Date   

Re: Athearn container gondolas

dahminator68
 

Hello:
 
The Westerfield Models Containers are still available, as are the decals for them.
 
Please see our #1200 Series Kits for the HB1A & H4 PRR Containers and decals.
 
Please see our #8100 Series Kits for the LCL Containers, for NYC, B&O & Reading.
 
Thank you,
Andrew Dahm



From: "Tim O'Connor timboconnor@... [STMFC]" <STMFC@...>
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2015 9:36 PM
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Athearn container gondolas

 

I vaguely recall that the origin of those containers were the massive
construction projects in New York by Robert Moses, which used an ocean
of cement. So it makes sense that all of the "anthracite" railroads
that served the New York City area, and upstate, had them.

The PRR also had containers but theirs was a boxy design, which is still
available I think from Westerfield. I've seen 1960's photos of the PRR
containers still in use -- but not in Iowa, Gene! :-)

Tim O'Connor


Plus Lackawanna and D&H.
Schuyler
I�e wondered if the cylindrical contains were built by one company and several railroads purchased them for use in cement service?   I know the NYC and the LV had them, I seem to recall CNJ as well?  Todd Horton
 
From: STMFC@... [ mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2015 9:42 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Athearn container gondolas
 
 


If you watch the 1960's movie "In The Heat Of The Night" there is scene
that features a Missouri Pacific train passing overhead and there are three
gondolas filled with containers that look remarkably like the Athearn "box"
style containers. The other cars in the train are covered hoppers so I'm
going to guess this train is moving cement cars. (It was filmed in Illinois.)

But I agree with Ben there were some insulated/LCL containers that also had
a similar appearance to the boxy Athearn containers. MP operated a number of
different kinds of bulk and LCL containers.

I've only ever seen the cylindrical containers in LV gondolas. I bought decals
for them from someone here years ago -- although the name escapes me now. The
gondolas can be "stood in" by modifying the Athearn gondola to remove the deep
fishbelly, cutting holes in the side, and putting steel braces on the floor and
top chord to hold the containers in place. You can detail the containers to
greatly improve their appearance, especially the lifting lugs.

Tim O'Connor



Re: NYC box car photo

Ed Hawkins
 

On Jan 15, 2015, at 10:57 AM, cepropst@q.com [STMFC] wrote:

I bought the NYC decal set from Ted at CCB. It wasn’t till I got home
that I could look up the number of the car I wish to model. NYC 167138
series 167000-167999. Therefore I missed out on looking through Bob’s
NYC binders.
I did find a photo of a tank car I’ modeling and two other photos from
his ‘new’ binders.
 
I believe this car is an early PS1. I would like a photo so I can
check out details that may or may not have been on these cars. Like,
corner sill tabs, straight stiles on the end ladders, etc.
 
Clark,
You are correct that it's an early PS-1, built ca. 3-48,
Pullman-Standard lot 5904. The only two photos I've found from NYC
167000-167999 are on page 99 of the 1949/1951 Car Builders' Cyclopedia
and a 1960 repaint of 167210 (Paul Dunn photo, Bob Lorenz collection).

This series was one of 9 series of PS-1s built in 1947-1948 having a
Pullman-Standard welded roof (same type roof as on CGW 93001-93500
built in 1947 among others).

This roof is quite different than the common P-S riveted roofs found on
PS-1s built in 1947-1949 (lacking the corrugation on the far end panels) or the more common P-S riveted roofs found on PS-1s built in
1950 and after (like the roof on the Kadee model).

If this early P-S welded roof has been offered in HO scale, I'm not
aware of it.
Regards,
Ed Hawkins


Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: (was Athearn) container gondolas (UNCLASSIFIED)

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
Caveats: NONE

Guys;

The area of container gons has not been fully explored. There is very poor resolution on many of them, even though most of them appear in ORERs.

In addition to the cylindrical cement containers, and oddball insulated (refrigerated?) containers, there were also the open-topped coke containers, and hatch-topped drop bottom or hopper bottom bulk materials containers, as well as the merchandise (LCL) containers.

Roads that had bulk containers included: B&O, DT&I, Erie, L&N, LV, Monon, NKP, N&W, NYC, P&LE, P&WV, PRR, RDG, and WM. Lots of these were used shipping things like powdered dolomite and other additives for the steel industry or other heavy industries.

I have seen them in photos in many locations all over the country, since they were serving industries in many locations.

The Westerfield PRR containers, and also their Youngstown containers are very nice. They build into very realistic loads. The previously-available Walthers Youngstown containers, and coke containers, and not quite as "fine", but still credible. They are also separate containers, which permits one to set up partial, or badly-loaded loads. At least on the PRR, they had container gons that did not have the truck capacity to carry 80-100 tons of containers, so they blocked portions of the center of the car, to permit no more than nine (+ or -) containers. Those are very interesting cars visually.

Some gons had very serious interior blocking, some had none. Some containers gons were fitted with replacement wire mesh flooring, except over the brake hardware and trucks. I am not aware of any offerings for these in anything but brass.

The NYC had a very large group of interesting container cars I would love to see more research on. You could read and see more on the PRR gons in the PRR gon book.

Elden Gatwood

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2015 9:42 PM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [STMFC] Athearn container gondolas




If you watch the 1960's movie "In The Heat Of The Night" there is scene
that features a Missouri Pacific train passing overhead and there are three
gondolas filled with containers that look remarkably like the Athearn "box"
style containers. The other cars in the train are covered hoppers so I'm
going to guess this train is moving cement cars. (It was filmed in Illinois.)

But I agree with Ben there were some insulated/LCL containers that also had
a similar appearance to the boxy Athearn containers. MP operated a number of
different kinds of bulk and LCL containers.

I've only ever seen the cylindrical containers in LV gondolas. I bought decals
for them from someone here years ago -- although the name escapes me now. The
gondolas can be "stood in" by modifying the Athearn gondola to remove the deep
fishbelly, cutting holes in the side, and putting steel braces on the floor and
top chord to hold the containers in place. You can detail the containers to
greatly improve their appearance, especially the lifting lugs.

Tim O'Connor





Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
Caveats: NONE


Re: Ye Old X29

Bruce Smith
 

Arved, Folks,

Just to clarify, the etched X29 patch panels that I showed at Cocoa were created by Peter Aue and will be sold through Pierre Oliver’s Yarmouth Model Works.  They are not yet available.

Regards

Bruce


Bruce F. Smith            

Auburn, AL

https://www5.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/

"Some days you are the bug, some days you are the windshield."



On Jan 15, 2015, at 8:50 AM, Arved Grass arved_grass@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:

Could you look into availability of Red Caboose X29 boxcars? I'm primarily interested in RC 7005s, but RC 7002 would also work for me. I believe the patch panels are available in etched brass now.
<SNIP>
Thanks,
Arved Grass
Arved_Grass@... or Arved@...
Fleming Island, Florida


NYC box car photo

Clark Propst
 

I bought the NYC decal set from Ted at CCB. It wasn’t till I got home that I could look up the number of the car I wish to model. NYC 167138 series 167000-167999. Therefore I missed out on looking through Bob’s NYC binders.
I did find a photo of a tank car I’ modeling and two other photos from his ‘new’ binders.
 
I believe this car is an early PS1. I would like a photo so I can check out details that may or may not have been on these cars. Like, corner sill tabs, straight stiles on the end ladders, etc.
 
Thanks for any help!!
Clark Propst
Mason City Iowa


Re: Athearn container gondolas

 

Speaking of containers in gondolas, in the early real container days used to see 40' cans in gondolas in the early '80s. This was on the Santa Fe going EB thru Fullerton CA. Guess they were so short on even pig flats they used whatever would work.
Andy Jackson
Bellflower CA


Re: Ye Old X29

arved_grass
 

Sorry. This was meant off-list for Andy Carlson, and I evidently neglected to change the addressee.

Voluntarily placing myself in moderator lockup,
Arved Grass
Arved_Grass@yahoo.com or Arved@I-Do-Photography.com
Fleming Island, Florida

--------------------------------------------

On Thu, 1/15/15, Arved Grass arved_grass@yahoo.com [STMFC] <STMFC@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Subject: [STMFC] Ye Old X29
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Date: Thursday, January 15, 2015, 9:50 AM


 









Could you look into availability of Red Caboose X29
boxcars? I'm primarily interested in RC 7005s, but RC
7002 would also work for me. I believe the patch panels are
available in etched brass now.



The "Undecorated Kit Listing" shows them as in
stock, but when I go to the individual cars,7002 shows
"Kits may be in limited supply"/Low Stock, and
7005 shows "Kits may be in limited supply"/Out of
Stock. I'm not sure how up to date the stock listing
is.



I'd like to avoid buying Walthers/Trainline models. They
have molded on grabs and ladders, whereas the RC kits have
them separate. I don't know of another option for the
X29. Perhaps old Train Miniature, but I doubt they'll be
any better than the Walthers models.



Thanks,

Arved Grass

Arved_Grass@yahoo.com or Arved@I-Do-Photography.com

Fleming Island, Florida













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Ye Old X29

arved_grass
 

Could you look into availability of Red Caboose X29 boxcars? I'm primarily interested in RC 7005s, but RC 7002 would also work for me. I believe the patch panels are available in etched brass now.

The "Undecorated Kit Listing" shows them as in stock, but when I go to the individual cars,7002 shows "Kits may be in limited supply"/Low Stock, and 7005 shows "Kits may be in limited supply"/Out of Stock. I'm not sure how up to date the stock listing is.

I'd like to avoid buying Walthers/Trainline models. They have molded on grabs and ladders, whereas the RC kits have them separate. I don't know of another option for the X29. Perhaps old Train Miniature, but I doubt they'll be any better than the Walthers models.

Thanks,
Arved Grass
Arved_Grass@yahoo.com or Arved@I-Do-Photography.com
Fleming Island, Florida


Re: Xxtreme Modeling Presentation

gtws00
 

Bill,
Yes please show up at Lisle. I could not get to The Beach. Can you please provide the link you are referring too?

Thanks

George Toman


Re: Klein Modellbahn 2-dome tank car

Hobi Point
 

There is one USTC two-dome tankcar restored in Croatian RR museum:

Few more photos of it --> http://bit.ly/1B4YXTU

As somebody said, Roco is coming with similar models in 2015: http://www.ajckids.com/TRAINS/detail.asp?Manufacturer=Roco&Item=67117

Tomislav Dornik 


Re: Bobs photos

Scott H. Haycock
 

Great story, Andy!

As I'm working on setting up a new computer in a space that will become a digital darkroom/scanner/printer/matting and framing work workroom, I'd like to keep this conversation going.

But I really don't want to push Mike's patience... Maybe there is a more appropriate (but unknown to me) list for this subject.  

Scott Haycock


 

At 05:15 PM 1/13/2015 -0800, you wrote:
>use the services of others for all printing. As I have found myself of
>late it is also becoming more and
>more difficult to purchase decent black & white photographic printing
>paper and chemicals. Once
>they have been found the price is often prohibitive as well. Whatever
>happened to American
>opportunity and competition? It is even effecting the STMFC hobby field.

I had a small but very functional purpose built darkroom at my old
house. 5x8' with a counter top, double sink, ventilation, the
works. Going in there was like going into a casino. No clocks - time
would go by. More than once I went in after dinner, and when I came out
the sun was coming up. Alas when I moved in 2003, I dismantled it and my
equipment is in storage. But I still have it. I could probably set up a
usable darkroom in my basement on a temporary basis, but there is that
question of paper and chemistry. I haven't gone shopping for it since the
90s. I even have undeveloped B&W film from the 90s that I really need to
get done - I never let anybody else develop my B&W film. At least if I get
the negs, I can scan them which is what I've been slowly doing with my
slide collection.

I loved darkroom work. I grew up with it - there was a time when a home
darkroom wasn't all that unusual, and the corner drugstore sold some basic
chemicals and supplies. I probably made my first prints when I was 5 or
6. But it is very time consuming. I've never been much into art printing
- most of my subjects were railroad and family, and I was only concerned
with getting a good print, not doing 4 hours worth of dodge-burn on a
single print. Even so, in a session I might produce 50, 60 8x10 prints and
I'd emerge with a stiff neck and blurry vision. I can't imagine what it's
like to do that on a "production" basis.

Funny - I was showing Annette my Leicas tonight. We were watching a TV
show where a woman was taking pictures in 1953, and she had a correct prop
- a Leica screwmount with a collapsible lens. Unfortunately she was taking
all her pictures with the lens in collapsed position. Ask me how I know
that doesn't work.... I got out my 1957 M3 w/collapsible, and my 2000
M6. A part of me says I should sell them and get some decent money,
another part of me wants to go buy some TMX and just go drive out in the
country somewhere and shoot a roll like I used to do 20 years ago.

Andy



Re: Klein Modellbahn 2-dome tank car

Hobi Point
 

Somewhat in line with the tankca, Fleischmann also has (as News for 2015) three other USTC cars in the pipeline: https://www.flipgorilla.com/p/23735439970015520/show#/23735439970015520/40
(PDF page 41)

Regards!
Tomislav Dornik


Re: Bobs photos

Andy Harman
 

At 02:26 AM 1/15/2015 -0500, you wrote:
Fortunately it's no longer necessary to make lists. Simply dump the
entire photo collection (assuming you scan everything you buy) onto a
pad computer and carry that computer with you. When you find a print,
search the index... voila! The pad will pay for itself in prevented
duplicates, and foobie-prevention.
That would require major effort and organization. Well actually not that much. The total number of bought prints I have is in the low hundreds. Maybe 200, 250. Not a really huge number.

Andy


Re: Bobs photos

Tim O'Connor
 

Andy

Fortunately it's no longer necessary to make lists. Simply dump the
entire photo collection (assuming you scan everything you buy) onto a
pad computer and carry that computer with you. When you find a print,
search the index... voila! The pad will pay for itself in prevented
duplicates, and foobie-prevention.

Tim O'

As far as Bob's photos, one thing I fail to do pretty much at every show is
prepare myself for the photo vendors. I end up just randomly browsing and
buying stuff that catches my eye or is appropriate, but I have a bad habit
of buying duplicates because the pics I bought last year are still in the
bag. I started to work on that by going through my prints and organizing
them by road into folders, and I had a few dupes but not as many as I
feared. When I go to a show - probably Marion next - which I missed in
2014 due to an unscheduled trip to Pluto - I need to have some idea what
I'm looking for, because I simply don't have the time to go through every
bin. Just an example... L&N freight cars. They fit my era and location -
Monon as well - but I rarely think about them when I'm digging through the
N&W and Wabash stuff.

Andy


Re: Photo technology

Andy Harman
 

At 11:33 PM 1/13/2015 -0500, you wrote:

Ilford is still committed to the silver halide technology and I use them exclusively, and so do other photo dealers. If Ilford gives up there will always be Chinese-made paper, though how good their product is, remains to be seen.
Nice to know Ilford is still around. Can you still get Dektol? Or Kodafix?

I have a couple bottles of Rodinal - which was my preferred developer for Kodak TMX film, which was my preferred film for daylight B&W photography. I wonder if it's still good? Ultra concentrated. Not sure if it's still available or not.

Andy


Re: Bobs photos

Andy Harman
 

At 05:15 PM 1/13/2015 -0800, you wrote:
use the services of others for all printing. As I have found myself of late it is also becoming more and
more difficult to purchase decent black & white photographic printing paper and chemicals. Once
they have been found the price is often prohibitive as well. Whatever happened to American
opportunity and competition? It is even effecting the STMFC hobby field.
I had a small but very functional purpose built darkroom at my old house. 5x8' with a counter top, double sink, ventilation, the works. Going in there was like going into a casino. No clocks - time would go by. More than once I went in after dinner, and when I came out the sun was coming up. Alas when I moved in 2003, I dismantled it and my equipment is in storage. But I still have it. I could probably set up a usable darkroom in my basement on a temporary basis, but there is that question of paper and chemistry. I haven't gone shopping for it since the 90s. I even have undeveloped B&W film from the 90s that I really need to get done - I never let anybody else develop my B&W film. At least if I get the negs, I can scan them which is what I've been slowly doing with my slide collection.

I loved darkroom work. I grew up with it - there was a time when a home darkroom wasn't all that unusual, and the corner drugstore sold some basic chemicals and supplies. I probably made my first prints when I was 5 or 6. But it is very time consuming. I've never been much into art printing - most of my subjects were railroad and family, and I was only concerned with getting a good print, not doing 4 hours worth of dodge-burn on a single print. Even so, in a session I might produce 50, 60 8x10 prints and I'd emerge with a stiff neck and blurry vision. I can't imagine what it's like to do that on a "production" basis.

Funny - I was showing Annette my Leicas tonight. We were watching a TV show where a woman was taking pictures in 1953, and she had a correct prop - a Leica screwmount with a collapsible lens. Unfortunately she was taking all her pictures with the lens in collapsed position. Ask me how I know that doesn't work.... I got out my 1957 M3 w/collapsible, and my 2000 M6. A part of me says I should sell them and get some decent money, another part of me wants to go buy some TMX and just go drive out in the country somewhere and shoot a roll like I used to do 20 years ago.

Andy


Re: Athearn container gondolas

Jeffrey White
 

The 1955 IC Freight Car Diagram book shows 24 low side (3 1/2' sides) steel gons modified for containers.

The 1960 Equipment List shows 37 steel gons with 5 foot sides equipped to carry calcium carbide in containers. AAR designation LG inside length 37'8" capacity 1672 cu ft, 140,000 pounds.

Somewhere I have a photo of one of the low side gons.

Jeff White
Alma, IL


Re: Bobs photos

Andy Harman
 

Missed Cocoa Beach this year for the first time in 15 years. I am once again self employed after 12+ years at a pretty nice job with benefits. I could have made the trip but the focus now needs to be on building my new business and working on my contacts. I have some great relationships with some very smart people and I've spent 2015 so far doing a lot of communicating, and building models late night on the bench.

As far as Bob's photos, one thing I fail to do pretty much at every show is prepare myself for the photo vendors. I end up just randomly browsing and buying stuff that catches my eye or is appropriate, but I have a bad habit of buying duplicates because the pics I bought last year are still in the bag. I started to work on that by going through my prints and organizing them by road into folders, and I had a few dupes but not as many as I feared. When I go to a show - probably Marion next - which I missed in 2014 due to an unscheduled trip to Pluto - I need to have some idea what I'm looking for, because I simply don't have the time to go through every bin. Just an example... L&N freight cars. They fit my era and location - Monon as well - but I rarely think about them when I'm digging through the N&W and Wabash stuff.

Andy


Re: Couplers for sale

rob.mclear3@...
 

All the couplers except the No 5's have been sold.

Regards
Rob McLear.


Re: Athearn container gondolas

Brian Carlson
 

The air activated containers were developed by MDT (The LCL Corporation) in the 1930's. Much of the cement headed to NYC. The DL&W, D&H, LV and NYC had them. a hobby shop in Allentown made the correct decals for them in the 90's not sure if they are around now. Not everything is on the internet, but if anyone has Morning Sun's Erie/DL&W Rolling Stock Color Guide, see pages 96-97 for more information.  Not the containers were numbered like freight cars and other rolling stock. DL&W's were 23000-23684. The DL&W at one point had 90 gondolas converted, most carried 5 containers each.

 

 

Brian J. Carlson, P.E.

Cheektowaga NY

 

Brian carlson

 

From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2015 11:03 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Athearn container gondolas

 

 

I’ve wondered if the cylindrical contains were built by one company and several railroads purchased them for use in cement service?   I know the NYC and the LV had them, I seem to recall CNJ as well?  Todd Horton

 

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