Date   

Re: Stripes and ampersand on T&NO (SP) freight cars

david ellzey
 

Looks like I have plenty lines to "erase". These are Red Caboose RTR cars that are lettered "as built", they may need to be renumbered too.

Thanks, David
 


From: "Tim O'Connor timboconnor@... [STMFC]"
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Saturday, March 21, 2015 8:00 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Stripes and ampersand on T&NO (SP) freight cars

 

The thin white lines above & below reporting marks ended about 1948, if I
recall correctly. I have many photos of SP freight cars in this era and very
few of the cars still have the lines. Some still did, but it was uncommon by
1960 and later.

Tim O'Connor

>Modeling the late 50's and early 60's, would the stripes above and below the reporting marks have been removed during renumbering. Is it possible that a few stripes survived into the 60's? Same with the ampersand on T&NO cars, could any have survived?
>
>Thanks in advance.
>
>David Ellzey




ADMIN: Termination of the "Random Thought" thread

Mikebrock
 

Well, perhaps at some point this thread [ Random thoughts...] did have some discussion about steam era freight cars and while a few times it wandered into areas definitely out of scope [ business practices of manufacturers ], it did serve, I suppose, to allow those who fear the impending doom of the worl...uh...hobby to announce why they believe model trains are fast disappearing so maybe we won't have to endure that again for awhile. I actually would have terminated this thread long ago except that I got involved with 4-12-2 studies again.

I will add one thing and try to keep some of our members from considering suicide by simply noting that the old song is right. "Nothing stays the same".

And now, the thread called "Random Thoughts from my two articles..." but which really is a thread about the health of the MR hobby is now terminated. I might note that the new wing to Moderate Jail is ready for admittance...although, as is our custom...while we supply clean plates and drinking glasses...there is no food or drink.

Mike Brock
STMFC Owner


Re: Hobby Shops in the Nashville, TN area

Mitchell Mercante
 

TJ,

The only model railroad friendly hobby shop in Nashville and its immediate surroundings is at the Tennessee Centrail Railway Museum in Nashville.  There is a smallish but well stocked store in the museum with nothing but railroad related products.

Regards,

Mitch Mercante



On Sunday, March 22, 2015 11:18 AM, "'T.J. Stratton' michigancentralrr@... [STMFC]" wrote:




Are there any "must visit" model railroad friendly hobby shops in the Nashville, TN area?

Thanks- TJ

TJ Stratton Maumee, OH. "Modeling the 1950's branch lines of the Michigan Central Railroad in southern Michigan" Mailto:michigancentralrr@...





Re: Random Thoughts from my two articles in Volume 3 of Speedwitc...

mwbauers
 

In another Yahoo group, they are discussing ways to bring in new modelers.

They inspired me to come up with a display that starts from the basic level and ends with the completed models along with some one building and chatting with them.... With slideshows  and some other goodies.

It goes outside of any ingrained preference for RTR or kit and gives a bit of inspiration for trying a different approach.

I'm quite bummed at my favorite hobby shop closing, even to the point of not yet trying a recommended new place. Or maybe it's all of this blasted snow that kept me away since the end of December, when 'my' place closed?

I can at least feel I'm working on the promotion of the hobby this coming fall and now that the snow is nearly gone, I'll finally get to that highly recommended hobby shop.

While I've lamented losing that grand old hobby shop, I've felt good about planning out my next few projects involving just how to make the things, and have fun in the building process.

That last paragraph is just what I most enjoy about this hobby.

Mike Bauers


On Mar 22, 2015, at 11:24 AM, "tgregmrtn@... [STMFC]" <STMFC@...> wrote:

 

All five of my Grandson's have trains and I have made sure of that. Tim and I belong to  a Facebook group that would send the "old man's hobby" stats in the round file as we are definitely the minority if you are say old is 50+. 
 
I am sick of this hobby doom and is getting real old.
 
If you want a hobby shop support him.  Don't spend all your money on the Internet.
 
If you want to do the Internet thing, if a good shop on line...
 
If you like kits because you like to model don't buy ready to run.
 
If you don't want to buy Ready to Run vote with your dollars.
 
It is that simple... No more whining, please!
 
Can we move on now please?
 
Greg Martin
 
Eventually all things merge into one and a river runs through it.
Norman Maclean
 
In a message dated 3/21/2015 6:58:08 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, STMFC@... writes:
I have to agree somewhat that that it's an "old man's hobby". Back in the early 50's just about every kid had a Lionel or American Flyer train set under the Christmas tree. Now, the kids want computer games and other hi-tech stuff. Changing times.
I remember steam on mainline railroads (yep, I'm a dinosaur), that's why most of us in our 60's and older model the transition era, we can relate. It was a very interesting era.
But this hobby is getting more hi-tech and sophisticated all the time, great to lure the younger generation in. I personally think it will be around a very long time.


Re: Random Thoughts from my two articles in Volume 3 of Speedwitc...

Greg Martin
 

All five of my Grandson's have trains and I have made sure of that. Tim and I belong to  a Facebook group that would send the "old man's hobby" stats in the round file as we are definitely the minority if you are say old is 50+. 
 
I am sick of this hobby doom and is getting real old.
 
If you want a hobby shop support him.  Don't spend all your money on the Internet.
 
If you want to do the Internet thing, if a good shop on line...
 
If you like kits because you like to model don't buy ready to run.
 
If you don't want to buy Ready to Run vote with your dollars.
 
It is that simple... No more whining, please!
 
Can we move on now please?
 
Greg Martin
 
Eventually all things merge into one and a river runs through it.
Norman Maclean
 

In a message dated 3/21/2015 6:58:08 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, STMFC@... writes:
I have to agree somewhat that that it's an "old man's hobby". Back in the early 50's just about every kid had a Lionel or American Flyer train set under the Christmas tree. Now, the kids want computer games and other hi-tech stuff. Changing times.
I remember steam on mainline railroads (yep, I'm a dinosaur), that's why most of us in our 60's and older model the transition era, we can relate. It was a very interesting era.
But this hobby is getting more hi-tech and sophisticated all the time, great to lure the younger generation in. I personally think it will be around a very long time.


Re: If things are so bad why. . .

Jack Burgess
 

Tim wondered:

I watched a Netflix documentary today on 3-D printing, and I wondered -- Who
will produce the first 3-D copier? I mean, you just put the car (or 1:1
part) into the copier and out pops a perfect scale copy! :-) It's a whole
new world.

It is already being done Tim. A friend has a 3D scanner which will output
code to drive a CNC machine. Newer scanners will output a file which can be
3D printed. I doubt that the resolution is what we need but all of this
technology is changing fast. How about figures on your layout which
replicate yourself and friends:

http://www.computerworld.com/article/2836838/worlds-first-3d-full-body-scann
ing-booth-to-create-custom-you-figurines.html


Jack Burgess


Re: If things are so bad why. . .

Jack Burgess
 

Tim wondered:

I watched a Netflix documentary today on 3-D printing, and I wondered -- Who
will produce the first 3-D copier? I mean, you just put the car (or 1:1
part) into the copier and out pops a perfect scale copy! :-) It's a whole
new world.

It is already being done Tim. A friend has a 3D scanner which will output
code to drive a CNC machine. Newer scanners will output a file which can be
3D printed. I doubt that the resolution is what we need but all of this
technology is changing fast. How about figures on your layout which
replicate yourself and friends:

http://www.computerworld.com/article/2836838/worlds-first-3d-full-body-scann
ing-booth-to-create-custom-you-figurines.html


Re: Random Thoughts ...

MDelvec952@...
 



Looking for 500-sellers in the resin biz I would first check with Al Westerfield. That his kits were distributed by Walthers and were a stock item in the hobby shop heyday before the names like Sunshine and Funaro and Speedwich were common makes me think that many of his PRR and NYC offerings may have had a 500-piece stocking order at Walthers.

I am curious which of the injected steam-era freight cars may have sold a million units over its lifetime, as was suggested in a previous note in this thread.

             ....Mike Del Vecchio


-----Original Message-----
From: riverman_vt@... [STMFC]
To: STMFC
Sent: Sun, Mar 22, 2015 12:43 am
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Random Thoughts ...

 
    Now you have me curious, Tim. It is possible that a resin car kit or two have 
sold 500 units but which do you think these might have been and what evidence 
of such  do we have?

Cordially, Don Valentine


Hobby Shops in the Nashville, TN area

T.J. Stratton
 

Are there any "must visit" model railroad friendly hobby shops in the Nashville, TN area?

Thanks- TJ

TJ Stratton Maumee, OH. "Modeling the 1950's branch lines of the Michigan Central Railroad in southern Michigan" Mailto:michigancentralrr@...


Re: Random Thoughts from my two articles in Volume 3 of Speedwitch's Modeling Journal

david ellzey
 

The tinplate train set was the humble beginning of this hobby. Am I correct on this assumption? I believe one reason kids wanted trains was the larger roles that railroads played in the communities at that time. Another reason is the fascination of seeing a miniature train snake through trackwork and realistic scenery, this certainly still holds true today! It offers something for just about every one with an interest in railroads or history.
David
 


From: "Tony Thompson tony@... [STMFC]"
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Saturday, March 21, 2015 9:03 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: Random Thoughts from my two articles in Volume 3 of Speedwitch's Modeling Journal

 
I have to agree somewhat that that it's an "old man's hobby". Back in the early 50's just about every kid had a Lionel or American Flyer train set under the Christmas tree. Now, the kids want computer games and other hi-tech stuff. Changing times.

   But the trains under the Christmas tree that kids played with are NOT the hobby, not now and not then. Of course it may get kids intrigued, but the hobby we are talking about is, one might say, entirely different. Most people join it decades later than the Christmas tree experience.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history







Re: Random Thoughts ...

Mark Drake <markstation01@...>
 

Oh wow, now we're looking for "evidence"....stick a fork in this thread, it's done. 

Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android


From:"riverman_vt@... [STMFC]"
Date:Sun, Mar 22, 2015 at 12:43 AM
Subject:[STMFC] Re: Random Thoughts ...

 

    Now you have me curious, Tim. It is possible that a resin car kit or two have 

sold 500 units but which do you think these might have been and what evidence 
of such do we have?

Cordially, Don Valentine


Re: paper models (was Re: Random Thoughts ...)

Garth Groff <sarahsan@...>
 

Tim,

Clever Models has an HO or O-scale Clyde Puffer paper model: http://clevermodels.squarespace.com/models-gallery/ . Admittedly, this is a European design, but the superstructure could easily be reworked to something more American. This is a print-it-yourself kit.

Another print-it-yourself kit from Scalescenes makes several narrowboats in N or OO (which can be rescaled for HO): http://scalescenes.com/products/T018-Narrowboats-and-lock . These aren't quite as a adaptable to the US scene as the Puffer, but are interesting models.

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff



On 3/21/15 11:11 PM, Tim O'Connor timboconnor@... [STMFC] wrote:
 

Mike

There's some really cool stuff there -- I'm a real believer in paper for
building structures and I see from this web site there are SHIP MODELS too!
Paper is ideal IMO for a lot of applications like this for layouts because
it is cheap, light, and static -- i.e. it doesn't have to move around on
wheels or be handled. It's just there to serve as a backdrop for TRAINS. :-)

Tim O'Connor



 I was afraid I'd scare too many with that one. Its very complex.
 But it sure shows how complex curved surfaces can be done in materials one wouldn't expect to work.
 Best to ya,
 Mike Bauers
 Milwaukee, Wi

 There's a GG1` paper kit as well.
  http://cp.c-ij.com/en/contents/2027/gg1/index.html
 Scott Haycock



Re: Random Thoughts from my two articles in Volume 3 of Speedwitch's Modeling Journal

A&Y Dave in MD
 

I've seen lots of youth railroad model videos on YouTube (even one weathering freight cars that fit this list) and someone contacted me from my rail history website asking for proto info to design freight cars virtually. Modeling with a computer takes different skills than modeling with resin, but no less interesting or rewarding.

Perhaps it may only be an old man's hobby if your looking for a kid like Opie Taylor or Dennis the Menace instead of Bart Simpson or Sheldon Cooper?

Could it be the hobby may be bigger and faster growing without you seeing it?

Sent from Dave Bott's iPad

On Mar 21, 2015, at 9:58 PM, david ellzey davidellzey1@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:

 

I have to agree somewhat that that it's an "old man's hobby". Back in the early 50's just about every kid had a Lionel or American Flyer train set under the Christmas tree. Now, the kids want computer games and other hi-tech stuff. Changing times.
I remember steam on mainline railroads (yep, I'm a dinosaur), that's why most of us in our 60's and older model the transition era, we can relate. It was a very interesting era.
But this hobby is getting more hi-tech and sophisticated all the time, great to lure the younger generation in. I personally think it will be around a very long time.
 

From: "Tim O'Connor timboconnor@... [STMFC]" <STMFC@...>
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Saturday, March 21, 2015 8:08 PM
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Random Thoughts from my two articles in Volume 3 of Speedwitch's Modeling Journal

 

> Face it; it's an old man's hobby.
> Brad

Not old -- but most people get into the hobby (or come back to it, as I did)
in their 30's and 40's after they "settle down" and develop an interest in doing
some activity in their leisure time at home. But I think the median age of NMRA
membership was always in the low 40's... It's probably climbed now since a lot
of new model railroaders no longer join because there are so many other outlets
for sharing in the hobby. Like STMFC!

Ah well it's nothing to worry about -- considering everything that is out there,
there's never been a better time to enjoy this hobby than right now!

Tim O'Connor




Re: paper models (was Re: Random Thoughts ...)

Tim O'Connor
 

Mike

There's some really cool stuff there -- I'm a real believer in paper for
building structures and I see from this web site there are SHIP MODELS too!
Paper is ideal IMO for a lot of applications like this for layouts because
it is cheap, light, and static -- i.e. it doesn't have to move around on
wheels or be handled. It's just there to serve as a backdrop for TRAINS. :-)

Tim O'Connor



 I was afraid I'd scare too many with that one. Its very complex.
 But it sure shows how complex curved surfaces can be done in materials one wouldn't expect to work.
 Best to ya,
 Mike Bauers
 Milwaukee, Wi

 There's a GG1` paper kit as well.
  http://cp.c-ij.com/en/contents/2027/gg1/index.html
 Scott Haycock


Re: Random Thoughts from my two articles in Volume 3 of Speedwitch's Modeling Journal

Tim O'Connor
 

David

And people are living longer. And the world as a whole is becoming much
wealthier, with lots more leisure and hobby spending. These are macro trends,
as is the decline of unskilled or low-skill manufacturing jobs, automation,
etc. I read somewhere that 80% of the children born in the USA after 2000
will reach their 100th birthday! And railroads are enjoying a revival in
much of the world and have pretty much stopped contracting in North America.
So I think you are right, this is a great, fun hobby and will continue to be
as long as our civilization lasts. :-)

Tim O'Connor

I remember steam on mainline railroads (yep, I'm a dinosaur), that's why most of us in our 60's
and older model the transition era, we can relate. It was a very interesting era. But this hobby
is getting more hi-tech and sophisticated all the time, great to lure the younger generation in.
I personally think it will be around a very long time.


Re: Random Thoughts from my two articles in Volume 3 of Speedwitch's Modeling Journal

mwbauers
 

I was afraid I'd scare too many with that one. Its very complex.

But it sure shows how complex curved surfaces can be done in materials one wouldn't expect to work.

Best to ya,
Mike Bauers
Milwaukee, Wi

On Mar 21, 2015, at 9:53 PM, 'Scott H. Haycock '  wrote:


There's a GG1` paper kit as well.


Scott Haycock


 



Here..... try something different.... download and consider building this per the plans and study how you could make a more conventional RR model from it.....


Or some just as modern, but less complicated to build...


Re: Random Thoughts from my two articles in Volume 3 of Speedwitch's Modeling Journal

mwbauers
 

I slipped on a word............

Here is what it was meant to be....

Maybe I'm too optimistic about the pre-decorated aspect. But look at carbon3d.com and see how the newest 3d printers make prints in six-minutes that other makes take over ELEVEN hours to make. "

That's going to change things on us ........... Imagine when you can buy one of those machines in five years or so as a home-tool, as the prices drop to that of the cheap 3d printers of today.

Best to ya,
Mike Bauers
Milwaukee, Wi

On Mar 21, 2015, at 9:09 PM, Mike Bauers mwbauers55@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:


Maybe I'm too optimistic about the pre-decorated aspect. But look at carbon3d.com and see how the newest 3d printers make prints in six-minutes that other makes take over an hour to make. Then consider what a small maker can do with a bunch of those machines running at once.

I'll bet this hobby will have a tidal wave of new offerings five years from now.



Re: Random Thoughts from my two articles in Volume 3 of Speedwitch's Modeling Journal

Scott H. Haycock
 

There's a GG1` paper kit as well.

http://cp.c-ij.com/en/contents/2027/gg1/index.html

Scott Haycock


 



Here..... try something different.... download and consider building this per the plans and study how you could make a more conventional RR model from it.....


Or some just as modern, but less complicated to build...


Best to ya,
Mike Bauers
Milwaukee, Wi



Re: Random Thoughts from my two articles in Volume 3 of Speedwitch's Modeling Journal

mwbauers
 

In the day, model trains were the analog of todays personal computers.

Let's put it this way...... In Europe and Japan model railroading is still a vibrant hobby of both the old and the young. 

We have fallen into a rut in our ways of doing the hobby. We can just as easily refresh it as we update it. We can put new life into it without sticking with just the old ways of doing the hobby. Our hobby is so much more than just opening the box and putting model RR equipment on the track.

We can't let it be thought of being just that.

Here..... try something different.... download and consider building this per the plans and study how you could make a more conventional RR model from it.....


Or some just as modern, but less complicated to build...


Best to ya,
Mike Bauers
Milwaukee, Wi

On Mar 21, 2015, at 8:58 PM, david ellzey davidellzey1@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:


I have to agree somewhat that that it's an "old man's hobby". Back in the early 50's just about every kid had a Lionel or American Flyer train set under the Christmas tree. Now, the kids want computer games and other hi-tech stuff. Changing times.
I remember steam on mainline railroads (yep, I'm a dinosaur), that's why most of us in our 60's and older model the transition era, we can relate. It was a very interesting era.
But this hobby is getting more hi-tech and sophisticated all the time, great to lure the younger generation in. I personally think it will be around a very long time.
  

From: "Tim O'Connor timboconnor@... [STMFC]" <STMFC@...>
To: STMFC@... 
Sent: Saturday, March 21, 2015 8:08 PM
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Random Thoughts from my two articles in Volume 3 of Speedwitch's Modeling Journal

 

> Face it; it's an old man's hobby. 
> Brad

Not old -- but most people get into the hobby (or come back to it, as I did)
in their 30's and 40's after they "settle down" and develop an interest in doing
some activity in their leisure time at home. But I think the median age of NMRA
membership was always in the low 40's... It's probably climbed now since a lot
of new model railroaders no longer join because there are so many other outlets
for sharing in the hobby. Like STMFC!

Ah well it's nothing to worry about -- considering everything that is out there,
there's never been a better time to enjoy this hobby than right now!

Tim O'Connor


Re: Random Thoughts from my two articles in Volume 3 of Speedwitch's Modeling Journal

mwbauers
 

Actually, I am listening.

I had been separating brick and mortar sales from Internet sales................. With an eye on those that now only buy from hobby swap meets because retail and discount sales are costly for them.

Let me offer a narrow example....

About 9-months ago you could buy the power trucks from the Bachmann trolley-doodlebug line for $12-$15. The price had been around that for some years by then.

As of last week, they are now $30-$35 in sub-assemblies instead of the lower priced complete assembly of the last few years.

As for the increasing numbers of RTR freight cars, is it a good sign that they are topping $60-$70 for some and are only available in small quantity runs that are soon sold out?

Are they better than the premium kits selling for $15-$19 a few years ago? I can dig up specific examples for this. But you know that in general, this is, as it is.

Well, this can be debated forever.

Lets just agree that many people can no longer afford the hobby and it's compounded by restricted runs increasing the rarity of individual models. Thus a great many potential model railroaders will never even enter the hobby, as it now stands.

Or rather as it is presented to them, being of hard to find and relatively expensive commercial models [ use the Internet or you'll miss out]............ Order in advance of production, or wait some years for the next run, and do pre-order to get it then.

Yet......... new makers offering small runs of models in limited distribution is not quite as positive as you think. Give it about three years and a lot of offerings will be in highly detailed, mostly pre-decorated 3d printings from even more new sources using the new much faster 3d printers that are just arriving.........

Maybe I'm too optimistic about the pre-decorated aspect. But look at carbon3d.com and see how the newest 3d printers make prints in six-minutes that other makes take over an hour to make. Then consider what a small maker can do with a bunch of those machines running at once.

I'll bet this hobby will have a tidal wave of new offerings five years from now.

I'm pessimistic about the state of the hobby today and very enthused about what it will be in the near future as the new tools and processes go on-line.

Now lets see if we can finally get this nation going again and get the under-30's out of their parents basement bedrooms and into a vibrant future where they afford to have places of their own and spend freely on hobbies.

Best to ya,
Mike Bauers
Milwaukee, Wi

On Mar 21, 2015, at 7:47 PM, Tony Thompson  wrote:


Mike Bauers wrote:

The trends are not positive and have been steadily negative for far too many years.

Look at the numbers over time and see if book sales match those of the past. I think if they had stayed very strong, so many bookstores would not have closed over the last several years.

I just think the hobby has changed radically around us. Its still there, just very changed.

     You're still not listening, Mike. Total hobby sales and trends are NOT negative, just store sales. Books likewise have held up, even hardbacks, and e-books, though no longer growing by leaps and bounds, continue to show strong sales. The book business is FAR from failing, though physical stores are struggling.
     Your last statement is the key. Our hobby, and much else in the world of retail, is indeed changing, in some ways radically. But to understand it, you have to recognize Internet sales. It won't be long before people react the same way to remarks about hobby shops, as some already do to the idea of a camera store. One person said to me, "what camera stores?"
     With respect to freight cars, Richard Hendrickson was fond of saying, "THESE are the good old days." Look at the selection and quality of today, and the fact that there are NEW manufacturers offering ready-to-run freight cars. Doesn't sound to me like "the trends are not positive."

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history