Date   

Re: GPEX Pfaudler Steel Milk Car: beer cars (was proper paint color?)

Kenneth Montero
 

Tony,

It's for both - the car being a poor substitute for the liquid.

Ken Montero

----- Original Message -----
From: "Tony Thompson" <tony@...>
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Monday, June 3, 2013 2:53:34 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: GPEX Pfaudler Steel Milk Car: beer cars (was proper paint color?)






Ken Montero wrote:
Beer cars? I wonder if any were used for that purpose during our time period (ending on December 31, 1959)? If so, I'd like to model such a car using the Intermountain kit. I'm probably nont the only one, as the model railroad community has an affinity for beer cars.
Gee, Ken, I always thought it was an affinity for BEER. <g>

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: GPEX Pfaudler Steel Milk Car: beer cars (was proper paint color?)

Tony Thompson
 

Ken Montero wrote:
Beer cars? I wonder if any were used for that purpose during our time period (ending on December 31, 1959)? If so, I'd like to model such a car using the Intermountain kit. I'm probably nont the only one, as the model railroad community has an affinity for beer cars.
Gee, Ken, I always thought it was an affinity for BEER. <g>

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: GPEX Pfaudler Steel Milk Car: beer cars (was proper paint color?)

Kenneth Montero
 

Chuck,

Thank you.

Beer cars? I wonder if any were used for that purpose during our time period (ending on December 31, 1959)? If so, I'd like to model such a car using the Intermountain kit. I'm probably nont the only one, as the model railroad community has an affinity for beer cars.

Ken Montero

----- Original Message -----
From: "Charles R Yungkurth" <drgwrail@...>
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Monday, June 3, 2013 11:50:43 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: GPEX Pfaudler Steel Milk Car: proper paint color?






Back some years ago when Bob Mohonwski and I wrote a three part article on milk cars for RMC, I visited the Pfaudler Company in Rochester NY. Hoped to find any information of the milk tank cars.

I was told that Pfaudler never had anything to do with the actual construction of the cars. Pfaudler just made glass lined steel tanks and partly financed the joint venture with Genral American. There was no one there who could really supply any information on the milk cars. But there was a large photograph of one of the cars lettered for a brewery to carry beer. Unfortuantely I can't recall the brewery name.

The Chateau-Martin were former milk cars that were acquired by the company to carry wine.

Far as I know Pfaudler is still in the business of making glass lined steel tanks.

Chuck Yungkurth
Boulder CO

________________________________
From: " va661midlo@... " < va661midlo@... >
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Monday, June 3, 2013 8:42 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: GPEX Pfaudler Steel Milk Car: proper paint color?



I noticed that one photo shows that this particular car was last leased to Fleishmann Distilleries Corporation. Were they were used for fluids other than milk? Any ideas what was shipped other than milk? It might expand the modeler's use of these cars besides movement of milk.

Ken Montero

----- Original Message -----
From: "soolinehistory" < destorzek@... >
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Sunday, June 2, 2013 11:28:43 PM
Subject: [STMFC] Re: GPEX Pfaudler Steel Milk Car: proper paint color?

--- In STMFC@... , "cereshill" <cereshill@...> wrote:

Fellas,

I am not sure what the correct paint color is for these cars. Any advice appreciated!

Brad Andonian
The one we have at IRM, GPEX 1021, is Pullman Green with yellow lettering. This link should take you to photos:

http://www.irm.org/gallery/GPEX1021

Surprisingly, that's still the original paint. I remember the car when it arrived in 1974 or thereabouts, and the gloss was gone from the paint then. It was a rather light, yellowish version of Pullman Green.

Dennis

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: GPEX Pfaudler Steel Milk Car: proper paint color?

Tony Thompson
 

Dennis Storzek wrote:
I THINK the IRM data plaque is incorrect about the tanks being stainless; that much may be true, but I was under the impression they were glass lined, the glass being fused to the substrate much like porcelain.
What are called "glass-lined" steel articles do indeed have a porcelain surface, which is strongly bonded to the steel. It would make no sense for the steel tank itself to be stainless, as the porcelain is the entire interior, although external piping probably IS stainless. The likely material for the tanks is in fact mild steel. The porcelain enamel lining is predominantly a glassy material, thus the shorthand "glass-lined." Bathtubs and sinks can be made with the same process.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


F&C Website DO NOT USE

Dennis Williams
 

F&C website hacked!! Do not use. Sharon will contact me when it is OK to use. I will post when it is up.
Dennis Williams/Owner
www.resinbuilders4u.com


Re: GPEX Pfaudler Steel Milk Car: proper paint color?

soolinehistory <destorzek@...>
 

--- In STMFC@..., va661midlo@... wrote:


I noticed that one photo shows that this particular car was last leased to Fleishmann Distilleries Corporation. Were they were used for fluids other than milk? Any ideas what was shipped other than milk? It might expand the modeler's use of these cars besides movement of milk.

Ken Montero
It would appear that as rail shipments of milk were winding down during the sixties, the cars were leased for transporting other edible substances.

I THINK the IRM data plaque is incorrect about the tanks being stainless; that much may be true, but I was under the impression they were glass lined, the glass being fused to the substrate much like porcelain.

I recall when the car came to IRM, the General American Pfaudler Corporation up near the roof was painted out with patches of Pullman green of a slightly bluer shade. I don't know the reason for this, and I see from the photos it has either been removed or weathered off; only a few small patches are visible.

Dennis


Re: GPEX Pfaudler Steel Milk Car: proper paint color?

Kenneth Montero
 

Doug,

Thank you.

Ken Montero

----- Original Message -----
From: "Douglas Harding" <doug.harding@...>
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Monday, June 3, 2013 11:26:45 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: GPEX Pfaudler Steel Milk Car: proper paint color?






Ken, Fleishmann was a major player in the yeast market, ie yeast for making
bread etc. You might look up yeast and how its manufactured for more
information.

Doug Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org


Re: GPEX Pfaudler Steel Milk Car: proper paint color?

drgwrail
 

Back some years ago when Bob Mohonwski and I wrote a three part article on milk cars for RMC, I visited the Pfaudler Company in Rochester NY. Hoped to find any information of the milk tank cars.
 
I was told that Pfaudler never had anything to do with the actual construction of the cars. Pfaudler just made glass lined steel tanks  and partly financed the joint venture with Genral American.  There was no one there who could really supply any information on the milk cars. But there was a large photograph of one of the cars lettered for a brewery to carry beer. Unfortuantely I can't recall the brewery name.
 
The Chateau-Martin were former milk cars that were acquired by the company to carry wine.
 
Far as I know Pfaudler is still in the business of making glass lined steel tanks.
 
Chuck Yungkurth
Boulder CO

________________________________
From: "va661midlo@..." <va661midlo@...>
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Monday, June 3, 2013 8:42 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: GPEX Pfaudler Steel Milk Car: proper paint color?

 

I noticed that one photo shows that this particular car was last leased to Fleishmann Distilleries Corporation. Were they were used for fluids other than milk? Any ideas what was shipped other than milk? It might expand the modeler's use of these cars besides movement of milk.

Ken Montero

----- Original Message -----
From: "soolinehistory" <destorzek@...>
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Sunday, June 2, 2013 11:28:43 PM
Subject: [STMFC] Re: GPEX Pfaudler Steel Milk Car: proper paint color?

--- In STMFC@... , "cereshill" <cereshill@...> wrote:

Fellas,

I am not sure what the correct paint color is for these cars. Any advice appreciated!

Brad Andonian
The one we have at IRM, GPEX 1021, is Pullman Green with yellow lettering. This link should take you to photos:

http://www.irm.org/gallery/GPEX1021

Surprisingly, that's still the original paint. I remember the car when it arrived in 1974 or thereabouts, and the gloss was gone from the paint then. It was a rather light, yellowish version of Pullman Green.

Dennis

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: GPEX Pfaudler Steel Milk Car: proper paint color?

Douglas Harding
 

Ken, Fleishmann was a major player in the yeast market, ie yeast for making
bread etc. You might look up yeast and how its manufactured for more
information.



Doug Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org


Re: GPEX Pfaudler Steel Milk Car: proper paint color?

 

CMWX (Chateau Martin) had several steel Pfaudler cars, albeit painted in
their magenta paint scheme, for hauling wine. See
http://coastdaylight.com/chatmart/cmwx_roster_1.html for examples.
(including one by me). Use of these cars by Chateau Martin, however was
after 1960.

Thanks!
--

Brian Ehni

From: <va661midlo@...>
Reply-To: STMFC List <STMFC@...>
Date: Monday, June 3, 2013 9:42 AM
To: STMFC List <STMFC@...>
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: GPEX Pfaudler Steel Milk Car: proper paint color?







I noticed that one photo shows that this particular car was last leased to
Fleishmann Distilleries Corporation. Were they were used for fluids other
than milk? Any ideas what was shipped other than milk? It might expand the
modeler's use of these cars besides movement of milk.

Ken Montero

----- Original Message -----
From: "soolinehistory" <destorzek@... <mailto:destorzek%40mchsi.com> >
To: STMFC@... <mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, June 2, 2013 11:28:43 PM
Subject: [STMFC] Re: GPEX Pfaudler Steel Milk Car: proper paint color?

--- In STMFC@... <mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com> , "cereshill"
<cereshill@...> wrote:

Fellas,

I am not sure what the correct paint color is for these cars. Any advice
appreciated!

Brad Andonian
The one we have at IRM, GPEX 1021, is Pullman Green with yellow lettering.
This link should take you to photos:

http://www.irm.org/gallery/GPEX1021

Surprisingly, that's still the original paint. I remember the car when it
arrived in 1974 or thereabouts, and the gloss was gone from the paint then.
It was a rather light, yellowish version of Pullman Green.

Dennis

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]









[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: GPEX Pfaudler Steel Milk Car: proper paint color?

Kenneth Montero
 

I noticed that one photo shows that this particular car was last leased to Fleishmann Distilleries Corporation. Were they were used for fluids other than milk? Any ideas what was shipped other than milk? It might expand the modeler's use of these cars besides movement of milk.

Ken Montero

----- Original Message -----
From: "soolinehistory" <destorzek@...>
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Sunday, June 2, 2013 11:28:43 PM
Subject: [STMFC] Re: GPEX Pfaudler Steel Milk Car: proper paint color?








--- In STMFC@... , "cereshill" <cereshill@...> wrote:

Fellas,

I am not sure what the correct paint color is for these cars. Any advice appreciated!

Brad Andonian
The one we have at IRM, GPEX 1021, is Pullman Green with yellow lettering. This link should take you to photos:

http://www.irm.org/gallery/GPEX1021

Surprisingly, that's still the original paint. I remember the car when it arrived in 1974 or thereabouts, and the gloss was gone from the paint then. It was a rather light, yellowish version of Pullman Green.

Dennis




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: Modeling air hoses on STMFC era car

Guy Wilber
 

Jack wrote:

I beg to disagree on one point. "Glad hand" is a generally understood and commonly used synonym for "air brake hose coupling", which is the defined name per the Cyc.
Jack,

I agree, glad hand is synonymous with the coupling and I apologize for my own misuse of the term in relation to the angle cock handle.

Three railroaders and two truck drivers have light heartedly scolded me tonight, and I accept their corrections as well as yours.

Regards,

Guy Wilber
Reno, Nevada



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: Modeling air hoses on STMFC era car

Jack Mullen
 

I beg to disagree on one point. "Glad hand" is a generally understood and commonly used synonym for "air brake hose coupling", which is the defined name per the Cyc.
I've never heard glad hand (or gladhand) used to refer to part of an angle cock. If you have a reference for that usage, I'd be interested to see it. I think you're referring to the handle of the angle cock, which afaik is just the "angle cock handle".

Jack Mullen

Guy Wilber wrote:


Jim wrote:


"If my observations are correct the way that the air hoses
work is that the end of the air hose has a rubber grommet
(doughnut) in a cavity in the glad hand."

Jim,

What you are referring to as a "gland hand" is called the air brake hose
coupling which was fitted into and clamped to one end of the brake hose
(22-1/2'' long x 2-1/8" O.D.) while the other end of the hose was fitted over
and clamped to the air hose nipple, also cast in malleable iron. The
"grommet" was the air brake hose gasket.

The nipple was threaded into the angle cock which was equipped with a
"glad hand" in order to open or shut off the air flow. Though there were
dimensional specifications for the angle cock - no call out was made for the
material used in their manufacture. Angle cocks were positioned at an
angle of 30 degrees ( /) while looking at the end of the car.

Circa 1943 (slightly revised from 1939) preference for the center line of
the air line was 2-1/2" below the center line of the coupler and 12" to
the right of center. The location of the angle cock from the end of the car
was to be 15" from the pulling face of the coupler (back) to the center of
the glad hand.


Re: GPEX Pfaudler Steel Milk Car: proper paint color?

MDelvec952
 

To add to Dennis's answer, the lettering was imitation gold on the Pfaudler cars, a pretty common color for lettering in the steam era. In the 1980s I looked closely at (wiping clean) the three cars given to museums (IRM, St. Louis and Rio Vista Junction) and they are consistent in the "Dulux" gold color of the lettering.

....Mike

-----Original Message-----
From: soolinehistory <destorzek@...>
To: STMFC <STMFC@...>
Sent: Sun, Jun 2, 2013 11:28 pm
Subject: [STMFC] Re: GPEX Pfaudler Steel Milk Car: proper paint color?








--- In STMFC@..., "cereshill" <cereshill@...> wrote:

Fellas,

I am not sure what the correct paint color is for these cars. Any advice appreciated!

Brad Andonian
The one we have at IRM, GPEX 1021, is Pullman Green with yellow lettering. This link should take you to photos:

http://www.irm.org/gallery/GPEX1021

Surprisingly, that's still the original paint. I remember the car when it arrived in 1974 or thereabouts, and the gloss was gone from the paint then. It was a rather light, yellowish version of Pullman Green.

Dennis








[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: GPEX Pfaudler Steel Milk Car: proper paint color?

soolinehistory <destorzek@...>
 

--- In STMFC@..., "cereshill" <cereshill@...> wrote:

Fellas,

I am not sure what the correct paint color is for these cars. Any advice appreciated!

Brad Andonian
The one we have at IRM, GPEX 1021, is Pullman Green with yellow lettering. This link should take you to photos:

http://www.irm.org/gallery/GPEX1021

Surprisingly, that's still the original paint. I remember the car when it arrived in 1974 or thereabouts, and the gloss was gone from the paint then. It was a rather light, yellowish version of Pullman Green.

Dennis


Re: NP REFER QUESTIONS

Richard Hendrickson
 

On Jun 2, 2013, at 4:44 PM, WILLIAM PARDIE <PARDIEW001@...> wrote:

I am doing a two Northern Pacific refers. The first is in the 947 series ( has truss rods)
and the second is in the 902 series. What is the proper color of the trucks on these refers?
Also which are the best (Tahoe Model hopefully) trucks for these cars.
Bill, in the post-WW-II period, some NP wood sheathed reefers had their original trucks replaced by later ARA types. However, the photos I have of these cars show the 94400-94899 series with Bettendorf T-Section trucks and the 90000-90799 series with early Andrews L-section trucks. Tahoe doesn't make either of them, but Kadee offers both. Their Bettendorf T-section truck is #509 and their Andrews truck is #511. Both are available only in the earlier Kadee versions with "working" springs that look nothing like the real thing, but I've improved their appearance by CA-ing small black styrene "view blocks" on the backs of the side frames so you can't see through the spring boxes. NP reefer trucks were black - or after they had been in service for awhile, dirty, grimy dark gray.

Richard Hendrickson


NP REFER QUESTIONS

WILLIAM PARDIE
 

I am doing a two Northern Pacific refers. The first is in the 947 series ( has truss rods)
and the second is in the 902 series. What is the proper color of the trucks on these refers?
Also which are the best (Tahoe Model hopefully) trucks for these cars.

Thanks in advance.

Bill Pardie


Re: GPEX Pfaudler Steel Milk Car: proper paint color?

Don Burn
 

Basically a Pullman Green color. For more information go to the Yahoo
MilkTrains list

Don Burn

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of
cereshill
Sent: Sunday, June 02, 2013 6:57 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] GPEX Pfaudler Steel Milk Car: proper paint color?

Fellas,

I am not sure what the correct paint color is for these cars. Any advice
appreciated!

Brad Andonian



------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links


GPEX Pfaudler Steel Milk Car: proper paint color?

Brad Andonian
 

Fellas,

I am not sure what the correct paint color is for these cars. Any advice appreciated!

Brad Andonian


Re: Modeling air hoses on STMFC era car

Gene <bierglaeser@...>
 

As is often the case on this forum, Guy Wilbur has posted the correct information. I am currently revising my Freight Car Underbody Detail clinic and attendant handout and the information on placement of angle cock is fresh in my mind. As I said, Guy is correct.

I have an angle cock complete with 22 inch hose (Guy, did mine shrink a half an inch?), 10" pipe nipple and air brake hose coupling which is often referred to as a "glad hand." (Truckers use the term glad hand as well for the dinky little things they have between their tractors and trailers.)

My nipple/angle cock/hose/coupling assembly came off (with permission) a 1937 AAR 10-0 IH box car. The angle cock still has most of the original paint on it, no accumulation of crude but rust were the paint is gone. Ditto for the coupling except that there is more rust and a lot less paint.

The hose is a very dark gray and anyone looking at it would call it black. That which came off on my hand when I picked it up just now would be termed "black" by any mother in the land.

There is more than one permissible way to secure the hose to the fittings on either end. Automobile radiator hose clamp is one way. Mine are held on with ferrules and these are still a silvery, metallic color with a yellow hue suggestive of cadmium plating???. They stand out as "silver" on an otherwise fairly dark assembly.

Gene Green

78361 - 78380 of 194805