless Bill gives a thumbs up, I would stay away, focusing mainly on the 1921 and 1927 style cars (Sunshine for both, Intermountain for post WWII rebuilds of the 1927, or as fodder for kitbashing the earlier cars).

Regards
Bruce

Bruce F. Smith
Auburn, AL
https://www5.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/

"Some days you are the bug, some days you are the windshield."
__
/ &#92;
__<+--+>________________&#92;__/___ ________________________________
|- ______/ O O &#92;_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ |
| / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 &#92; | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||
|/_____________________________&#92;|_|________________________________|
| O--O &#92;0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0


Re: Buffalo Creek

Greg Bartek
 

The only models that I have:

Branchline #1601, 40' AAR box with a 7' door

and Kadee did a few road numbers.

Regards, Greg Bartek

--- In STMFC@..., "dmamfahr" <mamfahr@...> wrote:

 Q)... What's the dope on this new Buffalo Creek Railroad? Please give history of this road.

 A)...This railroad is not new, despite the fact that it owns a thousand 50-ton boxcars ... These boxcars were purchased to overcome the frequent shortage of clean cars suitable for loading flour.
Hello all,

For what it's worth, two of those cars showed up in a sample of Union Pacific trains moving during May of 1956. Neither of the two cars on the U.P. contained flour - one had aluminum, the other paper. So it appears that they were "roaming freely" across the country along with most other plain boxcars.

Is there an HO model of those cars available (AC&F 40'6" all steel with 7' doors) decorated for BCK?

Take care,

Mark Amfahr


Re: Buffalo Creek

Ed Hawkins
 

On Jan 17, 2012, at 12:27 PM, dmamfahr wrote:

Is there an HO model of those cars available (AC&F 40'6" all steel with 7' doors) decorated for BCK?
Mark,
Branchline Trains offered a model of this car (Cat. no. 1601). However, as I recall, the model was painted using a bright red circle inside the flour sack rather than the same "freight car red" used on the sides. It was otherwise a very accurate HO-scale model of the prototype cars for BCK 2500-2999 built in 1956 by American Car & Foundry.
Regards,
Ed Hawkins


Re: Re-issue of Branchline wood reefers by Atlas

Ed Hawkins
 

On Jan 17, 2012, at 12:29 PM, spsalso wrote:

Atlas has stated that it is a re-issue of the Branchline car.

I ask about this model because I'm far from an expert in the wood-reefer field. I don't know the difference(s) between FGEX, Union, NATX......

And there isn't a lot of material on this kind of car online, as opposed to, say, 50' steel boxcars.

Or am I just missing a perhaps available source?

I note that the model has a fish-belly center sill--Fruit Growers appear to not.

There are also corner re-enforcements on the model--these are kinda rare on most of the wood reefer photos I've looked at (the reefers in color book).

Ed,
The models are patterned after URTC, MRX, NWX, and WRX cars built in the late 1920s to 1930s by AC&F. RP CYC Volumes 4 and 5, both out of print, had articles about the cars including numerous builder's photos of original billboard schemes and 1930s-1950s in-service photos. Color photos of some of these cars are in Gene Green's Refrigerator Car Color Guide by Morning Sun Books.
Regards,
Ed Hawkins


Re: Is this paint scheme correct for this car?

mopacfirst
 

A more correct statement than my original one, but nevertheless one does not have to buy an R-40-23 painted in ART colors when a much more accurate version is actually available :

http://amarillorailmuseum.com/model_rail_cars.html

Ron Merrick

--- In STMFC@..., "espee1fan" <espeefan@...> wrote:

The MPHS and ARM horizontal seam car is not a retooling of the R-40-23. It is a retooling ( retooled side with other specific detail parts on separate sprue )of the PFE R-40-10. Ed Hawkins did the grunt work with Intermountain on these changes.

Regards,
Dan Smith


--- In STMFC@..., "mopacfirst" <ron.merrick@> wrote:

To add to Richard's comment, <snip>>


Re: Buffalo Creek

Aley, Jeff A
 

Mark,

See http://www.trainlife.com/magazines/pages/473/34478/april-1994-page-4 .


Regards,

-Jeff


From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of dmamfahr
Sent: Tuesday, January 17, 2012 10:28 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Buffalo Creek



Q)... What's the dope on this new Buffalo Creek Railroad? Please give history of this road.

A)...This railroad is not new, despite the fact that it owns a thousand 50-ton boxcars ... These boxcars were purchased to overcome the frequent shortage of clean cars suitable for loading flour.
Hello all,

For what it's worth, two of those cars showed up in a sample of Union Pacific trains moving during May of 1956. Neither of the two cars on the U.P. contained flour - one had aluminum, the other paper. So it appears that they were "roaming freely" across the country along with most other plain boxcars.

Is there an HO model of those cars available (AC&F 40'6" all steel with 7' doors) decorated for BCK?

Take care,

Mark Amfahr


Re: steamfreighcars dot com (was Re: Buffalo Creek)

Aley, Jeff A
 

I thought I'd give Mark a hand by checking the rosters at steamfreightcars dot com. But I found that the website is defunct (fortunately, it is archived by the Wayback Machine).

We also were unable to contact Ted Culotta re: Prototype Rails. Has anybody heard from him recently?

Regards,

-Jeff


From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of dmamfahr
Sent: Tuesday, January 17, 2012 10:28 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Buffalo Creek



Q)... What's the dope on this new Buffalo Creek Railroad? Please give history of this road.

A)...This railroad is not new, despite the fact that it owns a thousand 50-ton boxcars ... These boxcars were purchased to overcome the frequent shortage of clean cars suitable for loading flour.
Hello all,

For what it's worth, two of those cars showed up in a sample of Union Pacific trains moving during May of 1956. Neither of the two cars on the U.P. contained flour - one had aluminum, the other paper. So it appears that they were "roaming freely" across the country along with most other plain boxcars.

Is there an HO model of those cars available (AC&F 40'6" all steel with 7' doors) decorated for BCK?

Take care,

Mark Amfahr


Re: Re-issue of Branchline wood reefers by Atlas

spsalso
 

Atlas has stated that it is a re-issue of the Branchline car.

I ask about this model because I'm far from an expert in the wood-reefer field. I don't know the difference(s) between FGEX, Union, NATX......

And there isn't a lot of material on this kind of car online, as opposed to, say, 50' steel boxcars.

Or am I just missing a perhaps available source?

I note that the model has a fish-belly center sill--Fruit Growers appear to not.

There are also corner re-enforcements on the model--these are kinda rare on most of the wood reefer photos I've looked at (the reefers in color book).




Ed

Edward Sutorik

--- In STMFC@..., Benjamin Hom <b.hom@...> wrote:

Arved Grass wrote:
"Prototype: http://www.hfmgv.org/exhibits/pic/2005/fruit/car.asp
Model: http://tinyurl.com/7qyhnpy

I'm certainly not a FGE expert, but it's not all that bad, is it?"

Model certainly isn't an ex-Branchline reefer.  It's got molded on details, and
looks an N scale model.  (Even though this photo is hosted on their "HO Scale"
pages, Atlas has used photos of N scale models in HO listing in the past.)


Ben Hom 


Re: Buffalo Creek

dmamfahr <mamfahr@...>
 

 Q)... What's the dope on this new Buffalo Creek Railroad? Please give history of this road.

 A)...This railroad is not new, despite the fact that it owns a thousand 50-ton boxcars ... These boxcars were purchased to overcome the frequent shortage of clean cars suitable for loading flour.
Hello all,

For what it's worth, two of those cars showed up in a sample of Union Pacific trains moving during May of 1956. Neither of the two cars on the U.P. contained flour - one had aluminum, the other paper. So it appears that they were "roaming freely" across the country along with most other plain boxcars.

Is there an HO model of those cars available (AC&F 40'6" all steel with 7' doors) decorated for BCK?

Take care,

Mark Amfahr


Re: BLI NYC steel boxcars

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Mark Rossiter wrote:
I have seven of the cars in different variations and the roofwalks on virtually all of them fell off while in the process of changing out the couplers. They must have used sticky-note glue to hold them on! What type of glue are the rest of you using to refasten them? I know CA is not the answer, but what is a good glue to use that won't creep up through the fine grates?
I've removed the running boards on all four of my cars (one was loose in the box) to file down the support for the lateral boards, then of course gluing them back on. I use model airplane canopy cement, which remains flexible even after years in service. None of that "popping loose" every time there's a temperature excursion, as you can get with CA.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Buffalo Creek

Steve Vallee
 

Dear Group...

   I found this tidbit on page 68 of the January, 1954 issue of Railroad Magazine:


 Q)... What's the dope on this new Buffalo Creek Railroad? Please give history of this road.

 A)...This railroad is not new, despite the fact that it owns a thousand 50-ton boxcars, built as recently as from July, 1952 through February, 1953, and probably some more recently. Five-hundred cars from Pullman-Standard bear numbers from 1000 to 1499, and five-hundred from American Car & Foundry are numbered from 1500 to 1999. These boxcars were purchased to overcome the frequent shortage of clean cars suitable for loading flour. Bearing the reporting marks BCK on the left, the herald on the right-hand side of the door is a large white circle with buffalo
Creek railroad in red letters. Inside the circle on a red background is a large white flour sack on which is a red circle, with the word flour in white letters.

  The Buffalo Creek is a terminal switching line with 5.73 miles of operating track connecting with all other Buffalo railroads and 34.12 miles serving waterfront and other industries for carload freight only. It provides private open-dock facilities for lake vessels handling bulk commodities in lake-rail transfer. Some years ago the Buffalo Creek owned several heavy steam switching locomotives and one or two older engines. Diesel-electric switchers are now used. The Buffalo Creek was incorporated in New York on January 25, 1869, and the road was opened in June, 1870. The road and equipment was leased in 1889 to the Erie Railroad and the Lehigh Valley Railroad, at an annual rental equal to the interest on bonds and corporate expenses.


  My question is this: What
happened to the equipment after it joined Conrail? 

  Steve Vallee



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: BLI NYC steel boxcars

Samuel Röthlisberger
 

I agree they’re looking great. The trucks aren’t to good, They look very “flat” compared to other brands.

Personally, I don’t understand why BLI chose to introduce a new style of truck mounting, but I think it works.

Samuel Roethlisberger

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: Drawing Nomenclature

Dennis Storzek
 

--- In STMFC@..., "Schuyler Larrabee" <schuyler.larrabee@...> wrote:
Actually, "pounce" patterns is >>A<< correct term. I have seen this
spelling in print, in catalogs, in product literature and elsewhere. For
those who are wondering what it is, it is a sheet of something, probably
paper, with the outline of the image to be painted that is perforated. In
use, at least in some applications, the pattern is held in place and a
"pounce bag" is used to (words fail me) whap on the paper over the
perforations. The pounce bag is filled with a material such as chalk, that
will leave a dot through the holes in the pattern. Once the entire pattern
has been "whapped" with the pounce bag, the pattern is removed and an
outline of the image remains on the surface.
Which now raises the question in my mind just what the N&WHS Archives holds. I had assumed these were the DRAWINGS to make the punched pounce (their spelling)patterns from, but perhaps they hold the actual punched patterns? I know the Soo Society has some of the actual punched pounce patterns for passenger car lettering in their collection.

Looking a bit further for a generic name for the drawings of actual lettering, I looked through a very nice book of drawings published by the Southern Railway Historical Association. Their usage is consistent with what I find in both the N&W collection and the H&B drawings at IRM; a "stenciling" drawing show placement, not the actual letterforms. The drawings of the actual lettering are simply titled as to what they are: 12" LETTERS "SOUTHERN", 12" FIGURES, 3" LETTERS "LT WT", etc. The herald drawings are titled MONOGRAM (TOP HALF) and MONOGRAM (BOTTOM HALF) Which is how the handle the problem of an item that is too large for the blueprint machine. I point this out because while Pullman may have called drawings of the actual characters "stencil" drawings, many other offices did not, and a drawing so titled should not automatically be assumed to show the true shape of the letters. More than one manufacturer has made this mistake.

Dennis


Re: Drawing Nomenclature

Bob Webber <drgw18@...>
 

Which only serves to underline the comment that accuracy is only as
good as the person involved.

Ponce patterns (not "pounce" patterns) are not the same as
Actually, "pounce" patterns is >>A<< correct term. I have seen this
spelling in print, in catalogs, in product literature and elsewhere. For
Having said that, the Pullman spec does indicate "ponce". Then
again, Pullman had some interesting ways to spell things. Pullman
isn't an arbiter of correct spelling of the current vernacular,
anymore than Google is of that from 100 years ago. Mea Culpa.


Bob Webber


Re: Is this paint scheme correct for this car?

 

The MPHS and ARM horizontal seam car is not a retooling of the R-40-23. It is a retooling ( retooled side with other specific detail parts on separate sprue )of the PFE R-40-10. Ed Hawkins did the grunt work with Intermountain on these changes.

Regards,
Dan Smith

--- In STMFC@..., "mopacfirst" <ron.merrick@...> wrote:

To add to Richard's comment, the similarity of the R-40-23 to certain ART cars inspired the MPHS and Amarillo Railroad Museum to have new, accurate, tooling made specifically for the ART horizontal seam car. Models of this car in various ART schemes have been available from the ARM directly.

Ron Merrick


Re: freight cars on the CSS&SB (was Sunshine at Timonium)

Dennis Storzek
 

--- In STMFC@..., Bruce Smith <smithbf@...> wrote:

On Jan 17, 2012, at 8:10 AM, Patrick Wilkinson wrote:
It's the CSS&SB which runs 80 miles from the interchange with the IC @
Kensington, Il to the east to South Bend, Indiana...
Pat,

I'm not sure I understand your problem. While interchange partners are, by definition, the source of interchanged cars, they do NOT have to be roadnames seen, for a variety of reasons.
Yeah, I don't see the problem, either. You're modeling a road smack dab in the middle of the nation, with a varied industrial base, that interchanged, either directly or through on of the belt roads, with every railroad of consequence that made it to Chicago. This could be the poster child for the most average car fleet of any railroad in the US.

I believe that the CSS&SB acted as a terminal road; as you say, they had almost no cars of their own. They simply picked up and delivered cars for their connections. Back in the days you are modeling, all major railroads had traffic solicitation departments that sold their service. Since they couldn't sell on price (the rates were controlled by the ICC and had to be the same for all) they sold on service, car availability, entertainment, and booze. Every railroad that connected with the South Shore had an interest in securing the outbound loadings from the customers served by the South Shore, so they all solicited the traffic. Whoever won the loads, had to make arrangements to deliver empties to the CSS&SB for placement for loading. These empties could either be home road cars (owned by the connection that was getting the line haul) or any empties that they could use for their own business. Diverting a "foreign" road empty to the CSS&SB for loading toward it's home district was well within the car service rules. Sounds like it would be an interesting railroad to operate; the inbound empties would have more specific routing that on other roads.

Anyway, just start building "typical" cars. Build the cars on the IHB interchange lists. Build the cars you can identify from train photos, of which there are plenty.

And don't worry about it so much.

Dennis


Re: BLI NYC steel boxcars

Andy Sperandeo
 

Hello Peter,
I replaced the Broadway couplers with Kadee 153 couplers in their own boxes, which are a drop-in replacement if you trim the top lip off the Kadee box.
I don't like the BLI trucks at all and replaced them with Tahoe Model Works Buckeye trucks, a basic AAR style, with semi-scale wheels. That required replacing the body bolster with a block of .160 x .250-inch styrene drilled and reamed to fit around the cast on kingpin post. I showed this in my "Ready to run in 3 hours" clinic at Cocoa Beach. (I'll admit I was pretty proud to get this car into the show since I only received it on the previous Friday.) 
So long,
Andy


















[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


freight cars on the CSS&SB (was Sunshine at Timonium)

Bruce Smith
 

On Jan 17, 2012, at 8:10 AM, Patrick Wilkinson wrote:
It's the CSS&SB which runs 80 miles from the interchange with the IC @
Kensington, Il to the east to South Bend, Indiana.
I model late 1957 which is due to when they started putting rebuilt NYC R2
electrics in service.
I know from one source that they interchanged 57,000 loads with the NKP but
I have no idea what the cars were.

I have another source where I know the car number, type, and what it was
carrying that was delivered from the CB&Q VIA the IHB.

But since they interchanged with everyone who ran across NW Indiana there is
a large base to draw from.
Pat,

I'm not sure I understand your problem. While interchange partners are, by definition, the source of interchanged cars, they do NOT have to be roadnames seen, for a variety of reasons.

You really have two options to build a fleet of freight cars, operationally for a model railroad. You can model the fleet from specific trains and unless you run the same train, over and over again, this gives you a fleet of "known" cars arranged in trains that are different from the ones that they were in, or you can model the fleet from the stats that have been discussed here many times (aka the N-G, NG, Nelson-Gilbert model for house cars and flats, regional-national distribution of gons and local-regional distribution of hoppers) which gives you a fleet of "possible cars" arranged in whatever trains you are running. Some modelers here have done an admirable job with the former, while others, such as myself, have focused on the later. Both probably tell you that you need at least one NYC Steel USRA box and one PRR X29 to start <G>! After that just keep building (and remember to throw in a few "oddballs" - just don't use them every ops session!)

Regards
Bruce

Bruce F. Smith
Auburn, AL
https://www5.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/

"Some days you are the bug, some days you are the windshield."
__
/ &#92;
__<+--+>________________&#92;__/___ ________________________________
|- ______/ O O &#92;_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ |
| / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 &#92; | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||
|/_____________________________&#92;|_|________________________________|
| O--O &#92;0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0


Re: Sunshine at Timonium

Patrick Wilkinson <glgpat@...>
 

Scott,



It's the CSS&SB which runs 80 miles from the interchange with the IC @
Kensington, Il to the east to South Bend, Indiana.



I model late 1957 which is due to when they started putting rebuilt NYC R2
electrics in service.



I know from one source that they interchanged 57,000 loads with the NKP but
I have no idea what the cars were.



I have another source where I know the car number, type, and what it was
carrying that was delivered from the CB&Q VIA the IHB.



But since they interchanged with everyone who ran across NW Indiana there is
a large base to draw from.



Pat Wilkinson