Date   

Re: Westerfield kits for sale

 

Bob – Please be sure the kits are urethane rather than polyester.  If the latter, better to just chuck them. – Al Westerfield
 

From: teu6500
Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 2013 4:02 PM
Subject: [STMFC] Westerfield kits for sale
 
 

My interests have changed, and my time is occupied with other things, so it's clear that I won't be building this collection of Westerfield 1920s-era kits any time soon. So I'm offering them for sale at a reduced price so that maybe someone will give them more attention.

These are the older flat-cast kits, not the newer kits with one-piece bodies.

10 kits for $100, plus postage for USPS medium flat rate box. List is below.

I don't visit this group frequently, so if you're interested, please contact me by email.

Bob Edmonson

The kits:

1302 XL Box Car PRR Union Line

1351 Mod. XL Box Car Pennsylvania

1401 BX-Z Box Car Santa Fe

1601 HP Hopper Car Norfolk & Western

1701 B-50-1 Box Car Southern Pacific

1718 B-50-2 Box Saftey Appl. Chicago & Alton

2406 PSC Hopper, Pittsburg & Buffalo

4310 6' Door 36' Fowler Box GTR 107100 Series (1918)

4452 40' Fowler Box Car MODN CStPM&O (Omaha)

7312 B-50-9 Box Car 1913 PDN Chicago & Alton


Re: Beer Shipments in 1950

Dave Nelson
 

In 1950 Georgia was #9 in the list of states who received beer by rail
shipments, about 2.68% of all such shipments nationally. I don't see the
number of carloads that required... it's around here somewhere and I just
need to find it.

Roughly half of all rail shipped beer originated in the Midwest. In order
of most shipments, WI, IL, OH, MO.

Dave Nelson

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
David
Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 2013 2:07 PM

How prevalent were beer shipments by rail in 1950 and what type(s) of cars
were principally used to handle this business? Particularly, I am
interested in shipments destined for Georgia or Alabama.

Thank you.

David Payne


Re: Westerfield kits for sale

teu6500
 

Kits have been sold. Thanks for your prompt reply.

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "teu6500" <oldmancat@...> wrote:

CORRECTION - Shipping will be USPS Large flat rate box. $16.95 to U.S. destinations, higher elsewhere.

Bob E

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "teu6500" <oldmancat@> wrote:

My interests have changed, and my time is occupied with other things, so it's clear that I won't be building this collection of Westerfield 1920s-era kits any time soon. So I'm offering them for sale at a reduced price so that maybe someone will give them more attention.

These are the older flat-cast kits, not the newer kits with one-piece bodies.

10 kits for $100, plus postage for USPS medium flat rate box. List is below.

I don't visit this group frequently, so if you're interested, please contact me by email.

Bob Edmonson

The kits:

1302 XL Box Car PRR Union Line

1351 Mod. XL Box Car Pennsylvania

1401 BX-Z Box Car Santa Fe

1601 HP Hopper Car Norfolk & Western

1701 B-50-1 Box Car Southern Pacific

1718 B-50-2 Box Saftey Appl. Chicago & Alton

2406 PSC Hopper, Pittsburg & Buffalo

4310 6' Door 36' Fowler Box GTR 107100 Series (1918)

4452 40' Fowler Box Car MODN CStPM&O (Omaha)

7312 B-50-9 Box Car 1913 PDN Chicago & Alton


Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: Re: Rosters for USRA single sheathed boxcar and steel rebuilds (UNCLASSIFIED)

Benjamin Scanlon
 

that was the conclusion i'd arrived at from watching the undated video footage taken in 'the 50s' (the well known decade).

the CNJ footage had one composite boxcar, btw, an SLSF howe truss car. 

again, that train, with CNJ 'toothpaste'  F3s i wouldn't like to date ... that livery lasted from 1950-1962 and i am no expert on the liveries of the freight cars in the train. 

i am not trying to be opaque, but in this case, attempting any further precision would lead to greater inaccuracy, and that is not what i am trying to do.

as for the northeast, the impression i'd formed by my highly unscientific approach tallies with the idea that home road composite cars were getting awful rare, certainly by the end of the decade.  modelling one on a small pike would be enough, but i have a choice of three. 

time to start sniffing around NYC USRA steel cars.

benjamin s.




---In stmfc@..., <timboconnor@...> wrote:

To back up Richard, I just skimmed about 50 1960's scans of railroad yards
and found a number of single sheathed box cars of SLSF, AC, GN, NP, ... And
a few double sheathed cars as well. I know GN held on to many older box cars
(and probably other grain hauling roads did too) for the annual wheat rush.

Traffic in the northeastern USA was in a steep decline that began in the 50's
and many thousands of modern steel cars were surplus to northeastern roads by
1960, so I'd not be surprised if home road SS/DS cars were uncommon by 1960
in the northeast.

Tim O'Connor



>I have many yard and train photos from the early 1950s which show large numbers of single sheathed box and auto cars; photos from the late �50s show fewer of them, as they were being progressively retired or rebuilt, but many remained in revenue service well beyond the end of the decade, especially on midwestern and western railroads that hauled a lot of grain.
>
>A couple of videos shot on the CNJ in �the �50s� (WHEN in the �50s, for Pete�s sake?) provide very little useful information unless your are modeling the CNJ at about the time they were taken.
>
>Richard Hendrickson


Re: CMO Express Box Cars

thomas christensen
 

CMO 20000-20048(even #s) express box cars were part of 20000-21398(even #s) built in 10/11 1941. As built, the expressfor cars had Allied Full Cushion trucks, Gypsum running boards, Ureco hand brakes, Viking roofs, AB brakes?, and the small tab was towards the end from the 3rd panel seam(per builders photo). Between 1946 and 1951 the Allied Full Cushion trucks were replaced with Commonwealth equalized trucks(and the small tab moved towards the car center, almost under the 3rd panel seam, about 6"). And in 1950/51 the AB brake system was replaced with a LN brake system. See "Common Express Box Cars" in the September 2003 RMJ.
Tom Christensen



------------------------------

On Wed, Nov 6, 2013 2:41 AM EST wcfn100@gmail.com wrote:

I have a couple questions about the CMO Express Box Cars that I'm hoping someone might know something about.


At the bottom of the page on the following link:


http://www.steamerafreightcars.com/gallery/boxauto/cnw72710main.html http://www.steamerafreightcars.com/gallery/boxauto/cnw72710main.html



On the underside of the car between the brake reservoir and cylinder, there's a silver/gray device hanging down. What might that be?


Also, it looks like the sill tabs have changed from the as-built car. Could that be tied in somehow? I assume that indicates changes to the under frame.


Thanks for any help.


Jason Kliewer
Colorado Springs, CO


Re: Westerfield kits for sale

teu6500
 

CORRECTION - Shipping will be USPS Large flat rate box. $16.95 to U.S. destinations, higher elsewhere.

Bob E

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "teu6500" <oldmancat@...> wrote:

My interests have changed, and my time is occupied with other things, so it's clear that I won't be building this collection of Westerfield 1920s-era kits any time soon. So I'm offering them for sale at a reduced price so that maybe someone will give them more attention.

These are the older flat-cast kits, not the newer kits with one-piece bodies.

10 kits for $100, plus postage for USPS medium flat rate box. List is below.

I don't visit this group frequently, so if you're interested, please contact me by email.

Bob Edmonson

The kits:

1302 XL Box Car PRR Union Line

1351 Mod. XL Box Car Pennsylvania

1401 BX-Z Box Car Santa Fe

1601 HP Hopper Car Norfolk & Western

1701 B-50-1 Box Car Southern Pacific

1718 B-50-2 Box Saftey Appl. Chicago & Alton

2406 PSC Hopper, Pittsburg & Buffalo

4310 6' Door 36' Fowler Box GTR 107100 Series (1918)

4452 40' Fowler Box Car MODN CStPM&O (Omaha)

7312 B-50-9 Box Car 1913 PDN Chicago & Alton


November MRH: Long article on Handbrakes

Bill Welch
 

The November issue of Model Railroad Hobbyiest has a long well illustrated article by Dick Bale on Freight Car Brake Wheels.


MRH is filling a much needed role, ala the badly missed RMJ and MM, of giving us prototype freight car modeling content. Way to go MRH and the authors of the recent articles and THANK YOU!

Bill Welch


Beer Shipments in 1950

David Payne
 

I attempted to search for this subject before asking here ...

How prevalent were beer shipments by rail in 1950 and what type(s) of cars were principally used to handle this business? Particularly, I am interested in shipments destined for Georgia or Alabama.

Thank you.

David Payne


Westerfield kits for sale

teu6500
 

My interests have changed, and my time is occupied with other things, so it's clear that I won't be building this collection of Westerfield 1920s-era kits any time soon. So I'm offering them for sale at a reduced price so that maybe someone will give them more attention.

These are the older flat-cast kits, not the newer kits with one-piece bodies.

10 kits for $100, plus postage for USPS medium flat rate box. List is below.

I don't visit this group frequently, so if you're interested, please contact me by email.

Bob Edmonson

The kits:

1302 XL Box Car PRR Union Line

1351 Mod. XL Box Car Pennsylvania

1401 BX-Z Box Car Santa Fe

1601 HP Hopper Car Norfolk & Western

1701 B-50-1 Box Car Southern Pacific

1718 B-50-2 Box Saftey Appl. Chicago & Alton

2406 PSC Hopper, Pittsburg & Buffalo

4310 6' Door 36' Fowler Box GTR 107100 Series (1918)

4452 40' Fowler Box Car MODN CStPM&O (Omaha)

7312 B-50-9 Box Car 1913 PDN Chicago & Alton


Re: CNW box car help please

Clark Propst
 

Just found info that says these cars were rebuilds. Makes sense, cause they’re listed as having a 10’ IH in the ORER.
 
Clark Propst
Mason City Iowa
 

Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 2013 1:53 PM
To: STMFC
Subject: CNW box car help please
 
I want to build a CNW box car number 65954. My ORER says it’s from series 65700-66298 even numbers. I also have a note that says it was a PS-1 with a 7 panel superior door. Finally got ahold of an undec IM PS-1.  Where I got that info about it being a PS-1 from I don’t know, because I can’t find out anything about these cars in any of my references.
I need general knowledge for building a correct car, like, is it really a PS-1, door, running board, hand brake and truck types.
Thanks to those who offer help!
Clark Propst
Mason City Iowa


CNW box car help please

Clark Propst
 

I want to build a CNW box car number 65954. My ORER says it’s from series 65700-66298 even numbers. I also have a note that says it was a PS-1 with a 7 panel superior door. Finally got ahold of an undec IM PS-1.  Where I got that info about it being a PS-1 from I don’t know, because I can’t find out anything about these cars in any of my references.
I need general knowledge for building a correct car, like, is it really a PS-1, door, running board, hand brake and truck types.
Thanks to those who offer help!
Clark Propst
Mason City Iowa


Re: PFE wood reefer grab irons

Dick Harley
 

Back on Oct 29, 2013 Ed Mines asked about the grab irons on PFE wood reefers.

I have the General Design drawings for the R-30-11, R-30-12, R-30-14 and R-40-2 cars (among others).

All show 21" (hole spacing) grab irons on the sides and ends (right-hand part), with 15-5/8" wide end grab iron ladders.
It is easy enough to come close to horizontal measurements from photographs of PFE wood reefers by counting the boards and multiplying by 3.25"
The side grab irons shown on page 97 of the PFE Book are ALL about 6-1/2 boards wide (hole centers) - i.e. 21".

The vertical spacing of the side and end grab iron ladders on the as-built -11 and -12 was 18-1/2" with a total of six grab irons, including the one on the side sill.
Those cars had just one grab iron over the step to the left of the door.

The vertical spacing of the side and end grab iron ladders on the -14 and R-40-2 was 15-3/4" with a total of seven grab irons, including the one on the side sill. Probably due to a change in ARA rules which Guy Wilber could quote. Those cars also had just one grab iron over the step to the left of the door.

PFE cars reconditioned in the mid-1930s appear to have had seven grab irons in their ladders and two grab irons over the step to the left of the door (another ARA rule change?), regardless of what they had new.

So, the chances of seeing a grab iron ladder with only six grab irons (total) after WWII (Ed's original question) would be very slim in my opinion. First because it would represent an as-built car some 20+ years later, but also because, as Tony says, the cars with grab iron ladders were quickly being rebuilt into the -19, -21 and -24 classes. There's a chart, which I drew almost 20 years ago, on page 440 of the 2nd edition of the PFE Book that shows how rapidly those early classes of wood cars disappeared.


Hope this helps,
Dick Harley
Laguna Beach, CA


Re: CMO Express Box Cars

richard haave
 

That may be the graduated release cap portion of the control valve.  All passenger equipment had it.  Was used to condition brakes (control valve) to respond in graduated release when in passenger service and direct release when used in  freight service. 

 

Dick Haave


Re: CMO Express Box Cars

Jason Kliewer
 

So with the information given and doing some research, I'm looking at some sort of control valve normally associated with passenger cars that not only applies the brakes but can fill a main and reserve reservoir.


I can keep looking to see if I find something that looks close.  Or maybe the CNWHS could have some info.


Thanks again.



Jason 



---In STMFC@..., <wcfn100@...> wrote:

Hi Steve,  when I say moved, I guess I just mean moved from what a standard car would be (or more specifically what the IM box car has).  I think the reason you mentioned is exactly why.


I don't have the express trucks yet, I'm hoping to win a auction for a Athearn Pfaudler Milk car (N scale) but I may need to move the crosstie on the model for clearance as well.



Jason



---In STMFC@..., <shile@...> wrote:

Not so much moved as different, probably from the beginning.  I suspect that the crosstie, that the tab marks the end of, is in a slightly different place, perhaps due to the longer wheel base express trucks.

 

My speculation for today.

 

Steve Hile

 


From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of wcfn100@...
Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 2013 10:10 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: RE: Re: [STMFC] CMO Express Box Cars

 

 

Hi Ben, if you compare to the picture at the top of the page I linked,  the small tab below the reporting marks has moved more towards the center of the car.  I probably won't worry about it unless I can somehow identify what if any new underframe they had.

 

Thanks for the discussion guys.   I have a few books I can look through.  Maybe I can find a brake valve that looks similar.

 

 

Jason



---In STMFC@..., <b.hom@...> wrote:

Jason Kliewer asked:
http://www.steamerafreightcars.com/gallery/boxauto/cnw72710main.html

...it looks like the sill tabs have changed from the as-built car.  Could that be tied in somehow?  I assume that indicates changes to the under frame."

I'm not seeing any changes in the sill tabs.  The express trucks have a longer wheelbase, but if you look closely, the tabs are still in the same position relative to the panel lines.
 
 
Ben Hom


Re: CMO Express Box Cars

Jason Kliewer
 

Hi Steve,  when I say moved, I guess I just mean moved from what a standard car would be (or more specifically what the IM box car has).  I think the reason you mentioned is exactly why.


I don't have the express trucks yet, I'm hoping to win a auction for a Athearn Pfaudler Milk car (N scale) but I may need to move the crosstie on the model for clearance as well.



Jason



---In STMFC@..., <shile@...> wrote:

Not so much moved as different, probably from the beginning.  I suspect that the crosstie, that the tab marks the end of, is in a slightly different place, perhaps due to the longer wheel base express trucks.

 

My speculation for today.

 

Steve Hile

 


From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of wcfn100@...
Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 2013 10:10 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: RE: Re: [STMFC] CMO Express Box Cars

 

 

Hi Ben, if you compare to the picture at the top of the page I linked,  the small tab below the reporting marks has moved more towards the center of the car.  I probably won't worry about it unless I can somehow identify what if any new underframe they had.

 

Thanks for the discussion guys.   I have a few books I can look through.  Maybe I can find a brake valve that looks similar.

 

 

Jason



---In STMFC@..., <b.hom@...> wrote:

Jason Kliewer asked:
http://www.steamerafreightcars.com/gallery/boxauto/cnw72710main.html

...it looks like the sill tabs have changed from the as-built car.  Could that be tied in somehow?  I assume that indicates changes to the under frame."

I'm not seeing any changes in the sill tabs.  The express trucks have a longer wheelbase, but if you look closely, the tabs are still in the same position relative to the panel lines.
 
 
Ben Hom


Re: CMO Express Box Cars

Benjamin Hom
 

Jason Kliewer wrote:
http://www.steamerafreightcars.com/gallery/boxauto/cnw72710main.html
...if you compare to the picture at the top of the page I linked,  the small tab below the reporting marks has moved more towards the center of the car.  I probably won't worry about it unless I can somehow identify what if any new underframe they had."
 
I'll buy that.  It looks like those crossmembers were moved to accomodate the longer wheelbase of the new trucks.  That's a simple enough modification to a model.
 
 
Ben Hom


Re: CMO Express Box Cars

Steve and Barb Hile
 

Not so much moved as different, probably from the beginning.  I suspect that the crosstie, that the tab marks the end of, is in a slightly different place, perhaps due to the longer wheel base express trucks.

 

My speculation for today.

 

Steve Hile

 


From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of wcfn100@...
Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 2013 10:10 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: RE: Re: [STMFC] CMO Express Box Cars

 

 

Hi Ben, if you compare to the picture at the top of the page I linked,  the small tab below the reporting marks has moved more towards the center of the car.  I probably won't worry about it unless I can somehow identify what if any new underframe they had.

 

Thanks for the discussion guys.   I have a few books I can look through.  Maybe I can find a brake valve that looks similar.

 

 

Jason



---In STMFC@..., <b.hom@...> wrote:

Jason Kliewer asked:
http://www.steamerafreightcars.com/gallery/boxauto/cnw72710main.html

...it looks like the sill tabs have changed from the as-built car.  Could that be tied in somehow?  I assume that indicates changes to the under frame."

I'm not seeing any changes in the sill tabs.  The express trucks have a longer wheelbase, but if you look closely, the tabs are still in the same position relative to the panel lines.
 
 
Ben Hom


Re: CMO Express Box Cars

Jason Kliewer
 

Hi Ben, if you compare to the picture at the top of the page I linked,  the small tab below the reporting marks has moved more towards the center of the car.  I probably won't worry about it unless I can somehow identify what if any new underframe they had.


Thanks for the discussion guys.   I have a few books I can look through.  Maybe I can find a brake valve that looks similar.



Jason



---In STMFC@..., <b.hom@...> wrote:

Jason Kliewer asked:
http://www.steamerafreightcars.com/gallery/boxauto/cnw72710main.html

...it looks like the sill tabs have changed from the as-built car.  Could that be tied in somehow?  I assume that indicates changes to the under frame."

I'm not seeing any changes in the sill tabs.  The express trucks have a longer wheelbase, but if you look closely, the tabs are still in the same position relative to the panel lines.
 
 
Ben Hom


Re: CMO Express Box Cars

Dennis Storzek
 

I don't think it's an L valve, because it appears to have a pipe running directly to the valve housing. L triples were piped through a pipe bracket that  was part of the brake cylinder head, while the older P triple had the branch pipe run directly to the valve, very similar to the K freight brake, which was its contemporary. While schedule P was old technology, it lasted quite late in some applications; most, if not all, of the Lackawanna "Boonton" car running on tourist railroads today still have P equipment. Here's a photo of the valve on DL&W 556 at IRM


http://www.irm.org/cgi-bin/image.pl?conf=img800&img=/gallery/albums/DLW556/aac.sized.jpg


Dennis



---In STMFC@..., <asperandeo@...> wrote:

That is a series "L" passenger-type brake valve, which is mounted directly to the end of the brake cylinder. It was commonly used on cars in express service, including both boxcars and reefers. Heavyweight passenger cars used it too, prior to the introduction of the better-known UC valve. We need a good HO scale part for the series L valve ("series" because it had a couple of variations). – Andy 





Re: CMO Express Box Cars

Andy Sperandeo
 

That is a series "L" passenger-type brake valve, which is mounted directly to the end of the brake cylinder. It was commonly used on cars in express service, including both boxcars and reefers. Heavyweight passenger cars used it too, prior to the introduction of the better-known UC valve. We need a good HO scale part for the series L valve ("series" because it had a couple of variations). – Andy 




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