Date   

Re: Southern Railway 1937 Box Car Herald Color in 1949

Tim O'Connor
 


That's an easy question to answer - the aluminum heralds were an earlier
style than the one in your photo. Therefore, it's white.

The color changed to white before the style changed - Ted includes both
white and aluminum versions of the early style. The white ones were being
applied to new cars in 1942, if not earlier.

Tim O'Connor



I have just uploaded three files containing pictures of a wreck on the Siskiyou Line of the Southern Pacific near the California-Oregon border.  The year is around 1950.  My question is simple: what color should the herald be for this car built in 1937, which according to Speedwitch decals was originally painted with Aluminum color heralds?  I'm assuming that this car would have been repainted by the late 40's but would the herald be White by this time?  From black and white photos its really impossible to tell, so I'm looking for a Southern Rwy expert.

Thanks in advance,
Ken Roth


Southern Railway 1937 Box Car Herald Color in 1949

Ken Roth
 

I have just uploaded three files containing pictures of a wreck on the Siskiyou Line of the Southern Pacific near the California-Oregon border.  The year is around 1950.  My question is simple: what color should the herald be for this car built in 1937, which according to Speedwitch decals was originally painted with Aluminum color heralds?  I'm assuming that this car would have been repainted by the late 40's but would the herald be White by this time?  From black and white photos its really impossible to tell, so I'm looking for a Southern Rwy expert.

Thanks in advance,
Ken Roth



Re: Tacoma photos (was BLI 6K Tank Car)

Tim O'Connor
 


And this great and rare photo of a Santa Fe 60 foot Ft-U flat car, built
by General American in 1941, in Tacoma in 1952 with some kind of refinery
vessel load

http://cdm17061.contentdm.oclc.org/utils/ajaxhelper/?CISOROOT=p17061coll21&CISOPTR=33748&action=2&DMSCALE=100&DMWIDTH=1382&DMHEIGHT=1142

Tim O'Connor




  And another:
  http://cdm17061.contentdm.oclc.org/cdm/singleitem/collection/p17061coll21/id/4899/rec/108
  Brian Leppert
  Carson City, NV


New file uploaded to STMFC

STMFC@...
 

Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the STMFC
group.


File : /05111611.JPG
Uploaded by : krowth3249 <kenwroth@comcast.net>
Description : Southern Rwy. 1937 AAR box. Siskiyou Line of the SP in N. Cal.


You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/STMFC/files/05111611.JPG


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398


Regards,


krowth3249 <kenwroth@comcast.net>


New file uploaded to STMFC

STMFC@...
 

Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the STMFC
group.


File : /05111612.JPG
Uploaded by : krowth3249 <kenwroth@comcast.net>
Description : Southern Rwy 1937 Box on Siskiyou Line of the SP in N.Cal. ~1950


You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/STMFC/files/05111612.JPG


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398


Regards,


krowth3249 <kenwroth@comcast.net>


New file uploaded to STMFC

STMFC@...
 

Hello,


This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the STMFC
group.


File : /05111613.JPG
Uploaded by : krowth3249 <kenwroth@comcast.net>
Description : Southern AAR 1937 Boxcar on Siskiyou Line of SP in Northern California.


You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/STMFC/files/05111613.JPG


To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398


Regards,


krowth3249 <kenwroth@comcast.net>


Re: BLI 6K Tank Car photos posted

gary laakso
 

Garth, who is the person to contact at Tangent and is there an e-mail address available for that person?

Gary Laakso
south of Mike Brock


On Mar 7, 2017, at 9:24 PM, Garth Groff sarahsan@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:

 

Tim and Friends,

I have asked Tangent to consider an ACF 10K high walkway Type 7 or 11. I've been lobbying various manufacturers for these for years. I have two of the 8K F&C cars, but really want a couple of 10s (the WP used them up until the end). This is a much needed car for the first half of the 20th century, made in the thousands for numerous owners, and very distinctive. Perhaps if some of you also asked Tangent, they might give this more consideration.

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff


On 3/7/17 6:00 PM, Tim O'Connor timboconnor@... [STMFC] wrote:
 

Tony

Granted, it is a size of tank car that is highly desirable!

But didn't TRIX previously try to render this car, and they ran into a lot
of flak here for their mistakes too?

That was Strike ONE. Now, Strike TWO.

It's time for somebody to hit a HOME RUN, I think.

I'm patient. I'm pretty sure that David Lehlbach (Tangent) is planning to do
some more good work building on that beautiful tank car tooling he's already
done. I can wait. There's plenty of stuff in the queue.

Tim O'Connor





Tim O'Connor wrote:

But a funky model with giant rivets, fat handrails, a 4" thick solid walkway. I'm
sorry, but park this blob next to a TANGENT tank car and you will not be happy with
the comparison.


If you mean on the jacket, those are bolts, not rivets. Handrails, last time I checked, can be replaced (along with the heavy ladder). The walkway is pretty lame, there I agree. And full agreement with the comparison to Tangent models.

It's kind of like the BLI releases of the NYC steel boxcars. Yeah, well short of great models, but we needed the cars. These BLI tank cars are very badly needed 6000-gallon insulated cars. Reminds me in a way of what we always used to say about Walthers (some still do): good news is that the model has been produced, bad news is that Walthers did it.

Tony Thompson


Re: BLI 6K Tank Car photos posted

Garth Groff <sarahsan@...>
 

Tim and Friends,

I have asked Tangent to consider an ACF 10K high walkway Type 7 or 11. I've been lobbying various manufacturers for these for years. I have two of the 8K F&C cars, but really want a couple of 10s (the WP used them up until the end). This is a much needed car for the first half of the 20th century, made in the thousands for numerous owners, and very distinctive. Perhaps if some of you also asked Tangent, they might give this more consideration.

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff


On 3/7/17 6:00 PM, Tim O'Connor timboconnor@... [STMFC] wrote:
 

Tony

Granted, it is a size of tank car that is highly desirable!

But didn't TRIX previously try to render this car, and they ran into a lot
of flak here for their mistakes too?

That was Strike ONE. Now, Strike TWO.

It's time for somebody to hit a HOME RUN, I think.

I'm patient. I'm pretty sure that David Lehlbach (Tangent) is planning to do
some more good work building on that beautiful tank car tooling he's already
done. I can wait. There's plenty of stuff in the queue.

Tim O'Connor





Tim O'Connor wrote:

But a funky model with giant rivets, fat handrails, a 4" thick solid walkway. I'm
sorry, but park this blob next to a TANGENT tank car and you will not be happy with
the comparison.


If you mean on the jacket, those are bolts, not rivets. Handrails, last time I checked, can be replaced (along with the heavy ladder). The walkway is pretty lame, there I agree. And full agreement with the comparison to Tangent models.

It's kind of like the BLI releases of the NYC steel boxcars. Yeah, well short of great models, but we needed the cars. These BLI tank cars are very badly needed 6000-gallon insulated cars. Reminds me in a way of what we always used to say about Walthers (some still do): good news is that the model has been produced, bad news is that Walthers did it.

Tony Thompson


Re: BLI 6K Tank Car photos posted

brianleppert@att.net
 


Re: What is the third car from the camera?

Jack Mullen
 

I agree that it's a covered gon. Presumably the intended cargo would be something shipped in bulk that needed some protection from weather. Perhaps salt?  I'm sure there are other plausible mineral products.

Jack Mullen


Re: BLI 6K Tank Car photos posted

brianleppert@att.net
 

Here's a Penn Salt tank photo from the Tacoma Public Library Northwest Room

http://cdm17061.contentdm.oclc.org/cdm/singleitem/collection/p17061coll21/id/11668/rec/1

Might be in the same series as BLI

Brian Leppert
Carson City, NV


Re: BLI 6K Tank Car photos posted

Richard Townsend
 

I wonder if some of the criticisms for the tank car might be muted when one realizes that it is a 6,000 gallon car. What looks oversized on this relatively small car might not be. Critics might be coming from a frame of reference based on 8,000 gallon, 10,000 gallon, and 11,000 gallon cars, and unconsciously seeing those features relative to the scale of the larger cars. In other words, what looks right on an 11,000 gallon car might look oversized on a 6,000 gallon car, even though it is the same size on both.
 
I'll withhold judgment until I have one in my hand.
 
Richard Townsend
Lincoln City, OR
 
 

-----Original Message-----
From: Tony Thompson tony@... [STMFC]
To: STMFC
Sent: Tue, Mar 7, 2017 3:42 pm
Subject: Re: [STMFC] BLI 6K Tank Car photos posted

 
Tim O'Connor wrote:

 
But didn't TRIX previously try to render this car, and they ran into a lot
of flak here for their mistakes too?

    Yes though they were hindered by their seriously unusual truck-coupler-underframe design, not the least bit easy to fix. This one has far less warts, IMO. And I'm already looking at mods toward insulated ICC 103 and 104 cars of this size.

Tony Thompson




Re: What is this car?

Douglas Harding
 

Al that might be true for very early stockcars, but the 28hr law implemented in 1906 (itself an update of a 1877 law) made feed bins on stockcars obsolete. Stockcars with high exterior boards as seen in the photo were common up past WWII.

 

 

From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Tuesday, March 7, 2017 1:54 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: What is this car?

 

 

Solid top areas had pull-down feed bins I believe?

 

Al Kresse

On March 7, 2017 at 2:41 PM "Al Kresse water.kresse@... [STMFC]" <STMFC@...> wrote:

 

 

C&O had them also . . . . Mr Garstang, later Master Mechanic for C&O helped in their design.

 

Al Kresse

On March 7, 2017 at 2:32 PM "Ray Breyer rtbsvrr69@... [STMFC]" <STMFC@...> wrote:

 

 

>>...But I've never seen a stock car that has those boards on the top of the sides/ends (on any RR)....

 

>>...But the top of the sides (and ends) are something I've never seen anywhere on any RR's stock car....
>>Jim B.

 

Hi Jim, 

 

Really? That's a little surprising, because at one time they were de rigueur on almost every stock car built. Just in my own photo collection, I have images of cars from the following roads with this type of large lettering board:

 

A&NM, ATSF, BCE, C&A, C&GT, C&S, C&NW, CA&CRW, CB&Q, CCC&StL, CGW, CMO, CP, CRI&P, CC&O, CWV&S, D&RG, DL&W, GN, Hicks, IC, I-GN, KCMO, LPTC, LS&MS, LV, M&NA, M&O, Mather, Milwaukee, MKT, MP, NdeM, NP, NKP, NYC&HR, PM, PRR, RGS, Rutland, SLSF, Soo, SSW, W&LE, Wabash, WC, WM.

 

Cyril Durrenberger wrote an article for Model Railroading magazine in the early '00's on matching the old Roundhouse (and AHM) shorty stock car to the prototype, and showcased a couple of dozen of these cars. 

 

True, this type of stock car wasn't much built after 1910, but the type survived into WWII.

 

Regards, 

Ray Breyer

Elgin, IL

 


 

 


 


Re: What is the third car from the camera?

riverman_vt@...
 

I think you're probably correct, Richard, but given that the photo appears to be taken in Wyoming. PA
wonder what it could be for. It could be a special load other than ore of any grade if it were something 
large that required a crane to hoist it over and lower it into the car. Also, are those webbed straps similar
to what is used now that are going over the top and appear to be fastened to the sides between the stakes?

My best, Don Valentine


---In STMFC@..., <richtownsend@...> wrote :

I'm going to say covered gondola. I've seen similar cars on the C&S narrow gauge in Colorado, used for carrying high-grade ore.
 
Richard Townsend
Lincoln City, OR
 
 

-----Original Message-----
From: 'Claus Schlund' claus@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...>
To: STMFC <STMFC@...>
Sent: Mon, Mar 6, 2017 9:13 pm
Subject: [STMFC] What is the third car from the camera?

 
Hi List Members,

I'd like to invite everyone to consider the nice image linked below:

http://lists.railfan.net/erielackphoto.cgi?erielack-12-05-13/C3665.jpg

The two cars closest to the camera appears to PRR class GS gondolas.

What is the third car from the camera? Pickle car? Gondola with covers?
Something else?

Claus Schlund


Re: Broadway Limited Dealers on this list

riverman_vt@...
 

That makes two of us, Bill, though I thought folks knew that.

Don Valentine, New England Rail Service, Inc.


Re: Pennsy X29

Robert J. Amsler, Jr.
 

Thanks.

 

Bob Amsler

 

From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2017 12:48 PM
To: 'Robert J. Amsler, Jr.' mpfan1@... [STMFC] ; STMFC@...
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Pennsy X29

 

 

‎Bob

 

According to a PRR plan sheet for ladders, the X29 has

The vertical Styles are 1-3/4 by 1-3/4 by 3/16

Outside to outside the ladder width is 20

The rungs have the rivet holes 18-1/4 apart

The rungs are 3/4 inch in diameter

The rivets fit into a 5/8 hole

The vertical spacing, rung to rung is 15-3/4

 

Hope this helps

Mark

 

From: 'Robert J. Amsler, Jr.' mpfan1@... [STMFC]

Sent: Tuesday, March 7, 2017 11:20 AM

Reply To: STMFC@...

Subject: [STMFC] Pennsy X29

 

 

Good morning:

 

I am hope someone on the list may know this information.  I looking for the width of the ladders on Pennsy X29 box cars so I can get the correct ladder from Pierre.  I looked at the all steel book from Speedwitch and the drawings show the distance between the rungs but not the stiles.

 

Thanks,

 

Bob Amsler

Saint Louis, Missouri

 

 




Re: BLI 6K Tank Car photos posted

Tony Thompson
 

Tim O'Connor wrote:

 

But didn't TRIX previously try to render this car, and they ran into a lot
of flak here for their mistakes too?


    Yes though they were hindered by their seriously unusual truck-coupler-underframe design, not the least bit easy to fix. This one has far less warts, IMO. And I'm already looking at mods toward insulated ICC 103 and 104 cars of this size.

Tony Thompson




Re: What is this car?

tyesac@...
 

These were "dual service"  stock & coke loading.   Which is why they also have Caswell operating drop doors in the floor.

Tom Casey
Solid top areas had pull-down feed bins I believe?



-----Original Message-----
From: Al Kresse water.kresse@... [STMFC]
To: STMFC
Sent: Tue, Mar 7, 2017 1:53 pm
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: What is this car?

 
Solid top areas had pull-down feed bins I believe?

Al Kresse
On March 7, 2017 at 2:41 PM "Al Kresse water.kresse@... [STMFC]" <STMFC@...> wrote:

 
 
C&O had them also . . . . Mr Garstang, later Master Mechanic for C&O helped in their design.

Al Kresse
On March 7, 2017 at 2:32 PM "Ray Breyer rtbsvrr69@... [STMFC]" <STMFC@...> wrote:

 
 
>>...But I've never seen a stock car that has those boards on the top of the sides/ends (on any RR)....


>>...But the top of the sides (and ends) are something I've never seen anywhere on any RR's stock car....
>>Jim B.


Hi Jim, 

Really? That's a little surprising, because at one time they were de rigueur on almost every stock car built. Just in my own photo collection, I have images of cars from the following roads with this type of large lettering board:

A&NM, ATSF, BCE, C&A, C>, C&S, C&NW, CA&CRW, CB&Q, CCC&StL, CGW, CMO, CP, CRI&P, CC&O, CWV&S, D&RG, DL&W, GN, Hicks, IC, I-GN, KCMO, LPTC, LS&MS, LV, M&NA, M&O, Mather, Milwaukee, MKT, MP, NdeM, NP, NKP, NYC&HR, PM, PRR, RGS, Rutland, SLSF, Soo, SSW, W&LE, Wabash, WC, WM.

Cyril Durrenberger wrote an article for Model Railroading magazine in the early '00's on matching the old Roundhouse (and AHM) shorty stock car to the prototype, and showcased a couple of dozen of these cars. 

True, this type of stock car wasn't much built after 1910, but the type survived into WWII.

Regards, 
Ray Breyer
Elgin, IL
 

 
 

 


Re: BLI 6K Tank Car photos posted

Tim O'Connor
 

Tony

Granted, it is a size of tank car that is highly desirable!

But didn't TRIX previously try to render this car, and they ran into a lot
of flak here for their mistakes too?

That was Strike ONE. Now, Strike TWO.

It's time for somebody to hit a HOME RUN, I think.

I'm patient. I'm pretty sure that David Lehlbach (Tangent) is planning to do
some more good work building on that beautiful tank car tooling he's already
done. I can wait. There's plenty of stuff in the queue.

Tim O'Connor





Tim O'Connor wrote:

But a funky model with giant rivets, fat handrails, a 4" thick solid walkway. I'm
sorry, but park this blob next to a TANGENT tank car and you will not be happy with
the comparison.


If you mean on the jacket, those are bolts, not rivets. Handrails, last time I checked, can be replaced (along with the heavy ladder). The walkway is pretty lame, there I agree. And full agreement with the comparison to Tangent models.

It's kind of like the BLI releases of the NYC steel boxcars. Yeah, well short of great models, but we needed the cars. These BLI tank cars are very badly needed 6000-gallon insulated cars. Reminds me in a way of what we always used to say about Walthers (some still do): good news is that the model has been produced, bad news is that Walthers did it.

Tony Thompson


Re: BLI 6K Tank Car photos posted

Tony Thompson
 

Tim O'Connor wrote:

 

But a funky model with giant rivets, fat handrails, a 4" thick solid walkway. I'm
sorry, but park this blob next to a TANGENT tank car and you will not be happy with
the comparison.


   If you mean on the jacket, those are bolts, not rivets. Handrails, last time I checked, can be replaced (along with the heavy ladder). The walkway is pretty lame, there I agree. And full agreement with the comparison to Tangent models.
     It's kind of like the BLI releases of the NYC steel boxcars. Yeah, well short of great models, but we needed the cars. These BLI tank cars are very badly needed 6000-gallon insulated cars. Reminds me in a way of what we always used to say about Walthers (some still do): good news is that the model has been produced, bad news is that Walthers did it.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history





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