Date   

Re: USRA rebuild with a Hutchins end?

Brent Greer
 

Did these cars have the flat panel roofs or the diagonal panel roofs?

Brent

________________________________
Dr. J. Brent Greer

From: STMFC@... on behalf of Tim O'Connor timboconnor@... [STMFC]
Sent: Sunday, October 22, 2017 5:12:34 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: RE: [STMFC] USRA rebuild with a Hutchins end?
 
 


1963 TP&W series 1301-1312 (12 cars) expanded to 1301-1349 by 1965 (16 cars).

The TP&W series did not exist in 1959.

NKP series 27000-27914 still had 879 cars in 1959. By 1965 the NKP had been
folded into the N&W and the entire series was gone.


  > So ... Eric, what year the TP&W got these cars from the NKP?
  > Schuyler


 The best sift out of my data is the TP&W cars with 5 reverse, square-end, Hutchins panels are apparently out of the NKP 27000 series. This is based on the ends that are unique as far as I know. The NKP cars were rebuilt at Frankfort, IN, out of NKP 19000-19999 (Illinois Car & Manufacturing, 1923, XA, 10-0 door, IH 10-0) and some derivatives of that series by increasing the IH to 10-6 with steel sheathing and door at 7-0. The unique end arrangement resulted from rebuilding the original five panel end, the upper-most a flat blank the lower four reverse Hutchins, to a five panel end in which all were reverse Hutchins.
 Eric Lombard


Re: USRA rebuild with a Hutchins end?

Tim O'Connor
 


1963 TP&W series 1301-1312 (12 cars) expanded to 1301-1349 by 1965 (16 cars).

The TP&W series did not exist in 1959.

NKP series 27000-27914 still had 879 cars in 1959. By 1965 the NKP had been
folded into the N&W and the entire series was gone.


  > So ... Eric, what year the TP&W got these cars from the NKP?
  > Schuyler


 The best sift out of my data is the TP&W cars with 5 reverse, square-end, Hutchins panels are apparently out of the NKP 27000 series. This is based on the ends that are unique as far as I know. The NKP cars were rebuilt at Frankfort, IN, out of NKP 19000-19999 (Illinois Car & Manufacturing, 1923, XA, 10-0 door, IH 10-0) and some derivatives of that series by increasing the IH to 10-6 with steel sheathing and door at 7-0. The unique end arrangement resulted from rebuilding the original five panel end, the upper-most a flat blank the lower four reverse Hutchins, to a five panel end in which all were reverse Hutchins.
 Eric Lombard


Re: USRA rebuild with a Hutchins end?

Schuyler Larrabee
 

So now that Gary Roe’s identified the Ford as a ’59, do you know, Eric, what year the TP&W got these cars from the NKP?



Schuyler



From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Saturday, October 21, 2017 2:50 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: Re: [STMFC] USRA rebuild with a Hutchins end?





Tim and Bill,



The best sift out of my data is the TP&W cars with 5 reverse, square-end, Hutchins panels are apparently out of the NKP 27000 series. This is based on the ends that are unique as far as I know. The NKP cars were rebuilt at Frankfort, IN, out of NKP 19000-19999 (Illinois Car & Manufacturing, 1923, XA, 10-0 door, IH 10-0) and some derivatives of that series by increasing the IH to 10-6 with steel sheathing and door at 7-0. The unique end arrangement resulted from rebuilding the original five panel end, the upper-most a flat blank the lower four reverse Hutchins, to a five panel end in which all were reverse Hutchins.




Eric Lombard

Homewood, IL

elombard@... <mailto:elombard@...>



On Sat, Oct 21, 2017 at 3:42 AM, Tim O'Connor timboconnor@... <mailto:timboconnor@...> [STMFC] <STMFC@... <mailto:STMFC@...> > wrote:




Does anyone know who may have applied Hutchins ends to their USRA
rebuilds? I'm guessing this TP&W car is second-hand...

https://www.flickr.com/photos/11690865@N06/35324886915/

Tim O'Connor







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: USRA rebuild with a Hutchins end?

Schuyler Larrabee
 

Thanks Gary.



Schuyler



From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Sunday, October 22, 2017 3:31 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: Re: [STMFC] USRA rebuild with a Hutchins end?





It is a 1959.



gary roe

quincy, illinois





_____

From: "'Schuyler Larrabee' schuyler.larrabee@... [STMFC]" <STMFC@...>
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Sunday, October 22, 2017 2:12 PM
Subject: RE: [STMFC] USRA rebuild with a Hutchins end?





What year is that Ford?

Schuyler

From: STMFC@...
[mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Saturday, October 21, 2017 4:43 AM
To: stmfc@...
Subject: [STMFC] USRA rebuild with a Hutchins end?

Does anyone know who may have applied Hutchins
ends to their USRA
rebuilds? I'm guessing this TP&W car is
second-hand...

https://www.flickr.com/photos/11690865@N06/3532488
6915/

Tim O'Connor









[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: USRA rebuild with a Hutchins end?

Gary Roe
 

It is a 1959.

gary roe
quincy, illinois




From: "'Schuyler Larrabee' schuyler.larrabee@... [STMFC]"
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Sunday, October 22, 2017 2:12 PM
Subject: RE: [STMFC] USRA rebuild with a Hutchins end?

 
What year is that Ford?

Schuyler

From: STMFC@...
[mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Saturday, October 21, 2017 4:43 AM
To: stmfc@...
Subject: [STMFC] USRA rebuild with a Hutchins end?

Does anyone know who may have applied Hutchins
ends to their USRA
rebuilds? I'm guessing this TP&W car is
second-hand...

https://www.flickr.com/photos/11690865@N06/3532488
6915/

Tim O'Connor

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




Re: USRA rebuild with a Hutchins end?

Schuyler Larrabee
 

What year is that Ford?



Schuyler



From: STMFC@...
[mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Saturday, October 21, 2017 4:43 AM
To: stmfc@...
Subject: [STMFC] USRA rebuild with a Hutchins end?






Does anyone know who may have applied Hutchins
ends to their USRA
rebuilds? I'm guessing this TP&W car is
second-hand...

https://www.flickr.com/photos/11690865@N06/3532488
6915/

Tim O'Connor


Re: Freigh Car Repair Scene (Poling)

destorzek@...
 




---In STMFC@..., <thecitrusbelt@...> wrote :

A TRAINS March 1993 article also quotes an ICC official who states, "If the push pole was officially outlawed I have no record of that fact…"

++++


I have looked for this before, to no avail, but I definitely remember reading a rule that stated to the effect that , "Poling will be done only with the pole provided." The purpose being to prevent the use of old ties or common lumber that could split or shatter. The "pole provided" was universally straight grained hardwood, with a steel band fitted around each end to prevent splitting. Once that rule was in a road's safety rules, when the order went out to take all the poles off the locomotives, the practice was defacto against the rules, even if not specifically outlawed. It would appear that this occurred at different times on different roads, and the exact dates are not well documented.


Dennis Storzek


Re: Freigh Car Repair Scene (Poling)

thecitrusbelt@...
 

I have come across some various takes on this (below).


Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA

++++


A person in the industry commented, "Individual railroads would have forbidden the practice without regard to what other railroads were or were not doing. From my reading of various first person accounts of railroading it appears that the practice of poling continued on a few roads even after it was forbidden by management. Of course, the same could be said for any number of other railroader habits or practices".

++++

 

A TRAINS March 1993 article also quotes an ICC official who states, "If the push pole was officially outlawed I have no record of that fact…"

++++

Generally speaking, freight cars were still being manufactured with poling pockets well into at least the 1950s and locomotives into the early 1960s. GP-30 locomotives can be seen with poling pockets. In the case of the switchers one can speculate that it was not as easy to redo the pilot area castings to omit the poling pocket.


Again, individual railroads may have banned poling and perhaps certain states. But I have never seen documented proof that the Federal Government did so as some have claimed.





Re: Freigh Car Repair Scene

Guy Wilber
 

Steve wrote:

“Notice that the jack is right under a poling pocket - another dangerous thing outlawed eventually.”

Steve,

Are you stating that jacking the car under the poling pocket was outlawed or poling was outlawed? If the latter; when, and by what entity?

Thank You,

Guy Wilber
Reno, Nevada


Re: Freigh Car Repair Scene

Steve Caple <stevecaple@...>
 

Notice that the jack is right under a poling pocket  -  another dangerous thing outlawed eventually.   And really, really hard to model!


Re: Freigh Car Repair Scene

Jack Mullen
 

Actually, no. It's another of the many photos taken by Jack Delano while on assignment for the OWI documenting the homefront during WW2. It may bot be totally candid, but it's pretty likely that the way it was photographed its the way it was being done.

Jack Mullen


Re: Freigh Car Repair Scene

Charles Peck
 

Posed or not, Duff makes good jacks. I used two to lift one end of a 
car just Friday.  Chuck Peck

On Sat, Oct 21, 2017 at 9:37 PM, Bill Daniels billinsf@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:
 

This was a posed photo taken for the manufacturer of the jack.
 
Bill Daniels San Francisco, CA


On Saturday, October 21, 2017 11:34 AM, "Charles Peck lnnrr152@... [STMFC]" <STMFC@...> wrote:


 
By todays standards, he should have lowered the car onto blocking rather than
leaving it rest on the jacks alone.  Also there should have been a block of wood on TOP
of the jack to reduce the risk of slippage. 
What he did RIGHT was remove the handle from the jack.
Chuck Peck

On Sat, Oct 21, 2017 at 1:08 PM, rwitt_2000@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:





Re: Freigh Car Repair Scene

Bill Daniels <billinsf@...>
 

This was a posed photo taken for the manufacturer of the jack.
 
Bill Daniels San Francisco, CA


On Saturday, October 21, 2017 11:34 AM, "Charles Peck lnnrr152@... [STMFC]" wrote:


 
By todays standards, he should have lowered the car onto blocking rather than
leaving it rest on the jacks alone.  Also there should have been a block of wood on TOP
of the jack to reduce the risk of slippage. 
What he did RIGHT was remove the handle from the jack.
Chuck Peck

On Sat, Oct 21, 2017 at 1:08 PM, rwitt_2000@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:




Milk Tanks of Flat cars

Brad Andonian
 

I am seeking a copy of the RMC from May 1988 that details bell tanks on flat cars.    If someone has the issue to share or answer questions, please ping me off list.

Thanks,
Brad Andonian
Seattle


Re: Reprints of out of stock Focus on Freight Cars Volumes 5, 6, 7, and 9

Robert J Miller CFA
 

Ted.

Will you be bringing some to RPM Chicago next week?

Robert J. Miller CFA
Saginaw, MI

Tell the truth, work hard, and come to dinner on time.
Gerald R. Ford


On ‎Sunday‎, ‎October‎ ‎15‎, ‎2017‎ ‎05‎:‎45‎:‎50‎ ‎PM‎ ‎EDT, Ted Culotta speedwitchmedia@... [STMFC] wrote:


 

I am reprinting four volumes of Focus on Freight Cars that have been out of stock. I also have several new decal sets for Steam Era freight cars (with more coming). More details at the Speedwitch site.Thank you.

Cheers,
Ted


Re: Rio Grande question - Where is "FA?"

destorzek@...
 




---In STMFC@..., <schuyler.larrabee@...> wrote :


BTW, the link doesn’t seem to work. Is there a “tiny url” equivalent?
======================

Sorry Schuyler it's been a while since I used tiny url, not sure I remember how. Just go to:


Click on FILES, and scroll down past all the folders to "Station & Reweigh Symbols." It's an Excel file. It's not an official listing, but rather compiled by Richard Hendrickson and others from photo references, but I think it's pretty complete.

I wonder if the ARA/AAR ever published an official list? It appears the symbols were picked to avoid duplication; the other two FA's I found were in a foreign country, on the CP and CN.

Dennis Storzek


Re: Freigh Car Repair Scene

destorzek@...
 


I see something all crushed up between the jack and car frame... it may be leather all folded over, which works as well as wood.

Dennis Storzek

---In STMFC@..., <lnnrr152@...> wrote :

By todays standards, he should have lowered the car onto blocking rather than
leaving it rest on the jacks alone.  Also there should have been a block of wood on TOP
of the jack to reduce the risk of slippage. 
What he did RIGHT was remove the handle from the jack.
Chuck Peck

On Sat, Oct 21, 2017 at 1:08 PM, rwitt_2000@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:


Re: USRA rebuild with a Hutchins end?

Eric Lombard
 

Tim and Bill,

The best sift out of my data is the TP&W cars with 5 reverse, square-end, Hutchins panels are apparently out of the NKP 27000 series. This is based on the ends that are unique as far as I know. The NKP cars were rebuilt at Frankfort, IN, out of NKP 19000-19999 (Illinois Car & Manufacturing, 1923, XA, 10-0 door, IH 10-0) and some derivatives of that series by increasing the IH to 10-6 with steel sheathing and door at 7-0. The unique end arrangement resulted from rebuilding the original five panel end, the upper-most a flat blank the lower four reverse Hutchins, to a five panel end in which all were reverse Hutchins.

Eric Lombard
Homewood, IL

On Sat, Oct 21, 2017 at 3:42 AM, Tim O'Connor timboconnor@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:
 


Does anyone know who may have applied Hutchins ends to their USRA
rebuilds? I'm guessing this TP&W car is second-hand...

https://www.flickr.com/photos/11690865@N06/35324886915/

Tim O'Connor



Re: Freigh Car Repair Scene

Charles Peck
 

By todays standards, he should have lowered the car onto blocking rather than
leaving it rest on the jacks alone.  Also there should have been a block of wood on TOP
of the jack to reduce the risk of slippage. 
What he did RIGHT was remove the handle from the jack.
Chuck Peck

On Sat, Oct 21, 2017 at 1:08 PM, rwitt_2000@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:


Re: Tank car with biggest capacity during 1930?

Tim O'Connor
 

the infamous J&L Steel tank cars of course - 20,000 gallons

I would like to know what is the tank car with the most gallons in capacity as of the year 1930. The candidate I've been thinking is the 1930-built Santa Fe Tk-L with 16,000 gallons or a little more. Thank you.

Tyler

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