Date   

Re: more on asphalt cars

Tony Thompson
 

Jeff Shultz wrote:

 
While I thought that the difference is that asphalt is a tar/aggregate compound, apparently they come from different sources:

     The asphalt/aggregate compound used for paving is called "asphalt concrete" in the trade. The asphalt binder may be quite variable depending on the source, and sometimes is similar to "road tar" or "road oil," sometimes much different. Road oil is sometimes the term used for oil sprayed to keep down dust on dirt and gravel roads, but I have seen it used to mean the binder in asphalt concrete. Obviously as modelers we don't need to know the exact terminology, but do need to know how the material was handled.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history






Re: USRA hoppers for Westmoreland - was Photo help for M&STL hoppers

SUVCWORR@...
 

The company still exists for their website and corporate history see

http://westmoreland.com/about-us/our-timeline/

There is on very small photo with hoppers in it.

Since this line was affiliated with the PRR most of the cars were built by the PRR and follow PRR designs -   GG Gla  GLaC etc.  AFAIK they never had any GLD (USRA) class hoppers.

Rich Orr


-----Original Message-----
From: 'Claus Schlund HGM' claus@... [STMFC]
To: STMFC
Sent: Fri, Sep 16, 2016 1:01 pm
Subject: Re: [STMFC] USRA hoppers for Westmoreland - was Photo help for M&STL hoppers



Hi Lester and List Members,
 
Lester wrote "The small data sheet states the hoppers were acquired from Westmoreland Coal Company via Hyman- Michaels"
 
I have two questions:
 
(1) Does anyone know, did Westmoreland own any USRA hoppers (or copies)? If so, does anyone know of any references (online or offline) to images of these?
 
(2) Does anyone know of any published articles or other information regarding Westmoreland Coal and Coke and their railroad operations in general? I've seen more than one such article on Berwind, but have seen nothing that I can recall regarding Westmoreland...
 
Thanks
 
Claus Schlund
 
 

 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, September 16, 2016 7:48 AM
Subject: [STMFC] Photo help for M&STL hoppers

The current project is the upgrade of six Athearn and Accurail open top hoppers, four MILWAUKEE, one SOO LINE and two MINNEAPOLIS & ST LOUIS, to what I call the "Kadee Standard." The upgrade which includes wire grabs, brake wheel, retainer valve and line, train line, etc., I was able to complete the MILWAUKEE and SOO LINE hoppers as I was able to find photos to complete; however, I have had no success finding a photo for the M&STL hoppers.  The M&STL hoppers are USRA 5th Ave Car Shops plastic kits painted, lettered and numbered correctly 65243 and 65287 for series 65001 to 65355, odd only, delivered in 1943. The small data sheet states the hoppers were acquired from Westmoreland Coal Company via Hyman- Michaels.  The best photo I could find was on RR Picture Archieves of hopper 63537  which is similar in design; however, I can not be sure if same hand brake, retainer valve location, and uncoupling lever type remained the same for the 65001 to 65355 series. So photo help needed.   BTW the photo I found can be viewed at 
Thank you for your time and effort to help in advance.   Lester Breuer








Re: more on asphalt cars

Jeff Shultz <jeff@...>
 

While I thought that the difference is that asphalt is a tar/aggregate compound, apparently they come from different sources:


On Fri, Sep 16, 2016 at 9:24 AM, 'Claus Schlund HGM' claus@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:
 

Hi List Members,

I came across this image described as "UTLX 56816 unloading Road Tar (Mid 1950's) "

http://vernwigfield.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=404420

I don't know the subtlety of difference between tar and asphalt, but there may be sufficient similarity to make this on topic.

Looks to be a scene illustrating unloading the car into a tanker truck.

Claus Schlund

----- Original Message -----
From: "Tony Thompson tony@... [STMFC]" <STMFC@...>
To: "Era Freight Car List Steam" <STMFC@...>
Sent: Tuesday, September 13, 2016 6:21 PM
Subject: [STMFC] more on asphalt cars

>I have written a second post on asphalt tank cars, including additional model views. If you're interested, it can be found at this
>link:
>
> http://modelingthesp.blogspot.com/2016/09/asphalt-tank-cars-part-2.html
>
> Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
> 2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
> (510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@...
> Publishers of books on railroad history
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
> Posted by: Tony Thompson <tony@...>
> ------------------------------------
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo Groups Links
>
>
>
>




--
Jeff Shultz
Error: Pithy Saying Generator not installed


Reflecting mid-1920s freight car lettering

Eric Hansmann
 

Two HO scale freight car decal jobs wrapped up this week to move a Reading XMp box car and a PRR GS gondola further along. A summary of both projects has been posted to the DesignBuildOp blog.

http://designbuildop.hansmanns.org/2016/09/16/more-decal-work/

 

 

Eric Hansmann

El Paso, TX


Re: USRA hoppers for Westmoreland - was Photo help for M&STL hoppers

Claus Schlund &#92;(HGM&#92;)
 


Hi Lester and List Members,
 
Lester wrote "The small data sheet states the hoppers were acquired from Westmoreland Coal Company via Hyman- Michaels"
 
I have two questions:
 
(1) Does anyone know, did Westmoreland own any USRA hoppers (or copies)? If so, does anyone know of any references (online or offline) to images of these?
 
(2) Does anyone know of any published articles or other information regarding Westmoreland Coal and Coke and their railroad operations in general? I've seen more than one such article on Berwind, but have seen nothing that I can recall regarding Westmoreland...
 
Thanks
 
Claus Schlund
 
 

 

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, September 16, 2016 7:48 AM
Subject: [STMFC] Photo help for M&STL hoppers

The current project is the upgrade of six Athearn and Accurail open top hoppers, four MILWAUKEE, one SOO LINE and two MINNEAPOLIS & ST LOUIS, to what I call the "Kadee Standard." The upgrade which includes wire grabs, brake wheel, retainer valve and line, train line, etc., I was able to complete the MILWAUKEE and SOO LINE hoppers as I was able to find photos to complete; however, I have had no success finding a photo for the M&STL hoppers.  The M&STL hoppers are USRA 5th Ave Car Shops plastic kits painted, lettered and numbered correctly 65243 and 65287 for series 65001 to 65355, odd only, delivered in 1943. The small data sheet states the hoppers were acquired from Westmoreland Coal Company via Hyman- Michaels.  The best photo I could find was on RR Picture Archieves of hopper 63537  which is similar in design; however, I can not be sure if same hand brake, retainer valve location, and uncoupling lever type remained the same for the 65001 to 65355 series. So photo help needed.   BTW the photo I found can be viewed at 
Thank you for your time and effort to help in advance.   Lester Breuer




Re: more on asphalt cars

mwbauers
 

Asphalt is tar with crushed stones embedded in it. I don’t think its at all common to ship a tank car with a load of tar bonded stone…...

The cars contain tar destined to become asphalt once its mixed for the application at the road project.

I’m betting that calling the contents asphalt is just common slang for the load.

Best to ya,
Mike Bauers
Milwaukee, Wi

On Sep 16, 2016, at 11:24 AM, 'Claus Schlund HGM'  wrote:

I don't know the subtlety of difference between tar and asphalt, but there may be sufficient similarity to make this on topic.

Looks to be a scene illustrating unloading the car into a tanker truck.


Re: more on asphalt cars

Claus Schlund &#92;(HGM&#92;)
 

Hi List Members,

I came across this image described as "UTLX 56816 unloading Road Tar (Mid 1950's) "

http://vernwigfield.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=404420

I don't know the subtlety of difference between tar and asphalt, but there may be sufficient similarity to make this on topic.

Looks to be a scene illustrating unloading the car into a tanker truck.

Claus Schlund

----- Original Message -----
From: "Tony Thompson tony@... [STMFC]" <STMFC@...>
To: "Era Freight Car List Steam" <STMFC@...>
Sent: Tuesday, September 13, 2016 6:21 PM
Subject: [STMFC] more on asphalt cars


I have written a second post on asphalt tank cars, including additional model views. If you're interested, it can be found at this link:

http://modelingthesp.blogspot.com/2016/09/asphalt-tank-cars-part-2.html

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history







------------------------------------
Posted by: Tony Thompson <tony@...>
------------------------------------


------------------------------------

Yahoo Groups Links




Re: Photo help for M&STL hoppers

Ed Hawkins
 


On Sep 16, 2016, at 9:48 AM, frograbbit602@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:

The current project is the upgrade of six Athearn and Accurail open top hoppers, four MILWAUKEE, one SOO LINE and two MINNEAPOLIS & ST LOUIS, to what I call the "Kadee Standard." The upgrade which includes wire grabs, brake wheel, retainer valve and line, train line, etc., I was able to complete the MILWAUKEE and SOO LINE hoppers as I was able to find photos to complete; however, I have had no success finding a photo for the M&STL hoppers.  The M&STL hoppers are USRA 5th Ave Car Shops plastic kits painted, lettered and numbered correctly 65243 and 65287 for series 65001 to 65355, odd only, delivered in 1943. The small data sheet states the hoppers were acquired from Westmoreland Coal Company via Hyman- Michaels.  The best photo I could find was on RR Picture Archieves of hopper 63537  which is similar in design; however, I can not be sure if same hand brake, retainer valve location, and uncoupling lever type remained the same for the 65001 to 65355 series. So photo help needed.   BTW the photo I found can be viewed at 

Thank you for your time and effort to help in advance.   Lester Breuer

Lester,
The 1956 M&StL freight car diagrams denote that 65001-65355 (odd) were built by Pressed Steel Car Co. in 1920-1921. It also specifies that at the time 12 cars remained in service. The diagram further states the hand brake as “A.A.R. Std.” and trucks as “Bettendorf.” From the photo described below, the trucks are an A.R.A./A.A.R. integral-journal design with spring planks. Wheels appear to be steel. 

Regarding photos, I have one of M&StL 65327 purchased many years ago from Jay Williams. This photo shows a build date of 3-21, HEG. 7-43 reweigh, and HEG. 7-10-43 repack by “HMC” for the Hyman-Michaels Co. The paint & stencils are fresh, so the photo date would have likely been soon after July10, 1943. The photo showing the right side of the car is a 3/4-A end view such that the hand brake and retainer line are not visible. 

Perhaps resident M&StL historians Gene Green and Clark Propst may have additional information and/or photos.
Regards,
Ed Hawkins





Re: Photo help for M&STL hoppers

Claus Schlund &#92;(HGM&#92;)
 


Hi Lester and List Members,
 
Lester wrote:
 
 

It looks to me like this car had just been repainted prior to being photographed, and one can make out some of the old lettering as a ghost image. At a minimum, the word "CHICAGO" is clearly visible.
 
Anyone have any thoughts on who the previous owner was?
 
Claus Schlund
 

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, September 16, 2016 7:48 AM
Subject: [STMFC] Photo help for M&STL hoppers

The current project is the upgrade of six Athearn and Accurail open top hoppers, four MILWAUKEE, one SOO LINE and two MINNEAPOLIS & ST LOUIS, to what I call the "Kadee Standard." The upgrade which includes wire grabs, brake wheel, retainer valve and line, train line, etc., I was able to complete the MILWAUKEE and SOO LINE hoppers as I was able to find photos to complete; however, I have had no success finding a photo for the M&STL hoppers.  The M&STL hoppers are USRA 5th Ave Car Shops plastic kits painted, lettered and numbered correctly 65243 and 65287 for series 65001 to 65355, odd only, delivered in 1943. The small data sheet states the hoppers were acquired from Westmoreland Coal Company via Hyman- Michaels.  The best photo I could find was on RR Picture Archieves of hopper 63537  which is similar in design; however, I can not be sure if same hand brake, retainer valve location, and uncoupling lever type remained the same for the 65001 to 65355 series. So photo help needed.   BTW the photo I found can be viewed at 
Thank you for your time and effort to help in advance.   Lester Breuer




Photo help for M&STL hoppers

frograbbit602
 

The current project is the upgrade of six Athearn and Accurail open top hoppers, four MILWAUKEE, one SOO LINE and two MINNEAPOLIS & ST LOUIS, to what I call the "Kadee Standard." The upgrade which includes wire grabs, brake wheel, retainer valve and line, train line, etc., I was able to complete the MILWAUKEE and SOO LINE hoppers as I was able to find photos to complete; however, I have had no success finding a photo for the M&STL hoppers.  The M&STL hoppers are USRA 5th Ave Car Shops plastic kits painted, lettered and numbered correctly 65243 and 65287 for series 65001 to 65355, odd only, delivered in 1943. The small data sheet states the hoppers were acquired from Westmoreland Coal Company via Hyman- Michaels.  The best photo I could find was on RR Picture Archieves of hopper 63537  which is similar in design; however, I can not be sure if same hand brake, retainer valve location, and uncoupling lever type remained the same for the 65001 to 65355 series. So photo help needed.   BTW the photo I found can be viewed at 
Thank you for your time and effort to help in advance.   Lester Breuer




Re: May 24th, 1918

Jim Gates
 

St. Joseph and Grand Island, a UP subsidiary.

Jim Gates

--------------------------------------------

On Thu, 9/15/16, 'Schuyler Larrabee' schuyler.larrabee@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:

Subject: [STMFC] May 24th, 1918
To: STMFC@...
Date: Thursday, September 15, 2016, 9:36 PM


 









http://lists.railfan.net/erielackphoto.cgi?erielack-09-15-16/X0970.jpg
 Before you look, what does
StJ&GI stand for??  J  Schuyler  









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May 24th, 1918

Schuyler Larrabee
 

http://lists.railfan.net/erielackphoto.cgi?erielack-09-15-16/X0970.jpg

 

Before you look, what does StJ&GI stand for??  J

 

Schuyler

 


Re: M&StL LT 70001 GATC "Dri-Flow" tank car

Jack Mullen
 

"Dry-Flo" (correct spelling with a y, a hyphen, and no w) was a GATC trade name applied to various types of covered hoppers over the years. The first use that I'm aware of was in 1932, for converted tank cars  with several hatches on the tank centerline and a central discharge hopper fed by drag conveyors.I think the first was GATX 33000, and I believe GATX 34000 was similar.

Just before the cutoff for this list, around 1959, GATC came out with a 3500 cuft Dry-Flo which had a carbody similar to the Airslide cars GATC was building concurrently. I believe these Dry-Flo cars had either pressure discharge or gravity/pressure hoppers. AFAIK GATC did not use the Dry-Flo designation for plain gravity discharge covered hoppers.

Jack Mullen


Re: M&StL LT 70001 GATC "Dri-Flow" tank car

Tim O'Connor
 


Were the Dry Flow tank cars listed as tank cars, or special "L" cars (e.g. LO - the familiar "covered hopper")

I have seen other pictures of similar "tank car" bodies on cars designed to carry dry cargo.

Tim O'Connor



not on Jan 1940

Rich Orr


-----Original Message-----
From: Tony Thompson tony@... [STMFC]

In November 1936 the M&StL leased one GATC "Dri-Flow" tank car which was marked M&StL 70001.  It came onto the M&StL as GATX 34000 and was remarked by M&StL.  We have found this car listed in 1937, 1938, and 1939 ORERs.  Would anyone with a 1940 or 1941 ORER please look for M&StL LT 70001 and if found, let us know which month and year.  A copy of page is not needed.  We are just trying to determine when the lease ended.  We checked  January 1942 ORER and it was not listed.


       This car number is not listed in the April 1940 ORER. There is a covered hopper number series starting with 70003 (odd numbers only).

Tony Thompson


Re: M&StL LT 70001 GATC "Dri-Flow" tank car

SUVCWORR@...
 

not on Jan 1940

Rich Orr


-----Original Message-----
From: Tony Thompson tony@... [STMFC]
To: Era Freight Car List Steam
Sent: Thu, Sep 15, 2016 2:06 pm
Subject: Re: [STMFC] M&StL LT 70001 GATC "Dri-Flow" tank car



In November 1936 the M&StL leased one GATC "Dri-Flow" tank car which was marked M&StL 70001.  It came onto the M&StL as GATX 34000 and was remarked by M&StL.  We have found this car listed in 1937, 1938, and 1939 ORERs.  Would anyone with a 1940 or 1941 ORER please look for M&StL LT 70001 and if found, let us know which month and year.  A copy of page is not needed.  We are just trying to determine when the lease ended.  We checked  January 1942 ORER and it was not listed.

       This car number is not listed in the April 1940 ORER. There is a covered hopper number series starting with 70003 (odd numbers only).

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history








Re: M&StL LT 70001 GATC "Dri-Flow" tank car

 

Aha! A Google search for “Dryflow tank car” returned this hit. Scroll down about 2/3 page for photos of a Dryflow tank car.



http://cs.trains.com/mrr/f/13/p/254256/2841241.aspx





Thanks!
--

Brian Ehni



From: STMFC List <STMFC@...> on behalf of STMFC List <STMFC@...>
Reply-To: STMFC List <STMFC@...>
Date: Thursday, September 15, 2016 at 11:25 AM
To: STMFC List <STMFC@...>
Subject: [STMFC] M&StL LT 70001 GATC "Dri-Flow" tank car





In November 1936 the M&StL leased one GATC "Dri-Flow" tank car which was marked M&StL 70001. It came onto the M&StL as GATX 34000 and was remarked by M&StL. We have found this car listed in 1937, 1938, and 1939 ORERs. Would anyone with a 1940 or 1941 ORER please look for M&StL LT 70001 and if found, let us know which month and year. A copy of page is not needed. We are just trying to determine when the lease ended. We checked January 1942 ORER and it was not listed.



We assume from the length of the lease that the car was successful.



Gene Green and Roger Ward

Out in the Badlands of New Mexico


Re: M&StL LT 70001 GATC "Dri-Flow" tank car

Tony Thompson
 

In November 1936 the M&StL leased one GATC "Dri-Flow" tank car which was marked M&StL 70001.  It came onto the M&StL as GATX 34000 and was remarked by M&StL.  We have found this car listed in 1937, 1938, and 1939 ORERs.  Would anyone with a 1940 or 1941 ORER please look for M&StL LT 70001 and if found, let us know which month and year.  A copy of page is not needed.  We are just trying to determine when the lease ended.  We checked  January 1942 ORER and it was not listed.


       This car number is not listed in the April 1940 ORER. There is a covered hopper number series starting with 70003 (odd numbers only).

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history






Re: M&StL LT 70001 GATC "Dri-Flow" tank car

 

I was under the impression that the GATC “Dryflow” was a 3 bay covered hopper, and based on GATC’s two bay early Airslides, as shown in this model photo: http://cdn3.volusion.com/ztna9.tft5b/v/vspfiles/photos/TSM-12017-01-2.jpg?1456472651 These cars were produced starting in the 50’s, not 30’s.



Is there a photo of the car you’re describing, or similar car?





Thanks!
--

Brian Ehni



From: STMFC List <STMFC@...> on behalf of STMFC List <STMFC@...>
Reply-To: STMFC List <STMFC@...>
Date: Thursday, September 15, 2016 at 11:25 AM
To: STMFC List <STMFC@...>
Subject: [STMFC] M&StL LT 70001 GATC "Dri-Flow" tank car





In November 1936 the M&StL leased one GATC "Dri-Flow" tank car which was marked M&StL 70001. It came onto the M&StL as GATX 34000 and was remarked by M&StL. We have found this car listed in 1937, 1938, and 1939 ORERs. Would anyone with a 1940 or 1941 ORER please look for M&StL LT 70001 and if found, let us know which month and year. A copy of page is not needed. We are just trying to determine when the lease ended. We checked January 1942 ORER and it was not listed.



We assume from the length of the lease that the car was successful.



Gene Green and Roger Ward

Out in the Badlands of New Mexico


Re: Roommate needed for Naperville area meet

Douglas Harding
 

Jared I have a friend looking for a roommate. Will contact you.

Doug Harding from my phone


From: Jared Harper harperandbrown@... [STMFC]
Sent: ‎9/‎15/‎2016 9:13 AM
To: rpm-forum@...; STMFC@...; Proto-Layouts@...
Subject: [STMFC] Roommate needed for Naperville area meet

 

I will be attending the Chicagoland/Naperville RPM meet beginningWednesday, October 19th and checking out on Sunday, October 23rd and need someone to share room expenses with.

Jared Harper
Athens, GA


[The entire original message is not included.]


M&StL LT 70001 GATC "Dri-Flow" tank car

genegreen1942@...
 

In November 1936 the M&StL leased one GATC "Dri-Flow" tank car which was marked M&StL 70001.  It came onto the M&StL as GATX 34000 and was remarked by M&StL.  We have found this car listed in 1937, 1938, and 1939 ORERs.  Would anyone with a 1940 or 1941 ORER please look for M&StL LT 70001 and if found, let us know which month and year.  A copy of page is not needed.  We are just trying to determine when the lease ended.  We checked  January 1942 ORER and it was not listed.


We assume from the length of the lease that the car was successful.


Gene Green and Roger Ward

Out in the Badlands of New Mexico

 

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