Date   

Re: Intriguing discovery

Benjamin Hom
 

Pierre Oliver asked:
"I've just discovered that the Branchline 40' boxcars were manufactured
in 2 different lengths.
One car is almost a scale foot shorter than the other. I have no idea,
at this time, which version is newer or correct.
Can somebody provide insight?"
The incorrect (longer) cars are from the original tooling.  Branchline, to their credit, made the investment to correct the tooling.  The correct cars can be identified from the end label, which includes a photo of the model.  The incorrect cars lack a photo on the end label.

This source of this error was the same man who brought you (among other mistakes) the Gould/Tichy tank car and incorrect PRR lettering and trucks for the pre-production BLI PRR Class K7A stock cars (fortunately corrected before production).


Ben Hom


Re: Intriguing discovery

Greg Martin
 

Just ask the Boss Mike Brock, when we were ask to figure it out in a train on his layout we couldn't.
 
I have one in ERIE paint that I still have un-built as a collectors piece.
 
They were the very first run and were retooled. I am still looking for metal running board for it... Think I have that one figured out as well.

Greg Martin
 
Eventually all things merge into one and a river runs through it.
Norman Maclean
 
In a message dated 5/8/2014 7:44:31 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, pierre.oliver@... writes:

 

I've just discovered that the Branchline 40' boxcars were manufactured
in 2 different lengths.
One car is almost a scale foot shorter than the other. I have no idea,
at this time, which version is newer or correct.
Can somebody provide insight?
Thanks

--
Pierre Oliver
www.elgincarshops.com
www.yarmouthmodelworks.com


Intriguing discovery

Pierre Oliver
 

I've just discovered that the Branchline 40' boxcars were manufactured in 2 different lengths.
One car is almost a scale foot shorter than the other. I have no idea, at this time, which version is newer or correct.
Can somebody provide insight?
Thanks

--
Pierre Oliver
www.elgincarshops.com
www.yarmouthmodelworks.com


Re: Helium Cars

asychis@...
 

Would really be nice if someone such as Exact Rail or Tangent would do the most common of these cars.  They had a long life and traveled all over the country.  We have an actual car at the Amarillo Railroad Museum donated by the Bureau of Mines.
 
Jerry Michels


Re: Height of Tank Car Handrail

Bill Kelly
 

Guy,
The dimensions and location were later changed in 1920.
The dimension became 7/8ths of an inch for a rod or 1-1/4in pipe. A mininmum clearence of 2-1/2 inches was added.
The location was changed to not less than 36 inches and not more than 54 inches above platform or running-board.
 
These newer specs can be found in Appendix A of the _United States Safety Appliances for All Classes of Cars and Locomotives_ book issued by the AAR Mechanical Div.
 
Later,
Bill Kelly
 
Guy wrote:
 
Bill Asked:
 
"Given that the handrails were safety appliances, was this height used by AC&F based on a rule or regulation?"
 
Bill,
 
The United States Safety Appliance Standards for tank car safety-railings:
 
Number:  One (1) continuous safety-railing running around sides and ends of tank, securely fastened to tank or tank-bands at ends and sides of tank; or two (2) running full length of tank at sides of car supported by posts. 
 
Dimensions:  Not less than Three-fourths (3/4) of an inch, iron.
 
Location: Running full length of tank either at side supported by posts or securely fastened to tank or tank bands, not less than thirty (30) nor more than sixty (60) inches above platform.
 
Manner of Application:  Safety-railings shall be securely fastened to tank-body, tank-bands or posts.  
 
 
Guy Wilber
Reno, Nevada 




WANTED : Stewart Hoppers

Scaler164@...
 

I am looking for the following Stewart Hobbies (not Bowser) hoppers (NOS)... built or unbuilt... MUST have original boxes... no missing or broken parts :
 
 - 14 Panel Triple Hopper - Seaboard Air Line - All six road numbers (or 6-pack)
 
 - 70 Ton Offset  Triple Hopper - Seaboard Air Line - All six road numbers (or 6-pack)
 
 - 70 Ton Offset  Triple Hopper - SOUTHERN - road numbers 70215, 70125, 70152  (Early black cars)
 
 - 70 Ton Offset  Triple Hopper - Atlantic Coast Line - All six road numbers (or 6-pack) (Early cars with 1-52 Blt date)
 
Please contact me off list if you have any of these and are willing to sell, or know where I can find them.
 
Thanks.
 
 
John Degnan
Scaler164@...
 


Re: Santa Fe ends and sills.

Greg Martin
 

jonhedtke@... writes:
"Greg,
I wanted to let you know that I received the Santa Fe ends and sills and they are excellent. I think I can use them from other Santa Fe models as well, do have some still available? I'd be interested in a couple more Santa Fe sets and probably a CNW one as well.
Thanks, Jon"
 
Jon and all,
 
Good question.
 
You need to nail down exactly what you want because we are making a final run of these parts to fill in open orders and I believe we are going to retire them. Let me know right away so I can get the final orders in to the castor. The Santa Fe parts are actually over sold and thus the one last SHORT RUN... We are trying to get the Santa Fe information posted then I am going to complete the Rock Island car.
 
If you requested parts and responded to my email consider this a LAST CALL , as in the words of Tom Hanks, "there is no whining in Baseball"
 
We are moving on to different projects. I am starting to work on SHAKE_N_TAKE 2015.
 
Anyone else that is interested needs to get to me OFF LINE  tgregmrtn@...  pronto...
 
Greg Martin
 
Eventually all things merge into one and a river runs through it.
Norman Maclean
 
 


Re: Height of Tank Car Handrail

Guy Wilber
 

Bill Asked:
 
"Given that the handrails were safety appliances, was this height used by AC&F based on a rule or regulation?"
 
Bill,
 
The United States Safety Appliance Standards for tank car safety-railings:
 
Number:  One (1) continuous safety-railing running around sides and ends of tank, securely fastened to tank or tank-bands at ends and sides of tank; or two (2) running full length of tank at sides of car supported by posts. 
 
Dimensions:  Not less than Three-fourths (3/4) of an inch, iron.
 
Location: Running full length of tank either at side supported by posts or securely fastened to tank or tank bands, not less than thirty (30) nor more than sixty (60) inches above platform.
 
Manner of Application:  Safety-railings shall be securely fastened to tank-body, tank-bands or posts.  
 
 
Guy Wilber
Reno, Nevada 


Re: Helium Cars

Tony Thompson
 

Robert Schott wrote:

 
I am doing internet research before modelling a USNX helium car using the AHM shell.  Jay Miller's 2007 tracing of a GATC car built 1942-43 shows these cars as 42'-6" long.  The later, more prevalent ACF/Magor cars built 1955-62 are reported as 45'-2".  In photos, these look the same to me.  Can anyone confirm the actual car lengths?

      My investigation, using Jay Miller's info and others, confirms the two lengths you mention. You probably know my three blog posts on this topic, including creating a car from the AHM model, starting with this one:


Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history





Re: Helium Cars

Benjamin Hom
 

Robert Schott asked:
"I am doing internet research before modelling a USNX helium car using the AHM shell.  Jay Miller's 2007 tracing of a GATC car built 1942-43 shows these cars as 42'-6" long.  The later, more prevalent ACF/Magor cars built 1955-62 are reported as 45'-2".  In photos, these look the same to me.  Can anyone confirm the actual car lengths?"
These sites may help:
Jay Miller's summary at the SFRHMS website.
http://www.atsfrr.org/Reviews/HO/Freight/Helium/Index.htm


Tony Thompson's Modeling the SP blog entries on modeling helium cars:
http://modelingthesp.blogspot.com/2012/04/helium-cars-part-1.html

http://modelingthesp.blogspot.com/2012/06/helium-cars-part-2.html

http://modelingthesp.blogspot.com/2012/11/helium-cars-part-3.html



Ben Hom


Re: Vendome Tank Car Company

Aley, Jeff A
 

Charles,

 

               The depth and quality of your analyses are amazing!  Great job!

 

-Jeff

 

 

From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of Charles Hostetler
Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2014 12:16 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Vendome Tank Car Company

 

 

In STMFC 123938 Bill Welch wrote:  "I am trying to make a decision about how to decal one of my Southern Car & Foundry's Standard Steel Car model. One option is a car for the Vendome Tank Car Company based in Oklahoma. I assume this company served that states oil companies, something I know very little about. Can someone offer some wisdom in terms of where these cars cars would have been making deliveries? Thank you.

 

 

Bill and any others interested in Vendome,

 

I have also wondered about the geographic scope and frequency of shipments of refinery products.  It turns out that shipments of refinery products from Kansas, Oklahoma, and Texas were reasonably frequent on a band trending from these states northeast toward Wisconsin, and in the case of Texas, on a band extending from Arizona to Georgia.  Factors that promoted geographic scope beyond this band were:

 

-  the nature of the commodity, with other refined products (e.g., kerosene, naphtha, and aromatics shipped to industrial and transportation-related facilities) more widely distributed by rail than fuel oil/diesel (to bulk dealers) which were more widely distributed by rail than gasoline

-  the state of origin, with Texas having a broader distribution than Oklahoma than Kansas

-  the era; in the early 1950s the distribution of gasoline and diesel shipments was wider than in the late 50s, but for other refined products the situation was reversed.  

 

After looking at the frequency of shipments and the numbers of TMs that were based in Kansas, Oklahoma, and Texas it seems to me that (in the absence of more detailed information on the nature of Vendome’s lessee/shipper) modeling shipments of refinery products to consignees in most parts of the U.S. would be not be implausible.  Shipping refinery products from Kansas, Oklahoma, and Texas was not just a local business.  

 

Those interested can find the analyses at:

 

 

and

 

 

Regards,

 

Charles Hostetler

Goshen, Ind.


Helium Cars

bobster1269@...
 

I am doing internet research before modelling a USNX helium car using the AHM shell.  Jay Miller's 2007 tracing of a GATC car built 1942-43 shows these cars as 42'-6" long.  The later, more prevalent ACF/Magor cars built 1955-62 are reported as 45'-2".  In photos, these look the same to me.  Can anyone confirm the actual car lengths?


Thanks you,

Robert Schott


Re: Vendome Tank Car Company

Steve SANDIFER
 

Great Stuff. Since I model Emporia, I should have one of these. Does anyone
make the decals in HO scale?

________________________________________________________________
Steve Sandifer
12027 Mulholland Drive, Meadows Place, TX 77477
713-376-0684
www.ssandifer.com

From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of
Charles Hostetler
Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2014 2:16 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Vendome Tank Car Company


In STMFC 123938 Bill Welch wrote: "I am trying to make a decision about how
to decal one of my Southern Car & Foundry's Standard Steel Car model. One
option is a car for the Vendome Tank Car Company based in Oklahoma. I assume
this company served that states oil companies, something I know very little
about. Can someone offer some wisdom in terms of where these cars cars would
have been making deliveries? Thank you."


Bill and any others interested in Vendome,

I have also wondered about the geographic scope and frequency of shipments
of refinery products. It turns out that shipments of refinery products from
Kansas, Oklahoma, and Texas were reasonably frequent on a band trending from
these states northeast toward Wisconsin, and in the case of Texas, on a band
extending from Arizona to Georgia. Factors that promoted geographic scope
beyond this band were:

- the nature of the commodity, with other refined products (e.g., kerosene,
naphtha, and aromatics shipped to industrial and transportation-related
facilities) more widely distributed by rail than fuel oil/diesel (to bulk
dealers) which were more widely distributed by rail than gasoline
- the state of origin, with Texas having a broader distribution than
Oklahoma than Kansas
- the era; in the early 1950s the distribution of gasoline and diesel
shipments was wider than in the late 50s, but for other refined products the
situation was reversed.

After looking at the frequency of shipments and the numbers of TMs that were
based in Kansas, Oklahoma, and Texas it seems to me that (in the absence of
more detailed information on the nature of Vendome's lessee/shipper)
modeling shipments of refinery products to consignees in most parts of the
U.S. would be not be implausible. Shipping refinery products from Kansas,
Oklahoma, and Texas was not just a local business.

Those interested can find the analyses at:

http://cnwmodeling.blogspot.com/2014/05/vendome-tank-car-co-where-did-they-m
ake.html

and

http://cnwmodeling.blogspot.com/2014/05/vendome-shipments-part-2.html

Regards,

Charles Hostetler
Goshen, Ind.


Re: Height of Tank Car Handrail

Tony Thompson
 

Mike Brock wrote:

A quick look at AC&F drawings shows the height of the handrail from running board for 10,000 gal ICC 103 cars to run from 3' 11 3/4" to 4' 4 15/16".
Semet Solvay cars show different heights possibly depending on the tank size. 
Just an observation but AC&F doesn't seem to have had a definite idea of what the height should be. Perhaps it was based on some manager's height?


      I have in front of me the AAR "Specifications for Tank Cars" book, effective August 1, 1941. It's a 6 x 9-inch softbound book of about 180 pages. It contains nothing for any car type about platforms or hand rails. This fits with what Ed Kaminski told me about AC&F sales: the buyer specifies all those details, as to what kind and size of platform they want. So I think there was NOT any standard. We will either have to model specific cars based on specific information, or try to use something "typical."

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history





Re: Vendome Tank Car Company

Charles Hostetler
 

In STMFC 123938 Bill Welch wrote:  "I am trying to make a decision about how to decal one of my Southern Car & Foundry's Standard Steel Car model. One option is a car for the Vendome Tank Car Company based in Oklahoma. I assume this company served that states oil companies, something I know very little about. Can someone offer some wisdom in terms of where these cars cars would have been making deliveries? Thank you.


Bill and any others interested in Vendome,

I have also wondered about the geographic scope and frequency of shipments of refinery products.  It turns out that shipments of refinery products from Kansas, Oklahoma, and Texas were reasonably frequent on a band trending from these states northeast toward Wisconsin, and in the case of Texas, on a band extending from Arizona to Georgia.  Factors that promoted geographic scope beyond this band were:

-  the nature of the commodity, with other refined products (e.g., kerosene, naphtha, and aromatics shipped to industrial and transportation-related facilities) more widely distributed by rail than fuel oil/diesel (to bulk dealers) which were more widely distributed by rail than gasoline
-  the state of origin, with Texas having a broader distribution than Oklahoma than Kansas
-  the era; in the early 1950s the distribution of gasoline and diesel shipments was wider than in the late 50s, but for other refined products the situation was reversed.  

After looking at the frequency of shipments and the numbers of TMs that were based in Kansas, Oklahoma, and Texas it seems to me that (in the absence of more detailed information on the nature of Vendome’s lessee/shipper) modeling shipments of refinery products to consignees in most parts of the U.S. would be not be implausible.  Shipping refinery products from Kansas, Oklahoma, and Texas was not just a local business.  

Those interested can find the analyses at:


and


Regards,

Charles Hostetler
Goshen, Ind.


Re: Height of Tank Car Handrail

Bill Welch
 

I do have a 10 K S-S drawing.

Bill Welch


Re: Decal problems

Jim Betz
 

Denny,

Although I use Microscale decals almost
exclusively I also use a fair amount of Champ
and other decals. Many/most of them I have
had - in my possession - for more than a
decade ... and some for more than 2 decades.

I have never had a problem getting the decals
to separate from the backing.

****

Perhaps my 'process' will help you and others.

1) I put about 1/2" of -distilled- water in a glass
pie plate - and set it down on a dark towel.
Towel to catch any spills, dark so you can see
the decals in the water. I have used a drop or
two of PhotoFlo or other wetting agents in the
water in the past - but I don't any more because
it seemed to me that it softened the decals and
made them more likely to break up.

2) I cut the decals out using sharp scissors I
only use for decals. And drop them in the
water.

3) About 3 to 5 minutes later (or more) I start
'just touching' the decal film with the point
of an Exacto knife - testing if the decal is
starting to move. If it is I let it sit about a
minute more.

4) Slide the decal off the paper, still immersed
in the distilled water - and slip the Exacto
blade under it and carefully lift it out of the
water.

5) Transfer the decal to the model and lay it
down as close to the final position as I can.

6) Add at least one drop of the distilled water
on top of the decal and then use the tip of
the blade to position the decal.

7) Using small 1" square (or so) pieces of tissue
I put a corner into the edge of the bead of
water around the decal and wick the water
away.

8) Set it aside (or work on another part of the
model or another model) and let the water
dry for about 15-20 minutes. If it is not
settled down enough I will add water and
work the decal down. I usually use a -sharp-
pin to puncture the decal - the kind that has
a round ball of plastic for a head. It is -very-
important that you move the pin in a
vertical line both going down and coming
back up.
During this phase I do not let the decal
dry fully - it always has some wetness to it.

9) When the decal is fully settled I wick away
any remaining water (again -never- touching
the decal with the tissue) and start the first
of several applications of setting solution.

10) During the first application of the setting
solution is when I ... finally ... get ever last
little bubble and 'shiny spots' settled down
by pricking with the pin.

11) Set aside to dry, reapply setting solution as
required until the decal is fully down. I
apply the setting solution with a brush
and 'float' the solution off the brush and
onto the model without touching the
decal.

12) Let the decal -fully- dry before doing any
over spray with a 'fixing' product such as
dull coat. (I first 'wash' the car with water
to remove any decal setting solution.)

Yes, the above takes a -long- time. I don't work
on just one model at a time. I only work on one
side of a model at a time and get the decals all
the way thru step 11 before I change to a different
side. Usually the side I'm working on is pretty
much horizontal most of the time - but I have
been know to 'tilt' them a bit when wicking the
solutions.
****

OK - here is where some guys are going to
positively GROAN/YELL at me ...

For over 2 decades now the only setting
solution I've ever used for any decal work
has been Solvaset. Yes, it is very 'aggressive'.
But if the decal is Fully settled down before
you ever use it, and you Never touch the
decal with the brush, and you Don't try to
prick or touch the decal between drying
stages ... I have found I can use Solvaset
for any and all decals.
- Jim Betz

P.S. The above works for me. What do you
do that works for you?


Re: Height of Tank Car Handrail

Mikebrock
 

Bill,
A quick look at AC&F drawings shows the height of the handrail from running board for 10,000 gal ICC 103 cars to run from 3' 11 3/4" to 4' 4 15/16". Semet Solvay cars show different heights possibly depending on the tank size. Do you actually have a Semet Solvay drawing?

Just an observation but AC&F doesn't seem to have had a definite idea of what the height should be. Perhaps it was based on some manager's height?

Mike Brock


Re: General American tank car parts from Tangent Scale Models

Tangent Scale Models
 

Al,

 

While there are at least 3 configurations of these underframes over the course of their production span (and thanks to changeovers from KC brakes), here is what I consider to be the most common variation.

 

The retainer valve pull rod is basically a .010" wire that protrudes from underneath the AB Valve.  It is not centered underneath the AB valve but is on the right side underneath it, perhaps 2 inches from the outside edge. 

 

The wire rod itself protrudes outward from the AB valve about 6 inches, and then has a ~120 degree bend and extends another 3 inches, providing a lever for the employee to "pull". 

 

For the "other" side of the car, the valve hangs from a bracket mounted to the underside of the walkway.  See the prototype photo here: 

https://www.tangentscalemodels.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/11512-prototype-gatx52444_1000.jpg (if that link breaks thanks to neo yahoo, go to the "sold out" section of www.tangentscalemodels.com, then GA tank cars, then click on the GATX 1968 car offering).

 

I hope this helps.


David Lehlbach

Tangent Scale Models


Re: General American tank car parts from Tangent Scale Models

al_brown03
 

I'm building the Tangent General American three-compartment tank-car kit, and a lovely kit it is ... I'm thinking to add a little more detail: would anyone happen to know where the retainer valve is located on this car?

 

T.I.A.,

 

Al Brown, Melbourne, Fla.

72701 - 72720 of 196937