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Re: Help with paint and lettering of WIF boxcars

Garth Groff <sarahsan@...>
 

Fenton,

There is a color photo of WIF 314 on page 43 of John Henderson's CLASSIC FREIGHT CARS, volume 1. It is nice brick red. There is no date in the cutline, but it probably is from the late 1950s. The source is Bob's Photos.

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff



On 3/7/16 11:57 AM, srrfan1401@... [STMFC] wrote:
 

Trying to do a few West India Fruit boxcars.  Does anyone know the paint color of the early car(looks like a Pennsy X-29) with the round logo?  Also a second car (Like Speedwitch ex Erie cars) with the steamship logo. This logo has ha straight bow on the ship.  Apparently they changed to a more modern slanted bow in the mid 1950's but I don't know for sure.  Also the cars were painted green at least one in 1957.  Can anyone shed light on these WIF car colors and lettering schemes.

Thanking all in advance for help

Fenton Wells




Re: spiral gondola ends (was Monon gondola spiral ends)

Tim O'Connor
 


These ends are not only good for the Monon. The Soo Line had composite
gondolas with these ends (e.g. SOO #64341) as well.

Tim O'Connor






Richard,

Paul is correct that the Shops was the name of Chad's Monon model business.  As a Monon modeler myself, I benefited a great deal from his creativity and I have too many of his kits to count.  Chad did offer the spiral ends to retrofit the Intermountain USRA gon.  I have a few pairs, but the part was rather thick as a resin casting.  After seeing Jack Burgess's clinic at Naperville last year, I was inspired to 3D model the ends and have Shapeways print them.  You can see them here if you want a set:

Monon Spiral Gondola End by MononInMonon on Shapeways


Re: Shipping Bricks

destorzek@...
 




---In STMFC@..., <tony@...> wrote :
     Both in steelmaking and other industries using refractory brick, there are numerous kinds, and they all have different looks.
===========

And the pertinent point for modelers is they all came from different places. Same with architectural face brick. While common brick was chosen strictly on cost, and tended to be locally produced, to the point where all the buildings in a large city tended to have the same color brick,  face brick was chosen for color and/or texture, and was shipped longer distances; if white brick was desired, it had to come from an area that had clean white clay; other colors were similar. Being a premium product, it warranted the extra expense in handling, at one time being loaded by hand and the layers packed with straw or other padding.

Dennis Storzek






Re: Shipping Bricks

Tony Thompson
 

Elden Gatwood wrote:

 

The steel industry and foundries all over the country used vast quantities of refractory (oven bricks). Since they were valuable, they were usually shipped on pallets bound in place with metal banding, but in your time perhaps rope. They could be any color, but the ones I saw were a very dark red/black, slightly metallic color.


     Both in steelmaking and other industries using refractory brick, there are numerous kinds, and they all have different looks. Silica brick can be gray to almost golden, chrome brick can be dark gray to dark brown, magnesia brick are various light colors depending on composition, and so on. I'm not saying Elden is wrong in what he says, only that there is a great deal more to the topic if you wish to depict pallets of such brick.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history






9F 2-10-0

paul.doggett2472 <paul.doggett2472@...>
 

On a preserved railway




Sent from Samsung mobile


Re: [resinfreightcars] PFE Book

Tony Thompson
 

Rob McLear wrote:

 

There is a copy of the PFE book by Tony Thompson and others on e-Bay now, I have a copy of this and it is an outstanding work and one of the ultimate reference series of books that you need when modelling freight cars. 


     I should point out that the book is still in print and a new copy can be obtained by on-line secure ordering at www.signaturepress.com with free shipping within the U.S.

Full disclosure: I am a partner in the publishing company.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history






Re: Help with paint and lettering of WIF boxcars

Barry Bennett
 

I am working on one of the Speedwitch cars at the moment. I am going with a rich oxide red colour (actually Triumph Russet Brown) and am going to use decals from FECRS. There is also a dry transfer set available from Clover House. The only photo I know of, and which is included by Ted in the kit, has the tone of ROR paint, and 5 years of grime should sort out any nit pickers.

I think it is well established that different ships were depicted on various iterations of boxcars depending on what was in service at the time the cars were built/obtained. There is a lot of previous posts on here, including the ex-HPT&D (not X29) cars, which you can't model as there is no roof available.

Barry Bennett
Coventry, England.

On Mon, Mar 7, 2016 at 4:57 PM, srrfan1401@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:
 

Trying to do a few West India Fruit boxcars.  Does anyone know the paint color of the early car(looks like a Pennsy X-29) with the round logo?  Also a second car (Like Speedwitch ex Erie cars) with the steamship logo. This logo has ha straight bow on the ship.  Apparently they changed to a more modern slanted bow in the mid 1950's but I don't know for sure.  Also the cars were painted green at least one in 1957.  Can anyone shed light on these WIF car colors and lettering schemes.

Thanking all in advance for help

Fenton Wells




Help with paint and lettering of WIF boxcars

O Fenton Wells
 

Trying to do a few West India Fruit boxcars.  Does anyone know the paint color of the early car(looks like a Pennsy X-29) with the round logo?  Also a second car (Like Speedwitch ex Erie cars) with the steamship logo. This logo has ha straight bow on the ship.  Apparently they changed to a more modern slanted bow in the mid 1950's but I don't know for sure.  Also the cars were painted green at least one in 1957.  Can anyone shed light on these WIF car colors and lettering schemes.

Thanking all in advance for help

Fenton Wells



Re: Shipping Bulk Cement: A Few More National Statistics

ed_mines
 

I don't see how covered hoppers would be used in general service unless the customer didn't mind having his load contaminated by the previous load.

 Cement would particularly be a problem to clean out since it sets up with water.



Re: Shipping Bricks

destorzek@...
 

A couple observations from the Chicago area in the fifties, sixties, and seventies:

Dad was a carpenter, so I had early exposure to construction sites, and keenly watched what was going on in the neighborhood, which was just finishing building out.

In the fifties and sixties, common brick (the soft brick with no holes) was delivered to the job site by dump truck, and just dumped on the ground. Broken or chipped brick were either cut for smaller pieces, or used on the interior of walls, where they would be covered. I have no idea how it was shipped; I think all the brick in use in Chicago at that time was produced locally, and may have been shipped from the brick plant in dump trucks.

Face brick, the hard brick with shrinkage holes, was valuable enough that it rated special handling. It was delivered on flatbed trucks, offloaded by hand with a brick tongs, and stacked. It was stacked again on a brick barrow for movement around the job site. This is the  brick was loaded in boxcars by hand, unloaded and stacked at the retail brick yard by hand, then loaded once again by hand for delivery.

By the seventies local brick production had ended, and with it the availability of the distinctive "Chicago pink" common brick. As older neighborhoods were demolished, a business in used brick arose. It is my understanding that the "Chicago pink" was much in demand as an architectural wall covering in California. Used brick was salvaged on the demolition site by day labor being paid by the brick, and initially stacked and loaded by hand, using the traditional methods. I had some photos published in RMC in the early eighties of used brick being loaded into boxcars spotted on a team track using the old, labor intensive brick tongs.

By this time new brick was being shipped bundled such that it could be unloaded by a forklift, and 'self unloader' delivery trucks were becoming common. It wasn't long before consolidation in the used brick business prompted the adoption of the same methods; pallets and cardboard wrappers would be dropped on the demolition site to be filled, then a self loading truck would return to pick up the filled pallets. That allowed all the downstream handling to be mechanized, also.

Dennis Storzek


Re: [EXTERNAL] RE: Shipping Bricks

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Gary;

One more add:

The steel industry and foundries all over the country used vast quantities of refractory (oven bricks). Since they were valuable, they were usually shipped on pallets bound in place with metal banding, but in your time perhaps rope. They could be any color, but the ones I saw were a very dark red/black, slightly metallic color.

Elden Gatwood

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Monday, March 07, 2016 10:11 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [EXTERNAL] RE: [STMFC] Shipping Bricks







Thanks to everyone who replied. Really appreciate this group and their expertise.

Gary Ray


Re: Shipping Bulk Cement: A Few More National Statistics

rwitt_2000
 

The B&OHS has several document about specialized cars including LO. The one from the early 1950s shows that most covered hoppers were in assigned service and not in pool service. So these cars traveled between the source of the load and one of the customer facilities. One could assume the customer wanted the shortest possible route.

Bob Witt


Re: Shipping Bricks

Gary Ray
 

 

 

Thanks to everyone who replied.  Really appreciate this group and their expertise.

Gary Ray


Re: Monon gondola spiral ends - the Shops

Michael Aufderheide
 

Richard,

Paul is correct that the Shops was the name of Chad's Monon model business.  As a Monon modeler myself, I benefited a great deal from his creativity and I have too many of his kits to count.  Chad did offer the spiral ends to retrofit the Intermountain USRA gon.  I have a few pairs, but the part was rather thick as a resin casting.  After seeing Jack Burgess's clinic at Naperville last year, I was inspired to 3D model the ends and have Shapeways print them.  You can see them here if you want a set:

Monon Spiral Gondola End by MononInMonon on Shapeways

 

The price is the direct cost from them, I haven't marked it up. The material is very thin and strong, sort of like a thin guitar pick.


Regards,


Mike Aufderheide


End of car details

Eric Hansmann
 

How much do we model end of car details? The latest Resin Car Works blog post has tips and photos to illustrate the possibilities. 

http://blog.resincarworks.com/end-sill-details/


Eric Hansmann
El Paso, TX


Re: Shipping Bulk Cement: A Few More National Statistics

Ted Culotta
 

It could be a function of the utility of the covered hopper. If I (meaning a railroad) invest in a car that is specialized in nature, it's likely done with the intent of serving my customers' needs, which are online and thereby shorter haul in nature and also, quite possibly, in bulk. Box cars could be used for "finished" (bagged) shipments that are not as customer-specific in nature. Every hardware store needs bagged cement, but only a small number of customers need or want a covered hopper's worth. Each customer receives the cement in a way that suits their needs.

Cheers
Ted Culotta


PFE Book

rob.mclear3@...
 

Hi to all


There is a copy of the PFE freight car book by Tony Thompson and others on ebay now.


http://www.ebay.com/itm/Pacific-Fruit-Express-PFE-Second-Ed-2003-Thompson-Church-Jones-FINE-/111928085527?hash=item1a0f6f0c17:g:3lgAAOSwqrtWoUCq


This is an outstanding work and I have a copy already, for me it is one of the must have reference series of books if you are into freight car modelling.   Good Luck.  No association with the seller or the Authors just passing this on for info


Rob McLear

Aussie.



Re: Monon gondola spiral ends - the Shops

Paul
 

Hi Richard,

 

‘The Shops’ were kits from Chad Boas if I recall correctly.  Chad has a price list on the Resincarworks site, but the ends (Van Dorn?) are not listed.  You may be able to contact Chad from the addresses on the price list.  See;

http://resincarworks.com/boas_kitlist_201506.pdf

 

Regards,

 

Paul Nitz.

 

 

 

Several years ago Mont Switzer had an article in MM about building the Monon's USRA-style gondolas. He used ends on the car representing the spiral stamped ends the prototype had. They (the model ends) were  from "The Shops." Does "The Shops" still exist or are the ends available elsewhere?

 

Richard Townsend

Lincoln City, OR


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Re: Union Pacific Freight Cars 1936-51 - paperback

Tony Thompson
 

Brian Carlson wrote:

 
Terry Metcalfe’s groundbreaking book is available on eBay for a very good price. About half what I paid for my copy. If you don’t have it and you’re a freight car person you need to buy it. 

    Full agreement with Brian. This is the book that was the model for the PFE book, and inspired me to write the SP freight car volumes. It's a foundation.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history






Re: Shipping Bulk Cement: A Few More National Statistics

Tim O'Connor
 


Charles I wonder if this relatively short haul has something to do
with the high revenue per loaded car mile? In other words the revenue
per car LOAD may not be much, even if per MILE it was higher than average.

Tim O'Connor




- LO loads were really short line hauls while box car loads were a little more dispersed in terms of distance traveled.  Again from 1952, these data are typical:

1-49 miles  458 box cars, 376 LO
50-99 miles  799 box cars, 672 LO
100-199 miles  1217 box cars, 802 LO
200-399 miles  800 box cars, 381 LO

Charles Hostetler
Washington Ill.

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