Date   

CNW boxcar 47688

Tim Meyer
 

Hi All

Does anyone have any information on CNW boxcar 47688 that is at the Mill Museum in Neligh Nebraska? Any Specs, lot number. Recommendations on models in HO.

Thanks

Tim Meyer


Re: X29 questions . . .

soolinehistory <destorzek@...>
 

--- In STMFC@..., "Brian" <cornbeltroute@...> wrote:

Couple of questions, if I might:

1 - At the top joint between the car sides and the Z-bar angle, is the vertical rivet strip the Z-bar angle itself? That is, are the car sides riveted to the inside vertical surface of the Z-bar angle? I ask because I wonder if that riveted strip is 3-1/8" deep (the Z-bar angle's vertical flanges are each 3-1/8" wide, the horizontal flat 4-1/16", iirc). And, that top riveted strip seems rounder than other photos of Z-angle bars I've seen (such as the vertical Z posts on certain covered hopper car types).
Brian,

The drawing in the 1922 Car Builder's Cyc. calls out 4"-10.3 lb.Z for the top chords of the sides. I don't have a structural steel section reference handy, and this section could possibly now be obsolete, but the sectional drawing in the CBC gives a dimension of 2-13/16" between the top of the web and top of the flange as the section is installed. If your 3-1/8" dimension is taken from the other side of the web, that would indicate a web thickness of 5/16", which sounds about r1ght. To me the call-out says this is a standard structural shape (not a foregone conclusion in more modern car designs). If you need more detailed dimensions this web site has dimensional data on structural steel, both current and historical sections.

http://www.aisc.org/content.aspx?id=2868

The "top riveted strip" would be the ends of the roof sheets, which lap over the outside of the up-standing flange; I would expect this tight bend to actually have a small die formed radius, but don't have access to nay drawings that actually specify it. Roof sheets from the fifties used a 1" radius bend at this location.

Dennis


NPRHA Butte MT Convention RPM (Modeling) Day July 21, 2012

leakinmywaders
 

Northern Pacific Railway Historical Association

2012 Annual Swap, Sale, and Railroad Prototype Modelers Meet

Saturday July 21, 2012 Butte Montana

All events in the restored NP depot, Butte Front Street Station, 800 E. Front Street, Butte

All Railroads—All Scales Saturday Admission Free to All

Railroad Prototype Modelers Meet and Display, 9am to 4pm. Come and look and talk, but we encourage all to bring railroad models to share, in progress or completed for display. Each model displayed will win a ticket to a 4pm raffle for prizes.
Model displays will be secure and closely monitored by NPRHA personnel

Swap Meet and Sale of models, books, and railway collectibles from 9am to Noon. In addition, the NPRHA Company Store will be open for sales of books, DVDs, and exclusive model kits in HO, N, and O scales.

Modeling Presentations from 11am through 4pm every hour, on the hour
Presenters Include Richard Yaremko, Aaron Gjermundson, Jim Ruffing, Bill Seifert, Chris Frissell, Dean O'Neill
• Modeling the NP's mechanical refrigerator cars
• Easy to model SP&S freight cars
• Butte and western MT railroads in the 1960s and early 1970s: Matt Herson photos
• Patternmaking techniques for cast resin models
• Cab roof and caboose model color interpretations
• Slide show of NP and Butte area modeling, layouts and dioramas

Questions: Chris Frissell, email leakinmywaders[at]yahoo[dot]com

Please consider attending all events at the NPRHA's Annual Convention on July 18-21, 2012 at the Butte depot. Registration and additional information at www.nprha.org

Posted by Chris Frissell
Polson, MT


Re: More.....RPM--Re: Jon Cagle

Bill Welch
 

Just to keep the record straight Jon currently offers five different tank car kits and IIRC he intends to release two more, at least one of which will be a jacketed insulated model.

Bill Welch

--- In STMFC@..., "Mike Brock" <brockm@...> wrote:

Tom Madden says:

"I suspect, in the case Mike cited, that Jon considers himself a
subcontractor."

Yes...but Jon is also a commercial architectural model builder. What does
that mean as far as being an OEM? Nothing in the case I referenced. IOW, Jon
wears several hats. He IS a subcontractor when he makes parts for the Shake
N Take, but that is a VERY minor part of the SC&F business. In that realm he
produces kits...4 Harriman cars, several O scale cars and currently 3 HO
scale tank cars [ if I have the numbers right ]. In that case he is
certainly an OEM...if I understand the definition.

Dennis Storzek writes:

"Jon Cagle is in the same class as Tom is himself... a resin caster who will
do custom work."

Yes, but...again...it is a VERY small part of his SC&F business...which is
the manufacture of kits for sale. Yes, he does purchase some minor
parts...including brass rod...and even resin.

Mike Brock


Re: More.....RPM

Mikebrock
 

Tom Madden says:

"I suspect, in the case Mike cited, that Jon considers himself a subcontractor."

Yes...but Jon is also a commercial architectural model builder. What does that mean as far as being an OEM? Nothing in the case I referenced. IOW, Jon wears several hats. He IS a subcontractor when he makes parts for the Shake N Take, but that is a VERY minor part of the SC&F business. In that realm he produces kits...4 Harriman cars, several O scale cars and currently 3 HO scale tank cars [ if I have the numbers right ]. In that case he is certainly an OEM...if I understand the definition.

Dennis Storzek writes:

"Jon Cagle is in the same class as Tom is himself... a resin caster who will do custom work."

Yes, but...again...it is a VERY small part of his SC&F business...which is the manufacture of kits for sale. Yes, he does purchase some minor parts...including brass rod...and even resin.

Mike Brock


Re: X29 questions . . .

Don Burn
 

Ed,

Use the Kalmbach seach at http://trc.trains.com/magazineindex with X29
then have a second window or tab open to trainlife. Trainlife's search is
lacking since most of the magazines are not indexed.

Don Burn

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of
eshoben
Sent: Sunday, May 20, 2012 4:54 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Re: X29 questions . . .

Brian-

Can you tell me what search term you used on trainlife to look for X-29
boxcar information? I entered both "X29" and "X-29" and came up empty.
Richard's 1987 Model Railroading piece is not on trainlife.com to the best
of my knowledge.

Thanks for your help.

Ed Shoben

--- In STMFC@..., "Brian" <cornbeltroute@...> wrote:

I've read the latest issue of RPCyc, which contains an extensive treatise
on the X29/ARA box cars. Also, from TrainLife I've downloaded a number of
articles (mainly authored by Richard H.) on the subject.

Couple of questions, if I might:

1 - At the top joint between the car sides and the Z-bar angle, is the
vertical rivet strip the Z-bar angle itself? That is, are the car sides
riveted to the inside vertical surface of the Z-bar angle? I ask because I
wonder if that riveted strip is 3-1/8" deep (the Z-bar angle's vertical
flanges are each 3-1/8" wide, the horizontal flat 4-1/16", iirc). And, that
top riveted strip seems rounder than other photos of Z-angle bars I've seen
(such as the vertical Z posts on certain covered hopper car types).

2 - The patch panels applied to repair the rusted out bottoms of the car
sides, were they individual sections that matched the width of the side
panels, or were they one piece running from the car ends to the doorway?

Thanks much,

Brian Chapman
Evansdale, Iowa



------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links


Re: X29 questions . . .

eshoben <eshoben@...>
 

Brian-

Can you tell me what search term you used on trainlife to look for X-29 boxcar information? I entered both "X29" and "X-29" and came up empty. Richard's 1987 Model Railroading piece is not on trainlife.com to the best of my knowledge.

Thanks for your help.

Ed Shoben

--- In STMFC@..., "Brian" <cornbeltroute@...> wrote:

I've read the latest issue of RPCyc, which contains an extensive treatise on the X29/ARA box cars. Also, from TrainLife I've downloaded a number of articles (mainly authored by Richard H.) on the subject.

Couple of questions, if I might:

1 - At the top joint between the car sides and the Z-bar angle, is the vertical rivet strip the Z-bar angle itself? That is, are the car sides riveted to the inside vertical surface of the Z-bar angle? I ask because I wonder if that riveted strip is 3-1/8" deep (the Z-bar angle's vertical flanges are each 3-1/8" wide, the horizontal flat 4-1/16", iirc). And, that top riveted strip seems rounder than other photos of Z-angle bars I've seen (such as the vertical Z posts on certain covered hopper car types).

2 - The patch panels applied to repair the rusted out bottoms of the car sides, were they individual sections that matched the width of the side panels, or were they one piece running from the car ends to the doorway?

Thanks much,

Brian Chapman
Evansdale, Iowa


Re: Roofwalk Reattachment

Jim Betz
 

Hi,

Have you considered using Krystal Klear? It dries clear and
becomes 'invisible'. And if you don't like it you can soak the
top of the car in water for a couple of hours and remove it.
- Jim


Re: X29 questions . . .

Bruce Smith
 

Brian,

Patch panels on X29s were of both types. Early in the program, they seemed more often to be covering individual panels, and frequently would only cover the panels that had rust, leaving some panels with no patches and others with them. In addition, the panels might vary in height. In other cases, patch panels were applied that were continuous between the end of the car and the door. In addition, there has been a lot of discussion on whether these panels were applied with the origianl panel overlapping over or under the patch. While the former seems more water-tight, photo evidence suggests that most patches were simply applied over the original panels, with a top weld bead providing the seal. Patch panels could also be applied either by riveting or later, welding.

As for question #1, I'll leave that to the car construction eggs-perts <G>.

Regards
Bruce Smith
Auburn, AL
Join the PRRT&HS! www.prrths.com
________________________________________
From: STMFC@... [STMFC@...] on behalf of Brian [cornbeltroute@...]
Sent: Saturday, May 19, 2012 3:11 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] X29 questions . . .

I've read the latest issue of RPCyc, which contains an extensive treatise on the X29/ARA box cars. Also, from TrainLife I've downloaded a number of articles (mainly authored by Richard H.) on the subject.

Couple of questions, if I might:

1 - At the top joint between the car sides and the Z-bar angle, is the vertical rivet strip the Z-bar angle itself? That is, are the car sides riveted to the inside vertical surface of the Z-bar angle? I ask because I wonder if that riveted strip is 3-1/8" deep (the Z-bar angle's vertical flanges are each 3-1/8" wide, the horizontal flat 4-1/16", iirc). And, that top riveted strip seems rounder than other photos of Z-angle bars I've seen (such as the vertical Z posts on certain covered hopper car types).

2 - The patch panels applied to repair the rusted out bottoms of the car sides, were they individual sections that matched the width of the side panels, or were they one piece running from the car ends to the doorway?

Thanks much,

Brian Chapman
Evansdale, Iowa



------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links



http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/


Re: Atlas plugdoor boxcar

Ed Hawkins
 

On May 19, 2012, at 11:10 PM, steel77086@... wrote:

Thanks for the information on this car.
Vince,
Something I neglected to mention in my previous reply was the reporting
marks for these Fruit Growers Express 40' insulated box cars, which was
RBNX. Over a 10 year period there were 2,394 cars of essentially the
same design, but with several variations, built by three builders
(PC&F, FGE, AC&F). More than 2,000 of them were built within the time
period of this discussion group.
Regards,
Ed Hawkins


Re: Atlas plugdoor boxcar

steel77086@...
 

Ed and Bill,

Thanks for the information on this car.

Vince Altiere

In a message dated 5/19/2012 5:52:01 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
hawk0621@... writes:


On May 19, 2012, at 3:51 PM, vincent wrote:

Has anyone seen the photo of an undecorated plug door boxcar on the
Atlas website? Is it a totally new model? a rerun? a former
Brannchline kit? Is it aooropriate for this group's era? What roads
might have used it? Any other comments?
Vince,
From what I can tell from the model on the Atlas web site, it
represents the Fruit Growers Express 80000-80999 series 40' insulated
box cars (RB) built in late-1952 to early 1953. The first 500 cars were
built by Pacific Car & Foundry and the last 500 by FGE at their Indiana
Harbor Shops. These were the only FGE 40' RB cars having early Improved
Dreadnaught ends with "rolling pin shape" main corrugations and high
end placards. The prototype cars had 10-panel riveted sides, 8' clear
door openings covered with Youngstown Sliding Flush Doors, and diagonal
panel roofs.

Atlas has followed a number of other manufacturers by missing the fact
that the top main corrugation is asymmetrical about its horizontal
center line on the Improved Dreadnaught ends used on the prototype
cars. The lower portion of this corrugation should be essentially
straight across.

http://www.atlastrainman.com/HOFreight/tmho40plugdoorbc.htm

More FGE 40' RB cars of this general type were built in 1955 by AC&F
and later by FGE-Alexandria Shops with late-version Improved
Dreadnaught ends and low end placards among some other differences.

It seems unlikely to me that any of the Branchline Trains tooling for
their 50' RB box car was used for this Atlas model.

FGE historian Bill Welch, please come to my rescue if I've messed up
anything!
Regards,
Ed Hawkins

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links


Re: Roofwalk Reattachment

jerryglow2
 

And if the fit has gotten sloppy or when using on other cars, I make press fit retainers of sheet stryene squares under the roof.

Jerry Glow

--- In STMFC@..., Todd Horton <toddchorton@...> wrote:

Michael, "IF" these are on Kadee cars then the roof walks are a press fit. I have taken them off and put them back on with just finger pressure.


Todd Horton


________________________________
From: atsfnut <michaelEGross@...>
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Saturday, May 19, 2012 6:53 PM
Subject: [STMFC] Roofwalk Reattachment



 

Dear All,
Does anyone have any ideas about re-attaching roofwalks that have popped
up ?
One or two places on my Kadee PS-1 Apex roofwalks have worked themselves
loose from their roof rib supports, and I am curious to know if there is
any some handy way to reattach them without removing the entire walk.
The Kadee roofwalks are, I believe, an engineering plastic.
Any advice as to materials or techniques would be much appreciated.
Many thanks!
Michael GrossLa Canada, CA

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: Roofwalk Reattachment

Todd Horton
 

Michael, "IF" these are on Kadee cars then the roof walks are a press fit. I have taken them off and put them back on with just finger pressure.


Todd Horton


________________________________
From: atsfnut <michaelEGross@...>
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Saturday, May 19, 2012 6:53 PM
Subject: [STMFC] Roofwalk Reattachment



 

Dear All,
Does anyone have any ideas about re-attaching roofwalks that have popped
up ?
One or two places on my Kadee PS-1 Apex roofwalks have worked themselves
loose from their roof rib supports, and I am curious to know if there is
any some handy way to reattach them without removing the entire walk.
The Kadee roofwalks are, I believe, an engineering plastic.
Any advice as to materials or techniques would be much appreciated.
Many thanks!
Michael GrossLa Canada, CA






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Roofwalk Reattachment

atsfnut <michaelEGross@...>
 

Dear All,
Does anyone have any ideas about re-attaching roofwalks that have popped
up ?
One or two places on my Kadee PS-1 Apex roofwalks have worked themselves
loose from their roof rib supports, and I am curious to know if there is
any some handy way to reattach them without removing the entire walk.
The Kadee roofwalks are, I believe, an engineering plastic.
Any advice as to materials or techniques would be much appreciated.
Many thanks!
Michael GrossLa Canada, CA


Re: Atlas plugdoor boxcar

Bill Welch
 

You explained the FGE owned cars flawlessly Ed.

Bill Welch

--- In STMFC@..., Ed Hawkins <hawk0621@...> wrote:


On May 19, 2012, at 3:51 PM, vincent wrote:

Has anyone seen the photo of an undecorated plug door boxcar on the
Atlas website? Is it a totally new model? a rerun? a former
Brannchline kit? Is it aooropriate for this group's era? What roads
might have used it? Any other comments?
Vince,
From what I can tell from the model on the Atlas web site, it
represents the Fruit Growers Express 80000-80999 series 40' insulated
box cars (RB) built in late-1952 to early 1953. The first 500 cars were
built by Pacific Car & Foundry and the last 500 by FGE at their Indiana
Harbor Shops. These were the only FGE 40' RB cars having early Improved
Dreadnaught ends with "rolling pin shape" main corrugations and high
end placards. The prototype cars had 10-panel riveted sides, 8' clear
door openings covered with Youngstown Sliding Flush Doors, and diagonal
panel roofs.

Atlas has followed a number of other manufacturers by missing the fact
that the top main corrugation is asymmetrical about its horizontal
center line on the Improved Dreadnaught ends used on the prototype
cars. The lower portion of this corrugation should be essentially
straight across.

http://www.atlastrainman.com/HOFreight/tmho40plugdoorbc.htm

More FGE 40' RB cars of this general type were built in 1955 by AC&F
and later by FGE-Alexandria Shops with late-version Improved
Dreadnaught ends and low end placards among some other differences.

It seems unlikely to me that any of the Branchline Trains tooling for
their 50' RB box car was used for this Atlas model.

FGE historian Bill Welch, please come to my rescue if I've messed up
anything!
Regards,
Ed Hawkins

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: Atlas plugdoor boxcar

Ed Hawkins
 

On May 19, 2012, at 3:51 PM, vincent wrote:

Has anyone seen the photo of an undecorated plug door boxcar on the
Atlas website? Is it a totally new model? a rerun? a former
Brannchline kit? Is it aooropriate for this group's era? What roads
might have used it? Any other comments?
Vince,
From what I can tell from the model on the Atlas web site, it
represents the Fruit Growers Express 80000-80999 series 40' insulated
box cars (RB) built in late-1952 to early 1953. The first 500 cars were
built by Pacific Car & Foundry and the last 500 by FGE at their Indiana
Harbor Shops. These were the only FGE 40' RB cars having early Improved
Dreadnaught ends with "rolling pin shape" main corrugations and high
end placards. The prototype cars had 10-panel riveted sides, 8' clear
door openings covered with Youngstown Sliding Flush Doors, and diagonal
panel roofs.

Atlas has followed a number of other manufacturers by missing the fact
that the top main corrugation is asymmetrical about its horizontal
center line on the Improved Dreadnaught ends used on the prototype
cars. The lower portion of this corrugation should be essentially
straight across.

http://www.atlastrainman.com/HOFreight/tmho40plugdoorbc.htm

More FGE 40' RB cars of this general type were built in 1955 by AC&F
and later by FGE-Alexandria Shops with late-version Improved
Dreadnaught ends and low end placards among some other differences.

It seems unlikely to me that any of the Branchline Trains tooling for
their 50' RB box car was used for this Atlas model.

FGE historian Bill Welch, please come to my rescue if I've messed up
anything!
Regards,
Ed Hawkins


Re: Atlas plugdoor boxcar

jerryglow2
 

It says Trainman which has been their slightly lower quality line with molded on detail and does not represent any Branchline model I'm aware of.

Jerry Glow

--- In STMFC@..., "vincent" <steel77086@...> wrote:

To The Group,

Has anyone seen the photo of an undecorated plug door boxcar on the Atlas website? Is it a totally new model? a rerun? a former Brannchline kit? Is it aooropriate for this group's era? What roads might have used it? Any other comments?

Vince Altiere


Atlas plugdoor boxcar

vincent <steel77086@...>
 

To The Group,

Has anyone seen the photo of an undecorated plug door boxcar on the Atlas website? Is it a totally new model? a rerun? a former Brannchline kit? Is it aooropriate for this group's era? What roads might have used it? Any other comments?

Vince Altiere


Re: X29 questions . . .

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Brian Chapman wrote:
2 - The patch panels applied to repair the rusted out bottoms of the car sides, were they individual sections that matched the width of the side panels, or were they one piece running from the car ends to the doorway?
Yes. But usually separate pieces.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


X29 questions . . .

Brian <cornbeltroute@...>
 

I've read the latest issue of RPCyc, which contains an extensive treatise on the X29/ARA box cars. Also, from TrainLife I've downloaded a number of articles (mainly authored by Richard H.) on the subject.

Couple of questions, if I might:

1 - At the top joint between the car sides and the Z-bar angle, is the vertical rivet strip the Z-bar angle itself? That is, are the car sides riveted to the inside vertical surface of the Z-bar angle? I ask because I wonder if that riveted strip is 3-1/8" deep (the Z-bar angle's vertical flanges are each 3-1/8" wide, the horizontal flat 4-1/16", iirc). And, that top riveted strip seems rounder than other photos of Z-angle bars I've seen (such as the vertical Z posts on certain covered hopper car types).

2 - The patch panels applied to repair the rusted out bottoms of the car sides, were they individual sections that matched the width of the side panels, or were they one piece running from the car ends to the doorway?

Thanks much,

Brian Chapman
Evansdale, Iowa

86541 - 86560 of 195563