Date   

Tangent Acid Tanks Cars Once Again

asychis@...
 

I received my five today.  MAGNIFICENT!  Thanks Dave.
 
Jerry Michels


Re: Dowell vs Dow Chemical?

hubert mask
 

Larry Buell please contact me of list 

Hubert Mask 


On Nov 22, 2014, at 7:53 PM, "'Larry Buell' lbuell@... [STMFC]" <STMFC@...> wrote:

 

I worked for Dowell from June, 1973 until April, 1976, before I went to work for the Santa Fe Ry.  The full name of the company was Dowell Division of Dow Chemical.  The headquarters was in Midland, MI at that time.  Dowell was later taken over by Slumberger, a French-American joint venture, IIRC, in the oil patch.  Dowell got its start after Dow management realized the potential for improving the output of oil/gas wells after acidizing some of Dow’s brine wells and noting the output improvements.


Re: Dowell vs Dow Chemical? and MKT express boxcars.

Tom Palmer
 

Hi Larry,

                It is Schlumberger. The Dowell group still exists and is partially located at Schlumberger’s Sugar Land Texas campus. I know this because I work for Schlumberger and have friends who work in the Dowell group. I design drilling tools for another engineering group.

                Answering Tom Baker’s question on MKT express boxcars they had Murphy rectangular panel roofs. Starting in October of 1949 the cars were repainted Pullman green with dulux gold lettering. By January 1950 all cars in express service were repainted. The cars that were transferred to freight service remained Sloan yellow with the express markings painted over and extra passenger connections blanked out.

 

Best regards to all,

Tom Palmer

Stafford, Texas

Modeling the Katy in central Texas in the year 1952

 

 

From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Saturday, November 22, 2014 6:53 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Dowell vs Dow Chemical?

 

 

I worked for Dowell from June, 1973 until April, 1976, before I went to work for the Santa Fe Ry.  The full name of the company was Dowell Division of Dow Chemical.  The headquarters was in Midland, MI at that time.  Dowell was later taken over by Slumberger, a French-American joint venture, IIRC, in the oil patch.  Dowell got its start after Dow management realized the potential for improving the output of oil/gas wells after acidizing some of Dow’s brine wells and noting the output improvements.


Re: Prototype fidelity

Nelson Moyer <ku0a@...>
 

Actually, I'm not boggled at all. After four years of BRHS membership, I
fully understand the limitations of society leadership and the proclivities
of the membership. The BRHS is predominantly made up of retired railroaders
and railroad historians. While there are modelers among the ranks, few are
true prototype modelers. Most of the societies modelers are perfectly happy
with Accurail.



I give the society credit for some excellent Burlington Bulletins over the
years, but the publication schedule has sagged in recent years to the point
where I'm beginning to wonder about the value of continued membership.



The bottom line is, 'Knowledge is power', and whoever said that was
certainly right when it comes to historical society or society affiliated
model releases.



Nelson Moyer



From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Saturday, November 22, 2014 6:08 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Prototype fidelity





Boggles the mind to think any society would issue a bogus car. Caveat
emptor!



Michael Gross

Facebook.com/ActorMichaelGross <http://Facebook.com/ActorMichaelGross>

Twitter.com/MichaelGrossBiz <http://Twitter.com/MichaelGrossBiz>


Re: Prototype fidelity

Charles Peck
 

It would seem that a well run board, faced with a decision outside their expertise, would seek assistance from someone better informed.
Chuck Peck

On Sat, Nov 22, 2014 at 7:42 PM, 'Douglas Harding' doug.harding@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:
 

And a lot has to do with who sits on the deciding board of the Historical Society. One of the struggles with the CNWHS, the one cited by Clark, is the board was mostly former employees and/or railfans, but not modelers, and certainly not prototype modelers. If a car was lettered for their favorite road it was ok, even if was an Athearn bluebox car. And remember when many HS got started, the Athearn bluebox was about the only car they could get custom lettered. So the powers that be keep going back to the same supplier, asking what have to you got that we can letter for ….

 

​ 

 

Doug Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org

 



Re: Dowell vs Dow Chemical?

Larry Buell
 

I worked for Dowell from June, 1973 until April, 1976, before I went to work for the Santa Fe Ry.  The full name of the company was Dowell Division of Dow Chemical.  The headquarters was in Midland, MI at that time.  Dowell was later taken over by Slumberger, a French-American joint venture, IIRC, in the oil patch.  Dowell got its start after Dow management realized the potential for improving the output of oil/gas wells after acidizing some of Dow’s brine wells and noting the output improvements.


Re: Prototype fidelity

Douglas Harding
 

And a lot has to do with who sits on the deciding board of the Historical Society. One of the struggles with the CNWHS, the one cited by Clark, is the board was mostly former employees and/or railfans, but not modelers, and certainly not prototype modelers. If a car was lettered for their favorite road it was ok, even if was an Athearn bluebox car. And remember when many HS got started, the Athearn bluebox was about the only car they could get custom lettered. So the powers that be keep going back to the same supplier, asking what have to you got that we can letter for ….

 

Fortunately we have companies and individuals who are willing to come as close as they can with a prototypically correct freight car. For example the Cudahy meat reefer that Don Valentine, via his NERS, had Atlas run using their 36’ wood meat reefer. I just got mine today and compared it to the photo Don used. It looks excellent, considering he used an off the shelf model. Atlas claims their meat reefer is based upon a Cudahy car, and the model is very, very close. Most will be very pleased. Those who aren’t may want to stick with scratch building.

 

Doug Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org

 


Re: Prototype fidelity

Tim O'Connor
 


I think it's been the general practice for a very long time... Although
it has changed in the last 10-15 years with the availability of so many
accurate models. I have foobies from the IC, MP, SOO, and other societies.

Tim O'Connor



 Boggles the mind to think any society would issue a bogus car.  Caveat emptor!
 Michael Gross


Re: Prototype fidelity

michaelegross <michaelEGross@...>
 

Boggles the mind to think any society would issue a bogus car.  Caveat emptor!


Re: Dowell vs Dow Chemical?

Dave Parker
 

Sorry, there is no such thing as ferric chromide (or even a chromide ligand for that matter).

Ferric chloride enjoys a rich tradition in metal etching, originally for artwork and more recently for things like PCBs.  It is often supplied and shipped in liquid form, thus its relevance to tank cars.

Dave Parker
Riverside, CA


Re: Dowell vs Dow Chemical?

arved_grass
 

On Sat, 11/22/14, Ed Hawkins hawk0621@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:

I don't know what Ferric Chromide is...
Commonly used as an etchant for copper based alloys. i.e. printed circuit boards, and those nifty etched brass parts we use on our models.

Arved Grass
Fleming Island, Florida


Re: Dowell vs Dow Chemical?

Ian Cranstone
 

On 2014-11-22, at 4:02 AM, Tim O'Connor timboconnor@... [STMFC] wrote:
 

Two acid tank cars, consecutively numbered, one lettered for
Dow Chemical in Midland Michigan and the other for Dowell?? Was
this the origin of the Dow name or just a weird coincidence?

https://www.flickr.com/photos/barrigerlibrary/15541180788/
https://www.flickr.com/photos/barrigerlibrary/15107226713/

I can't make out the gallonage on either car. Anyone know?

After sleuthing through ORERs, I believe DOWX 8370 became DOWX 38328 in late 1939 or early 1940.

DOWX 8371 disappeared from the roster in late 1937 or early 1938, prior to the renumbering of the fleet -- my guess would be that Dowell was spun off to another outfit at this time (apparently under a new name), although the car could possibly have been wrecked.


Re: Stock car question

Andy Carlson
 

As a great admirer and friend of the late Jack Parker, I have a little more to add to the decision as to why the car was built over width. Jack told me that he felt that there was not enough room for the trucks to swivel on a 12" radius track, so his decision to built the car wide was to aid the tangent-challenged modellers.

Jack was a fine scale modeler, and reflecting on his decision to go wide he admitted it had been a mistake. Though freight cars were low on his list of priorities (Look how many Athearn BB box cars show in his pictures of his NP freight trains) he could go deep-end when it suited him. He had quite a few brass steam locomotives, many with 63 inch drivers which appearances bothered Jack. He simply machined 3 or 4 driver centers in Acrylic at 4 X size, followed by pantographing the shape into a hard aluminum mold. After injection molding styrene HO copies, he had them investment cast into brass. He made his own steel driver tires and later ALL of his steam engines had satisfactory drivers! He and Terry Wegmann were friends, and I felt I was in the presence of greatness when around those two great guys.

-Andy Carlson
Ojai CA


From: "aschneiderjr@... [STMFC]" To: STMFC@...
Sent: Saturday, November 22, 2014 12:04 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Stock car question

 
Thanks. That raises a question. If I go to the trouble of narrowing the cars, will they look worse because of the oversize trucks? I can't do much about them.

Alex Schneider



OZCX 1 and 2

spsalso
 

While searching for what happened to ole number 500, I found a couple of interesting tank cars in the July 1945 ORER:


Ozark Chemical Company


OZCX 1 and 2


11,586 and 11,589 gal capy


200,000 lb capy



And I said to myself:  A 100 ton tank car in 1945?  And ?????




Ed


Edward Sutorik


Re: Stock car question

Tim O'Connor
 

I doubt it was because of "oversize trucks". But it may have been because
the swing of the trucks on 22" HO scale radius curves would interfere with
the sill steps on the corners. So if you narrow the cars you might have to
go with etched steps like those from Yarmouth, or fabricate your own, so
you can bend them outwards -- if you run them on tight radius track that is.

Tim O'Connor

Thanks. That raises a question. If I go to the trouble of narrowing the cars, will they look worse because of the oversize trucks? I can't do much about them.

Alex Schneider


Re: Prototype fidelity

Andy Carlson
 

Ask Tony about Richard Hendrickson's reaction to the CB&Q's society similar destroying their assumed crown of all-knowing expertise by passing off inappropriate cars for a society offering. Our Richard was heaped a lot of scorn from self-righteous "defenders" of the indefensible. Richard, of course, took it well.

The first Naperville following this, I saw the Q's Bat Masterson visiting with Richard amicably, prompting me to do my best (Could be argued) Rogers and Hammerstein "Oh the farmer and the cowboy should be friends". Richard laughed, as he was one of a few who understood some of my humor, Bat was puzzled.

Anyhow, they both survived as friends, which illustrates yet another of Richard's fine traits.
-Andy Carlson
Ojai CA


From: "cepropst@q.com [STMFC]"
Now that I’ve rambled on let me get to the reason for this post. How many group members trust what an historical society offers to be reasonably prototypical? I feel the average Joe modeler does.
I was given the opportunity to see a photo of the next cars being offered by the CNWHS at their annual convention next spring. They have chosen to have Accurail do two CGW box cars for them. One is a one only 40’ 8’ door PS1 with a SL badge. The Accurail model’s a fair choice. The second car is a 40’ 6’ door PS1 with DF badge. Does Accurail offer a PS1 with a 6’ door? No. So guess what carbody they put the paint job on? Their 3500 series AAR box car! A completely wrong car! This convention is a joint convention with the UP society. So they reweighed one of the cars with the reweigh station symbol of UP.
To me this is worst than the Atlas tank car goof...They are abusing the modeler’s trust, or showing them little if any respect.
 
Clark Propst
Mason City Iowa



Re: Stock car question

Alex Schneider
 

Thanks. That raises a question. If I go to the trouble of narrowing the cars, will they look worse because of the oversize trucks? I can't do much about them.


Alex Schneider


Prototype fidelity

Clark Propst
 

Bill wrote, referring to the rivet strip on the Atlas tank car running board: “To me this is right up there with the 41-foot Branchline post-war steel boxcars,”
 
Beings these are RTR cars it’s something I never noticed. Take the tank car out of the box, weather it and run it. Tank cars are a mystery to many of us, they’re not well documented like, say a box car, where I can look up which brake wheel should be on the car, as an example.
I own 6 tank cars for my packing house operation, 2 for my oil distributor, 1 SC&F two dome and a Tangent three dome and 1 of the Atlas cars to haul ammonia to my fertilizer manufacturing plant. Modeling one town and running no through trains, that’s all I need. The layout operates on a 5 day week cycle. The 6 packinghouse cars run through the cycle of being weighed empty, cleaned/inspected and loaded, weighed each session. One car is delivered to the oil jobber on Tuesday and the other is spotted on Thursday. This gives the oil dealer enough time to unload the cars without demurrage if we don’t count the weekend when there’s no switch job. The ammonia car is delivered once a week.
 
Now that I’ve rambled on let me get to the reason for this post. How many group members trust what an historical society offers to be reasonably prototypical? I feel the average Joe modeler does.
I was given the opportunity to see a photo of the next cars being offered by the CNWHS at their annual convention next spring. They have chosen to have Accurail do two CGW box cars for them. One is a one only 40’ 8’ door PS1 with a SL badge. The Accurail model’s a fair choice. The second car is a 40’ 6’ door PS1 with DF badge. Does Accurail offer a PS1 with a 6’ door? No. So guess what carbody they put the paint job on? Their 3500 series AAR box car! A completely wrong car! This convention is a joint convention with the UP society. So they reweighed one of the cars with the reweigh station symbol of UP.
To me this is worst than the Atlas tank car goof...They are abusing the modeler’s trust, or showing them little if any respect.
 
Clark Propst
Mason City Iowa


Re: Identity of very large FD built February 1941

Jack Mullen
 

The Jumbo cask was designed to be used to contain the test bomb during the Trinity test, so that if the implosion failed to initiate a critical nuclear reaction, the plutonium would be contained and could be recovered. As it happened, it was later decided not to use it and it was placed near ground zero, surviving the blast more-or-less intact.

Apparently Jumbo was moved by rail twice: Delivery from Babcock and Wilcox in Barberton, Ohio to Los Alamos (Post, NM) in spring 1945, and from there to the test site in late June or early July. The final leg of each trip was by road on a special trailer. 

 
IIRC, neither the Trinity device nor the two bombs were transported intact. Components were transported separately and assembled before use, at the test site and on Tinian, respectively.  Nothing as massive as the Jumbo cask would have been needed for transportation. 

Jack Mullen


Re: Rib Side Car Kits

Bill Welch
 

Dave would you mind sending to me at:
fgexbill(at)tampabay.rr.com

Bill Welch

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