Date   

Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: PRR G22 Gondola Photos

Bruce Smith
 

Nelson, Folks,

Another excellent source of information and photos on the G22 and all other PRR gondolas is the PRRT&HS book "Pennsylvania Railroad Gondolas" by Al Buchan and Elden Gatwood. That book is now available at 50% off the cover price, or just $25 at the PRRT&HS eStore. http://www.prrths.com/estore/index_books.html

While you're there, check out the flat car book too, which is just $20!

Regards
Bruce Smith
Auburn, AL
________________________________________
From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com <STMFC@yahoogroups.com> on behalf of 'Gatwood, Elden J CIV CESAW CESAD (US)' elden.j.gatwood@usace.army.mil [STMFC] <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, January 25, 2017 6:48 AM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [EXTERNAL] Re: [STMFC] PRR G22 Gondola Photos

Nelson;

I have the Westerfield kit for a PRR G22 gondola, and I’m having trouble finding photos of the B end. In fact, the only photo I found was the model done by Ted Culotta on the Steam Era Freight Car web site. Ted put the retainer valve on the side to the left of the grab irons, while the model photos on the instruction sheet show the retainer valve on the end to the right of the center line so that the pipe runs down to the right side of the coupler pocket.
The retainer is left of the grab on the far right of the side left of the B end. The retainer itself is just below the top chord, and the pipe runs vertically down to a point just below the floor, then goes in a hole there. Look for the floor rivets.

The hand brake hardware isn’t shown. The brake shaft runs through the end sill, but the bottom end is obscured.

Other than the wheel and shaft, there is a pawl on top of the end sill, and a rectangular box that holds the take up spool that partially protrudes below the end sill . There is an eye bolt that hold the shaft in place that goes through the end just under the top chord.

The instruction show KC brakes, but I believe AB brakes were installed in later years.
They were.

I’m not a PRR modeler, so I don’t know their AB brake arrangement on gondolas. I’d appreciate any photos or descriptions that would answer these questions so I can build the car. About all I know is that the cars had Carmer uncoupling levers (type unknown) and Crown trucks. Until YMW came out with a smorgasbord of Carmer types, I didn’t know there were more than one.
I'll send you a couple photos if you send your email address

Elden Gatwood


------------------------------------
Posted by: "Gatwood, Elden J CIV CESAW CESAD (US)" <Elden.J.Gatwood@usace.army.mil>
------------------------------------


------------------------------------

Yahoo Groups Links


Re: Single sheathed UP B-50-B?

Eric Lombard
 


Randy, 

No documents available make a case for #51406 as having been a UP car.

Now let me ramble on here.... I tend to ;-)

UP classes B-50-7, -8, -9, -10 are a mystery and if anyone has information about them would be grateful to be enlightened.

In the ORER every six months starting 1-1913 through 1-1916 and then 14-1920 well into the renumbering there is no series that would include #51406. It is possible to look at every month in that span on Google books but my quick look is not encouraging.

I also reviewed the service data I have compiled from the original Union Pacific equipment records made available by Don Strack. In the 310 series series built before 1945 or renumbered from those series there are no UP or subsidiary box cars series that would include #51406 (1728 pages). Indeed, there are no B-50-8 cars at all. B-50-6 double-sheathed cars were built up through the end of 1913 and the next series are B-50-11, also double-sheathed, built 1914. The intermediate classes may only have been engineering proposals or resulted only in a sample car; I've not encountered documentation for these possibilities. UP began building fifty-foot single-sheathed auto cars in 1913 but they are too long to match the car in the museum and at any rate also did not have series that would include #51406. The fantastic primary documents behind this of which you are probably aware are available at:

https://donstrack.smugmug.com/UtahRails/Union-Pacific-Equipment-Record/Automobile-and-Box-Car/

As you note, the SP B-50-8 cars match the museum car in side truss design and single-sheathed end pattern. So far I am unaware of any that were renumbered into 51xxx series as box cars. In the 1940's however, some were among several classes reconfigured for wood chip service in series 51xxx-52xxx. There may lie a tale which needs to be told by someone with knowledge of the SP wood chip cars.

Cheers, 

Eric Lombard
elombard@...


Re: NKP 87100 Auto boxcars

O Fenton Wells
 

What price do you want for the two cars and roofs?


On Jan 25, 2017, at 11:22 AM, bnonut@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:

 

I am sorry the Viking roof is supplied made by Stan Rydarowicz!!! I bought three of those roofs and plan to sell two with the NKP proto boxcar.

Mark Morgan


Re: Old union station image

Eric Hansmann
 

Thank you for that information, John.

 

When did the Canadian Pacific stop using the arched lettering on the double sheathed 36-foot box cars?

 

The two double sheathed CPR cars in the image are possibly numbered as 57536 and 83052. My 1926 ORER notes nearly 11,000 cars in service in the 52250-59998 and the 80000-99998 number series, and I suspect there were a few thousand more similar DS shortys in other number series. Did these cars wear the arched lettering until they were out of service?

 

Eric Hansmann

El Paso, TX

 

 

 

 

 

 


From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Sunday, January 22, 2017 3:34 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Old union station image

 




Eric,

 

This photo was taken approximately September 1926 showing the CPR passenger car yard on the south side of Toronto’s third Union Station with its three towers and two arched train sheds – built in 1873 and rebuilt in 1895. Photo was taken from the roof of the newly constructed steam plant built to provide heat to Toronto’s forth Union Station under construction out of sight to the right of the view.

 

The bridge carrying York Street over the yard was demolished in 1927. The old station was demolished in early 1928 after the new station opened in 1927.

 

Hope this helps.

 

John Riddell



Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: PRR G22 Gondola Photos

Ed Shoben
 

Thanks for the information on the G22.  As I am building this car (from an F&C kit), would it be possible for me to get on your list of people who get your photos of the G22?  My email is ejshoben@....

Many thanks,

Ed Shoben


Re: Single sheathed UP B-50-B?

Steve SANDIFER
 

Photos of the car can be seen at:

http://www.trainweb.org/chris/12lomita.html

 

__________________________________________________

J. Stephen Sandifer

 

From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Wednesday, January 25, 2017 12:09 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Single sheathed UP B-50-B?

 

 

 

The Lomita railroad museum has a single sheathed box car identifed as "built for Union Pacific, numbered 51406, to US Naval Weapons station, Seal Beach, to Lomita Railroad Museum."

 

The car seems to be consistent with a Common Standard B-50-8, which was ordered by Southern Pacific and GH&SA in 1913.  The Union Pacific and Southern Pacific were part of Harriman’s lines, which were forced to dissassociate in 1913.  The B-50-8 was designed by SP staff prior to the break up, with orders placed in spring 1913, before the break up.  It is possible that this is a car ordered for the Union Pacific or one of its associated lines before the disassociation.

 

A review of the 1917 Railway Equipment Register does not show any UP or associated line, or LA&SL (listed separately) box car numbered 51406.  UP is known to have renumbered its freight cars in 1917.  I assume that LA&SL cars were renumbered when that line was merged into the UP.

 

If it is a B-50-8, it is somewhat unique in that it retains its composite ends.

 

The car is being deassetioned by Lomita.  We would like to add it to the collection of the Nevada State Railroad Museum in Boulder City but our process requires an accurate history.   An SP car would be withing our collection goals, but a UP car would be golden... Any thoughts on its history are welcome.

 

Randy Hees

Director, Nevada State Railroad Museum, Boulder City

 


Re: NKP 87100 Auto boxcars

Mark
 

I am sorry the Viking roof is supplied made by Stan Rydarowicz!!! I bought three of those roofs and plan to sell two with the NKP proto boxcar.

Mark Morgan


Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: PRR G22 Gondola Photos

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Nelson;

I have the Westerfield kit for a PRR G22 gondola, and I’m having trouble finding photos of the B end. In fact, the only photo I found was the model done by Ted Culotta on the Steam Era Freight Car web site. Ted put the retainer valve on the side to the left of the grab irons, while the model photos on the instruction sheet show the retainer valve on the end to the right of the center line so that the pipe runs down to the right side of the coupler pocket.
The retainer is left of the grab on the far right of the side left of the B end. The retainer itself is just below the top chord, and the pipe runs vertically down to a point just below the floor, then goes in a hole there. Look for the floor rivets.

The hand brake hardware isn’t shown. The brake shaft runs through the end sill, but the bottom end is obscured.

Other than the wheel and shaft, there is a pawl on top of the end sill, and a rectangular box that holds the take up spool that partially protrudes below the end sill . There is an eye bolt that hold the shaft in place that goes through the end just under the top chord.

The instruction show KC brakes, but I believe AB brakes were installed in later years.
They were.

I’m not a PRR modeler, so I don’t know their AB brake arrangement on gondolas. I’d appreciate any photos or descriptions that would answer these questions so I can build the car. About all I know is that the cars had Carmer uncoupling levers (type unknown) and Crown trucks. Until YMW came out with a smorgasbord of Carmer types, I didn’t know there were more than one.
I'll send you a couple photos if you send your email address

Elden Gatwood


Re: PRR G22 Gondola Photos

roy wojahn
 

On Tuesday, January 24, 2017 2:24 PM, "Nelson Moyer npmoyer@... [STMFC]" wrote:


 
I have the Westerfield kit for a PRR G22 gondola, and I’m having trouble finding photos of the B end. In fact, the only photo I found was the model done by Ted Culotta on the Steam Era Freight Car web site. Ted put the retainer valve on the side to the left of the grab irons, while the model photos on the instruction sheet show the retainer valve on the end to the right of the center line so that the pipe runs down to the right side of the coupler pocket. The hand brake hardware isn’t shown. The brake shaft runs through the end sill, but the bottom end is obscured.  The instruction show KC brakes, but I believe AB brakes were installed in later years. I’m not a PRR modeler, so I don’t know their AB brake arrangement on gondolas. I’d appreciate any photos or descriptions that would answer these questions so I can build the car. About all I know is that the cars had Carmer uncoupling levers (type unknown) and Crown trucks. Until YMW came out with a smorgasbord of Carmer types, I didn’t know there were more than one.
 
Nelson Moyer



Re: Single sheathed UP B-50-B?

al_brown03
 

Looking at the photo on the Lomita museum website, it has nine-panel Howe side trusses made from zee stock, and a fishbelly underframe. Unusually, each end panel has both a single diagonal brace and (over the single brace) double corner braces. That might be a clue ...

Al Brown, Melbourne, Fla.


Single sheathed UP B-50-B?

Randy Hees
 


The Lomita railroad museum has a single sheathed box car identifed as "built for Union Pacific, numbered 51406, to US Naval Weapons station, Seal Beach, to Lomita Railroad Museum."


The car seems to be consistent with a Common Standard B-50-8, which was ordered by Southern Pacific and GH&SA in 1913.  The Union Pacific and Southern Pacific were part of Harriman’s lines, which were forced to dissassociate in 1913.  The B-50-8 was designed by SP staff prior to the break up, with orders placed in spring 1913, before the break up.  It is possible that this is a car ordered for the Union Pacific or one of its associated lines before the disassociation.


A review of the 1917 Railway Equipment Register does not show any UP or associated line, or LA&SL (listed separately) box car numbered 51406.  UP is known to have renumbered its freight cars in 1917.  I assume that LA&SL cars were renumbered when that line was merged into the UP.


If it is a B-50-8, it is somewhat unique in that it retains its composite ends.


The car is being deassetioned by Lomita.  We would like to add it to the collection of the Nevada State Railroad Museum in Boulder City but our process requires an accurate history.   An SP car would be withing our collection goals, but a UP car would be golden... Any thoughts on its history are welcome.


Randy Hees

Director, Nevada State Railroad Museum, Boulder City



Re: High Detail semi-scale wheel sets by IMRC

Doug Dolloff
 

Jared,
       Our  current line will be continued. I will get some photos on our website asap.

Best regards,
Doug Dolloff
Senior Vice President
InterMountain Railway Co


On Jan 24, 2017, at 8:42 PM, Andy Carlson midcentury@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:

 

Jared-
I believe the new wheels are in addition to the existing line. I still sell a lot of these original semi-scale wheels by the 1000s.
-Andy Carlson
Ojai CA


 

Will the old line continue to be offered?

Jared Harper
Athens, GA

---In STMFC@..., wrote :

Hello-
It seems that the new HO wheel sets from Intermountain, their "High Detail" semi-scale code 88 wheels, will be shipped to dealers soon.

I have not seen any, either in picture form or in person. Were these wheel sets on display at Cocoa Beach? Has anyone seen them yet, and if so, do you have an opinion? They will sell for a premium (Retail $18/12 pack vs $14/12 pack for their current line). I offer substantial discounts on IM wheels.

Regards,
-Andy Carlson
Ojai CA



High Detail semi-scale wheel sets by IMRC

Andy Carlson
 

Jared-
I believe the new wheels are in addition to the existing line. I still sell a lot of these original semi-scale wheels by the 1000s.
-Andy Carlson
Ojai CA


 

Will the old line continue to be offered?

Jared Harper
Athens, GA

---In STMFC@..., wrote :

Hello-
It seems that the new HO wheel sets from Intermountain, their "High Detail" semi-scale code 88 wheels, will be shipped to dealers soon.

I have not seen any, either in picture form or in person. Were these wheel sets on display at Cocoa Beach? Has anyone seen them yet, and if so, do you have an opinion? They will sell for a premium (Retail $18/12 pack vs $14/12 pack for their current line). I offer substantial discounts on IM wheels.

Regards,
-Andy Carlson
Ojai CA



Re: Southern Car & Foundry

Jim Hayes
 

Somehow we are looking at two different web sites. The old one "dark and murky". The new one is only partly functioning but has a bright colorful photo of a tank car if you press on the arrow on the right side of the screen.

Jim

On Tue, Jan 24, 2017 at 6:37 PM, 'Schuyler Larrabee' schuyler.larrabee@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:
 

“Fully Functioning” maybe but so dark and low contrast as to be essentially unreadable. And text should NEVER be slammed up against the left margin; makes you wonder what you can’t see off to the left. I found it basically useless.

Schuyler

From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Tuesday, January 24, 2017 4:58 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Southern Car & Foundry

Don't know what site you're looking at, but the SC&F site I just looked at is fully functioning

Pierre Oliver
www.elgincarshops.com
www.yarmouthmodelworks.com

On 1/24/17 4:52 PM, Jim Hayes jimhayes97225@... [STMFC] wrote:

Looks like the web site has been redone but it's incomplete and not ready for prime time.

Jim

On Tue, Jan 24, 2017 at 11:47 AM, Richard Townsend richtownsend@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:

I have been trying to get to Southern Car & Foundry's web site at southerncarandfoundry.com, but have been having no luck. Does anyone else have this problem? All I get is "This page can't be displayed."

Richard Townsend

Lincoln City, OR

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



Re: Weathering Tank Cars

Bruce Smith
 

Armand,


I think we might have talked about this a number of times over the history of this list.  Here's my basic approach.


1) Start with an overspray of weathered or grimy black.  These cars got very grimy from smoke, dirt, dust and road grime and were rarely washed or repainted.  This also dulls the markings.


2) Add additional grime from spillage in the dome area.  I like oily black for this.


3) Add bearing oil grunge to the bottom and ends of the tank where leaky bearings on the car, or neighboring car would have spun oil out onto the tank and frame.


4) Add a rust wash to the edges of the tank bands to indicate where expansion and contraction have rubbed the paint off allowing rust.  Also rust the truck springs.


5) Add fresh spills with gloss paint.


6) Add appropriate placards and chalk marks.


With practice, it is possible to apply this type of weathering on a "fleet" basis.


Regards

Bruce




From: STMFC@... <STMFC@...> on behalf of Armand Premo arm.p.prem@... [STMFC]
Sent: Tuesday, January 24, 2017 2:26 PM
To: 'Brian Carlson' prrk41361@... [STMFC]
Subject: [STMFC] Fwd: Weathering Tank Cars
 



---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Armand Premo <arm.p.prem@...>
Date: Tue, Jan 24, 2017 at 1:07 PM
Subject: Weathering Tank Cars
" <STMFC@...>


With the advent of the new Tangent tank cars and new resin cars,has there been any discussion on weathering tank cars?If so ,guess I missed it.Armand Premo




Re: Southern Car & Foundry

Schuyler Larrabee
 

“Fully Functioning” maybe but so dark and low contrast as to be essentially unreadable. And text should NEVER be slammed up against the left margin; makes you wonder what you can’t see off to the left. I found it basically useless.



Schuyler



From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com]
Sent: Tuesday, January 24, 2017 4:58 PM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Southern Car & Foundry





Don't know what site you're looking at, but the SC&F site I just looked at is fully functioning

Pierre Oliver
www.elgincarshops.com
www.yarmouthmodelworks.com

On 1/24/17 4:52 PM, Jim Hayes jimhayes97225@gmail.com [STMFC] wrote:



Looks like the web site has been redone but it's incomplete and not ready for prime time.



Jim



On Tue, Jan 24, 2017 at 11:47 AM, Richard Townsend richtownsend@netscape.net [STMFC] <STMFC@yahoogroups.com> wrote:



I have been trying to get to Southern Car & Foundry's web site at southerncarandfoundry.com, but have been having no luck. Does anyone else have this problem? All I get is "This page can't be displayed."



Richard Townsend

Lincoln City, OR











[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: High Detail semi-scale wheel sets by IMRC

Jared Harper
 


Will the old line continue to be offered?

Jared Harper
Athens, GA

---In STMFC@..., <midcentury@...> wrote :

Hello-
It seems that the new HO wheel sets from Intermountain, their "High Detail" semi-scale code 88 wheels, will be shipped to dealers soon.

I have not seen any, either in picture form or in person. Were these wheel sets on display at Cocoa Beach? Has anyone seen them yet, and if so, do you have an opinion? They will sell for a premium (Retail $18/12 pack vs $14/12 pack for their current line). I offer substantial discounts on IM wheels.

Regards,
-Andy Carlson
Ojai CA


Re: NKP 87100 Auto boxcars

O Fenton Wells
 

Yes, Mark I would be interested
Are you saying you have 50 ft viking roof replacements?
Fenton Wells

On Tue, Jan 24, 2017 at 4:02 PM, bnonut@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:
 

In 2011 inquired about the Life Like Proto Auto Boxcar. This series used Viking roofs. I have two RTR cars with the replacement for each.

Anyone interested in these?

Sincerely, Mark Morgan





--
Fenton Wells
5 Newberry Lane
Pinehurst NC 28374
910-420-1144
srrfan1401@...


Re: High Detail semi-scale wheel sets by IMRC

Tim O'Connor
 

Andy

Are these like the Exactrail premium wheelsets, or something different?

I missed out on the Exactrail wheels... pricey but beautiful.

It seems that the new HO wheel sets from Intermountain, their "High Detail" semi-scale code 88 wheels, will be shipped to dealers soon.

I have not seen any, either in picture form or in person. Were these wheel sets on display at Cocoa Beach? Has anyone seen them yet, and if so, do you have an opinion? They will sell for a premium (Retail $18/12 pack vs $14/12 pack for their current line). I offer substantial discounts on IM wheels.

Regards,
-Andy Carlson


Re: PRR G22 Gondola Photos

 

Nelson -  Woops!  westerfieldalfred@...


On Tuesday, January 24, 2017 4:24 PM, "Nelson Moyer npmoyer@... [STMFC]" wrote:


 
I have the Westerfield kit for a PRR G22 gondola, and I’m having trouble finding photos of the B end. In fact, the only photo I found was the model done by Ted Culotta on the Steam Era Freight Car web site. Ted put the retainer valve on the side to the left of the grab irons, while the model photos on the instruction sheet show the retainer valve on the end to the right of the center line so that the pipe runs down to the right side of the coupler pocket. The hand brake hardware isn’t shown. The brake shaft runs through the end sill, but the bottom end is obscured.  The instruction show KC brakes, but I believe AB brakes were installed in later years. I’m not a PRR modeler, so I don’t know their AB brake arrangement on gondolas. I’d appreciate any photos or descriptions that would answer these questions so I can build the car. About all I know is that the cars had Carmer uncoupling levers (type unknown) and Crown trucks. Until YMW came out with a smorgasbord of Carmer types, I didn’t know there were more than one.
 
Nelson Moyer


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