Date   

Re: Ye Old X29

Andy Sperandeo
 

When I was a youngster in New Orleans, I saw X29 express cars at New Orleans Union Passenger Terminal practically every time I looked, at least until the demise of REA. They most often ran in trains of the Louisville & Nashville, Southern Ry., and Illinois Central. Along with Tony Thompson's observations, it's very common to find X29 express cars in photos of Santa Fe mail trains and of other Santa Fe trains carrying express traffic, such as the Grand Canyon and California Limited. They are also common in photos of the Santa Fe's Los Angeles coach yard.

So long,

Andy


Re: Black cat decals

O Fenton Wells
 

I might add that I am a very satisfied customer, the decals are great as is the service.
Fenton Wells

--
Fenton Wells
5 Newberry Lane
Pinehurst NC 28374
910-420-1144
srrfan1401@...


Re: Klein Modellbahn 2-dome tank car

genegreen1942@...
 

Thorsten,
Allow me to reword the beginning of my message to say that the Fleischmann models RESEMBLE the kit cars in the Army manual.  

My copy of the manual is dated December 1958 and the cars described therein all have welded underframes.  I am fairly confident that the designs contained the manual (Dept. of the Army Technical Manual 55-2220-201-35) are from after World War Two.  

That said, the Fleischmann models could easily be designs from a much earlier time and an entirely different source.  The Fleischmann catalogs own description says "1917."

Now you've got me wondering if the designs in the manual are revisions of those 1917 designs or if the manual merely reflects a continuation of a idea originating in 1917.

Thank you for bringing my error to my attention.

Gene Green
Backpedaling as fast as I can.


Re: Black cat decals

ajferguson@...
 

Just order direct from me. I accept US personnel checks.
Allen Ferguson
email me at ajfergus at mymts.net


Re: Photos from Prototype Rails 2015

David
 

I would definitely be interested in reading that article when it is published.

David Thompson


Re: Ye Old X29

Greg Martin
 

Guys,
 
Ben Hom authored an incredible article in Mainline Modeler and The Keystone Modeler released together, but don't ask me the date, Ben can tell you.
 
Greg Martin
 
Eventually all things merge into one and a river runs through it.
Norman Maclean
 

In a message dated 1/16/2015 7:41:57 A.M. Pacific Standard Time, STMFC@... writes:
 

Arved:

I shared your confusion about the various RC X29 offerings.  I haven't had much luck finding the out-of-print RPCs, but Ted's two articles in RMC (Jan and Feb 2007) were extremely helpful to me.  These are pretty easy to score:  eBay, or Paul Gibson has them at railpub.com I believe.

Dave Parker
Riverside, CA


Re: Ye Old X29

Dave Parker
 

Arved:

I shared your confusion about the various RC X29 offerings.  I haven't had much luck finding the out-of-print RPCs, but Ted's two articles in RMC (Jan and Feb 2007) were extremely helpful to me.  These are pretty easy to score:  eBay, or Paul Gibson has them at railpub.com I believe.

Dave Parker
Riverside, CA


Re: Photos from Prototype Rails 2015

Andy Sperandeo
 

Thank you very much, Gary. – Andy


Container gons from NKP (UNCLASSIFIED)

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
Caveats: NONE

https://www.flickr.com/photos/barrigerlibrary/12297246976/sizes/k/in/photostream/

This beauty of a photo from the Barriger collection shows two NKP container gons at PG tower at the junction of the Port Perry Branch and Monongahela Division of the PRR. Note the gons carry eleven, not twelve containers: 4 over each truck and three placed oddly in the center (one has them crosswise, one front-to-back). I suspect they are carrying either powdered limestone or powdered dolomite, as this yard served several steel mills, including USS's Duquesne Works, off photo to right (east). Tremendous photo.

Elden Gatwood

Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
Caveats: NONE


Re: Ye Old X29

David
 

'23 was the original proposal that was voted down. B&O's original class M26 (no suffix) was built to that spec, but everything else was derived from the revised '24 specs.

As for the RC kits, 7002 is the original X29 from 1924 (also B&O M26B).

7001 is the revised rivet pattern for the side sheets, plus the Dreadnaught ends used on the X29s built in the early 1930s. Kitbashing the plate ends from 7002 onto 7001 will get you a late '20s X29.

7003 is the ARA 1924 design (B&O M26A, C, D, etc. and not the same as the early X29).

David Thompson


Re: Klein Modellbahn 2-dome tank car

Thorsten Petschallies
 

Gene,

are you sure about the history of these cars.
AFAIK, the prototypes for the Fleischmann models were built during or immidiately after WW1 for supplying the troops in the France WW1 theather.

After the war the were taken over by the French ministry of public works (ministeré des travaux publics) and therefore called "wagons TP".

Best regards 
Thorsten Petschallie

Von meinem tragbaren Endgerät gesendet

Am 15.01.2015 um 19:17 schrieb "genegreen1942@... [STMFC]" <STMFC@...>:

 

The Fleischmann models pictured on page 41 were created by the US military after World War Two when the planners "knew" the next big war would be in Europe.  There were 5 kit cars in the series.  In addition to the low- and high-side gondolas and box car shown there was a flat car and a tank car.  The flat car was merely the floor of the gondolas or box car without any sides, ends, etc.  The design was such that the cars could be assembled in-theater with troop or indigenous (unskilled) labor.  The expectation was that trucks and couplers would be scrounged in-theater.   I have an Army manual with plans and assembly instructions.


I submitted an article to RMC on the tank car kit but it was never published.  My material is being returned to me.  The point of the article was mainly that flat cars (the P2K model) were loaded in 1953, moved hither, thither and yon but not unloaded until the early 1980s.  Sort of solves the empty/load in open top cars conundrum in at least one instance.

I was stationed in Germany for 3 tours and spent every off-duty chance I could photographing railroad subjects.  I came across former US freight cars occasionally but never any of the kit cars nor the 2-dome tank car to the best of my recollection.

Gene Green
Out in the Badlands of New Mexico


Re: container gondolas

Charles Tapper
 

I like container gons, my main interest being the open and closed top drop bottom types and the controlled flow types, the former used for transporting coke, the latter things like lime, dolomite and ferroalloys. but I find the cement gons intriguing. How far afield did these things go? Were these designed only for the New York City market?
 
Here are some on-line resources  pertaining to the cars to add to the list I had picked up in compiling information on them, hope I am not duplicating any other post:
 
A D&H car drawing:
 
NYC diagram:
 
and this is a near shot:
 
Hope th e links work.
 
These cars all have extensive internal permanent steel blocking for the containers, which would make for an interesting build. I have seen some nice models in the past. The availability of USRA and clone 46' mill gons that were used in some of these conversions is a plus.
 
Microtrains in N scale makes a cast resin load insert of unknown accuracy (to me) for these, for those in the smaller scale.
 
Charlie Tapper
Broken Arrow, OK
 
 


On Friday, January 16, 2015 7:59 AM, "'Todd Horton' toddchorton@... [STMFC]" wrote:


 
Yes, notice the orientation of the containers in NYC 501660 while it looks like they’re all positioned the same in the second photo.  Todd Horton
 
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Friday, January 16, 2015 8:34 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Re: container gondolas
 
 

these pop up immediately with Google Images

http://www.canadasouthern.com/caso/images/nyc-501660.jpg
http://www.canadasouthern.com/caso/images/nyc-501216.jpg
http://img.xooimage.com/files21/d/5/f/lcl3-b77a99.jpg

Tim O

At 1/16/2015 06:59 AM Friday, you wrote:
>Here's a link to a photo of another NYC car with 5 containers. Notice how
>they are orientated in the car in this photo. Todd Horton
>
>https://www.google.com/search?q=lehigh+valley+cement+gondolas&rlz=1T4ADRA_en
>US398US398&tbm=isch&imgil=xRc-9yG_Az7YYM%253A%253BnKwPE6HnO24INM%253Bhttp%25
>253A%25252F%25252Fwww.readingmodeler.com%25252Findex.php%25252Fforum%25252Ft
>he-caboose%25252F153-cement-container-gondolas&source=iu&pf=m&fir=xRc-9yG_Az
>7YYM%253A%252CnKwPE6HnO24INM%252C_&usg=__l-V9mu7DghtJ_fRtuXQBQbCo6uo%3D&biw=
>1563&bih=798&ved=0CDgQyjc&ei=ify4VLbAKIznsAT-_4D4Cw#imgdii=7j9fQMvi2ZGiDM%3A
>%3BxRc-9yG_Az7YYM%3B7j9fQMvi2ZGiDM%3A&imgrc=7j9fQMvi2ZGiDM%253A%3BSora6tB12T
>iYLM%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fi114.photobucket.com%252Falbums%252Fn255%252FChris
>333_33%252FDLW1.jpg%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fforum.atlasrr.com%252Fforum%252Fpop
>_printer_friendly.asp%253FARCHIVE%253Dtrue%2526TOPIC_ID%253D55643%3B800%3B51
>3



Re: container gondolas

Todd Horton
 

Yes, notice the orientation of the containers in NYC 501660 while it looks like they’re all positioned the same in the second photo.  Todd Horton

 

From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Friday, January 16, 2015 8:34 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Re: container gondolas

 

 


these pop up immediately with Google Images

http://www.canadasouthern.com/caso/images/nyc-501660.jpg
http://www.canadasouthern.com/caso/images/nyc-501216.jpg
http://img.xooimage.com/files21/d/5/f/lcl3-b77a99.jpg

Tim O

At 1/16/2015 06:59 AM Friday, you wrote:
>Here's a link to a photo of another NYC car with 5 containers. Notice how
>they are orientated in the car in this photo. Todd Horton
>
>https://www.google.com/search?q=lehigh+valley+cement+gondolas&rlz=1T4ADRA_en
>US398US398&tbm=isch&imgil=xRc-9yG_Az7YYM%253A%253BnKwPE6HnO24INM%253Bhttp%25
>253A%25252F%25252Fwww.readingmodeler.com%25252Findex.php%25252Fforum%25252Ft
>he-caboose%25252F153-cement-container-gondolas&source=iu&pf=m&fir=xRc-9yG_Az
>7YYM%253A%252CnKwPE6HnO24INM%252C_&usg=__l-V9mu7DghtJ_fRtuXQBQbCo6uo%3D&biw=
>1563&bih=798&ved=0CDgQyjc&ei=ify4VLbAKIznsAT-_4D4Cw#imgdii=7j9fQMvi2ZGiDM%3A
>%3BxRc-9yG_Az7YYM%3B7j9fQMvi2ZGiDM%3A&imgrc=7j9fQMvi2ZGiDM%253A%3BSora6tB12T
>iYLM%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fi114.photobucket.com%252Falbums%252Fn255%252FChris
>333_33%252FDLW1.jpg%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fforum.atlasrr.com%252Fforum%252Fpop
>_printer_friendly.asp%253FARCHIVE%253Dtrue%2526TOPIC_ID%253D55643%3B800%3B51
>3


Re: Ye Old X29

Tim O'Connor
 

At 1/16/2015 07:02 AM Friday, you wrote:
Tim O'Connor wrote:
"3/4" plate steel??? REALLY? What is this, armor plate? That'll stop a torpedo!"

3/4" is kind of thin for a warship. It definitely will not stop a torpedo, as the guys on the BISMARCK will tell you. Here's a comparative diagram showing armor protection for TIRPITZ and KING GEORGE V.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/fb/KGV_Tirpitz_armour_and_underwater_protection.png


Ben Hom


Re: container gondolas

Tim O'Connor
 

At 1/16/2015 06:59 AM Friday, you wrote:
Here's a link to a photo of another NYC car with 5 containers. Notice how
they are orientated in the car in this photo. Todd Horton

https://www.google.com/search?q=lehigh+valley+cement+gondolas&rlz=1T4ADRA_en
US398US398&tbm=isch&imgil=xRc-9yG_Az7YYM%253A%253BnKwPE6HnO24INM%253Bhttp%25
253A%25252F%25252Fwww.readingmodeler.com%25252Findex.php%25252Fforum%25252Ft
he-caboose%25252F153-cement-container-gondolas&source=iu&pf=m&fir=xRc-9yG_Az
7YYM%253A%252CnKwPE6HnO24INM%252C_&usg=__l-V9mu7DghtJ_fRtuXQBQbCo6uo%3D&biw=
1563&bih=798&ved=0CDgQyjc&ei=ify4VLbAKIznsAT-_4D4Cw#imgdii=7j9fQMvi2ZGiDM%3A
%3BxRc-9yG_Az7YYM%3B7j9fQMvi2ZGiDM%3A&imgrc=7j9fQMvi2ZGiDM%253A%3BSora6tB12T
iYLM%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fi114.photobucket.com%252Falbums%252Fn255%252FChris
333_33%252FDLW1.jpg%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fforum.atlasrr.com%252Fforum%252Fpop
_printer_friendly.asp%253FARCHIVE%253Dtrue%2526TOPIC_ID%253D55643%3B800%3B51
3


Re: Photos from Prototype Rails 2015

Layout Tour
 

Hi Greg,

            My intent is to do an article for the Anthracite Roads Historical Society’s magazine Flags, Diamonds & Statues on the Evolution of Lehigh Valley Coal Cars 1900-1976.  That is the first clinic which Bruce mentioned.  The best way to answer your questions on modeling is to call  at 757-440-1081.

 

Chuck Davis

Norfolk VA


Springfield 2015

Pierre Oliver
 

Hey all,
It's a week away! The annual Amherst Railway Society Railroad Hobby Show.
Just to let you know that Yarmouth Model Works will be there with a good inventory of all that we sell, weather permitting.
I'm in the same place as last year, Mallary 129 A. Drop by if only to chew the fat.
Thanks

--
Pierre Oliver
www.elgincarshops.com
www.yarmouthmodelworks.com


Re: Athearn container gondolas

RICH CHAPIN
 

I have a copy of the L.C.L. Container Corp “Diagrams and Descriptions L.C.L. Containers” dated 1/31/1956 [obtained from Smithsonian while researching LV container ops]

 

It lists these roads with containers: N.Y.C.; B&O; I.C.; M.P.L.; M.I.R.R.; L.V.; D.L.&W.; D&H. Pittsburgh Metallurgical Co. also listed

Types were air activated cement [round ones], drop bottom coke; drop bottom lime; controlled flow bulk; calcium carbide; drop bottom ferro silicon and portable refrigerator.

 

Rich Chapin

 


Re: Ye Old X29

Benjamin Hom
 

Tim O'Connor wrote:
"3/4" plate steel??? REALLY? What is this, armor plate? That'll stop a torpedo!"

3/4" is kind of thin for a warship. It definitely will not stop a torpedo, as the guys on the BISMARCK will tell you. Here's a comparative diagram showing armor protection for TIRPITZ and KING GEORGE V.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/fb/KGV_Tirpitz_armour_and_underwater_protection.png


Ben Hom


1947 Boxcar Shortage

Garth Groff <sarahsan@...>
 

Friends,

I was working my way through Western Pacific annual reports (dull reading, but I was looking for something specific) when I stumbled on this in the 1947 issue:

"The shortage of box cars during 1947 was of particular disadvantage to Western Pacific which is more adversely affected by such conditions than other California terminal carriers for the reason that a majority of such cars line-hauled westbound from Salt Lake or southbound from Bieber are turned over to other lines, either for delivery at common points or for line-haul to destination. Such cars are not returnable to Western Pacific for its eastbound loadings and because the number of such cars turned over to other carriers by Western Pacific for its eastbound loadings far exceeds the number of such cars received by it from other lines for delivery, it will be apparent that Western Pacific, during periods of car shortage, contributes substantially to the supply of other lines." [That's one VERY wordy sentence!]

We've talked about this issue here before in general, but this is much more specific. Up until 1947, the WP had a fairly small fleet of cars, especially boxcars. This was made worse by having most cars loaded on the WP being interchanged rather than delivered to other points on their own road. Starting in 1947 the WP began an aggressive program to buy boxcars. Many of these went into specific pool service, which tended to prevent capture by other roads.

The WPHS has the complete run of annual reports online at http://www.wplives.com/diagrams/ .The site also has equipment diagrams for nearly all their rolling stock, cabooses, passenger cars and MoW equipment for 1930, 1947, 1958 and 1968. It is a treasure trove of great stuff.

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff

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