Date   

Re: Bettendorf underframe

dennyanspach <danspach@...>
 

Can anyone help me with information on these [Westerfield] MILW cars [that have Bettendorf underframes]?
The Westerfield cars were double-sheathed 42' cars constructed by the thousands by Bettendorf, Milwaukee's own shops, and at least one other manufacturer in 1912 & 13. They all shared I-beam Bettendorf underframes and Bettendorf "boltless" trucks. One car (one car only) had Van Dorn "bullseye" ends. They lasted into the thirties until finally replaced by the welded steel "Ribside" cars. WW II saved a few to last until c. 1953, and one lasted until c. 1956 on the Virginian (a product of the "you wreck, you buy" program).

BTW, the Westerfield kits for these cars are simply terrific.

Of incidental interest is the fact that the last Milwaukee order of double sheathed box cars c. 1918 reverted to truss rods (6), presumably because of WWI restrictions on steel. The next order, were of USRA single sheathed cars.

Denny

Denny S. Anspach MD
Sacramento


Re: SP hog fuel car

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Tim O'Connor wrote:
Tony, I'm sure I've seen official SP documents somewhere that used the term hog fuel, but I just looked up SP 52490, a rebuilt A-50-6
(de-roofed with added small side-doors) and it is listed in the 1955 ORER simply as a "wood chip" car.
Well, as it happens, Tim (of interest to me because I model 1953) the 1953 ORER continues the SP practice of MANY years and still calls them "hog fuel" cars.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: axel end caps, spray painting

thmsdmpsy
 

Go to an auto parts store and ask them to pull out there selection of vacuum caps, they are available in both rubber and silicon, expand slightly to push over the axle end, and are inexpensive enough to be a "consumable" in the paint booth when they do eventually go away (takes quite a few axles to make that happen).  Tom Dempsey, Spokane, WA



________________________________
From: Jon Miller <atsf@izap.com>
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, January 22, 2012 10:42 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] axel end caps, spray painting


 
I have a commercial styrene wheel mask for keeping
the paint off the treads (spraying). However the axel
ends are not masked. Short of something applied to
each end does anyone know of a cap (silcone,
rubber, etc.) that is available to just plug on each axel
end?

Jon Miller
For me time stopped in 1941
Digitrax Chief/Zephyr systems, JMRI user
NMRA Life member #2623
Member SFRH&MS



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: axel end caps, spray painting

Richard Hendrickson
 

On Jan 22, 2012, at 10:42 AM, Jon Miller wrote:

I have a commercial styrene wheel mask for keeping
the paint off the treads (spraying). However the axel
ends are not masked. Short of something applied to
each end does anyone know of a cap (silcone,
rubber, etc.) that is available to just plug on each axel
end?
Jon, in my experience the commercial wheel masks don't really keep
all the paint off the treads, so I still have to clean and polish the
treads. I do this by chucking each axle end in a jeweler's lathe (a
Dremel tool in a stand would work equally well), spinning the
wheelset, and cleaning and polishing the tread with a mildly abrasive
typewriter eraser on which the point has been trimmed to a shallow
wedge shape. I then use the same eraser to clean the end bearing on
the opposite end of the axle before I reverse the wheelset and apply
the same treatment to the other tread and bearing. Takes only a
minute or two per wheelset and the result is polished bearings as
well as polished wheel treads.

Richard Hendrickson


Re: Walthers Troop Sleeper

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

derrell (not signing his full name) wrote:
As a professional painter I'd like to debunk a bit of the mythology about Air Honing (sand blasting) plastic; we seem to have this kid glove mentality about it. I Air Honed 4 plastic diesel shells yesterday (right along with a couple of brass pieces) in my Harbor Freight blasting cabinet. I used 220 grit silicon . . .
Do you mean silicon? or silicon carbide? pretty large difference.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: SP hog fuel car

Lee Thwaits <leethwaits@...>
 

Jim, duct tape was originally called duck tape because it shed water. /there is a brand called "Duck Tape".
Lee


Known USRA Sample Cars

David
 

Several builders painted and photographed "sample" USRA cars, before presumably repainting them for some railroad's allocation. These are the ones I know of; are there others?

SSC HM USA (no #) 7/18
ACF XM(ds) USA 100000 7/18
H&B GA USA 000000 9?/18
H&B XM(ss) U.S. 000000 10/18
StLC XM(ss) U.S. 000000 2/19

David Thompson


Creco doors

tomedill@frontier.com
 

Hi
Would anybody happen to have four of the Creco doors made by Keith Reterrer they would be willing to sell? thanks, Tom Dill


Re: axel end caps, spray painting

Jon Miller <atsf@...>
 

I have a commercial styrene wheel mask for keeping
the paint off the treads (spraying). However the axel
ends are not masked. Short of something applied to
each end does anyone know of a cap (silcone,
rubber, etc.) that is available to just plug on each axel
end?

Jon Miller
For me time stopped in 1941
Digitrax Chief/Zephyr systems, JMRI user
NMRA Life member #2623
Member SFRH&MS


Re: SP hog fuel car

mopacfirst
 

At the risk of beating a dead horse, I'll also note that gross and not very accurate machining of castings or steel forgings, to remove lots of metal before getting down to accurate machining, is called 'hogging out'.

Ron Merrick

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "spsalso" <Edwardsutorik@...> wrote:

From an on-line dictionary:

"To shred (waste wood, for example) by machine."

I'll modify that by noting that I do some work at a factory that has machines that are referred to as "hoggers". They turn square wood into largish dowels (about 1 1/2"). The purpose of these machines is not to shred (as implied by the definition), but they do shred as they work. I have heard the term most of my working life, and it means to quickly remove mass quantities. It applies to both wood and metal (and more, I suppose).


Ed

Edward Sutorik


Re: SP hog fuel car

tomedill@frontier.com
 

well, there has been a fair amount of info on the "hogged fuel" but little on the cars, which was the concern. guess the only photos out there are the few that I have. thanks, Tom Dill
Tom Dill
tomedill@frontier.com


Re: Walthers Troop Sleeper

derrell
 

I'd like to add to the comments here;

First of all I've found that original flavored Pinesol removes paint from plastic quite well. Once the paint is loosened use a stiff bristle brush to whisk as much of it off the model as you can submersed in the Pinesol because it seems to smear back onto the model once the Pinesol is washed way under warm water. Then I put the parts in my ultra sonic cleaner filled with Windex (again original flavor). While plastic doesn't clean up in an Ultrasonic cleaner quite as well as metal it does help remove loose particles. Finally rinse everything in warm water (soapy is optional). This is a long-term job, which can take a few days to complete.

Naturally test your plastic in the Pinesol and Windex first! I've stripped Athearn and Life-Like in this manner.

As a professional painter I'd like to debunk a bit of the mythology about Air Honing (sand blasting) plastic; we seem to have this kid glove mentality about it. I Air Honed 4 plastic diesel shells yesterday (right along with a couple of brass pieces) in my Harbor Freight blasting cabinet. I used 220 grit silicon at between 80 and 140 psi (depending on how far down the air use pulled it)! The shells came out clean with NO damage to any of the plastic or detail. I think we either don't understand or we forget that silicon cuts rather than beats and the harder the surface the better it cuts (up to a point, of course). The softer a material is (again up to a point) the more the particles tend to bounce rather than cut.

You are all quite welcome to continue to use messy, ineffective, and long term baking soda if you wish but I tell you from hard experience that it is a waste of time when the silicon at a rather high pressure works great. Again I have not air honed every type of plastic so I would encourage you to test it first - but I say that more as a disclaimer. Athearn and Proto-2000 I've found to be quite safe!

As far as removing lettering I think the tool Jack Burgess mentions in his RMC article would be perfect with the silicon for this. Or the Paache Air Eraser. But if you use the baking soda prepare to be there "alllllllll daaaaaaay long"! Grrrrr.

Derrell

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Pierre" <pierre.oliver@...> wrote:

Paul,
You might want to try Scalecoat paint remover.
I've used it to remove factory lettering on a finished locomotive. It worked quite well for me. Didn't really have any effect on the paint job. I used cotton swaps to apply the solution and just rubbed for a bit.
Pierre Oliver

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Bernice" <chris_hillman@> wrote:

I wanted to get a Walthers undec Troop Sleeper but couldn't find one, so I wound up with a blue B&O version, #932-4169.

I want to paint it for the C&EI, in their blue with orange striping.

The questions is; how to remove the lettering without affecting the overall blue paint scheme.

What solvent will remove only the lettering? Or, will the whole car have to be paint-removed?

Thanks,

Paul Hillman


Re: SP hog fuel car

Kent Sullivan
 

Jim, good point. The misunderstanding of the name must be pretty widespread (or was widespread)... The NP train sheet analysis I did for several months in 1953-7 for the Tacoma Division North Branches made multiple references to cars loaded with this material (often in a derailment!), and it was always "hog fuel". No dictionary for the dispatchers to consult for that one, I guess!

--Kent

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Jim Sabol" <jimsabol@...> wrote:

My point exactly. People, even in the industry call the rig a hog
machine because they don't hear the "ed". Calling the hogged fuel
hog fuel even on the SP doesn't make hogged fuel hog fuel any more
than hardware store employees calling duct tape duck tape makes duct
tape duck tape. Jim here.


Re: SP hog fuel car

Tim O'Connor
 

Tony, I'm sure I've seen official SP documents somewhere that used
the term hog fuel, but I just looked up SP 52490, a rebuilt A-50-6
(de-roofed with added small side-doors) and it is listed in the 1955
ORER simply as a "wood chip" car. I have a 1956 photo of 52490 and
it's loaded with can only be hogged fuel -- shredded bits of wood.
It looks like the stuff people put around their trees and flower beds.

I also have a 1957 shot of MILW 273221, a rebuilt 50 foot single sheathed
box car. This one has a roof with numerous hatches, no main doors, and
a line of dump doors along the bottom of the sides. MILW had hundreds
of these puppies in 1959!! They are also listed as "wood chip" cars.

Sigh. I wish Martin and Al had been more interested in the 1950's to
early 60's. So MANY interesting rebuilds back then!

Tim O'Connor



No argument with this as far as it goes, but wood chipper
machines for decades in sawmills have been called "hogs" and their
product "hog fuel." They are by means restricted to bark, and the
cargo carried in SP "hog fuel" cars was certainly not all bark. This
goes back to the days that much hog fuel was burned in conical
structures at sawmills when it could not be sold.
Tony Thompson


Re: Bettendorf underframe

John Riddell <jriddell@...>
 

Indeed, as of January 1914 there were 81,507 Bettendorf underframes in service in freight cars of many railroads including:



Armour

Arizona Eastern

CB&Q

CM&StP

CRI&P

CStPM&O

Central of Georgia

CI&S

Colorado & Southern

Central Pacific

C&A

Copper Range

C&NW

D&H

DNW&P

Erie

Georgia

Grand Trunk

GH&SA

H&TC

HE&WT

Illinois Central

Kansas City Southern

L&N

MDT

Michigan Central

ML&T

MStP&SSM

NYC&HR

LS&MS

North Coast

NW Pacific

Nevada Northern

OWRR&NCo

QSL

Oregon & California

Pacific Electric

PFE

Rutland

Southern

SP

SPLA&SL

St.J&GI

Tremont&G

T&NO

UP

Vandalia

Wash. I&M

Union Tank Line



More were built after 1914.

John Riddell


Re: Walthers Troop Sleeper

Pierre <pierre.oliver@...>
 

Paul,
You might want to try Scalecoat paint remover.
I've used it to remove factory lettering on a finished locomotive. It worked quite well for me. Didn't really have any effect on the paint job. I used cotton swaps to apply the solution and just rubbed for a bit.
Pierre Oliver

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Bernice" <chris_hillman@...> wrote:

I wanted to get a Walthers undec Troop Sleeper but couldn't find one, so I wound up with a blue B&O version, #932-4169.

I want to paint it for the C&EI, in their blue with orange striping.

The questions is; how to remove the lettering without affecting the overall blue paint scheme.

What solvent will remove only the lettering? Or, will the whole car have to be paint-removed?

Thanks,

Paul Hillman


Rivarossi PS-1 (was re: Steam freight cars website)

Tim O'Connor
 

Ashley

I think the Riv model was a post-1950 PS-1 with an 8' door; definitely
not a model of the New Haven pre-1950 PS-1's with 7' doors. Moreover I
have never seen a photo of a New Haven PS-1 in the snazzy black McGinnis
paint scheme. Some did get McGinnis era repaints but they were painted
in an oxide color overall. Still, New Haven had a large fleet of PS-1's
so Rivarossi wasn't totally off base.

Tim O'Connor


Speaking of freight cars, one of the very first box cars i ever owned
was a Rivarossi New Haven model in black with the white and orange
lettering.
Of course this is likely to be totally bogus, or at best a stand in, but
I was just a teenager and it was my first foray into American modelling,
and it looked pretty.
Ashley Pollard


Re: Steam Era Freight Cars web site is on-line again at new URL

Frederick Freitas <prrinvt@...>
 

Rob,
 
Many thanks for taking the site back to operational status.
I, for one, appreciate your efforts.
 
Fred Freitas
 


________________________________
From: Rob Adams <steamera@netins.net>
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, January 21, 2012 8:57 PM
Subject: [STMFC] Steam Era Freight Cars web site is on-line again at new URL


 
All;

I have the Steam Era Freight Cars web site up and running again at
http://www.SteamEraFreightCars.com

Please note that this URL differs slightly (the word "era" has been
added) from the original address, which is still dead.

Please contact me off-line with questions or material to contribute.
Thanks.

Best regards,

Rob Adams
Wellman, IA

On 1/20/12 9:37 AM, Bill Schneider wrote:

Looks like the domain has expired. Sad to see this resource go away..

Bill Schneider

From: cepropst@q.com <mailto:cepropst%40q.com>
Sent: Friday, January 20, 2012 10:34 AM
To: STMFC
Subject: [STMFC] Steam freight cars website

I just tried to look at something on the (originally Ted Culotta’s )
website and things have changed. Is it just me seeing the new
{useless) format?
Clark Propst
Mason City Iowa



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: Walthers Troop Sleeper

hacketet <hacketet@...>
 

The only way I've heard of that will remove only the lettering is to abrade it with baking soda and a Q-tip moistened in alcohol. In my opoinion, this is very tedious practice, but for a single car it may be OK. I usually do a bunch of cars at once so I've never tried it.

As for using a stripper, it all depends on what paint was used. The base color was spray painted, the lettering is applied with pad printing ink - basically a rubber stamp. They usually respond differently to different strippers, but there is no way to predict which will go first. Even if the lettering does come off first there is a good chance that the paint will be unacceptably damaged. It's better to remove everything and start over.

Here are some strippers that have been discussed in other lists:

Isopropanol (75% to 97% depending on personal preferance)
Brake fluid (no mention of the brands)
Chamelion (a propritary paint stripper)
10% sodium hydroxide (the only thing that works on old Athern models)

Unless someone has stripped this particular model, which would work best is just a guess.

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Bernice" <chris_hillman@...> wrote:

The questions is; how to remove the lettering without affecting the overall blue paint scheme.

What solvent will remove only the lettering? Or, will the whole car have to be paint-removed?

Thanks,

Paul Hillman


Re: Steam freight cars website

Don <riverman_vt@...>
 

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:

My 2 cents:

The whole concept of a "central repository" of information flies in
the face of the "web" -- Ted put together a nice site that contained
some good information about some prototype freight cars, and models > of freight cars, and that was a good thing. I'd like to see that
resource maintained and enhanced.

But the idea of folding other sites into it doesn't make any sense
to me at all. I joined MANY Yahoo interest groups (without daily
email) just to be able to take advantage of the resources in their
FILE and PHOTO archives. Yahoo doesn't permit Google web-bots to
crawl through the groups (What a bonanza that would be for us, but
probably a huge loss to Yahoo!). But you can subscribe to a single
daily email from Yahoo that will provide links and thumbnails for
any new files, photos, and attachments sent to ANY of the groups
you belong to. I find this email helps me immensely by eliminating
the need for me to crawl through the 75 or so groups I belong to,
to search for new stuff.

There are THOUSANDS of valuable railroad web sites. Let Google (or
Bing, or whomever) be your librarian! Become a searchologist!

One has to agree with you here, Tim. I have tried to limit the number of groups "subscribed" to but one can always join one for a sort time as needed. Like you, I also utilize the single daily email
that Yahoo offers as their "Yahoo Groups Update" and find it saves a lot of time. When folks are limited in time it is the only way to go!

See you next weekend????

Cordially, Don Valentine

83301 - 83320 of 189655