Re: Ye Old X29
Dave Parker
Arved: I shared your confusion about the various RC
X29 offerings. I haven't had much luck finding the out-of-print RPCs, but Ted's
two articles in RMC (Jan and Feb 2007) were extremely helpful to me. These are pretty easy to score: eBay, or Paul Gibson has them at railpub.com I believe. Dave Parker Riverside, CA
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Re: Photos from Prototype Rails 2015
Andy Sperandeo
Thank you very much, Gary. – Andy
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Container gons from NKP (UNCLASSIFIED)
Gatwood, Elden J SAD
Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
Caveats: NONE https://www.flickr.com/photos/barrigerlibrary/12297246976/sizes/k/in/photostream/ This beauty of a photo from the Barriger collection shows two NKP container gons at PG tower at the junction of the Port Perry Branch and Monongahela Division of the PRR. Note the gons carry eleven, not twelve containers: 4 over each truck and three placed oddly in the center (one has them crosswise, one front-to-back). I suspect they are carrying either powdered limestone or powdered dolomite, as this yard served several steel mills, including USS's Duquesne Works, off photo to right (east). Tremendous photo. Elden Gatwood Classification: UNCLASSIFIED Caveats: NONE
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Re: Ye Old X29
David
'23 was the original proposal that was voted down. B&O's original class M26 (no suffix) was built to that spec, but everything else was derived from the revised '24 specs.
As for the RC kits, 7002 is the original X29 from 1924 (also B&O M26B). 7001 is the revised rivet pattern for the side sheets, plus the Dreadnaught ends used on the X29s built in the early 1930s. Kitbashing the plate ends from 7002 onto 7001 will get you a late '20s X29. 7003 is the ARA 1924 design (B&O M26A, C, D, etc. and not the same as the early X29). David Thompson
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Re: Klein Modellbahn 2-dome tank car
Thorsten Petschallies
Gene,
are you sure about the history of these cars.
AFAIK, the prototypes for the Fleischmann models were built during or immidiately after WW1 for supplying the troops in the France WW1 theather.
After the war the were taken over by the French ministry of public works (ministeré des travaux publics) and therefore called "wagons TP".
Best regards
Thorsten
Petschallies
Von meinem tragbaren Endgerät gesendet
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Re: container gondolas
Charles Tapper
I like container gons, my main interest being the open and closed top drop bottom types and the controlled flow types, the former used for transporting coke, the latter things like lime, dolomite and ferroalloys. but I find the cement gons intriguing. How far afield did these things go? Were these designed only for the New York City market? Here are some on-line resources pertaining to the cars to add to the list I had picked up in compiling information on them, hope I am not duplicating any other post: A D&H car drawing: NYC diagram: and this is a near shot: Hope th e links work. These cars all have extensive internal permanent steel blocking for the containers, which would make for an interesting build. I have seen some nice models in the past. The availability of USRA and clone 46' mill gons that were used in some of these conversions is a plus. Microtrains in N scale makes a cast resin load insert of unknown accuracy (to me) for these, for those in the smaller scale. Charlie Tapper Broken Arrow, OK
On Friday, January 16, 2015 7:59 AM, "'Todd Horton' toddchorton@... [STMFC]" wrote: Yes, notice the orientation of the containers in NYC 501660 while it looks like they’re all positioned the same in the second photo. Todd Horton From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] Sent: Friday, January 16, 2015 8:34 AM To: STMFC@... Subject: [STMFC] Re: container gondolas these pop up immediately with Google Images http://www.canadasouthern.com/caso/images/nyc-501660.jpg http://www.canadasouthern.com/caso/images/nyc-501216.jpg http://img.xooimage.com/files21/d/5/f/lcl3-b77a99.jpg Tim O At 1/16/2015 06:59 AM Friday, you wrote: >Here's a link to a photo of another NYC car with 5 containers. Notice how >they are orientated in the car in this photo. Todd Horton > >https://www.google.com/search?q=lehigh+valley+cement+gondolas&rlz=1T4ADRA_en >US398US398&tbm=isch&imgil=xRc-9yG_Az7YYM%253A%253BnKwPE6HnO24INM%253Bhttp%25 >253A%25252F%25252Fwww.readingmodeler.com%25252Findex.php%25252Fforum%25252Ft >he-caboose%25252F153-cement-container-gondolas&source=iu&pf=m&fir=xRc-9yG_Az >7YYM%253A%252CnKwPE6HnO24INM%252C_&usg=__l-V9mu7DghtJ_fRtuXQBQbCo6uo%3D&biw= >1563&bih=798&ved=0CDgQyjc&ei=ify4VLbAKIznsAT-_4D4Cw#imgdii=7j9fQMvi2ZGiDM%3A >%3BxRc-9yG_Az7YYM%3B7j9fQMvi2ZGiDM%3A&imgrc=7j9fQMvi2ZGiDM%253A%3BSora6tB12T >iYLM%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fi114.photobucket.com%252Falbums%252Fn255%252FChris >333_33%252FDLW1.jpg%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fforum.atlasrr.com%252Fforum%252Fpop >_printer_friendly.asp%253FARCHIVE%253Dtrue%2526TOPIC_ID%253D55643%3B800%3B51 >3
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Re: container gondolas
Todd Horton
Yes, notice the orientation of the containers in NYC 501660 while it looks like they’re all positioned the same in the second photo. Todd Horton
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Friday, January 16, 2015 8:34 AM To: STMFC@... Subject: [STMFC] Re: container gondolas
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Re: Ye Old X29
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At 1/16/2015 07:02 AM Friday, you wrote:
Tim O'Connor wrote:
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Re: container gondolas
these pop up immediately with Google Images
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http://www.canadasouthern.com/caso/images/nyc-501660.jpg http://www.canadasouthern.com/caso/images/nyc-501216.jpg http://img.xooimage.com/files21/d/5/f/lcl3-b77a99.jpg Tim O
At 1/16/2015 06:59 AM Friday, you wrote:
Here's a link to a photo of another NYC car with 5 containers. Notice how
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Re: Photos from Prototype Rails 2015
Layout Tour
Hi Greg, My intent is to do an article for the Anthracite Roads Historical Society’s magazine Flags, Diamonds & Statues on the Evolution of Lehigh Valley Coal Cars 1900-1976. That is the first clinic which Bruce mentioned. The best way to answer your questions on modeling is to call at 757-440-1081.
Chuck Davis Norfolk VA
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Springfield 2015
Pierre Oliver
Hey all,
It's a week away! The annual Amherst Railway Society Railroad Hobby Show. Just to let you know that Yarmouth Model Works will be there with a good inventory of all that we sell, weather permitting. I'm in the same place as last year, Mallary 129 A. Drop by if only to chew the fat. Thanks -- Pierre Oliver www.elgincarshops.com www.yarmouthmodelworks.com
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Re: Athearn container gondolas
RICH CHAPIN
I have a copy of the L.C.L. Container Corp “Diagrams and Descriptions L.C.L. Containers” dated 1/31/1956 [obtained from Smithsonian while researching LV container ops]
It lists these roads with containers: N.Y.C.; B&O; I.C.; M.P.L.; M.I.R.R.; L.V.; D.L.&W.; D&H. Pittsburgh Metallurgical Co. also listed Types were air activated cement [round ones], drop bottom coke; drop bottom lime; controlled flow bulk; calcium carbide; drop bottom ferro silicon and portable refrigerator.
Rich Chapin
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Re: Ye Old X29
Benjamin Hom
Tim O'Connor wrote:
"3/4" plate steel??? REALLY? What is this, armor plate? That'll stop a torpedo!" 3/4" is kind of thin for a warship. It definitely will not stop a torpedo, as the guys on the BISMARCK will tell you. Here's a comparative diagram showing armor protection for TIRPITZ and KING GEORGE V. http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/fb/KGV_Tirpitz_armour_and_underwater_protection.png Ben Hom
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1947 Boxcar Shortage
Garth Groff <sarahsan@...>
Friends,
I was working my way through Western Pacific annual reports (dull reading, but I was looking for something specific) when I stumbled on this in the 1947 issue: "The shortage of box cars during 1947 was of particular disadvantage to Western Pacific which is more adversely affected by such conditions than other California terminal carriers for the reason that a majority of such cars line-hauled westbound from Salt Lake or southbound from Bieber are turned over to other lines, either for delivery at common points or for line-haul to destination. Such cars are not returnable to Western Pacific for its eastbound loadings and because the number of such cars turned over to other carriers by Western Pacific for its eastbound loadings far exceeds the number of such cars received by it from other lines for delivery, it will be apparent that Western Pacific, during periods of car shortage, contributes substantially to the supply of other lines." [That's one VERY wordy sentence!] We've talked about this issue here before in general, but this is much more specific. Up until 1947, the WP had a fairly small fleet of cars, especially boxcars. This was made worse by having most cars loaded on the WP being interchanged rather than delivered to other points on their own road. Starting in 1947 the WP began an aggressive program to buy boxcars. Many of these went into specific pool service, which tended to prevent capture by other roads. The WPHS has the complete run of annual reports online at http://www.wplives.com/diagrams/ .The site also has equipment diagrams for nearly all their rolling stock, cabooses, passenger cars and MoW equipment for 1930, 1947, 1958 and 1968. It is a treasure trove of great stuff. Yours Aye, Garth Groff
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Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: (was Athearn) container gondolas (UNCLASSIFIED)
Todd Horton
Here's a link to a photo of another NYC car with 5 containers. Notice how
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they are orientated in the car in this photo. Todd Horton https://www.google.com/search?q=lehigh+valley+cement+gondolas&rlz=1T4ADRA_en US398US398&tbm=isch&imgil=xRc-9yG_Az7YYM%253A%253BnKwPE6HnO24INM%253Bhttp%25 253A%25252F%25252Fwww.readingmodeler.com%25252Findex.php%25252Fforum%25252Ft he-caboose%25252F153-cement-container-gondolas&source=iu&pf=m&fir=xRc-9yG_Az 7YYM%253A%252CnKwPE6HnO24INM%252C_&usg=__l-V9mu7DghtJ_fRtuXQBQbCo6uo%3D&biw= 1563&bih=798&ved=0CDgQyjc&ei=ify4VLbAKIznsAT-_4D4Cw#imgdii=7j9fQMvi2ZGiDM%3A %3BxRc-9yG_Az7YYM%3B7j9fQMvi2ZGiDM%3A&imgrc=7j9fQMvi2ZGiDM%253A%3BSora6tB12T iYLM%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fi114.photobucket.com%252Falbums%252Fn255%252FChris 333_33%252FDLW1.jpg%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fforum.atlasrr.com%252Fforum%252Fpop _printer_friendly.asp%253FARCHIVE%253Dtrue%2526TOPIC_ID%253D55643%3B800%3B51 3
-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] Sent: Friday, January 16, 2015 4:28 AM To: STMFC@... Subject: RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: [STMFC] (was Athearn) container gondolas (UNCLASSIFIED) Todd So it would appear the LCL Corporation was the owner of the containers and the several railroads simply supplied the gondolas to transport them? Is that an accurate statement? Or perhaps the railroads leased the containers from LCL Corp? I guess I'm asking were all of the containers identical except for the lettering? Tim O'Connor At 1/15/2015 07:56 PM Thursday, you wrote: I uploaded a photo to the files section under my name. The picture shows anNYC and a D&H gon with cement containers. The NYC carried 20,000 lb containers and the D&H carried 22,000 lbs ones. The containers are listed as being 7 6 in diameter so I assume the ones the D&H used were taller than the NYC version. Both of these are lettered The LCL Corporation Todd Horton ------------------------------------ ------------------------------------ ------------------------------------ Yahoo Groups Links
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Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: (was Athearn) container gondolas (UNCLASSIFIED)
Todd Horton
Tim, I would think there has to be some difference in the containers due the
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capacity difference, 20,000 lbs. vs 22,000 lbs. The light weight for each are listed as 4,385 lbs. vs 4,430 lbs. That's only 45 pounds so maybe the difference was internally, a deeper sloped bottom perhaps? One thing I did missed upon first glance is that there's also a ACF logo on both the NYC and D&H canisters. The D&H photo says "Builder of car and containers, ACF" The other question that comes up is about unloading cement from them. The D&H car has 4 cut outs down at least one side of the car for this purpose, the NYC photo is too dark to tell but from looking at photos of other cars (LV I know for sure) had slots spaced evenly along the sides of the car as well.. The canisters have one fitting for an unloading hose to attach down towards the bottom of the canister. If you look at the photo of both of these cars the canisters in each are turned differently as placed in the gondola. I'm making an assumption here but I would think that the lettering would have been orientated the same on all of these when they were painted new. Using the D&H car as an example and going off the photo you would have had to unload three of these from one side of the car and two from the other. The NYC car shows a similar arraignment, 3 canisters are orientated in one direction and the other three are in the opposite direction. It would be interesting to compare in service shots of these cars to see how the canisters were positioned after they had been on the road from a period of time. I have always thought these were interesting cars and they would make a good modeling candidate. Todd Horton .
-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] Sent: Friday, January 16, 2015 4:28 AM To: STMFC@... Subject: RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: [STMFC] (was Athearn) container gondolas (UNCLASSIFIED) Todd So it would appear the LCL Corporation was the owner of the containers and the several railroads simply supplied the gondolas to transport them? Is that an accurate statement? Or perhaps the railroads leased the containers from LCL Corp? I guess I'm asking were all of the containers identical except for the lettering? Tim O'Connor
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Re: Ye Old X29
Benjamin Hom
Tim O'Connor wrote:
"Arved one of the photos I sent you is a PRR Merchandise Service (not REA express) X29 in Taylor Yard in Los Angeles, incredibly filthy as Tony says, and evidently simply being used as a box car. But that's in the later 1950's, not 1953. LCL was in precipitous decline from 1950 onwards so whole fleets of LCL box cars (NYC, SP, PRR, etc) ended up in general freight service." This doesn't answer Arved's question and confuses the issue. As you pointed out, this is NOT an express boxcar, and as LCL goes, the Merchandise Service X29s were plain boxcars lacking any special equipment for handling LCL. It's far more likely it was being used as a general service boxcar. The cars painted in Merchandise Service schemes got incredibly ratty as the years went on, and are definitely a weathering challenge! Ben Hom
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Re: Ye Old X29
Arved one of the photos I sent you is a PRR Merchandise Service (not REA express) X29 in Taylor Yard in Los Angeles, incredibly filthy as Tony says, and evidently simply being used as a box car. But that's in the later 1950's, not 1953. LCL was in precipitous decline from 1950 onwards so whole fleets of LCL box cars (NYC, SP, PRR, etc) ended up in general freight service. Tim O'Connor
Is it safe to assume these didn't venture far from home rails, and would be of little or no interest to a modeler of Southern Pacfiic's Coast Line? Or might an express car have ended up on the Coast Mail in anything resembling a regular basis?
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Re: Black cat decals
Garth Groff <sarahsan@...>
Scott,
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I ordered directly from their online catalog. They took care of the exchange rates. Yours Aye, Garth Groff
On 1/16/15 12:38 AM,
repairman87@... [STMFC] wrote:
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Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: (was Athearn) container gondolas (UNCLASSIFIED)
Todd
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
So it would appear the LCL Corporation was the owner of the containers and the several railroads simply supplied the gondolas to transport them? Is that an accurate statement? Or perhaps the railroads leased the containers from LCL Corp? I guess I'm asking were all of the containers identical except for the lettering? Tim O'Connor
At 1/15/2015 07:56 PM Thursday, you wrote:
I uploaded a photo to the files section under my name. The picture shows an NYC and a D&H gon with cement containers. The NYC carried 20,000 lb containers and the D&H carried 22,000 lbs ones. The containers are listed as being 7� 6� in diameter so I assume the ones the D&H used were taller than the NYC version. Both of these are lettered � The LCL Corporation� Todd Horton
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