Date   

30 Days to St. Louis RPM 2012

golden1014
 

2012 ST. LOUIS RAILROAD PROTOTYPE MODELER'S (RPM) MEET
 
The SIXTH ANNUAL St. Louis RPM Meet will be held on Friday, July 27th and Saturday, July 28th at the Gateway Convention Center, One Gateway Drive, Collinsville, IL 62234.  Collinsville is 12 miles east of metro St. Louis on I-55/70.  Meet Hours: 9 AM to 9 PM both days.  Our latest flyers can be found at http://home.mindspring.com/~icg/rpm/stlrpm.pdf or just Google “St. Louis RPM” for more information.
 
The Heart of our event is YOUR MODELS! 
 
Bring your models, finished or in progress, for display and discussion.  All scales, gauges, and models from all eras are welcome; bring locomotives, structures, freight cars, dioramas, vehicles or other models. There are no contests. The purpose of the meet is to share techniques, learn from your fellow modelers, and meet people from St. Louis and around the U.S.  We had 1,000+ models on 45 full display tables at our last meet!
 
In addition to model displays, presentations by nationally-recognized modelers and historians are scheduled for both days. Historical Societies and select vendors will also be in attendance; live, hands-on weathering clinics will be presented.  Evening layout tours and operating sessions are scheduled.  All this in 10,000 sq. ft. at the professional Gateway Convention Center. 
 
Two Days! July 27th and 28th in Collinsville, IL
 
Driving Directions:
 
- Traveling North on I-55/70: Take Collinsville Exit 11. At traffic light, turn left onto Highway 157/Bluff Road to Eastport Plaza Drive, turn Left. Continue to Gateway Drive, turn right. Gateway Center is located on your left.
- Traveling East on I-40 or 44: Take Interstate 55/70 North, to Collinsville Exit 11. At traffic light, turn left onto Highway 157/Bluff Road to Eastport Plaza Drive, turn Left. Continue to Gateway Drive, turn right. Gateway Center is located on your left.
- Traveling East or West on I-64: Take Exit 9 and then drive North on Hwy 157, approximately 7 miles, to Eastport Plaza Drive which is located off Hwy. 157. Turn left on Eastport Plaza Drive, then right on Gateway Drive. Gateway Center is located on left. and then left onto Gateway Drive. Gateway Center is located on right.
 
Hours: 9:00 A.M. to 9:00 P.M both days.  Admission: $20.00 Fri & Sat, $15.00 Sat only.  Kids under 13 free with paid adult admission.  Vendor set-up at 7:15 AM Fri.  Sales end at 5:00 P.M. Sat.  This is a not-for-profit event.
 
CLINICS
Presentations will run from 9:30 a.m. to 8:00 p.m. both days.  Our featured speakers include:
Bob Harpe – Modeling Southern SD-45 3100L
The Dean of Diesel Modeling, Author, and Savannah RPM host presents cutting-edge diesel modeling, Southern style!
 
Roger Hinman – IC/NP Refrigerator Cars, 1909-1961
Roger examines the vast IC/NP refrigerator fleet from his forthcoming book—See  http://www.signaturepress.com/
 
Ed Hawkins – Non-Standard ARA Offset Hoppers
Our friend, author and RP Cyc. publisher describes prototype of the forthcoming Intermountain model.
 
Ryan Crawford – A Day on the C&IM
The co-author of "Chicago & Illinois Midland Railway in Color," compares one day on the C&IM in 1975 and 1989.  
 
Bill Schaumburg – Cars for the 5:15
Railroad Model Craftsman’s editor explores Midwestern commuter railroading in the transition era.
 
Mont Switzer – Favorite Freight Car Projects II
Longtime author and Monon modeler is back with more new modeling and exciting projects in HO.
 
David Lehlbach – Tangent Scale Models
Tangent Scale Models’ owner presents the products, business direction and prototypes of TSM’s model line.
 
Dave Roeder, MMR – Prototype Layout from Planning to Ops
Dave explains layout planning, construction, detailing, and ops, and will open his layout to STL RPM attendees.
 
Tony Sissons – Scratchbuilding & Super-Detailing Turnouts and Track
The famous English modeler returns to St. Louis, explaining and demonstrating super-detailed track and turnout construction.
 
John Greedy – Where’s The Beef?
John describes the Hormel meat-packing industry, with tips on modeling a variety of meat refrigerator cars in HO.
 
Joe Collias – St. Louis in the 1940s and 1950s, In Color
The master photographer and author presents original color images of St. Louis railroading from the 40s & 50s.
 
HANDS-ON CLINICS
Dave Schroedle, fromProtoweathering.com, will present Simple Weathering Techniques with AIM Powders all day, both days!  Bring your own models or buy them at the meet to learn new finishing skills!
Jeremy St. Peterand his six-man crew from The Weathering Shop will demonstrate their amazing weathering techniques as seen on their website at http://theweatheringshop.com/.  Bring models to weather and finish!
Pull up a chair with Tony Sissons as he builds and teaches turnout construction as described in his clinic all day, both days! 
VENDORS
Our biggest lineup ever!  70 tables of elite vendors: Bob’s Photos, Tangent Scale Models, Moloco, Plano, LokSound, ExactRail, Railflyer Models, Archer Fine Transfers, ProtoCraft, Rails Unlimited, Funaro & Camerlengo, ICG Custom Decals, Big Four Graphics, American Model Builders, Badger Airbrush, Mike Gruber Photos, Stan Rydarowicz Models, Proto 87 Stores, Des Plaines Hobbies, Joe Collias Photos, Q Connection, Mask Island Decals, Red Board Hobbies, John Fuller Photos, Netterfield Hobbies, Moon Dog Railcars, and more!
RAILROAD HISTORICAL SOCIETIES
The largest annual gathering of railroad historical societies in the U.S.  The New York Central, Wabash, Missouri Pacific, GM&O, Nickel Plate, Central of Georgia, Illinois Terminal, Terminal Railroad Association and C&NW societies will be on hand to aid your modeling. 
DOOR PRIZES!
NEW!  LAYOUT TOURS!
Tour and operate beautiful home layoutsby Bill Giese and John Schindler on Thursday (7:00 – 9:00 p.m.), and Dave Roeder and Mike Wise on Friday (7:30 – 10:00 p.m.)  Call or write for details on Thursday tours, or meet us at Bandana’s BBQ next to the Gateway Center (4 Commerce Drive, Collinsville, IL) for dinner at 5:30 p.m. and we’ll leave from there.  Friday tours leave from the RPM meet at 7:00 p.m.
PHOTOS FROM OUR PREVIOUS MEETS
... 2011 can be found at herel
... 2008 can be found at herel
... 2006 can be found at herel
... 2005 can be found at herel
... 2004 can be found at herel
ST.LOUIS AREA ATTRACTIONS
In addition to St. Louis RPM, St. Louis is also the home of the John W. Barriger National Railroad Library at the campus of the University of Missouri (http://www.umsl.edu/barriger/), the National Museum of Transportation (http://www.transportmuseumassociation.org/exhibits.html) and some of the best railfanning in the world.  Is the family coming too?  Check out area attractions at http://www.stlouisattractions.com/.
SEE YOU AT ST. LOUIS RPM!
Contact John Golden at Golden1014@... (812) 929-7181, Dan Kohlberg at paducah@... or Lonnie Bathurst at Bathurst@... (217) 556-0314 for meet info and layout tour reservations.  The Gateway Center Website is available at http://www.gatewaycenter.com/ for more information and directions. Gateway NMRA Division is at http://www.gatewaynmra.org/default.htm.
 
See you in St. Louis!
 
Signed,
 
Lonnie Bathurst
Daniel Kohlberg
John Golden

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: New Shapes to come

midrly <midrly@...>
 

I was getting together some parts for building a CN cinder car, and wanted an improved way to fabricate the Z's on the sides and ends. Many (all?) of these cars were made using frames and components from 36' "Fowler"/Dominion steel-frame boxcars. Including the Z's.

.010" thick stock for the part of the angle that meets the car side just looks heavy in HO compared with the real thing. I found myself taking the backing off two new razor blades, and inserting a spacer between them to cut strip of the appropriate width. Some 2-56 nuts and bolts hold the razor blades and spacers together.

This "tool" should have worked well to cut .005" strip to width, but I found that the blades flexed enough to vary the width of the strip as I was cutting it along a straightedge.

So .005" strip would be useful for making Z's, but I don't expect Evergreen to make the stuff for just my using a package or two.

As for styrene rail, many CN "Fowler"/Dominion 36' steel-frame boxcars and early 40' steel-frame boxcars used a length of rail (56- to 80-pound) as a vertical centre brace on the ends of these cars. Stafford Swain had used pieces of styrene approximating rail shape to model this, but a rust-coloured rail styrene strip would be very useful for this. And for other uses that I dare not mention under pain of a trip to Moderate Jail...

Steve Lucas.

--- In STMFC@..., timboconnor@... wrote:


5 thous strip! What a Godsend that would be! Think trust plates, rib flanges, patch panels, etc.

Tim O'Connor


----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed" <nprybiged@...>

And I'll echo Dennis Storzek's thoughts on smaller-section styrene strip, such as .010" square. Maybe some 5 thou strip...please??
Steve Lucas.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: ADMIN: The thread on plastic rails is terminated

Ed <nprybiged@...>
 

OK Mike, I'll move on with a Thank You to ALL that gave your
in put to something New. I Consider is topic closed on the
STMFC List.

My Best Regards to All,
Ed Ursem

--- In STMFC@..., "Mike Brock" <brockm@...> wrote:

Since Gordon is set up with Daily Digest, we are assuming that he has not
seen the desist order regarding plastic guard rails so we let his message go
through. Others in violation of the termination order risk jail time. Hmmm.
getting a bit crowded down there...not where I'd want to spend any time...

Mike Brock
STMFC Owner


Re: New Shapes to come

Tim O'Connor
 

5 thous strip! What a Godsend that would be! Think trust plates, rib flanges, patch panels, etc.

Tim O'Connor

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed" <nprybiged@...>

And I'll echo Dennis Storzek's thoughts on smaller-section styrene strip, such as .010" square. Maybe some 5 thou strip...please??
Steve Lucas.


Re: New Shapes to come

Ed <nprybiged@...>
 

Steve

Wow you covered a lot
Thank you

Ed

--- In STMFC@..., "midrly" <midrly@...> wrote:

There are many possibilities for the use of styrene rail. Not only for D&H modellers of the steam era that will have CWR next the running rails to be put in track (did any other road use much CWR in the STMFC timeframe?).

Handlaid turnouts and bridge decks (both actually relevant to STMFC'ers) could finally have guardrails that would not reveal bare nickle silver tops after track cleaning. Some railway structures used old rail as structural steel components instead of I- or H-section beams, another advantage of styrene rail shapes for the modeller.

National Steel Car had an in-plant service gon that used light rail (I have a photo of this car), probably 80# or lighter, as the posts supporting the sides of the car. This car also used the lowest third portion of their NSC-1 ends. Tricky to build out of nickle-silver rail, but easy in styrene. Maybe some roads used rail for uprights in gons as well?

As for rail length, very common in our era were 33' rails in many railways' main tracks. They fit nicely in the 36' i.l. gons and flats used to transport rail from the mill to customer. 39' rail was coming into use, but 33' rails were still very common. I don't recall any 39' rail being in use before 1910. To add to the mix, some roads chopped 18" off each battered end of rails, producing 36', 30', and 27' rails in the process. So cutting what length you want out of 36" long styrene shapes would be best for the modeller. But I'd personally appreciate even 12" lengths of Code 70/55 rail from Evergreen.

But modelling various rail-built bumpers, parking lot curbs, etc, is best done with metal rail for durability. Errant elbows do a lot of damage on a layout.

And I'll echo Dennis Storzek's thoughts on smaller-section styrene strip, such as .010" square. Maybe some 5 thou strip...please??

Steve Lucas.

--- In STMFC@..., "Ed" <nprybiged@> wrote:

We were talking about having Evergreen,or someone make some new
shape materials.

Well I'm going to dive off on the high board and hope someone filled
the pool.

How about making Styrene Rail, yes I said Rail, in code 100, 83 and
55. Think about it. How many times have you seen photos of the Right
of Way with, depending on the era, 38' sections or welded rail along
side of the track awaiting to be rerailed, or stacks of rail stored
in a freight yard.

This also opens up the posiblety of a welded rail train. Say 15 old
wooden side dump cars with the ends removed and one or two levels of
Rail. Now, I think, if you ahcor the rail in the middle it should
bend ok without derailing the cars.

So if we can but scale HO Tie plates and Rail Joiners in Styrene why
not Scale Rail. I know it can be done just look at the pieces of iron
work that Plastruct markets.

OK, how about your thoughts.

Ed Ursem


Re: New Shapes to come

Tim O'Connor
 

I'm confused. Why does styrene rail have to be in 3' lengths? Styrene is the easiest stuff in the world
to "weld" together into longer lengths -- Just like the prototype does with rail, as it turns out.

Tim O'Connor

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ed" <nprybiged@...>

Jerry

Sorry I have to disagree with you. The Rail Train is just
the tip of the iceberg as to the usage of this product

Ed Ursem

I had the same situation when making a coil load of real soft iron wire. I made one wrap coils on the bottom layer and multiple wrap ones on top.
I just can't see any manufacturer making plastic rail esp in 3' lengths just for limited use like a rail train. We hobbiests love to suggest new products but lets get realistic unless you want to invest your life's savings.
Jerry Glow


Re: New Shapes to come

Ed <nprybiged@...>
 

Allen

Thanks for your input.
Ed

--- In STMFC@..., Alan Kilby <albyrno@...> wrote:

A would use it to fill isolating gaps cut in rails for appearance and to make even flow of rail,I would prefer white plastic to best match ns rail,it would also be useful for guardrails in complex turnouts with multiple guard rails to avoid possible shorts and excessive number of isolating gaps and power feeds
 Alan
 


________________________________
From: Brian Ehni <behni@...>
To: STMFC List <STMFC@...>
Sent: Wednesday, June 20, 2012 12:13 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] New Shapes to come



 

If you make them to CODE, they are scale immaterial. He's only asking for
three sizes.

Thanks!
--

Brian P. Ehni

On 6/20/12 2:02 PM, "ronald parisi" <mailto:ronald.parisi%40gmail.com> wrote:

Group:

I think that asking them to model in all 3 scales might be excessive. I
would definitely
buy it in HO scale.

Ron parisi

On Wed, Jun 20, 2012 at 2:57 PM, Ed <mailto:nprybiged%40comcast.net> wrote:

**


All

I'm going to go to Evergreen and ask them if they would consider
marketing Styrene Rail in HO, O and N scale in codes 100,83 and 55
in packages of 6, in 24" or 36" in lenght.

So, to give them a feeling of what the modelers thing about
buying something like this, would you please let me know what
your thoughts are?

Thank you
Ed Ursem



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links







Re: New Shapes to come

Ed <nprybiged@...>
 

Jerry

Sorry I have to disagree with you. The Rail Train is just
the tip of the iceberg as to the usage of this product

Ed Ursem

--- In STMFC@..., jerryglow@... wrote:

I had the same situation when making a coil load of real soft iron wire. I made one wrap coils on the bottom layer and multiple wrap ones on top.

I just can't see any manufacturer making plastic rail esp in 3' lengths just for limited use like a rail train. We hobbiests love to suggest new products but lets get realistic unless you want to invest your life's savings.

Jerry Glow

--- In STMFC@..., Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@> wrote:

Jerry

One problem with real rail is WEIGHT. A gondola or flat that weighs
the NMRA recommended amount (or even more than that) becomes ridiculously
heavy with a full (realistic) load of nickel silver rail.

I think Sunshine made a resin rail load, for example.

Tim O'



At 6/20/2012 05:09 PM Wednesday, you wrote:
I don't understand the need for it - what's wrong with real rail?
Jerry Glow


new decals this week

jerryglow2
 

Along with the upgraded GN combo door set, I've done a CNJ PS-2 which is
an offshoot of the question I posed a week or so ago. I will release a
set for those cars pending further information.
See: http://home.comcast.net/~jerryglow/samples/CNJ_PS-2.jpg

If I haven't previously mentioned it, decals for a MP 45' flat car (Chad
Boas casting) is also available.
See: http://home.comcast.net/~jerryglow/samples/MP_45ft_flat.jpg

--
Jerry Glow
The Villages FL
http://home.comcast.net/~jerryglow/decals


improved GN combo door set

jerryglow2
 

At Chad's request and the help of Richard Yaremko, I've added door
operating instructions for the plug door of the GN combo door car. It is
not present on all cars and was not on the one I used for my original
artwork. Any previous purchasers of the set may get a supplement with
the data by sending a request with a self addressed stamped envelope.
Future sets will include it.
See: http://home.comcast.net/~jerryglow/samples/GN_door.jpg

--
Jerry Glow
The Villages FL
http://home.comcast.net/~jerryglow/decals


ADMIN: The thread on plastic rails is terminated

Mikebrock
 

Since Gordon is set up with Daily Digest, we are assuming that he has not seen the desist order regarding plastic guard rails so we let his message go through. Others in violation of the termination order risk jail time. Hmmm. getting a bit crowded down there...not where I'd want to spend any time...

Mike Brock
STMFC Owner


Re: New Shapes to come- whoa!

Bushnell.mp77 Account
 

Before we get too excited about styrene rail-

As one member said- what about the rail we already have? One reply was weight but that is not an issue unless you are going to "haul it." And most of the suggested uses by members didn't seem to lean that way.

But I'll suggest the real issue is going to be manufacturing the stuff with the right profile and at a good cost. It's not like the sheet goods nor the strips and tubes. I'll guess that to extrude the profile of a rail will be more of an issue- especially consistently and in some of the suggested sizes.

Who knows I might be wrong but those of us scratch building is a minority of model railroading and those wanting styrene rail probably even more of a minority. Be prepared for a "polite no."

Now that being said- maybe someone on the list will suggest a way they make small quantities for their projects. Even with a CNC that's not the first thing on my list of projects.

Gordon Andrews


ADMIN: Plastic rail thread terminated

Mikebrock
 

Guys,

Unexpectedly to me, welded rail came into use in the US in 1930. From the 1955 Track and Structure Cyc:

Concerns with expansion/contraction led RR's to use it in tunnels at first so as to avoid significant temperature differences. The first installation occurred in the US in 1930 by Central of Georgia in two of its tunnels. By the end of 1953 380 track miles were installed in tunnels and open track environments. By that time, the longest installation was 19812 ft on the EJ&E which was formed by joining an 11440 ft length installed in 1944 with an 8372 length added in 1950. The 1955 Track and Structure Cyclopedia shows an NP train hauling 8 strings of 2490 ft lengths 890 miles over 3 mountain ranges. So, welded rail and the transportation of it is within our time frame.

I will note that when Dennis Storzek writes about guard rails:

"It was also almost never installed on tie plates. So, if your bridge deck is built to scale, the track cleaning block shouldn't touch the guard rails anyway".

Given that Dennis refers to "bridge decks" I think we can assume that he refers to guard rails on bridges. Guard rails associated with turnout frogs were, however, placed on Guard Rail Plates. These plates supported both the guard rail and the running rail opposite the frog. Since the frog is elevated by its supporting plate, the opposite running rail and guard rail are necessarily raised as well. In fact, such guard rails are attached to the running rail. These plates are longer than standard tie plates and vary from 16 to 23 inches in length.

However, interesting as this subject might be, other than some discussion regarding rail as a load, the STMFC is not the forum to discuss the manufacture of plastic models of rail...welded or not. Given that we seem to have exhausted the subject, it is time to terminate this thread. If you feel otherwise, feel free to offer your views to me or Jeff Aley at STMFC-owner@...

Mike Brock
STMFC Owner


Re: New Shapes to come

soolinehistory <destorzek@...>
 

--- In STMFC@..., john.allyn@... wrote:

How about simply taking a few thousandths of an inch off the bottom of the guard rail with a  file?  As Jerry Glow has correctly noted there are a lot of products that just aren't commercially feasible.


John B. Allyn
A few thousandths less than Code 83 gets you to Code 70, and a few from Code 70 gets you to Code 55. Which is absolutely prototypically correct, since most "safety guard" (my term, as opposed to "operational guard" intended to guide the wheel) was old reclaimed rail of a lighter section than the running rail. It was also almost never installed on tie plates. So, if your bridge deck is built to scale, the track cleaning block shouldn't touch the guard rails anyway.

Dennis


Re: New Shapes to come

Tim O'Connor
 

Some railroads used rail on the sides of TOFC flat cars too. I was planning on using actual rail on mine
but I'd be happier if I could make them w/ styrene.

Anyway, why does anyone think this is a huge investment for someone like Evergreen? They'd just make
a new cutting tool to mill the rail shape.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Schneider" <bschneider424@...>

I suppose that I shouldn’t point out that the cleaner block would also remove paint from the styrene, leaving the tops whi.... never mind.

Seriously, I guess I could see some limited uses, but like Jerry it wouldn’t be high on my product investment list... However, I’ve been wrong before. I think... ;>)

Bill Schneider



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: New Shapes to come

john.allyn@...
 

How about simply taking a few thousandths of an inch off the bottom of the guard rail with a  file?  As Jerry Glow has correctly noted there are a lot of products that just aren't commercially feasible.


John B. Allyn

----- Original Message -----
From: "StephenK" <thekays100@...>
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2012 1:19:41 PM
Subject: [STMFC] Re: New Shapes to come

 




The real answer to guard rails that don't reveal bare nickle silver would be code 82 (or Code 80) size rail. Paint it whatever color you use, and it would be slightly lower than the running rail--and the cleaner block would pass over it without removing the paint.

Steve Kay

--- In STMFC@... , "midrly" <midrly@...> wrote:

There are many possibilities for the use of styrene rail. Not only for D&H modellers of the steam era that will have CWR next the running rails to be put in track (did any other road use much CWR in the STMFC timeframe?).

Handlaid turnouts and bridge decks (both actually relevant to STMFC'ers) could finally have guardrails that would not reveal bare nickle silver tops after track cleaning. Some railway structures used old rail as structural steel components instead of I- or H-section beams, another advantage of styrene rail shapes for the modeller.

National Steel Car had an in-plant service gon that used light rail (I have a photo of this car), probably 80# or lighter, as the posts supporting the sides of the car. This car also used the lowest third portion of their NSC-1 ends. Tricky to build out of nickle-silver rail, but easy in styrene. Maybe some roads used rail for uprights in gons as well?

As for rail length, very common in our era were 33' rails in many railways' main tracks. They fit nicely in the 36' i.l. gons and flats used to transport rail from the mill to customer. 39' rail was coming into use, but 33' rails were still very common. I don't recall any 39' rail being in use before 1910. To add to the mix, some roads chopped 18" off each battered end of rails, producing 36', 30', and 27' rails in the process. So cutting what length you want out of 36" long styrene shapes would be best for the modeller. But I'd personally appreciate even 12" lengths of Code 70/55 rail from Evergreen.

But modelling various rail-built bumpers, parking lot curbs, etc, is best done with metal rail for durability. Errant elbows do a lot of damage on a layout.

And I'll echo Dennis Storzek's thoughts on smaller-section styrene strip, such as .010" square. Maybe some 5 thou strip...please??

Steve Lucas.

--- In STMFC@... , "Ed" <nprybiged@> wrote:

We were talking about having Evergreen,or someone make some new
shape materials.

Well I'm going to dive off on the high board and hope someone filled
the pool.

How about making Styrene Rail, yes I said Rail, in code 100, 83 and
55. Think about it. How many times have you seen photos of the Right
of Way with, depending on the era, 38' sections or welded rail along
side of the track awaiting to be rerailed, or stacks of rail stored
in a freight yard.

This also opens up the posiblety of a welded rail train. Say 15 old
wooden side dump cars with the ends removed and one or two levels of
Rail. Now, I think, if you ahcor the rail in the middle it should
bend ok without derailing the cars.

So if we can but scale HO Tie plates and Rail Joiners in Styrene why
not Scale Rail. I know it can be done just look at the pieces of iron
work that Plastruct markets.

OK, how about your thoughts.

Ed Ursem



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: New Shapes to come

William Keene <wakeene@...>
 

Hello Group,

Let's return this to actual freight car modeling.

I concur that having plastic rail sections could be a usable modeling product. But it is not at the top of my "wish list" of "needs".

A short while back there was a discussion within this group of "Z" structural shapes. That discussion did point out that there are a number of prototype sizes needed to model steam era freight cars. And also that the thickness of the flanges is an issue. That said, I believe that a selection of scale sized Z structural shapes would be a more usable modeling resource to most freight car modelers than plastic welded rail.

And as someone -- Dennis (?) -- has pointed out... smaller milled stock would also be a grand addition to the parts bin.

Just my 2 worth of comment. Thanks for listening.

Cheers,
Bill Keene
Irvine, CA




On Jun 21, 2012, at 11:13 AM, jerryglow@... wrote:

Yea, that'll make some manufacturer rich! Do you get the drift I think this is one of the most ridiculous ideas I've even seen on this site. Who's going to be the first to invest HIS money?

Jerry Glow

--- In STMFC@..., Alan Kilby <albyrno@...> wrote:

A would use it to fill isolating gaps cut in rails for appearance and to make even flow of rail,I would prefer white plastic to best match ns rail,it would also be useful for guardrails in complex turnouts with multiple guard rails to avoid possible shorts and excessive number of isolating gaps and power feeds
Alan



________________________________
From: Brian Ehni <behni@...>
To: STMFC List <STMFC@...>
Sent: Wednesday, June 20, 2012 12:13 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] New Shapes to come





If you make them to CODE, they are scale immaterial. He's only asking for
three sizes.

Thanks!
--

Brian P. Ehni

On 6/20/12 2:02 PM, "ronald parisi" <mailto:ronald.parisi%40gmail.com> wrote:

Group:

I think that asking them to model in all 3 scales might be excessive. I
would definitely
buy it in HO scale.

Ron parisi

On Wed, Jun 20, 2012 at 2:57 PM, Ed <mailto:nprybiged%40comcast.net> wrote:

**


All

I'm going to go to Evergreen and ask them if they would consider
marketing Styrene Rail in HO, O and N scale in codes 100,83 and 55
in packages of 6, in 24" or 36" in lenght.

So, to give them a feeling of what the modelers thing about
buying something like this, would you please let me know what
your thoughts are?

Thank you
Ed Ursem



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links








[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: New Shapes to come

Bill Schneider
 

I suppose that I shouldn’t point out that the cleaner block would also remove paint from the styrene, leaving the tops whi.... never mind.

Seriously, I guess I could see some limited uses, but like Jerry it wouldn’t be high on my product investment list... However, I’ve been wrong before. I think... ;>)

Bill Schneider

From: StephenK
Sent: Thursday, June 21, 2012 2:19 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Re: New Shapes to come


The real answer to guard rails that don't reveal bare nickle silver would be code 82 (or Code 80) size rail. Paint it whatever color you use, and it would be slightly lower than the running rail--and the cleaner block would pass over it without removing the paint.

Steve Kay

--- In mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com, "midrly" <midrly@...> wrote:

There are many possibilities for the use of styrene rail. Not only for D&H modellers of the steam era that will have CWR next the running rails to be put in track (did any other road use much CWR in the STMFC timeframe?).

Handlaid turnouts and bridge decks (both actually relevant to STMFC'ers) could finally have guardrails that would not reveal bare nickle silver tops after track cleaning. Some railway structures used old rail as structural steel components instead of I- or H-section beams, another advantage of styrene rail shapes for the modeller.

National Steel Car had an in-plant service gon that used light rail (I have a photo of this car), probably 80# or lighter, as the posts supporting the sides of the car. This car also used the lowest third portion of their NSC-1 ends. Tricky to build out of nickle-silver rail, but easy in styrene. Maybe some roads used rail for uprights in gons as well?

As for rail length, very common in our era were 33' rails in many railways' main tracks. They fit nicely in the 36' i.l. gons and flats used to transport rail from the mill to customer. 39' rail was coming into use, but 33' rails were still very common. I don't recall any 39' rail being in use before 1910. To add to the mix, some roads chopped 18" off each battered end of rails, producing 36', 30', and 27' rails in the process. So cutting what length you want out of 36" long styrene shapes would be best for the modeller. But I'd personally appreciate even 12" lengths of Code 70/55 rail from Evergreen.

But modelling various rail-built bumpers, parking lot curbs, etc, is best done with metal rail for durability. Errant elbows do a lot of damage on a layout.

And I'll echo Dennis Storzek's thoughts on smaller-section styrene strip, such as .010" square. Maybe some 5 thou strip...please??

Steve Lucas.

--- In mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com, "Ed" <nprybiged@> wrote:

We were talking about having Evergreen,or someone make some new
shape materials.

Well I'm going to dive off on the high board and hope someone filled
the pool.

How about making Styrene Rail, yes I said Rail, in code 100, 83 and
55. Think about it. How many times have you seen photos of the Right
of Way with, depending on the era, 38' sections or welded rail along
side of the track awaiting to be rerailed, or stacks of rail stored
in a freight yard.

This also opens up the posiblety of a welded rail train. Say 15 old
wooden side dump cars with the ends removed and one or two levels of
Rail. Now, I think, if you ahcor the rail in the middle it should
bend ok without derailing the cars.

So if we can but scale HO Tie plates and Rail Joiners in Styrene why
not Scale Rail. I know it can be done just look at the pieces of iron
work that Plastruct markets.

OK, how about your thoughts.

Ed Ursem


Re: New Shapes to come

StephenK
 

The real answer to guard rails that don't reveal bare nickle silver would be code 82 (or Code 80) size rail. Paint it whatever color you use, and it would be slightly lower than the running rail--and the cleaner block would pass over it without removing the paint.

Steve Kay

--- In STMFC@..., "midrly" <midrly@...> wrote:

There are many possibilities for the use of styrene rail. Not only for D&H modellers of the steam era that will have CWR next the running rails to be put in track (did any other road use much CWR in the STMFC timeframe?).

Handlaid turnouts and bridge decks (both actually relevant to STMFC'ers) could finally have guardrails that would not reveal bare nickle silver tops after track cleaning. Some railway structures used old rail as structural steel components instead of I- or H-section beams, another advantage of styrene rail shapes for the modeller.

National Steel Car had an in-plant service gon that used light rail (I have a photo of this car), probably 80# or lighter, as the posts supporting the sides of the car. This car also used the lowest third portion of their NSC-1 ends. Tricky to build out of nickle-silver rail, but easy in styrene. Maybe some roads used rail for uprights in gons as well?

As for rail length, very common in our era were 33' rails in many railways' main tracks. They fit nicely in the 36' i.l. gons and flats used to transport rail from the mill to customer. 39' rail was coming into use, but 33' rails were still very common. I don't recall any 39' rail being in use before 1910. To add to the mix, some roads chopped 18" off each battered end of rails, producing 36', 30', and 27' rails in the process. So cutting what length you want out of 36" long styrene shapes would be best for the modeller. But I'd personally appreciate even 12" lengths of Code 70/55 rail from Evergreen.

But modelling various rail-built bumpers, parking lot curbs, etc, is best done with metal rail for durability. Errant elbows do a lot of damage on a layout.

And I'll echo Dennis Storzek's thoughts on smaller-section styrene strip, such as .010" square. Maybe some 5 thou strip...please??

Steve Lucas.

--- In STMFC@..., "Ed" <nprybiged@> wrote:

We were talking about having Evergreen,or someone make some new
shape materials.

Well I'm going to dive off on the high board and hope someone filled
the pool.

How about making Styrene Rail, yes I said Rail, in code 100, 83 and
55. Think about it. How many times have you seen photos of the Right
of Way with, depending on the era, 38' sections or welded rail along
side of the track awaiting to be rerailed, or stacks of rail stored
in a freight yard.

This also opens up the posiblety of a welded rail train. Say 15 old
wooden side dump cars with the ends removed and one or two levels of
Rail. Now, I think, if you ahcor the rail in the middle it should
bend ok without derailing the cars.

So if we can but scale HO Tie plates and Rail Joiners in Styrene why
not Scale Rail. I know it can be done just look at the pieces of iron
work that Plastruct markets.

OK, how about your thoughts.

Ed Ursem


Re: New Shapes to come

jerryglow2
 

Yea, that'll make some manufacturer rich! Do you get the drift I think this is one of the most ridiculous ideas I've even seen on this site. Who's going to be the first to invest HIS money?

Jerry Glow

--- In STMFC@..., Alan Kilby <albyrno@...> wrote:

A would use it to fill isolating gaps cut in rails for appearance and to make even flow of rail,I would prefer white plastic to best match ns rail,it would also be useful for guardrails in complex turnouts with multiple guard rails to avoid possible shorts and excessive number of isolating gaps and power feeds
 Alan
 


________________________________
From: Brian Ehni <behni@...>
To: STMFC List <STMFC@...>
Sent: Wednesday, June 20, 2012 12:13 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] New Shapes to come



 

If you make them to CODE, they are scale immaterial. He's only asking for
three sizes.

Thanks!
--

Brian P. Ehni

On 6/20/12 2:02 PM, "ronald parisi" <mailto:ronald.parisi%40gmail.com> wrote:

Group:

I think that asking them to model in all 3 scales might be excessive. I
would definitely
buy it in HO scale.

Ron parisi

On Wed, Jun 20, 2012 at 2:57 PM, Ed <mailto:nprybiged%40comcast.net> wrote:

**


All

I'm going to go to Evergreen and ask them if they would consider
marketing Styrene Rail in HO, O and N scale in codes 100,83 and 55
in packages of 6, in 24" or 36" in lenght.

So, to give them a feeling of what the modelers thing about
buying something like this, would you please let me know what
your thoughts are?

Thank you
Ed Ursem







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