1. main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
  2. Messages
   Date   
Re: CH&D&PM System what is it

Benjamin Hom
 

Rich Orr asked:
"What is the name of the road in the boxcar left side of the photo and what is the framed area to the right of the herald?"

Not just one railroad, but two affiliated railroads - Cincinnati, Hamilton & Dayton (CH&D) and the Pere Marquette (PM).

Ben Hom
Re: Wood running boards

Rhbale@...
 

Ed...
 
Here is a verbatim quote from the Dictionary of Car Terms from my copy of the 1940 Car Builders Cyclopedia:
 
Running Board. A plane surface, made of boards or special metal structure, for trainmen to walk or run on. It is placed on the roof of box, stock, refrigerator and covered hopper cars and at the side of tank cars. Gondola, hopper and flat cars usually have none.
 
The term roof walk does not appear in the 1940 edition. To be certain I also checked the 1879, 1919, 1931, 1946, 1953, 1970 and 1984 editions of Car Builders Dictionary and Car Builders Cyclopedia. They all list Running Board, none list roof walk. I'm interested in learning about any contradictory information you can cite for us.
 
Covered hopper cars are included in the my 1940 edition but I suspect they first appeared sometime earlier. 
 
Richard Bale
Re: Wood running boards

markstation01 <markstation01@...>
 

I wonder how long this will go back and forth; roof walks vs. running boards


Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE smartphone


-------- Original message --------
From: "'sartherdj@...' sartherdj@... [STMFC]" <STMFC@...>
Date:02/27/2015 8:27 PM (GMT-05:00)
To: STMFC@...
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: Wood running boards

 

I just pulled out my AFE's for the CB&Q 40' Combo Door Cars to see which term the "Q" used.  Their AFE's for their XM-2 and XM-2A 40' cars refer to them as RUNNING BOARDS.
 
Later,  Dave Sarther
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Tony Thompson tony@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...>
To: STMFC <STMFC@...>
Sent: Fri, Feb 27, 2015 6:08 pm
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: Wood running boards

 
Wood(en) or steel running boards exist only in the hobby world. In the real world (prototype) they are known as roof walks.

   Wrong. Look at any issue of Car Builders Cyclopedia or Railway Age, certainly at least as late as 1960.  Drawings (AAR or builder), descriptions and manufacturer's ads ALL use the same terminology, as does the set of definitions in the front of the Cyc. Professionally there is no question whatever that it was "running board." What the average switchman may have said is hard to be sure about and in any case not professional engineering language. We won't misunderstand you if you call it a "roof walk," but we will know you are not well informed.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.s ignaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history




Re: CH&D&PM System what is it

Schuyler Larrabee
 

Speculation:



Cincinnati, Hamilton & Dayton & Pere Marquette? Perhaps the D is for
Detroit?



Framed area? No clue.



Schuyler



From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Friday, February 27, 2015 8:01 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] CH&D&PM System what is it





What is the name of the road in the boxcar left side of the photo and what
is the framed area to the right of the herald?

Rich Orr

715.07554.CP - Archives Service Center, University of Pittsburgh - Historic
Pittsburgh Image Collection



Image removed by sender. image

715.07554.CP - Archives Service Center, University o...

Subjects Pittsburgh (Pa.); Bridges--Design and
construction--Pennsylvania--Pittsburgh.; Smithfield Street Bridge
(Pittsburgh, Pa.); Blue collar workers--...




View on images.library.pitt.edu

Preview by Yahoo
Another early steam era freight car photo

Schuyler Larrabee
 

Re: Wood running boards

Dave Sarther
 

I just pulled out my AFE's for the CB&Q 40' Combo Door Cars to see which term the "Q" used.  Their AFE's for their XM-2 and XM-2A 40' cars refer to them as RUNNING BOARDS.
 
Later,  Dave Sarther
 
 

-----Original Message-----
From: Tony Thompson tony@... [STMFC]
To: STMFC
Sent: Fri, Feb 27, 2015 6:08 pm
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: Wood running boards

 
Wood(en) or steel running boards exist only in the hobby world. In the real world (prototype) they are known as roof walks.

   Wrong. Look at any issue of Car Builders Cyclopedia or Railway Age, certainly at least as late as 1960.  Drawings (AAR or builder), descriptions and manufacturer's ads ALL use the same terminology, as does the set of definitions in the front of the Cyc. Professionally there is no question whatever that it was "running board." What the average switchman may have said is hard to be sure about and in any case not professional engineering language. We won't misunderstand you if you call it a "roof walk," but we will know you are not well informed.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.s ignaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history




Re: Wood running boards

Tony Thompson
 

Regarding the last two comments----Did April 1st come a month and two days early this year???

    Read ANY pre-1960 professional railroad literature or publication and tell me if you still think it's April 1.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history
Re: Wood running boards

Schleigh Mike
 

Regarding the last two comments----Did April 1st come a month and two days early this year???

Regards---Mike Schleigh


On Friday, February 27, 2015 8:08 PM, "Tony Thompson tony@... [STMFC]" wrote:


 
Wood(en) or steel running boards exist only in the hobby world. In the real world (prototype) they are known as roof walks.

   Wrong. Look at any issue of Car Builders Cyclopedia or Railway Age, certainly at least as late as 1960.  Drawings (AAR or builder), descriptions and manufacturer's ads ALL use the same terminology, as does the set of definitions in the front of the Cyc. Professionally there is no question whatever that it was "running board." What the average switchman may have said is hard to be sure about and in any case not professional engineering language. We won't misunderstand you if you call it a "roof walk," but we will know you are not well informed.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history
Re: Wood running boards

Tony Thompson
 

Wood(en) or steel running boards exist only in the hobby world. In the real world (prototype) they are known as roof walks.

   Wrong. Look at any issue of Car Builders Cyclopedia or Railway Age, certainly at least as late as 1960.  Drawings (AAR or builder), descriptions and manufacturer's ads ALL use the same terminology, as does the set of definitions in the front of the Cyc. Professionally there is no question whatever that it was "running board." What the average switchman may have said is hard to be sure about and in any case not professional engineering language. We won't misunderstand you if you call it a "roof walk," but we will know you are not well informed.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history
CH&D&PM System what is it

SUVCWORR@...
 

What is the name of the road in the boxcar left side of the photo and what is the framed area to the right of the herald?

Rich Orr

715.07554.CP - Archives Service Center, University of Pittsburgh - Historic Pittsburgh Image Collection

 
Re: hard way to earn a dollar

Andy Harman
 

Can you get them off?

I've gotten good deals on marked down books that had 18 price stickers plastered on them (is the lowest price the on?  Nope, add them together). Ever tried to get multiple stickers off a papet dust jacket?

Sent from my overpriced graham cracker

On Feb 27, 2015, at 5:25 PM, "ed_mines@... [STMFC]" <STMFC@...> wrote:

I bought a bunch of Evergreen styrene strips on e bay and a previous owner put a price tag on each one of the strips.


Ed Mines
Re: Wood running boards

Ed Mims
 

Wood(en) or steel running boards exist only in the hobby world. In the real world (prototype) they are known as roof walks.

Ed Mims 
Jacksonville, FL


On Friday, February 27, 2015 5:40 PM, "Schleigh Mike mike_schleigh@... [STMFC]" wrote:


 
An apology to the Group----

I was in error  in commenting about the seemingly odd lateral wood running board design (included in the 1937 InterMountain boxcar kits) that Rob K. had asked about.  I said that they were applied to the 1935/1937 ERIE milk cars as described in RP CYC #19.  That was not correct.  However, in that article the illustration of the Viking Chicago-Hutchins roof featured that running board design.  The ERIE cars used the more common/conventional lateral design which Rob expected more appropriate for the typical 1937 AAR car.

Sorry if there was confusion----Mike Schleigh


On Monday, February 23, 2015 10:22 AM, "jcdworkingonthenp@... [STMFC]" <STMFC@...> wrote:


 
    In the files I had posted some information about running boards, find it the file marked Running Boards that covers part of the steam era and also gives a general observation on wooden running board replacemet times  Jim Dick - chilly St Paul, MN  
Re: Drill size for Kadee Bracket Grabs?

James E Kubanick
 

Drill for Kadee bracket grabs

Bill, 

That would be #75.

Jim Kubanick
Morgantown WV


On Friday, February 27, 2015 8:43 AM, "fgexbill@... [STMFC]" wrote:


 
Can someone please remind me what the proper size drill bit is for the Kadee Bracket Grabs to get the press fit?

Bill Welch
Re: Wood running boards

Schleigh Mike
 

An apology to the Group----

I was in error  in commenting about the seemingly odd lateral wood running board design (included in the 1937 InterMountain boxcar kits) that Rob K. had asked about.  I said that they were applied to the 1935/1937 ERIE milk cars as described in RP CYC #19.  That was not correct.  However, in that article the illustration of the Viking Chicago-Hutchins roof featured that running board design.  The ERIE cars used the more common/conventional lateral design which Rob expected more appropriate for the typical 1937 AAR car.

Sorry if there was confusion----Mike Schleigh


On Monday, February 23, 2015 10:22 AM, "jcdworkingonthenp@... [STMFC]" <STMFC@...> wrote:


 
    In the files I had posted some information about running boards, find it the file marked Running Boards that covers part of the steam era and also gives a general observation on wooden running board replacemet times  Jim Dick - chilly St Paul, MN  
double sheathed box cars

ed_mines
 

I think several railroads in the northeast  (Lackawanna, LV, D&H) continued to buy double sheathed box cars when other roads switched to steel because they had their own supplies of cheap (or free) timber from land which they owned.


Loggers would pay landowners with timber for the right to cut timber on the landowners' land.


Maybe this was true for GN & NP too.


20 years ago, the last time I was in northeast Pennsylvania, I saw logs on trucks. Cellulose from those logs was used to make disposable diapers.


Ed Mines
hard way to earn a dollar

ed_mines
 

I bought a bunch of Evergreen styrene strips on e bay and a previous owner put a price tag on each one of the strips.


Ed Mines
Re: 1950s SP freight yard

Garth Groff <sarahsan@...>
 

Friends,

That didn't quite come out right. I meant that the GN was using USRA boxcars in the mid-1950s, not that they were still running in 1975. Bad writing.

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff

On 2/27/15 4:37 PM, Garth Groff sarahsan@... [STMFC] wrote:
 

Ed,

In 1975 I had a brief job driving a delivery truck in Southern California into many light industrial areas. Imagine my surprise when I found an NP  single-sheathed boxcar in pristine condition at a dog food factory in South Los Angeles. Yes, I had a camera with me. :~)

The GN and NP both hung on to wood cars longer than most roads, possibly because they served a robust timber industry. During the 1950s (mandatory STMFC content), their trains would have been liberally salted with wooden cars. This car in question was a "War Emergency" boxcar, and was about 30m years old, but had been recently painted. The GN was still operating WWI-era USRA boxcars.

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff


On 2/27/15 3:12 PM, ed_mines@... [STMFC] wrote:
 

Leonard Nemoy's death reminds me that he appeared in a 1958 TV show episode of Highway Patrol taking place in an SP freight yard.


The freight yard has a surprising number of single sheathed cars, mostly GN 50 ft, single door box cars. I would had thought that most wood sided cars were gone by then.


I've noticed that soem of these 50 ft. SS, GN box cars have Pratt trusses and some have the more common Howe trusses. Anyone have an explanation?


Ed Mines
Re: 1950s SP freight yard

Garth Groff <sarahsan@...>
 

Ed,

In 1975 I had a brief job driving a delivery truck in Southern California into many light industrial areas. Imagine my surprise when I found an NP  single-sheathed boxcar in pristine condition at a dog food factory in South Los Angeles. Yes, I had a camera with me. :~)

The GN and NP both hung on to wood cars longer than most roads, possibly because they served a robust timber industry. During the 1950s (mandatory STMFC content), their trains would have been liberally salted with wooden cars. This car in question was a "War Emergency" boxcar, and was about 30m years old, but had been recently painted. The GN was still operating WWI-era USRA boxcars.

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff


On 2/27/15 3:12 PM, ed_mines@... [STMFC] wrote:
 

Leonard Nemoy's death reminds me that he appeared in a 1958 TV show episode of Highway Patrol taking place in an SP freight yard.


The freight yard has a surprising number of single sheathed cars, mostly GN 50 ft, single door box cars. I would had thought that most wood sided cars were gone by then.


I've noticed that soem of these 50 ft. SS, GN box cars have Pratt trusses and some have the more common Howe trusses. Anyone have an explanation?


Ed Mines
Re: [EXTERNAL] 1950s SP freight yard (UNCLASSIFIED)

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
Caveats: NONE

Ed;

They may have been disappearing fast, but there were a significant number of single-sheathed cars, especially those from western, and particularly north-western roads, past the end of this list's interest. Roads I remember seeing SS cars past the end of this list include: NP, RI, GN, maybe one or two SP and ATSF cars, even an AC&Y 50-footer. Most were 50-footers. Richard and I chatted about them once, and he thought the 50-foot cars survived longer because of their original service not being as hard on the cars. Some were in hide service by that time, but I clearly remember NP and GN 50-footers in lumber service, all the way on the east coast.

Elden Gatwood

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Friday, February 27, 2015 3:12 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [EXTERNAL] [STMFC] 1950s SP freight yard



Leonard Nemoy's death reminds me that he appeared in a 1958 TV show episode of Highway Patrol taking place in an SP freight yard.




The freight yard has a surprising number of single sheathed cars, mostly GN 50 ft, single door box cars. I would had thought that most wood sided cars were gone by then.




I've noticed that soem of these 50 ft. SS, GN box cars have Pratt trusses and some have the more common Howe trusses. Anyone have an explanation?




Ed Mines



Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
Caveats: NONE
1950s SP freight yard

ed_mines
 

Leonard Nemoy's death reminds me that he appeared in a 1958 TV show episode of Highway Patrol taking place in an SP freight yard.


The freight yard has a surprising number of single sheathed cars, mostly GN 50 ft, single door box cars. I would had thought that most wood sided cars were gone by then.


I've noticed that soem of these 50 ft. SS, GN box cars have Pratt trusses and some have the more common Howe trusses. Anyone have an explanation?


Ed Mines
61381 - 61400 of 193487