Date   

Re: Ice refrigerators lettered "RD"

Charles Peck
 

Steve, Salt is your answer.  Frozen turkeys can be kept frozen with ice and salt.  
Zero degrees is possible with ice and salt but for practical usage, holding around
20 degrees F. would be reasonable shipping of frozen turkeys from anyplace USA
to anyplace USA. 

On Thu, Dec 31, 2015 at 11:47 AM, stevehprr@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:
 

Hi Jim--Thanks for replying. The list of cars reiced in Portland was from Oct 1945, at least 5 years before mechanical reefers began making a significant appearance. Loaded on a Rr-09 and a Rr-32 both with stage icing those turkeys wouldn't be frozen. Again, all the way to New York City? I know what happens to chicken left in my fridge for three days without cooking or freezing, and it isn't good.

Just trying to figure out what these IM and C&BT cars should be  carrying..........

Steve Hoxie
Pensacola FL



Re: Linde Box/Tank Cars - Ammonia?

Brian Carlson
 

RPC 14 covers these cars in detail. It's still available on there site. Rpcycpub.com

Brian J. Carlson

On Dec 31, 2015, at 2:53 PM, Tim O'Connor timboconnor@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:

 


I don't think ammonia was a Linde product -- they concentrated on pure
gases as Tony says -- argon, oxygen, nitrogen... Ammonia is manufactured.

Tim O'Connor


I am wondering what was carried in the well known tank-in-a-boxcar operated by the Linde company.  Liquid oxygen and "other chemicals" have been mentioned on some web sites.  Might ammonia have been shipped to ice makers in such cars? 

   Liquid nitrogen shipments were extensive too.

Tony Thompson 


Re: Photo-etched parts

 

Mark – In the January 1982 issue of RMC I illustrate photo etching which may be more detailed than the Micro-Mark instructions. – Al Westerfield
 

Sent: Thursday, December 31, 2015 10:39 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Photo-etched parts
 
 

Mark,

 

You obviously missed my clinic at Cocoa Beach last year, which was on using this system to photo etch at home :)

 

Bottom line is that it works well if you are careful and treat the chemicals with the respect that they are due.  It is only useful for making smaller sheets (3" x 5" is about the maximum and smaller than that is better). 

 

Pretty much everything in the kit is needed, although as noted the quality of things like the apron and gloves are not great and so I used my own.

 

SAFETY FIRST!  If you get this kit, please, please read all of the instructions and treat the etchant and other solutions with a great deal of respect.

 

Regards

Bruce Smith

Auburn, AL


From: STMFC@... on behalf of feddersenmark@... [STMFC]
Sent: Wednesday, December 30, 2015 10:55 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Photo-etched parts
 


Does anyone have any experience with the Micro-Mark Pro-Etch System? Does it work to satisfaction? Is it over-priced? Are there better systems? Are they selling you a bunch of extra crap you don't need? Any advise is welcomed. Thanks.  Mark Feddersen  Denver, Iowa





Re: Testors Decal Printing Results

John Hagen <sprinthag@...>
 

1a

Garth,

The Testors system works fine IF you need black lettering. Of course if the car you are lettering happens to be white, then anything works. So if you are doing certain tank cars or covered hoppers ………

As you noted you can use white decal paper and print things like signs, logos or anything that has straight edges that may be cut out easily. But that would make lettering an impossible chore.

The only affordable, home user type printer that works for decals is the Alps, now long out of production and working units are disappearing. There is a company in Japan that can repair them but the cost is prohibitive ($1500.00 + including shipping – a big part of the cost) and way too much for my pockets, especially with the ink supply dwindling as that is also out of production now.

I keep watching and hoping that something will turn up but the truth is no one is going to build a printer for the purpose of decal printing; the market is just too small. Such a printer must be able to print white both as a color and as a base layer under colors for opaqueness and be able to print multiple layers of color without losing registration. The Alps can do this. Finicky, touchy and a steep learning curve that required one to deal with challenge and everlasting frustration but they do the job.

Maybe in 2016 ……..

John Hagen

 

Friends,

I finally got around to applying the decals I made using the Testors
paper with my Epson Claria Photo 1400 printer. John's warning was
absolutely right. The inks did not have enough opacity, and the
lettering disappeared when I applied the decals to the car sides. Poop!
These were done with colors approximating the orange-yellow used by the
WP in the 1950s, and some in a light silver-gray, applied over boxcar
red paint. I still have a sheet printed in black for the Detroit &
Mackinac boxcar and for some Sacramento Belt Line RBLs with yellow
sides, but I haven't built these cars yet. I suspect the black inks may
work better. Maybe someone with a different brand of printer will get
better results.

OTOH, the inks did not soften during the soaking process. I made sure
the sheets had a double coating of the sealant, laid on and laid off.
The decals soaked right off the paper and were easy to transfer to the
car side. The product does work as advertised. The guy at the hobby
store is also experimenting with the Testors decal sheets, and he claims
any sprayed sealant will work.

I was using the sheets with a clear backing. Testors also offers sheets
with a white background. This isn't going to work for freight car
lettering, but certainly has applications for building signs.

More on this later.

Yours Aye,

Garth Groff


Visit Your Group

·         New Members 1


Re: Linde Box/Tank Cars - Ammonia?

Tim O'Connor
 


I don't think ammonia was a Linde product -- they concentrated on pure
gases as Tony says -- argon, oxygen, nitrogen... Ammonia is manufactured.

Tim O'Connor


I am wondering what was carried in the well known tank-in-a-boxcar operated by the Linde company.  Liquid oxygen and "other chemicals" have been mentioned on some web sites.  Might ammonia have been shipped to ice makers in such cars? 

   Liquid nitrogen shipments were extensive too.

Tony Thompson 


Re: Ice refrigerators lettered "RD"

Douglas Harding
 

Steve, frozen meat was indeed shipped in ice bunker reefers. The right amount of ice and salt could produce temps down into single digits, but more likely the teens or 20’s, sufficient for keeping frozen items frozen. Most “fresh” poultry is or was shipped what is called “chilled”, ideal temp of 32-38. But sometimes the chilling produced partially frozen birds. Many a housewife starting cutting open a chicken to find ice crystals inside.

 

Doug Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org

 


Re: Linde Box/Tank Cars - Ammonia?

Tony Thompson
 

I am wondering what was carried in the well known tank-in-a-boxcar operated by the Linde company.  Liquid oxygen and "other chemicals" have been mentioned on some web sites.  Might ammonia have been shipped to ice makers in such cars?  


   Liquid nitrogen shipments were extensive too.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history





Re: Ice refrigerators lettered "RD"

Tony Thompson
 

Steve Hoxie wrote:

 

Hi Jim--Thanks for replying. The list of cars reiced in Portland was from Oct 1945, at least 5 years before mechanical reefers began making a significant appearance. Loaded on a Rr-09 and a Rr-32 both with stage icing those turkeys wouldn't be frozen. Again, all the way to New York City? I know what happens to chicken left in my fridge for three days without cooking or freezing, and it isn't good.


   Steve, you assume that frozen food could not be shipped in ice reefers, which is not true. Addition of salt could reduce temperatures into the teens (Fahrenheit) and a mechanical reefer was not essential. I'm not saying that the turkey cargoes in question WERE frozen, but only that if they WERE frozen, they could be shipped in an ice car. Indeed frozen food was so shipped since the 1920s. Mechanical reefers were primarily important because they could attain lower temperatures than was possible with ice plus salt, such as zero Fahrenheit, essential for high-sugar things like frozen orange juice, rapidly growing in popularity after WW II.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history





Re: Testors Decal Printing Results

Bill Keene <wakeene@...>
 

Garth & Group,

The Testors white decal backing could maybe used to print out reweigh dates, lub plates, etc. In almost any word processing program one can create a text box with a black fill and the text — date and other info — as white lettering. This should result in a decal that looks like a patch. One could even chose to use a BCR or FCR color fill instead of black. I have seen MKT Sloan Yellow box cars with the reweigh info stenciled onto a BCR patch. 

Just a thought on possible freight car usage of the white decal sheets.

Cheers & Happy Modeling
Bill Keene
Irvine, CA


On Dec 31, 2015, at 1:53 AM, Garth Groff sarahsan@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:

Friends,

I finally got around to applying the decals I made using the Testors paper with my Epson Claria Photo 1400 printer. John's warning was absolutely right. The inks did not have enough opacity, and the lettering disappeared when I applied the decals to the car sides. Poop! These were done with colors approximating the orange-yellow used by the WP in the 1950s, and some in a light silver-gray, applied over boxcar red paint. I still have a sheet printed in black for the Detroit & Mackinac boxcar and for some Sacramento Belt Line RBLs with yellow sides, but I haven't built these cars yet. I suspect the black inks may work better. Maybe someone with a different brand of printer will get better results.

OTOH, the inks did not soften during the soaking process. I made sure the sheets had a double coating of the sealant, laid on and laid off. The decals soaked right off the paper and were easy to transfer to the car side. The product does work as advertised. The guy at the hobby store is also experimenting with the Testors decal sheets, and he claims any sprayed sealant will work.

I was using the sheets with a clear backing. Testors also offers sheets with a white background. This isn't going to work for freight car lettering, but certainly has applications for building signs. 

More on this later.

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff

On 11/8/15 6:50 PM, 'John Hagen' sprinthag@... [STMFC] wrote:
 

 

Garth,

Epson (or HP or Canon or any other inkjet), must have paper designed for inkjet printers. Dye or pigment based, inkjets papers have a coating that will allow the inks to soak in. Microscale paper is not for use in an inkjet so the inks just lay on the surface and may likely not dry in our lifetime. Using a better than normal mode for printing will increase the amount of ink deposited on the paper so even when using inkjet paper the ink will blur and stay liquid for a long time.

The problem with any printer that cannot print a layer of white ink as an undercoat is that the colors will not be opaque. If you are printing black decals or if the surface you are placing the decals on is white, they will be fine. If they are placed on a colored surface, the surface color will show thru and, depending on the surface color, cause a color shift or make the decal just about totally invisible.

Laser printers will print on Microscale paper but will have the same problem with opaqueness or the lack thereof..

BTW, I print decals. Have for over 10 years. I have had several HP’s and currently own 2 Epson’s and did have 1 Canon (hated it, but I do like their cameras). None of them were/are capable of printing decals, except black of course.

John Hagen

OBS-CALS – your source for Obscure DecalS

 



Posted by: "John Hagen" 
Reply via web postReply to sender Reply to group Start a New TopicMessages in this topic (5) 
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Re: Ice refrigerators lettered "RD"

Bill Decker
 

Turkeys from NW Oregon--absolutely in the time of this list!  Growing up in Corvallis, I well remember the Oregon State University (College then) experimental turkey barns, supporting that state industry.  Similarly, McMinnville, where I now live, has a "Turkeyrama" annual civic event that dates back over fifty years.  Mack was the center of a major turkey raising region then.  So, yes, LOTS of turkeys shipped from areas around Portland, OR--all carried in steam era reefers.

Bill Decker
McMinnville, OR


Re: Ice refrigerators lettered "RD"

pennsylvania1954
 

Hi Jim--Thanks for replying. The list of cars reiced in Portland was from Oct 1945, at least 5 years before mechanical reefers began making a significant appearance. Loaded on a Rr-09 and a Rr-32 both with stage icing those turkeys wouldn't be frozen. Again, all the way to New York City? I know what happens to chicken left in my fridge for three days without cooking or freezing, and it isn't good.

Just trying to figure out what these IM and C&BT cars should be  carrying..........

Steve Hoxie
Pensacola FL


Re: Photo-etched parts

Bruce Smith
 

Mark,


You obviously missed my clinic at Cocoa Beach last year, which was on using this system to photo etch at home :)


Bottom line is that it works well if you are careful and treat the chemicals with the respect that they are due.  It is only useful for making smaller sheets (3" x 5" is about the maximum and smaller than that is better).  


Pretty much everything in the kit is needed, although as noted the quality of things like the apron and gloves are not great and so I used my own.


SAFETY FIRST!  If you get this kit, please, please read all of the instructions and treat the etchant and other solutions with a great deal of respect.


Regards

Bruce Smith

Auburn, AL


From: STMFC@... on behalf of feddersenmark@... [STMFC]
Sent: Wednesday, December 30, 2015 10:55 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Photo-etched parts
 


Does anyone have any experience with the Micro-Mark Pro-Etch System? Does it work to satisfaction? Is it over-priced? Are there better systems? Are they selling you a bunch of extra crap you don't need? Any advise is welcomed. Thanks.  Mark Feddersen  Denver, Iowa





Re: Photo-etched parts

Jon Miller <atsfus@...>
 

On 12/30/2015 9:42 PM, Tim O'Connor timboconnor@... [STMFC] wrote:
My favorite has been the "Peter Aue" system. It's remarkably easy to use,
very cost effective, and the results are quite spectacular. :-)

    I will second that.  Peter's work is some of the finest I have ever seen!  For me it was decals.

-- 
Jon Miller
For me time stopped in 1941
Digitrax  Chief/Zephyr systems, JMRI User
NMRA Life member #2623
Member SFRH&MS


Re: SMSX 100: Depressed Center Flat Car

mwbauers
 

What a temptation !

That side view makes it almost easy to model that car.

Thank you for presenting it!

Best to ya,
Mike Bauers
Milwaukee, Wi

On Dec 31, 2015, at 1:18 AM, thecitrusbelt@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:

Here is the same car in 1936 on the same project with a different load.

 

Click on the link below and then click on the link below the image to see the TIF version and better details.

 

 



Re: Photo-etched parts

Jack Burgess <jack@...>
 

That is basically the process that the Micro-Mark system uses and that portion of the work is straight forward. My point was that the instructions could have had better way to ensure that the negative will be correct with the spaces black and the "parts" clear.

Jack Burgess

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Thursday, December 31, 2015 6:36 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Photo-etched parts

Will this improve the chore of making the negative ???

http://www.pcbfx.com/main_site/pages/direct_etch/the_8min_pcb.html

Best to ya,
Mike Bauers
Milwaukee, Wi

On Dec 31, 2015, at 8:30 AM, 'Jack Burgess' wrote:


I have one and have used it several times. You need to have a way to make the necessary drawings…I use a CAD program. The first time I used it, I was making some larger brass pieces (about 3/8”x1/4” actual size) and it worked fine. The next project was for the levers on the ends of an HO side dump car and most were quite small. I had problems with getting consistent etching on both ends of the pieces…one end would be fine but the other end would over-etch. At the same time, I etched a very fragile weathervane for a friend modeling in G scale and it came out fine.



The process is quite straight forward and covered pretty well in the instructions. Which part of the drawing is filled with black can be confusing…the parts need to be clear/white and the spaces between the parts filled with black. They don’t suggest widths for the frets holding the parts together but I used about .020" wide on .010” stock.



They do give you a pretty good set of materials and tools. You’ll need a much better apron (their plastic one is worthless) and a yellow light bulb is nice to be able to see while doing the darkroom stuff. Once the artwork was done and aligned, the brass and cardstock cut to size, etc., it took about 3 hours for the “darkroom” laminating and etching portion of the work including cleanup.



Jack Burgess







Does anyone have any experience with the Micro-Mark Pro-Etch System? Does it work to satisfaction? Is it over-priced? Are there better systems? Are they selling you a bunch of extra crap you don't need? Any advise is welcomed. Thanks. Mark Feddersen Denver, Iowa

------------------------------------
Posted by: Mike Bauers <mwbauers55@...>
------------------------------------


------------------------------------

Yahoo Groups Links


Linde Box/Tank Cars - Ammonia?

Richard Stern
 

I am wondering what was carried in the well known tank-in-a-boxcar operated by the Linde company.  Liquid oxygen and "other chemicals" have been mentioned on some web sites.  Might ammonia have been shipped to ice makers in such cars?  

thanks

Rick Stern


Sunshine Santa Fe stock car kits for sale

Jared Harper
 

I have ten Sunshine Santa Fe stock car kits for sale.  For a list and prices email me at harperandbrown@....


Jared Harper

Athens, GA


Re: Photo-etched parts

mwbauers
 

Will this improve the chore of making the negative ???

http://www.pcbfx.com/main_site/pages/direct_etch/the_8min_pcb.html

Best to ya,
Mike Bauers
Milwaukee, Wi

On Dec 31, 2015, at 8:30 AM, 'Jack Burgess' wrote:


I have one and have used it several times. You need to have a way to make the necessary drawings…I use a CAD program. The first time I used it, I was making some larger brass pieces (about 3/8”x1/4” actual size) and it worked fine. The next project was for the levers on the ends of an HO side dump car and most were quite small. I had problems with getting consistent etching on both ends of the pieces…one end would be fine but the other end would over-etch. At the same time, I etched a very fragile weathervane for a friend modeling in G scale and it came out fine.



The process is quite straight forward and covered pretty well in the instructions. Which part of the drawing is filled with black can be confusing…the parts need to be clear/white and the spaces between the parts filled with black. They don’t suggest widths for the frets holding the parts together but I used about .020" wide on .010” stock.



They do give you a pretty good set of materials and tools. You’ll need a much better apron (their plastic one is worthless) and a yellow light bulb is nice to be able to see while doing the darkroom stuff. Once the artwork was done and aligned, the brass and cardstock cut to size, etc., it took about 3 hours for the “darkroom” laminating and etching portion of the work including cleanup.



Jack Burgess







Does anyone have any experience with the Micro-Mark Pro-Etch System? Does it work to satisfaction? Is it over-priced? Are there better systems? Are they selling you a bunch of extra crap you don't need? Any advise is welcomed. Thanks. Mark Feddersen Denver, Iowa


Re: Photo-etched parts

Jack Burgess <jack@...>
 

I have one and have used it several times. You need to have a way to make the necessary drawings…I use a CAD program. The first time I used it, I was making some larger brass pieces (about 3/8”x1/4” actual size) and it worked fine. The next project was for the levers on the ends of an HO side dump car and most were quite small. I had problems with getting consistent etching on both ends of the pieces…one end would be fine but the other end would over-etch. At the same time, I etched a very fragile weathervane for a friend modeling in G scale and it came out fine.

 

The process is quite straight forward and covered pretty well in the instructions. Which part of the drawing is filled with black can be confusing…the parts need to be clear/white and the spaces between the parts filled with black. They don’t suggest widths for the frets holding the parts together but I used about .020" wide on .010” stock.

 

They do give you a pretty good set of materials and tools. You’ll need a much better apron (their plastic one is worthless) and a yellow light bulb is nice to be able to see while doing the darkroom stuff. Once the artwork was done and aligned, the brass and cardstock cut to size, etc., it took about 3 hours for the “darkroom” laminating and etching portion of the work including cleanup.

 

Jack Burgess

 

 

 

Does anyone have any experience with the Micro-Mark Pro-Etch System? Does it work to satisfaction? Is it over-priced? Are there better systems? Are they selling you a bunch of extra crap you don't need? Any advise is welcomed. Thanks.  Mark Feddersen  Denver, Iowa


Re: Photo-etched parts

mwbauers
 

This may be similar to the MicroMark version…

http://www.circuitspecialists.com/et20.html

$60

Now for anyone thinking of volume use of this method, consider this….

http://www.prototrains.com/etch1/etch1.html

from..

http://www.prototrains.com/index.html#equipment


Best to ya,
Mike Bauers
Milwaukee, Wi

On Dec 31, 2015, at 8:06 AM, gtws00 wrote:

Where can you find information on the "Peter Aue" System?

George Toman

55001 - 55020 of 194683