Date   

Interesting Waybill Sticker

Charles Hostetler <cesicjh@...>
 

I ran across this "Expedite" waybill sticker from the B&O in 1925:

http://cnwmodeling.blogspot.com/2012/05/interesting-waybill-sticker.html

It seemed to me that this might be an interesting variation to operations with prototype waybills, but I'm also wondering whether this practice was limited to a few railroads in the 1920s or whether it had more general application.

Regards,

Charles Hostetler


Re: Modeling truss rods

Nelson Moyer <ku0a@...>
 

Gene,



Thanks for the research! I especially appreciate the CB&Q reference, since
I'm building resin kits of several models with truss rods. Prototype 1-1/8
in. rods would be 0.0125 in. in HO scale. Prototype 1-1/4 in. rods would be
0.0140 in. in HO, so 0.0150 in. wire, monofilament, or silk or nylon thread
would be the closest match.



Nelson

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of Gene
Sent: Thursday, May 10, 2012 5:15 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Modeling truss rods





The Railroad Car Journal, January 1893, page 65, Live
Poultry Transportation Co. poultry car: Four 1 in. longitudinal truss rods,
enlarged to 1 1/4 in. at the threads.

The Railroad Car Journal, April 1893, page 163, Wabash coal car: 1 1/8" rod
with 1 1/4" ends.

The Railroad Car Journal, May 1893, page 175, NYC&HRR box car: Four 1 1/8
in. rods with the ends upset to receive 1 1/4 nuts.

Railroad Car Journal, January 1897, page 12, Illinois Central furniture car:
Six 1 1/8 inch truss rods.

Locomotive Engineering, February 1897, page 158, Buffalo, Rochester &
Pittsburg Ry. coal car: Four rods with bodies 1 1/4 inches in diameter, and
ends upset to 1 1/2 inches for nuts and turnbuckle.

Railway Master Mechanic, January 1902, page 9, CB&Q box car: 1 1/4" truss
rods.

Railway Master Mechanic, February 1902, page 42, Delaware, Lackawanna &
Western box car: Four 1 1/8" truss rods.

Railway Master Mechanic, April 1902, page 117, AT&SF box & stock cars: Four
1 1/4" truss rods with ends upset to 1 1/2 inch.

The Railroad Gazette, November 3, 1905, page 421, Chicago, Rock Island &
Pacific combination stock and drop bottom car: Truss rods 1 1/2 " diameter.

Railway Master Mechanic, January 1907, page 24, Boston & Maine box cars:
Four 1 1/8" truss rods with enlarged ends.

Gene Green


Re: Modeling truss rods

Gene <bierglaeser@...>
 

The Railroad Car Journal, January 1893, page 65, Live
Poultry Transportation Co. poultry car: Four 1 in. longitudinal truss rods, enlarged to 1 1/4 in. at the threads.

The Railroad Car Journal, April 1893, page 163, Wabash coal car: 1 1/8" rod with 1 1/4" ends.

The Railroad Car Journal, May 1893, page 175, NYC&HRR box car: Four 1 1/8 in. rods with the ends upset to receive 1 1/4 nuts.

Railroad Car Journal, January 1897, page 12, Illinois Central furniture car: Six 1 1/8 inch truss rods.

Locomotive Engineering, February 1897, page 158, Buffalo, Rochester & Pittsburg Ry. coal car: Four rods with bodies 1 1/4 inches in diameter, and ends upset to 1 1/2 inches for nuts and turnbuckle.

Railway Master Mechanic, January 1902, page 9, CB&Q box car: 1 1/4" truss rods.

Railway Master Mechanic, February 1902, page 42, Delaware, Lackawanna & Western box car: Four 1 1/8" truss rods.

Railway Master Mechanic, April 1902, page 117, AT&SF box & stock cars: Four 1 1/4" truss rods with ends upset to 1 1/2 inch.

The Railroad Gazette, November 3, 1905, page 421, Chicago, Rock Island & Pacific combination stock and drop bottom car: Truss rods 1 1/2 " diameter.

Railway Master Mechanic, January 1907, page 24, Boston & Maine box cars: Four 1 1/8" truss rods with enlarged ends.

Gene Green


Re: Accurail 40' Steel Plug Door Refrigerator Car

Ray Thibaut
 

Bill and Frank,
Thank you for your guidance. I appreciate your information.
Ray Thibaut


Re: Modeling truss rods

Nelson Moyer <ku0a@...>
 

I visited the Colorado Railroad Museum last fall, and while I didn't measure
the diameter of truss rods on the cars out there, I would estimate that they
were between 5/8 in. and 7/8 in. in diameter. Considering the absence of an
authoritative response to this thread, I'll actually measure the next car I
see. To do prototype modeling of 7/8 in. truss rods, you would use 0.010 in.
wire, monofilament, or surgical nylon.



Nelson

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of
robertm
Sent: Thursday, May 10, 2012 5:33 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Modeling truss rods





Have no idea, I do have photos of the car, and the truss rods on the model
look very good to me. My modeler friend got this recommendation from someone
who models a lot of truss rod cars. My truss rods are on a passenger car not
freight. The car is a Central Vermont 300 series truss rod coach built in
1912, later steel sheathed.

Bob Moeller

--- In STMFC@... <mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com> ,
timboconnor@... wrote:


That sounds too large to me. How large is the prototype truss rod
(diameter)?

Tim O'Connor

----- Original Message -----
From: "robertm" <robertmoeller47@...>
To: STMFC@... <mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, May 9, 2012 7:47:06 AM
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Modeling truss rods

At the recommendation of a modeler better than me I used

.025" music wire from K&S Engineering. You can find it at Walthers.

The good thing about this is its steel just like the prototype.

Bob Moeller





Re: Kadee's new generation of trucks

Nolan Hinshaw
 

On May 9, 2012, at 11:59 AM, Andy Harman wrote:

At 10:09 AM 5/9/2012 -0700, you wrote:
Kadee's own code 88 wheels work just fine, and the trucks are
available with them (or soon will be)
Must have missed that. I was looking around the web site but didn't look
under wheel sets.

Rip Van Harman

I *hate* it when *my* beard gets all over the keyboard.
ObContent: I can second the recommendation for the Kadee wheelsets.
--
"Not only is it not right, it's not even wrong!"
Wolfgang Pauli, perpetrator of the Pauli Exclusion Principle


Re: History of Prototype Freight Car Modeling

rwitt_2000
 

Bill Welch wrote:

As some of you will remember from posts I made in the fall of 2011, I
want to put together materials to create a history of modeling freight
cars more accurately and more prototypically. I now have some good
materials about the early offerings of Al Westerfield and the materials
that publicized the releases of Westrail and Dennis Storzek. F&C is
putting some materials together for me and I will be talking w/Martin
about Sunshine's initial offerings.

Here are somethings I need your help with.

Bill Clouser's articles on using rubber molds and polyester (was that
the material?) to make copies of parts, components, etc. Not sure of the
dates or how many articles there were. Ned scans of at least one of
these.
In addition to Bill Clouser's articles I personally believe that Jack
Work should be added to the list of early pioneers. I recall his was the
first article published describing how to cast detail parts to match a
specific prototype. He built a wood flat car and cast the parts to
represent the pawl and ratchet, stack pockets, and the nut and bolt
detail for the truss rods. He introduced the concept of spending a lot
of time to make very good "masters" and then cast many duplicates for
the model. His articles were published in MR.

Bob Witt


Re: Modeling truss rods

robertm <robertmoeller47@...>
 

Have no idea, I do have photos of the car, and the truss rods on the model look very good to me. My modeler friend got this recommendation from someone who models a lot of truss rod cars. My truss rods are on a passenger car not freight. The car is a Central Vermont 300 series truss rod coach built in 1912, later steel sheathed.

Bob Moeller

--- In STMFC@..., timboconnor@... wrote:


That sounds too large to me. How large is the prototype truss rod (diameter)?

Tim O'Connor

----- Original Message -----
From: "robertm" <robertmoeller47@...>
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Wednesday, May 9, 2012 7:47:06 AM
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Modeling truss rods

At the recommendation of a modeler better than me I used

.025" music wire from K&S Engineering. You can find it at Walthers.

The good thing about this is its steel just like the prototype.

Bob Moeller



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: Let's talk about ladders.

Monk Alan <Alan.Monk@...>
 

Pierre/all,

One of the specialist UK manufacturers (Model Signal Engineering http://www.modelsignals.com/4mm_scale_frame.htm) makes such etched ladders (long ones, for fitting to signal posts) with etched stiles, wire rungs and the all-important assembly jig. I've built a couple of his 30' ladders for signals on my UK layout and they really do look the part. Not that fiddly either, once you get into the swing of making them.

I hadn't thought to check the rung spacing to see if they were also applicable to HO freight cars (the width, of course, is set by the rung length). I'll have another look at them over the weekend at Derby show, where MSE have their usual stand.

To do a ladder as a single etch, I think it would have to be a double-sided etch to avoid the flat rung look, which adds to cost and difficulty. I know a chap over here who produces such double-sided etched parts for loco detailing (his roof fan grilles have to be seen to be believed, he's captured the 'woven' wire look brilliantly!) and ask him some basic questions (likely cost/difficulty/etc)

I have tried the DA moulded ones - personally, I found them too fragile, with a high proportion of split ladders just taking them off the sprue (using either my fine sprue-nippers or carefully with a brand new scalpel blade)

Regards,
Alan Monk
London, UK





Posted by: "Pierre" pierre.oliver@... <mailto:pierre.oliver@...?Subject=%20Re%3A%20Let%27s%20talk%20about%20ladders%2E> pierreoliver2003 <http://profiles.yahoo.com/pierreoliver2003>
Wed May 9, 2012 6:59 am (PDT)


Lately I've been thinking about available car ladders.
Generally, I'm not pleased with the overall quality of most of the commercial offerings. Badly rendered rungs, oversized stiles, etc.
So I'd like to generate an informal poll here, to try and establish if there's a desire for better ladders and what form that might take.

I'm particularly fond of the approach Ted Cullotta took with the Miner ladders in the Wabash AAR kitbash in a box. He supplied a set of photo-etched stiles that had the holes for grabs etched in and the modeler had to bend the stile into the angle shape and insert individual rungs from wire. Tedious but very effective. Looks great as well!

Another approach is to etch the entire ladder, while still requiring the stiles to be folded to create the correct angle look. The downside is the rungs are flat in profile.

The first etched approach would also create an option for a variety of rung spacings.

What's your thoughts?




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Re: History of Prototype Freight Car Modeling Gould/TichyIMWX timeframe.

Andy Harman
 

At 07:37 PM 5/9/2012 -0400, you wrote:
(who has yet to release a model in sync with an article about it!)
Well the Pullmans were within 20 years of the Hundman articles....

Andy


Re: History of Prototype Freight Car Modeling

Steve and Barb Hile
 

Before there was Prototype Modeler magazine, Robert Longo had Southwestern
Prototype Modeler and Western Prototype Modeler. The latter appears to have
grown from the former through the addition of UP and SP etc. material to
ATSF which appears to have evolved from the old Santa Fe Modelers
Association going back into the late 60's. The first WPM was Jan 1975.



I started getting them because they also had Rock Island modeling
information which, to me, was in short supply in MR and RMC of that era,
mostly because I missed the cool stuff that Al Kamm (junior, who is my
senior) was doing in MR in the late 1950's. Al was certainly one of the
early prototype modelers, doing mostly scratchbuilding.



When I came to the Chicago area in 1973, I was amazed at the amount of
railroad (especially steam locomotive) photos that were available. I bought
a lot from Don Gruber, who still sells at Wheaton each month.



I am sure that the burgeoning of RR historical societies in the 1970's
contributed greatly to the expansion of prototype modeling. It was through
the RI society that I met people who shared data and photographs, including
a lot of steam era freight cars.



Of course the launching of Mainline Modeler in the 1980's and the
progression of magazines edited by Bob Schleicher were a major contributor.
Prolific authors, including John Nehrich and Richard Hendrickson showed us
the better way. I still have copies of Richard's The Car Report newsletter
for the Freight Car Data Exchange information sharing group, something that
preceded the internet lists.



Considering the wealth of information and the ease of finding and sharing
this information, we are, truly, living in a golden age! It is certainly
true that go information leads to better models.



Here's to future of the past!



Steve Hile



_____

From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of
Pieter_Roos
Sent: Wednesday, May 09, 2012 2:22 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Re: History of Prototype Freight Car Modeling





Hi Bill;

I think you will find this history of Pacific Rail Shops on the S Scale Sig
site interesting, as it connects PRS, IMWX and Front Range with specific
products and dates:

http://sscale.org/426/volume-1-no-2-the-prs-story/

Vol. 1, No. 1 of Prototype Modeler magazine is available on-line at
Trainlife.com:

http://www.trainlife.com/magazines/model-train-magazine-contents/790/prototy
pe-modeler-august-1977

I may be able to find some of the RPI materials you ask about.

Hope that helps.

Pieter Roos

--- In STMFC@... <mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com> , "lnbill"
<fgexbill@...> wrote:

As some of you will remember from posts I made in the fall of 2011, I want
to put together materials to create a history of modeling freight cars more
accurately and more prototypically. I now have some good materials about the
early offerings of Al Westerfield and the materials that publicized the
releases of Westrail and Dennis Storzek. F&C is putting some materials
together for me and I will be talking w/Martin about Sunshine's initial
offerings.


Let's talk about ladders.

Robert kirkham
 

photos have been approved and can be found at <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/STMFC/photos/album/219763914/pic/list>.

Rob


Let's talk about ladders.

Robert kirkham
 

the CP 1937 boxcars.

Rob

--------------------------------------------------
From: "Jim Hayes" <jimhayes97225@...>
Sent: Wednesday, May 09, 2012 8:03 PM
To: <STMFC@...>
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Let's talk about ladders.

Rob, what TLT model is it for?
Jim Hayes


Re: Kadee's new generation of trucks

Jon Miller <atsf@...>
 

On 5/9/2012 6:45 PM, Anthony Thompson wrote:
Actually they call it "Heavy Gravity Compound."
Looked this stuff up and it's a very interesting material. They
are using it for bullets! It could be used with normal injected models,
say the underframe and the cars would not need weight. I see a use in
flat cars. But, it's expensive.

--
Jon Miller
For me time stopped in 1941
Digitrax--Chief/Zephyr systems, JMRI User
NMRA Life member #2623
Member SFRH&MS


Re: Let's talk about ladders.

Steve SANDIFER
 

Clever!
______________
J. Stephen (Steve) Sandifer
mailto:steve.sandifer@...
Home: 12027 Mulholland Drive, Meadows Place, TX 77477, 281-568-9918
Office: Southwest Central Church of Christ, 4011 W. Bellfort, Houston, TX 77025, 713-667-9417

----- Original Message -----
From: pullmanboss
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Wednesday, May 09, 2012 7:53 PM
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Let's talk about ladders.



Or just roll your own:

http://www.pullmanproject.com/Ladders.pdf

Tom Madden


Re: Let's talk about ladders.

Jim Hayes
 

Rob, what TLT model is it for?

Jim Hayes

On Wed, May 9, 2012 at 7:31 PM, Rob Kirkham <rdkirkham@...> wrote:

I've posted two photos of my most recent effort at printed ladders in a
folder titled "rp ladders", which is waiting approval from the moderators.
Hopefully this link will work:
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/STMFC/photos/album/219763914/pic/list>.

The ladder shown is simply laid on the side of the TLT model. I modelled
both end and side ladders and included two of each in a set. I've also
printed a drilling jig to assist precisely drilling mounting holes to fit
the mounting pins built into the design. The ladders only arrived in
yesterday's mail, so I haven't installed them yet.

The ladders are drawn with Google Sketchup's free software. I had them
printed in the US by ADC (thanks to advice from list member Brian Bussey)
as
I was not happy with the service at Shapeways.

This process allows one to design and model any style of ladder in HO or
larger - with different rungs spacing, width or stile designs, etc. I
expect that the longer the rungs have to be, the more risk there is that
they won't turn out. In a box of 80 ladders I found two rejects. One has
a
rung that isn't attached at one end - easily repaired with CA. The other
was missing a whole chunk - it will go onto a gon . . . .

But as I say - they are not cheap. I've not been careful counting the
pennies as this is a personal project (a fleet of about 25 cars), but I
think they are coming in at about $11 for a set of 4.

Rob

On May 9, 2012, at 4:35 AM, Rob Kirkham wrote:

I've printed off a set of ladders using rapid prototyping. They have
scale
stiles, .2 mm rungs and (as they are for Canadian boxcars) built in
place
stirrup steps which at .3 mm thickness are noticeably closer to scale
than
anything I have used - molded or etched. They are flexible, rugged to a
degree - and take paint well. I'll try to post a photo this evening when
I
get home from work. The price isn't cheap, but they allow one to design
any
style of ladder imaginable.

Rob Kirkham

--------------------------------------------------
From: <jerryglow@...>
Sent: Wednesday, May 09, 2012 7:21 AM
To: <STMFC@...>
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Let's talk about ladders.

The PE stiles w/ wire rungs approach would allow for wider ladders
used
by
some but individual artwork (easy enough) would have to be done for
different rung spacing.

Jerry Glow

--- In STMFC@..., "Pierre" <pierre.oliver@...> wrote:

Lately I've been thinking about available car ladders.
Generally, I'm not pleased with the overall quality of most of the
commercial offerings. Badly rendered rungs, oversized stiles, etc.
So I'd like to generate an informal poll here, to try and establish
if
there's a desire for better ladders and what form that might take.

I'm particularly fond of the approach Ted Cullotta took with the
Miner
ladders in the Wabash AAR kitbash in a box. He supplied a set of
photo-etched stiles that had the holes for grabs etched in and the
modeler had to bend the stile into the angle shape and insert
individual
rungs from wire. Tedious but very effective. Looks great as well!

Another approach is to etch the entire ladder, while still requiring
the
stiles to be folded to create the correct angle look. The downside is
the
rungs are flat in profile.

The first etched approach would also create an option for a variety
of
rung spacings.

What's your thoughts?

Pierre Oliver
www.elgincarshops.com







------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links




------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links




Let's talk about ladders.

Robert kirkham
 

I've posted two photos of my most recent effort at printed ladders in a folder titled "rp ladders", which is waiting approval from the moderators. Hopefully this link will work: <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/STMFC/photos/album/219763914/pic/list>.

The ladder shown is simply laid on the side of the TLT model. I modelled both end and side ladders and included two of each in a set. I've also printed a drilling jig to assist precisely drilling mounting holes to fit the mounting pins built into the design. The ladders only arrived in yesterday's mail, so I haven't installed them yet.

The ladders are drawn with Google Sketchup's free software. I had them printed in the US by ADC (thanks to advice from list member Brian Bussey) as I was not happy with the service at Shapeways.

This process allows one to design and model any style of ladder in HO or larger - with different rungs spacing, width or stile designs, etc. I expect that the longer the rungs have to be, the more risk there is that they won't turn out. In a box of 80 ladders I found two rejects. One has a rung that isn't attached at one end - easily repaired with CA. The other was missing a whole chunk - it will go onto a gon . . . .

But as I say - they are not cheap. I've not been careful counting the pennies as this is a personal project (a fleet of about 25 cars), but I think they are coming in at about $11 for a set of 4.

Rob

On May 9, 2012, at 4:35 AM, Rob Kirkham wrote:

I've printed off a set of ladders using rapid prototyping. They have scale
stiles, .2 mm rungs and (as they are for Canadian boxcars) built in place
stirrup steps which at .3 mm thickness are noticeably closer to scale than
anything I have used - molded or etched. They are flexible, rugged to a
degree - and take paint well. I'll try to post a photo this evening when I
get home from work. The price isn't cheap, but they allow one to design any
style of ladder imaginable.

Rob Kirkham

--------------------------------------------------
From: <jerryglow@...>
Sent: Wednesday, May 09, 2012 7:21 AM
To: <STMFC@...>
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Let's talk about ladders.

The PE stiles w/ wire rungs approach would allow for wider ladders used by
some but individual artwork (easy enough) would have to be done for
different rung spacing.

Jerry Glow

--- In STMFC@..., "Pierre" <pierre.oliver@...> wrote:

Lately I've been thinking about available car ladders.
Generally, I'm not pleased with the overall quality of most of the
commercial offerings. Badly rendered rungs, oversized stiles, etc.
So I'd like to generate an informal poll here, to try and establish if
there's a desire for better ladders and what form that might take.

I'm particularly fond of the approach Ted Cullotta took with the Miner
ladders in the Wabash AAR kitbash in a box. He supplied a set of
photo-etched stiles that had the holes for grabs etched in and the
modeler had to bend the stile into the angle shape and insert individual
rungs from wire. Tedious but very effective. Looks great as well!

Another approach is to etch the entire ladder, while still requiring the
stiles to be folded to create the correct angle look. The downside is the
rungs are flat in profile.

The first etched approach would also create an option for a variety of
rung spacings.

What's your thoughts?

Pierre Oliver
www.elgincarshops.com






------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links




Re: History of Prototype Freight Car Modeling Gould/TichyIMWX timeframe.

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Bill Schneider wrote:
Bill hits on a very valid point here. As he puts it, the efforts of
authors like “Messers. Hawkins, Wider and Long”, Richard
Hendrickson, and others through the support of Bob Schleicher and
Rail Model Journal contributed a great deal to promote knowledge
about both prototypes and available (or soon to be available) models
of the same and went a VERY long way IMO in not only popularizing
the movement, but (gasp!) showing modelers what was correct and what
was... well... not so correct.
This is quite true, Bill, so thanks for stating it. Richard
has always believed, and often said, that the key to getting better
models is to get better information out there, for manufacturers to
use and for modelers to measure against their models. He has done that
for quite a few years, and his encouragement was one of the driving forces behind the PFE book--which as many of us realize, led promptly,
upon its publication, to several MUCH improved PFE commercial models.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Kadee's new generation of trucks

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

John Golden wrote:
. . . I also interviewed Sam Clarke for the article and discussed the HGC (Heavy Grade Compound) material in depth.
Actually they call it "Heavy Gravity Compound." I talked to Sam about it a few days ago.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Let's talk about ladders.

Tom Madden
 

Or just roll your own:

http://www.pullmanproject.com/Ladders.pdf

Tom Madden

86581 - 86600 of 195368