Date   

Re: Stock car interiors painting

Jared Harper
 

Bill,

I assure you that there are units of the prototype police in Hawaii.

Jared Harper


---In STMFC@..., <PARDIEW001@...> wrote :


 Where I live I do not expect the Prototype Police to knock on my door.  









 


Re: Stock car interiors

Tony Thompson
 

      I did not say, nor did I mean to imply, that stock cars were steam cleaned at small village stock pens. I do know that several  railroads steam-cleaned stock cars before releasing them for re-loading. Presumably that would be done at central facilities.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history






Re: x43b roof color

Tim O'Connor
 


No one knows for sure. Ed Hawkins posted:

https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/stmfc/conversations/messages/97098

Tim O'Connor


As delivered, did these PRR box cars have a red, or black roof?  The branchline kit contains a black running board and a roof that is black in the center and red around the edges.  I'd be grateful for help in getting the original roof (and running board) color correct.  Many thanks, Ed Shoben


Re: STOCK CAR LOAD/UNLOAD TIME?

Guy Wilber
 

"I will search my files to clarify that, but certainly once the car was loaded the stock were considered "confined." You did not delay "confined" livestock"

The Twenty-Eight Hour Law clearly states, "In estimating such confinement, the time consumed in loading and unloading shall not be considered..."

I never disputed anything about delaying livestock once it was confined within stock cars.


Guy Wilber
Reno, Nevada


x43b roof color

Ed Shoben
 

As delivered, did these PRR box cars have a red, or black roof?  The branchline kit contains a black running board and a roof that is black in the center and red around the edges.  I'd be grateful for help in getting the original roof (and running board) color correct.  Many thanks, Ed Shoben



Re: STOCK CAR LOAD/UNLOAD TIME?

Steve SANDIFER
 

I will search my files to clarify that, but certainly once the car was loaded the stock were considered "confined." You did not delay "confined" livestock. Likewise you unloaded immediately upon arrival unless you could explain that weather conditions or something else made unloading unsafe. There were some exceptions for certain cases with sheep and hogs. I have one record of a special caboose hop sent to a stock pen in Kansas to pick up a loaded group of cars left at a pen earlier in the day for unloading. The clock was ticking and rain had made it unwise to unload the cars. They were taken to the division point feeding station to "beat the clock" and to wait out the high water.

__________________________________________________

J. Stephen Sandifer

 

From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Wednesday, March 8, 2017 11:29 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: Re: [STMFC] STOCK CAR LOAD/UNLOAD TIME?

 

 

Steve Sandifer wrote:

> "Remember, the 28/36 hour law began when the first hoof hit the floor, so you did not load cars and let them sit around for an hour waiting on the train unless the trip was short enough that you had time to spare on the clock. Factor in setting brakes, air tests, applying shipping seals, signing paperwork."

Incorrect, loading and unloading time did not factor into the law.

Guy Wilber
Reno, Nevada


Re: Stock car interiors

Steve SANDIFER
 

Note the car ID above the door and on items which might come loose like the doors and drover door.

 

__________________________________________________

J. Stephen Sandifer

 

From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Wednesday, March 8, 2017 12:05 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Stock car interiors

 

 

Brad per the STMFC list rules I am not able to post the photos because I do not own the copyright nor do I have permission from the owner. Most of the images I have, I found on the internet. Here are a couple of links:

http://columbusrailroads.com/Ralston%20photos/ralston-129-1939-SOUTHERN.JPG

http://www.trainweb.org/oldtimetrains/photos/cpr_rolling/273365.jpg

 

Google is your friend, use it.

 

 

From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Wednesday, March 8, 2017 9:31 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Stock car interiors

 

 

Doug,

 

Would you be willing to add this image to the files section?    Sure would be swell to see.

 

Thanks,

Brad Andonian 


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPad

On Tuesday, March 7, 2017, 8:35 PM, 'Douglas Harding' doug.harding@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:

 

Jared the photos I have of stockcar interiors show unpainted wood. One shows whitewashed wood, but the grain is still visible. It wouldn’t really matter too much as the steam used to clean the interiors often caused the paint to fail and flake off. Witness the many stockcars that appeared heavily weathered, in reality the paint is still attached to the metal parts, it is the wood parts where paint is absence because of the steam cleaning.

 

The wood interior was also smooth or splinter free, ie rounded edges on the boards where an animal might rub and injure themselves.

 

Doug Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org

 


Re: STOCK CAR LOAD/UNLOAD TIME?

Guy Wilber
 

Steve Sandifer wrote:


"Remember, the 28/36 hour law began when the first hoof hit the floor, so you did not load cars and let them sit around for an hour waiting on the train unless the trip was short enough that you had time to spare on the clock. Factor in setting brakes, air tests, applying shipping seals, signing paperwork."
Incorrect, loading and unloading time did not factor into the law.

Guy Wilber
Reno, Nevada


Re: Stock car interiors painting

WILLIAM PARDIE
 


If the car is a resin kit it would be best to prepaint both the interior and exterior of the car prior to assembly.  At this time
beddng could also be added to the floor of the car.  If it is an Intermountain car the floor could be removed to paint the interior.

Is it worth it?  Someone mentioned the other day that we are in a "Golden Age" of model railroading.  Richard Hendrickson got us started on the path to accurate modeling.  Ted Culotta continued this with his Essential Freight Car series.  The RP CYC publications provide a wealth of information.  The internet and in particular list such as the one we are on gives us answers to virtually all of our questions instantaneously.  We have unlimited information.  What we do
with it is up to each individual.  Where I live I do not expect the Prototype Police to knock on my door.  This does not,
however, make me compromise in my modeling efforts.  All of my stock cars have the interior painted.  Floquil Earth was my favorite.  Some cars even have cows.  The average person who visits the setup does not see this.  Actually most of
us would not.  It is just what I have extablished as standard in my modeling.  YOu have to decide for yourself.

Bill Pardie









On  M ar 8, 2017, at 1:23 PM, harperandbrown@... [STMFC] wrote:

 

Okay, we have established that stock car interiors were not painted.  Someone said they paint their stock car interiors gray for weathered wood.  What paint color would you use for new wood?  Also, if you spray your stock car interiors some wood color, weathered or new, how do you keep it off the exterior board faces and edges?  Or, is it worth painting the interior.  Will anyone notice?


Jared Harper

Athens, GA




Re: STOCK CAR LOAD/UNLOAD TIME?

Steve SANDIFER
 

Well, it depends.

 

Most stock pens had only one chute. If you had three car loads, then you loaded one, pulled the cars up, loaded the second, pulled the car up, loaded the third. If the cars were already at the pen, and you knew exactly when the train was to arrive, you might load them using a tractor to move the cars. Otherwise you waited until the train arrived, sometimes with the empty cars as a part of the train. Remember, the 28/36 hour law began when the first hoof hit the floor, so you did not load cars and let them sit around for an hour waiting on the train unless the trip was short enough that you had time to spare on the clock. Factor in setting brakes, air tests, applying shipping seals, signing paperwork.

 

Cattle loaded the fastest, they knew what to do. Sheep were afraid to load, so you needed something like a trained goat to lead them into the car. Once the first lamb was inside, the others would follow quickly.

 

Single deck or double deck car? Two chutes or stacked chutes? Daylight or dark? Any thunder or storms around?

 

On my railroad, operators have to spot the car at the church and then wait 1 real minute before moving the car.

 

__________________________________________________

J. Stephen Sandifer

 

From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Wednesday, March 8, 2017 3:22 PM
To: stmfc@...
Subject: [STMFC] STOCK CAR LOAD/UNLOAD TIME?

 

 

Hello Group,

With this discussion about stock car interiors I begun to think about filling those interiors.

My question is… Considering the load to be cattle, how long, on average, would it take to load a typical stock car. Also, the follow-on question of how long would it take to unload a typical stock car.

Next question(s)… would sheep or hogs take longer or less time to load or unload?

Thank & Cheers,
Bill Keene
Irvine, CA


Re: Stock car interiors

Steve SANDIFER
 

I am currently researching to write a book on Livestock Operations on the Santa Fe for the Santa Fe Railway Historical and Modeling Society. In all of my research, the only documentation I have found to steam cleaning a Santa Fe car is at the Swift plant in Fort Worth. The Santa Fe had clean out sites at Bellville, Texas and Lometa, Texas where the cars were simply swept clean.

Gordon Locke who used to operate on the Brady Branch told me, "Every train out of Brownwood had empty stock cars that were set  out at Lometa that were dirty. They were cleaned with manual labor. They shoveled them out. They didn’t do anything but shovel them out at Lometa, and then they had a front end loader that brought sand from the Colorado River, they had piles of sand, they’d go to each door and dump a pile of sand in there and the laborers would spread it in the car." 

 

I have photos of stock cars parked beside piles of sand with workers shoveling the sand up into the cars in the days before front end loaders.

 

Santa Fe Bulletin No. 12, Jan. 1, 1953 states: Section Foreman must see that stock cars are bedded with sufficient amount of proper material.  The proper thickness is approximately three inches, evenly distributed.  Sand shall be used for bedding.  New bedding must not  be placed over old without the approval of the shipper.  Where possible consult the Agent regarding this feature.  All furnished for hog loading must be cleaned before bedding; also , cars which have been used for hog  loading and have any noticeable hog litter in them must be cleaned before  other stock is loaded in them.  Excessive or wet and muddy bedding must be removed.

 

However, earlier in history the Texas tick was a major concern, and Texas cattle were not allowed in interstate shipment without clearance from the Livestock Sanitary Commission. Even the suspicion that bedding sand was infected with ticks would cause a car to be unacceptable and sent to a clean out facility. I suspect (no proof) that cleaning in the 30s would have been a bit more fastidious.

 

As to the inside of the car, the Santa Fe SK-3 preserved at Pawhuska, OK, the SK-S in Lubbock, and the SK-Q at Matthew's switch have no paint on the interior. The SK-R in Lubbock has some remnants of mineral brown paint on the inside, whether original or overspray from the outside I cannot tell.  The inside of the SK-T as restored at the IRM has paint on the inside of the side slats but no paint on the ends, floor, or ceiling. Since the car sat outside for a number of years, I wonder if that painted inside was to preserve it in static display? I have seen but do not have interior details for the SK-2 at Orange Empire, so the folks who restored it would have to tell us if they found paint on the insides of the boards. I would assume that the inside of a stock car like the inside of a box car was not painted. The ceiling and floors were not painted. Sometimes interior metal work was painted as a rust preventative.

 

BTW, if any of you knows where I can beg, borrow, or scan a Santa Fe Circular 2240 on LIvestock handling please let me know.

__________________________________________________

J. Stephen Sandifer

 

From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Wednesday, March 8, 2017 7:48 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Stock car interiors

 

 

Don Valentine responded to Tony Thompson’s remarks on this thread, and I’ll endorse not only what Don said about the availability of steam to clean cars, but also add that just because the interior of the car was steam cleaned doesn’t mean that the runoff from that process was completely washed off the entire car. I’m sure that some cars that had been cleaned on the interior would have residue appearing on the exterior of the car after the steam had condensed and run down on the exterior. Much more likely to happen in cooler climes than in the California Bay Area, perhaps, but still . . .

Schuyler

---In STMFC@..., <tony@...> wrote :

Eric Hansmann wrote:

Thanks for the info, Doug. I think I will have some lime remnant weathering on my stock car model.

Nice touch on a loaded car, but an empty one was ordinarily steam-cleaned before re-use and would certainly no longer show the lime.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA

2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com

(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@...

Publishers of books on railroad history

I would think that this would depend on how quickly and where the car was steam cleaned. Stock

pens were found all over the place, particularly in Northern New England where there seems to have

been one every 25 to 30 miles so farmers did not have to drive livestock too far. But I have seen few

of the pens that were left into the early 1970's that had anything close to steam cleaning equipment.

No notations have been found in reference to pens having steam cleaning equipment on site either.

Thus it would seem that empty cars would have to be moved at least to a yard with a car repair track

where one could probably find a steam generator as well. Perhaps things were different on the western roads but this is what I have found over the years on the B&M, the CV, the Rutland and the MEC.

Cordially, Don Valentine


Re: RF&P USRA Boxcar

Justin May
 

Thank you all who have responded thus far. I've also located some additional photos of these cars via Fallenflags.org -


I have an underlying project for this car, which once I get some additional Evergreen styrene in hand, I'll share via my blog, but for now, thank you again for all who have responded.

Justin May


On Wed, Mar 8, 2017 at 5:47 PM, Garth Groff sarahsan@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:


Justin, Eric and Friends,

Actually, there were two groups of RF&P USRA boxcars. RF&P 2451-2800 originally assigned to the RF&P by the USRA. Subsidiary Washington Southern was assigned 981-1130, later merged into the RF&P. This gave the RF&P a total of 500 cars. In January 1958, there were still 9 cars left in the 2451 group, and 8 in the 981 group. There was also a stock car, 2409, which had the same dimensions as the USRA boxcars. These were some of the longest serving USRA single-sheathed cars in revenue service in more-or-less original condition. I have a photo in my collection of RF&F 1131 with a 1965 reweigh date. Quite a few USRA boxcars also were in RF&P's MOW fleet.

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff

On 3/8/17 5:11 PM, 'Eric Hansmann' eric@... [STMFC] wrote:
 

Justin,

 

That is a USRA single-sheathed box car. RF&P were assigned 350 in the 2451-2800 series. It looks like RF&P 2538 in the image has been upgraded with an AB brake system and a second grab on the left side of the car.

 

The USRA freight car assignments can be found here.

http://designbuildop.hansmanns.org/usra-freight-car-assignments/

 

 

 

Eric Hansmann

El Paso, TX

 

 

 


From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Wednesday, March 08, 2017 2:34 PM
To: STMFC
Subject: [STMFC] RF&P USRA Boxcar

 




Can anyone provide me with the details on this series of RF&P boxcars? 

 

 

The cars appear to be USRA boxcars and similar to that of the Tichy USRA boxcar kit, 4026, but I wanted to confirm if there were any known differences besides the application of a wooden door? 

 

In RPC #8, a small caption gives some very pertinent details of a series converted to express service, but I was curious to know their original roster information and number series.

 

Thank you,

Justin May







RF&P Green Boxcar

George Courtney
 

It's been a while since I've watched the tape, but someone asked about the color, the Atlas model of this car is close but people from the Historical Society might have a better call on it.  And thanks for the info about Rumsford Press.  In my basement Reader Digest shall arrive in RF&P cars until the MR police arrive with better info.  Though that is a good excuse for a Southern boy to have a B&M Baggage car, hmmm.


George Courtney


Re: Empty tank car

Allan Smith
 

Instead of taking the car apart why not drill a hole thru the bottom and add bb's. add as many as you want to get the weight. Then plug the hole with plastic rod. You can get BB's at Walmart in the sporting goods section.

Al Smith
Sonora Ca


On Wednesday, March 8, 2017 7:05 PM, "Jon Miller atsfus@... [STMFC]" wrote:


 
On 3/8/2017 4:25 PM, Denny Anspach danspachmd@... [STMFC] wrote:
I have in hand a very nice Life-Like new old-stock tank car minus any weighting ex factory. Is there non-destructive way of opening this featherweight to add some heft?

Denny

    Depends on the glue.  I use MEK on mine so not a chance but if ACC was used maybe.  Should get some comments on ACC, I seem to remember freezing??
--
Jon Miller
For me time stopped in 1941
Digitrax  Chief/Zephyr systems,
SPROG, JMRI User
NMRA Life member #2623
Member SFRH&MS



Re: RF&P USRA Boxcar

Douglas Harding
 

According to Gene Green the M&StL 28000 series of box cars were 102 used boxcars purchased in 1939. 28000 to 28202; 40'-6";          80,000;  ex-RF&P 2251-2450 40'-6" SS box cars . they only lasted till 1944.

 

 

From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Wednesday, March 8, 2017 7:57 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: Re: [STMFC] RF&P USRA Boxcar

 

 

Hi Garth, Justin, and group,

If I might offer a small correction, RFP stock car 2409 was built from a different car series than the USRA cars. It came from the RFP 2251-2450 series delivered by Pressed Steel Car Co. in 1918. Those cars were shorter and wider than the USRA cars, had a different side stake configuration, and also a wider door opening. The majority of this series was off the RF&P’s roster in the late 1930s (at least 1 went to M&StL in the 28000 series, perhaps all?), but 10 were held back by the RF&P and converted to stock cars. What’s odd is that in the ORER the stock cars show up with the same dimensions as the USRA cars, but in the RF&P's documents 2409 (which survived into the 1960s) is clearly marked as PSC 1918 and the dimensional diagram matches the PSC cars. This is not the first weirdness I’ve uncovered in the RF&P’s ORER listings.

To the USRA cars, the doors are listed in RF&P documentation dated 1953 as “Camel, wood,” brakes as “Ajax geared - Westinghouse AB,” and the roof as “Murphy galvanized.” As of Jan. 1, 1955 the following cars numbers are listed as being in service: 1092, 1104, 2489, 2569, 2575, 2581, 2587, 2598, 2609, 2621, 2625, 2630, 2640, 2661, 2694, 2714, 2727, 2731, 2746, 2769, 2774, 2781, and 2782. That’s what’s in the documentation, but photographic evidence reveals this to be not 100% accurate as I have pictures of 1019, 1020, and 2775 all with reweigh dates from the 1960s. But at least that list may serve as a starting point for picking 1950s era numbers.

All the best,

James McDonald
Greenbelt, MD

>
> Messages in this topic (9)
> __________________________________________________________
> 3e. Re: RF&P USRA Boxcar
> Posted by: "Garth Groff" sarahsan@... ggg9y
> Date: Wed Mar 8, 2017 2:47 pm ((PST))
>
> Justin, Eric and Friends,
>
> Actually, there were two groups of RF&P USRA boxcars. RF&P 2451-2800
> originally assigned to the RF&P by the USRA. Subsidiary Washington
> Southern was assigned 981-1130, later merged into the RF&P. This gave
> the RF&P a total of 500 cars. In January 1958, there were still 9 cars
> left in the 2451 group, and 8 in the 981 group. There was also a stock
> car, 2409, which had the same dimensions as the USRA boxcars. These were
> some of the longest serving USRA single-sheathed cars in revenue service
> in more-or-less original condition. I have a photo in my collection of
> RF&F 1131 with a 1965 reweigh date. Quite a few USRA boxcars also were
> in RF&P's MOW fleet.
>
> Yours Aye,
>
>
> Garth Groff


Re: Empty tank car

Todd Sullivan
 

Hi Denny,

For some older tank cars, I have drilled a small hole in the bottom in a place that is not too noticeable, poured in enough lead bird shot to weight the car (or sand or anything else that is granular), added some glue (CA or whatever) and set it upright to let the glue dry with the 'ballast' in the center of the car.  Might need to cork up the hole.  The technique is a bit crude, but it works.

Todd Sullivan


Re: Empty tank car

Jon Miller <atsfus@...>
 

On 3/8/2017 4:25 PM, Denny Anspach danspachmd@... [STMFC] wrote:
I have in hand a very nice Life-Like new old-stock tank car minus any weighting ex factory. Is there non-destructive way of opening this featherweight to add some heft?

Denny

    Depends on the glue.  I use MEK on mine so not a chance but if ACC was used maybe.  Should get some comments on ACC, I seem to remember freezing??

-- 
Jon Miller
For me time stopped in 1941
Digitrax  Chief/Zephyr systems, 
SPROG, JMRI User
NMRA Life member #2623
Member SFRH&MS


Re: Decal replacement/recall

Schuyler Larrabee
 

A manufacturer/dealer who stands by his product line, and makes good on an error. Amazing! And really appreciated, Ted, even if I am not among those affected!



Schuyler



I had a bunch of sets that were released within the last nine months or so printed by a company that has become a large player in the decal industry within the last year. Unfortunately, I have had a number of complaints about these decals not conforming to many surfaces, even in two cases with application of undiluted darkroom stop bath (acetic acid, which is essentially undiluted decal softening agent). I have scrapped these decals and have had them reprinted with my new supplier (the one I raved about so profusely a few weeks back).



I am doing a sort of recall. PLEASE READ BEFORE CONTACTING ME ABOUT THIS. IF you ordered from me via the web site, you need not do anything. I will send free replacements. It may take several weeks for me to work through this. IF you purchased the decals from me at a meet or show, then I need you to let me know (by forwarding this email TO ME, NOT THE ENTIRE LIST). The following is a list of the affected decals:



* <http://speedwitchmedia.com/product/d161-pacific-fruit-express-r-30-9-with-1948-black-white-sp-medallionup-shield/> D161 – Pacific Fruit Express R-30-9 with ‘1948’ black & white SP medallion/UP shield
* <http://speedwitchmedia.com/product/d162-international-great-northern-mp-50-ton-aar-war-emergency-flat-car/> D162 – International-Great Northern (MP) 50-ton AAR War Emergency flat car (includes pulpwood version)
* <http://speedwitchmedia.com/product/d163-union-pacific-f-50-11-aar-50-ton-flat-cars/> D163 – Union Pacific F-50-11 AAR 50-ton flat cars
* <http://speedwitchmedia.com/product/d164-texas-new-orleans-g-50-19-21-24-war-emergency-design-composite-gondolas/> D164 – Texas & New Orleans G-50-19/-21/-24 War Emergency-design composite gondolas
* <http://speedwitchmedia.com/product/d166-western-pacific-pfe-reconditionedrebuilt-refrigerator-car/> D166 – Western Pacific PFE Reconditioned/Rebuilt refrigerator car
* <http://speedwitchmedia.com/product/d168-pacific-fruit-express-r-40-23-refrigerator-car-as-built-1946-scheme/> D168 – Pacific Fruit Express R-40-23 refrigerator car as-built (‘1946’ scheme)
* <http://speedwitchmedia.com/product/d169-pacific-fruit-express-r-3040-18-rebuilt-refrigerator-car-1946-scheme/> D169 – Pacific Fruit Express R-30/40-18 Rebuilt refrigerator car (‘1946’ scheme)
* <http://speedwitchmedia.com/product/d170-pacific-fruit-express-r-3040-21-rebuilt-refrigerator-car-1942-scheme/> D170 – Pacific Fruit Express R-30/40-21 Rebuilt refrigerator car (‘1942’ scheme)
* <http://speedwitchmedia.com/product/d171-chesapeake-ohio-9500-series-automobile-cars/> D171 – Chesapeake & Ohio 9500-series Automobile Cars
* <http://speedwitchmedia.com/product/d172-missouri-pacific-murphy-roof-covered-hoppers/> D172 – Missouri Pacific Murphy roof Covered Hoppers
* <http://speedwitchmedia.com/product/d172k-missouri-pacific-murphy-roof-covered-hoppers-with-im-undec-kit/> D172K – Missouri Pacific Murphy roof Covered Hoppers with undec IM kit
* <http://speedwitchmedia.com/product/d173-santa-fe-aar-70-ton-656-gondolas-ga-47-48-55-70/> D173 – Santa Fe AAR 70-ton 65’6″ Gondolas (Ga-47/-48/-55/-70)

Where feasible, I will combine with a mailing for other goods that you have ordered.



I apologize for the quality issues. I thought this printing technology would solve a problem, but it only created one. (However, I do have a use for such printing and will share it very soon).



Thanks for your patience.



Cheers,

Ted




Ted Culotta

Speedwitch Media

speedwitchmedia@gmail.com - www.speedwitchmedia.com

Blog: http://prototopics.blogspot.com





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: RF&P USRA Boxcar

James McDonald
 

Hi Garth, Justin, and group,

If I might offer a small correction, RFP stock car 2409 was built from a different car series than the USRA cars. It came from the RFP 2251-2450 series delivered by Pressed Steel Car Co. in 1918. Those cars were shorter and wider than the USRA cars, had a different side stake configuration, and also a wider door opening. The majority of this series was off the RF&P’s roster in the late 1930s (at least 1 went to M&StL in the 28000 series, perhaps all?), but 10 were held back by the RF&P and converted to stock cars. What’s odd is that in the ORER the stock cars show up with the same dimensions as the USRA cars, but in the RF&P's documents 2409 (which survived into the 1960s) is clearly marked as PSC 1918 and the dimensional diagram matches the PSC cars. This is not the first weirdness I’ve uncovered in the RF&P’s ORER listings.

To the USRA cars, the doors are listed in RF&P documentation dated 1953 as “Camel, wood,” brakes as “Ajax geared - Westinghouse AB,” and the roof as “Murphy galvanized.” As of Jan. 1, 1955 the following cars numbers are listed as being in service: 1092, 1104, 2489, 2569, 2575, 2581, 2587, 2598, 2609, 2621, 2625, 2630, 2640, 2661, 2694, 2714, 2727, 2731, 2746, 2769, 2774, 2781, and 2782. That’s what’s in the documentation, but photographic evidence reveals this to be not 100% accurate as I have pictures of 1019, 1020, and 2775 all with reweigh dates from the 1960s. But at least that list may serve as a starting point for picking 1950s era numbers.

All the best,

James McDonald
Greenbelt, MD


Messages in this topic (9)
________________________________________________________________________
3e. Re: RF&P USRA Boxcar
Posted by: "Garth Groff" sarahsan@embarqmail.com ggg9y
Date: Wed Mar 8, 2017 2:47 pm ((PST))

Justin, Eric and Friends,

Actually, there were two groups of RF&P USRA boxcars. RF&P 2451-2800
originally assigned to the RF&P by the USRA. Subsidiary Washington
Southern was assigned 981-1130, later merged into the RF&P. This gave
the RF&P a total of 500 cars. In January 1958, there were still 9 cars
left in the 2451 group, and 8 in the 981 group. There was also a stock
car, 2409, which had the same dimensions as the USRA boxcars. These were
some of the longest serving USRA single-sheathed cars in revenue service
in more-or-less original condition. I have a photo in my collection of
RF&F 1131 with a 1965 reweigh date. Quite a few USRA boxcars also were
in RF&P's MOW fleet.

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff


Re: Stock car interiors

Schuyler Larrabee
 

Don Valentine responded to Tony Thompson’s remarks on this thread, and I’ll endorse not only what Don said about the availability of steam to clean cars, but also add that just because the interior of the car was steam cleaned doesn’t mean that the runoff from that process was completely washed off the entire car. I’m sure that some cars that had been cleaned on the interior would have residue appearing on the exterior of the car after the steam had condensed and run down on the exterior. Much more likely to happen in cooler climes than in the California Bay Area, perhaps, but still . . .

Schuyler



---In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, <tony@...> wrote :

Eric Hansmann wrote:





Thanks for the info, Doug. I think I will have some lime remnant weathering on my stock car model.





Nice touch on a loaded car, but an empty one was ordinarily steam-cleaned before re-use and would certainly no longer show the lime.



Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA

2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com

(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@...

Publishers of books on railroad history





I would think that this would depend on how quickly and where the car was steam cleaned. Stock

pens were found all over the place, particularly in Northern New England where there seems to have

been one every 25 to 30 miles so farmers did not have to drive livestock too far. But I have seen few

of the pens that were left into the early 1970's that had anything close to steam cleaning equipment.

No notations have been found in reference to pens having steam cleaning equipment on site either.

Thus it would seem that empty cars would have to be moved at least to a yard with a car repair track

where one could probably find a steam generator as well. Perhaps things were different on the western roads but this is what I have found over the years on the B&M, the CV, the Rutland and the MEC.



Cordially, Don Valentine

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