Date   

Re: SP Ogden Yards - and more

Rod Miller
 

On 8/8/15 2:09 PM, David Allen dallen@nmu.edu [STMFC] wrote:


Folks - the photo is available on Don Strack's SmugMug site:

https://donstrack.smugmug.com/UtahRails/Roger-Kingsford-Photos/

And other browsing opportunities exist:

https://donstrack.smugmug.com/UtahRails/Roger-Kingsford-Photos/

Dave Allen
From the above link,

https://donstrack.smugmug.com/UtahRails/Roger-Kingsford-Photos/i-gFJhSSS/A

shows the interior of an all-steel SP GS gon. I recall a comment that
sometimes the interiors were painted when they were shopped. Apparently
not all were painted. What appears to be the same gon shows up in another
photo, part of a set that shows the dismantling of the SP roundhouse.

The photos were likely taken outside the scope of this group, but the
gon is IMHO in scope.

--
Rod Miller
Handcraftsman
===
Custom 2-rail O Scale Models: Drives, | O Scale West / S West
Repairs, Steam Loco Building, More | 2016 Meet is May 5 - 7
http://www.rodmiller.com | http://www.oscalewest.com


Re: roof paint (was Re: SP Ogden Yard 50s)

Tim O'Connor
 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/timboconnor/20225659819/

This is not my photo or scan but I uploaded it just to illustrate
the point I was trying to make about box car roofs. Notice the high
degree of paint loss and the blotchiness of the patterns on these cars.
The photo date is 1936 !!

Should every model box car look like that? Certainly not! Should a few
of them? Yeah, why not?

https://www.flickr.com/photos/timboconnor/19791552083/

Here's another -- a postwar NYC box car in 1957. Notice how blotchy the
roof is. Interesting side note -- one of the laterals is wood ! Maybe a
repair ?

Tim O'Connor


Re: SP Ogden Yard 50s

Tim O'Connor
 


Tony don't tell me what I do, and do not, know. I perceive only that
some modelers lack the SKILL to portray the moderate loss of paint only.
But for the period that I model, I've got dozens of shots of cars that have
lost most or ALL of the paint on the panels, often leaving only the enameled
seam caps still painted. And yes, many of those shots show very blotchy
patterns. This type of roof weathering may be overdone by some people, but
that doesn't make it not worth doing correctly. I can think of many examples
of poor and/or unrealistic and/or anachronistic weathering on freight cars.
I don't know why this particular one bugs you so much.

Tim O'Connor



   Same photo, Tim. And you know as well as I do that these faint signs of galvanized showing through the paint are a far cry from the bright silver or gray blotches that some modelers pepper all over car roofs. What's more interesting to me is the variation in running boards, already noted by a couple of other observers. Now THERE is something we can and should model.

Tony Thompson  


Re: SP Ogden Yard 50s

Eric Hansmann
 

I downloaded this image as it’s a pretty large file. It’s easier to zoom in on the details with the file on the hard drive.

 

There are three box cars in the third row that seem to exhibit paint failure on the roof. The second, third, and fourth cars have varying degrees of failure.

 

BTW, the box car in the lower left, ahead of the farm implement, looks like an X29 and there seems to be paint failure all along the ledge just off of the left side of the roof lip.

 

The varied tone of the wood running boards attracts my eye, too.

 

Eric Hansmann

El Paso, TX

 

 

.

 


From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Saturday, August 08, 2015 2:35 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: SP Ogden Yard 50s

 




Tim O'Connor wrote:



 

I don't know which photo you're looking at Tony -- the one I'm looking at has
four 40 foot steel box cars in a row, and the galvanized coating is starting to
show through on all four of them. The painted Gypsum running board also appears
to be losing its paint, and the Apex running board in the foreground also appears
to have had a painted lateral that has lost most of its paint ...

My guess is that modelers see precisely what they want to see. :-)

 

   Same photo, Tim. And you know as well as I do that these faint signs of galvanized showing through the paint are a far cry from the bright silver or gray blotches that some modelers pepper all over car roofs. What's more interesting to me is the variation in running boards, already noted by a couple of other observers. Now THERE is something we can and should model.

 

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA

2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com

(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...

Publishers of books on railroad history

 


KCS #20820 and 20834 missing from 1949 ORER?

bill stanton
 

Walthers proto has KCS auto cars 20820 and 20834 (blt 1941) but my 1949 ORER shows a gap between #20809 and 20851. Can anyone explain this discrepancy?


Re: SP Ogden Yard 50s

Greg Martin
 

Tim O'Connor writes:

>I don't know which photo you're looking at Tony -- the one I'm looking at has
four 40 foot steel box cars in a row, and the galvanized coating is starting to
show through on all four of them. The painted Gypsum running board also appears
to be losing its paint, and the Apex running board in the foreground also appears
to have had a painted lateral that has lost most of its paint ...

My guess is that modelers see precisely what they want to see. :-)

Tim O'Connor<
 
I have to agree that at least on three of the four cars the galvanize metal roofs are beginning to so signs of paint peel. I think, or at least it strikes me is what we see represented on paint peel in modeling is far more exaggerated then in practice. It appears, at least in the photos to be shades of gray, not silver or aluminum that we often see.
 
I am glad you pointed out the running boards as this is something that I am going to have to address more concisely in my modeling as the reality is that most of use should likely paint our running boards gray an weather tem slightly with your favorite freight car color, or by the KADEE running boards offered in galvanize gray/silver...
 
I am just wondering how roofs painted with asphaltum held up, not much better I suspect.  
 
Greg Martin     
 
Eventually all things merge into one and a river runs through it.
Norman Maclean


GATX Cars Types

Gary Wildung
 

I a looking for a list of GATX Car types 21,27 to go with car numbers. I have 160 different car numbers that was used in oil service in June and July 1955 as per Jim article on Wrenshall. Would like to model the correct cars for my layout  by using correct car numbers. Also  any recommendations  on who car model is the most correct to start this project.
Thanks Gary


CMO 38300-39098

mopacfirst
 

This series of cars shows in the Steam Freight Car list as having 7 panel Superior doors.


I'm building a Branchline special edition car, which included YSD-2 doors.  I have a pair of Kadee 7 panel Superior doors with the second panel from top wider to accomodate the tackboard.


I don't find any photos that I have access to that show this car, and other photos of similar North Western system cars are inconclusive. 


Anybody know exactly what kind of door this car might have had when new?



Ron Merrick


SP Ogden Yards - and more

David Allen
 

Folks - the photo is available on Don Strack's SmugMug site:

https://donstrack.smugmug.com/UtahRails/Roger-Kingsford-Photos/

And other browsing opportunities exist:

https://donstrack.smugmug.com/UtahRails/Roger-Kingsford-Photos/

Dave Allen


Re: SP Ogden Yard 50s

Jack Mullen
 

I was surprised that more folks didn't think of Don Strack's Utah Rails website in connection with this Ogden photo.

Here's a link to a higher rez version, in Don's gallery titled Roger Kingsford photos:


Re: SP Ogden Yard 50s

Tony Thompson
 

Tim O'Connor wrote:

 

I don't know which photo you're looking at Tony -- the one I'm looking at has
four 40 foot steel box cars in a row, and the galvanized coating is starting to
show through on all four of them. The painted Gypsum running board also appears
to be losing its paint, and the Apex running board in the foreground also appears
to have had a painted lateral that has lost most of its paint ...

My guess is that modelers see precisely what they want to see. :-)


   Same photo, Tim. And you know as well as I do that these faint signs of galvanized showing through the paint are a far cry from the bright silver or gray blotches that some modelers pepper all over car roofs. What's more interesting to me is the variation in running boards, already noted by a couple of other observers. Now THERE is something we can and should model.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history





Re: SP Ogden Yard 50s

Tim O'Connor
 


I don't know which photo you're looking at Tony -- the one I'm looking at has
four 40 foot steel box cars in a row, and the galvanized coating is starting to
show through on all four of them. The painted Gypsum running board also appears
to be losing its paint, and the Apex running board in the foreground also appears
to have had a painted lateral that has lost most of its paint ...

My guess is that modelers see precisely what they want to see. :-)

Tim O'Connor



      One thing I notice in this fine photo is how hard it is to find much of the famous "galvanized roof paint failure" so beloved of some modelers. Those white spots on the car at far left might be such failure, but otherwise I would describe the roofs as uniformly just dirty. And many cars do not have dirtier roofs than sides. If Richard Hendrickson were commenting on this photo, I think he might remark that these are cars in service in the West, where the urban soot of the Northeast was far less prevalent, so that the same scene in, say, Pittsburgh, might be fairly different as to roof dirt. Yes, the cars come from all over, but may have spent less time in the east recently than would be the case for cars photographed in the east. And many identifiable cars in the photo do belong to Western railroads.

Tony Thompson 


Re: photos (was SP Ogden Yard 50s - Bad News?)

Tim O'Connor
 

Guys

If you're not sure of the provenance of an online photo, the fastest most
reliable method to find out (most of the time) is

  1. copy the photo scan to your desktop

  2. go to images.google.com

  3. click on the camera "search by image" icon

  4. select Upload An Image from your desktop and select the image from your desktop

  5. click on the Search By Image button

If you do this with the Ogden photos, it goes straight to the UtahRails web site.

This is also a handy way to find out if people have copied your photos, and reposted
them to other web sites ! :-) Some web sites block the Google web crawler, so it's not
100% reliable.

Tim O'Connor



Eric,

  Here is the link ... will go off line fairly soon.  There are many great photos in
this 'collection' ... I think I got to this collection the first time by finding a link
to "Utah Rails" ... but can't remember for certain (too long ago) ... Jim B.

  http://donstrack.smugmug.com/UtahRails/Roger-Kingsford-Photos/


Re: SP Ogden Yard 50s

rwitt_2000
 

Guy Wilber wrote: As Dan Holbrook recently observed; this is simply one day. A photo taken any other day may have featured an entirely different mix of cars and loads. Still, a great reference photo for colors, equipment, etc.

You call the day of this photo "house car" day: box cars, refrigerator cars and stock cars.

Regards,

Bob Witt


Re: SP Ogden Yard 50s

Tony Thompson
 

      One thing I notice in this fine photo is how hard it is to find much of the famous "galvanized roof paint failure" so beloved of some modelers. Those white spots on the car at far left might be such failure, but otherwise I would describe the roofs as uniformly just dirty. And many cars do not have dirtier roofs than sides. If Richard Hendrickson were commenting on this photo, I think he might remark that these are cars in service in the West, where the urban soot of the Northeast was far less prevalent, so that the same scene in, say, Pittsburgh, might be fairly different as to roof dirt. Yes, the cars come from all over, but may have spent less time in the east recently than would be the case for cars photographed in the east. And many identifiable cars in the photo do belong to Western railroads.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history





Re: SP Ogden Yard 50s

Tony Thompson
 

Scott Haycock wrote:

 
Next to the stock cars are two gondolas. next to them is a 50' double door outside braced boxcar:
This car appears to have had the wood sides recently repainted- but not the roof, doors?, and, presumably the ends. Would composite cars have had the wood components painted, but not the metal parts?

        The box car, Scott, is a steel-sheathed SP auto car, not wood sheathed as you assume. And if you look carefully at the door, the flat parts match the car sides, so the lighter color of much of the door is due to the corrugations. The roof is already fairly dirty.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history





Re: SP Ogden Yard 50s - Bad News?

Tony Thompson
 

Jim Betz wrote:

 

 I -think- that this group's rules are to "errr in the direction of being too conservative"

rather than "assume it is in the public domain - if it is posted somewhere anyone can
find it".  

       This is like saying "here is a car with the keys in it, I'll assume it's in the public domain." With copyright as with many things, you cannot and should not assume nobody cares about it -- or has rights to it.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history





Re: SP Ogden Yard 50s - Bad News?

Jim Betz
 

Eric,

  Here is the link ... will go off line fairly soon.  There are many great photos in
this 'collection' ... I think I got to this collection the first time by finding a link
to "Utah Rails" ... but can't remember for certain (too long ago) ... Jim B.

 


Re: SP Ogden Yard 50s

Guy Wilber
 

Steve wrote:

"Amazing--not a tank car or covered hopper in sight and only one flat car."

There are three flats loaded with lumber in the background. Within the same cut of cars (to the left) is one light colored car which may be an LO. Further down may be two/three more flats of lumber. Too blurry to be sure.

As Dan Holbrook recently observed; this is simply one day. A photo taken any other day may have featured an entirely different mix of cars and loads. Still, a great reference photo for colors, equipment, etc.

Regards,

Guy Wilber
Reno, Nevada


Re: SP Ogden Yard 50s - Bad News?

Eric Hansmann
 

Jim,

Please share a link to the photo. There may be other images on the same site that will be of interest. 

Eric Hansmann
El Paso, TX

On Aug 8, 2015, at 11:36 AM, jimbetz@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:

  Somebody asked about the source of this photo.  It appears that I 'grabbed' it from
smugmug from a folder called "Roger Kingsford Photos" (sic).  There is nothing on
the website that implies the photo is protected ... but it might be.  I have no way to
really find out who the 'owner' of the image is and therefore can not determine if
posting it to STMFC is 'legal'.
  I -think- that this group's rules are to "errr in the direction of being too conservative"
rather than "assume it is in the public domain - if it is posted somewhere anyone can
find it".  

  Modertor(s) ===> do I have that correct and do you want me to take it down?
                             Right away?  In a day or two?
                                                                                                      - Jim B.

(who won't be back online until about 11pm PDT)

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