Date   

Re: More reefers

Jack Mullen
 

Paul said:
 "... that produce reefers hauled a lot (by "a lot" I mean nearly 50% of their loads) of canned goods."

That statement may be valid in the later steam era  for the Midwest where canned veggies were (and are) a big business, but as has already  been said by SMEs, PFE and SFRD were dominated by fresh produce.

Regional differences are as important as era in understanding reefer traffic, and national aggregates and ratios probably won't describe any individual carrier's traffic well.

Jack Mullen
 


Re: Scalecoat II Color suggestions for 1949 ATSF BX-12 raised roof.

Pierre Oliver
 

Scalecoat now offers a ATSF Mineral Brown which is nigh on perfect, and a copy of the old Floquil color
S2144

Pierre Oliver
www.elgincarshops.com
www.yarmouthmodelworks.com
On 2018-01-22 12:31 PM, repairman87@... [STMFC] wrote:

 

Hello,

Looking for suggestions for paint colors from scalecoat to paint a 1949 BX-12 raised roof. I am putting in an order for the next few resin cars I have waiting to be built.

Thank you
Scott McDonald



Scalecoat II Color suggestions for 1949 ATSF BX-12 raised roof.

Scott
 

Hello,

Looking for suggestions for paint colors from scalecoat to paint a 1949 BX-12 raised roof. I am putting in an order for the next few resin cars I have waiting to be built.

Thank you
Scott McDonald


Re: More reefers (Canned Goods)

thecitrusbelt@...
 

That may have been true (50% canned goods loads) after ice bunker reefers were no longer required to be iced in route (circa 1973) but pretty much all the SFRD data I have seen is similar to what Tony mentioned.


Dates need to be associated with statistical statements.


Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA


Re: More reefers

Tony Thompson
 

Paul Catapano wrote:

 

Really? You are most likely right,  but I seem to recall somewhere, of course I can't remember where, that produce reefers hauled a lot (by "a lot" I mean nearly 50% of their loads) of canned goods.

    "Really?" They are PFE statistics, you can look them up in the PFE book for yourself.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history






More reefers

Paul Catapano
 

Tony, 
You wrote:
Um, no. Non-produce was about 15 percent of PFE's total traffic

Really? You are most likely right,  but I seem to recall somewhere, of course I can't remember where, that produce reefers hauled a lot (by "a lot" I mean nearly 50% of their loads) of canned goods.
My numbers may come from SFRD but I cannot swear to it.
 
Paul Catapano



SFRD Circular

Paul Catapano
 

The file is posted to our files section.
It is 125 pages long, but the commodities are listed starting on page 12.
It also lists those items PROHIBITED from  being transported in SFRD reefers.
It is listed in the files section under the following name:
 
Paul Catapano



6650 - GTW 58300 Series Autocar - appropriate trucks?

Robert kirkham
 

I am slowly moving this kit to conclusion but have not yet found a proto photo, so am taking my chances on some elements.  One thing I’d like to get right is the trucks I put under it.  I seem to be missing information in the instructions, but the Mainline Modeller drawing appears to show Andrews trucks. 
 
Does anyone have more specific info on what trucks are appropriate for these cars?
 
Rob Kirkham  
 


New file uploaded to STMFC

STMFC@...
 

Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the STMFC
group.

File : /SFRD Circular 2-L April 1955.pdf
Uploaded by : atlanticinlandrailway <pc66ot@sbcglobal.net>
Description : SFRD Circular 4/1955

You can access this file at the URL:
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/STMFC/files/SFRD%20Circular%202-L%20April%201955.pdf

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
https://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?page=content&y=PROD_GRPS&locale=en_US&id=SLN15398

Regards,

atlanticinlandrailway <pc66ot@sbcglobal.net>


2018 Savannah RPM

seaboard_1966
 

Well guys, its that time of the year again.  Time for me to start spreading the word about the Savannah RPM.


We have a new date and a new location for this years meet.  After years of being at the Port Wentworth Community Center we are moving.  The new meet location is While Bluff Presbyterian Church, 10710  White Bluff Road, Savannah, Georgia.  The dates for this years meet are Friday April 13th and Saturday April 14th.


The new facility offers several improvements over the Community Center.  There are individual rooms available to us for Clinics, Displays, Vendors, etc.  This will make set up much easier.  There are also plenty of tables and chairs on site so that our Macon Gang doesn't have to bring them down with them.


The cost for the meet remains $25.00 for the weekend.  Those that present clinics get in for free.  Speaking of Clinics,, we are always looking for clinicians.  The topic can be anything model railroading related.  This includes model building and its various aspects, prototype information and research is most welcome as well.  If you have a talent, others will be interested in it.  You dont need to be MMR to present a clinic, just knowledgeable.  We present our clinic digitally as well.  For those interested in presenting a clinic, please contact Ken Preston at Ken.preston@....  Thanks


We have made arrangements at the Marriott Spring Hill Suites Midtown

11317 Abercorn Street

Savannah, GA.  

Reservations must be made by March 29th and cancellation must be made 72 hours before your scheduled check in.


Please be sure to bring plenty of models to display as they are what the meet is all about.  Also, bring friends, the more the merrier and we will be glad to have you there.


Again, dates, April 13-14, 9am to 5pm.  Slide/movies shows after the meet each night.


Door prizes to be awarded Saturday after lunch.  You must be present to win.


Cost, $25.00 for the weekend.  No daily rates available 


For more information please feel free to contact me, Denis Blake, at seaboard_1966@...


Thanks


Denis Blake




Re: Meat Reefers - Backhaul Freight

Tony Thompson
 

Paul Catapano wrote:

And I believe, you'll have to talk to Tony T. about this, as a percentage produce was the largest single item, but the majority of the tonnage hauled was non-produce perishable items, for lack of a better term.
 
      Um, no. Non-produce was about 15 percent of PFE's total traffic (don't have data for other lines). In the early 1950s, fruit was 28 percent, vegetables 57 percent, and all would be regarded as perishable. That 15 percent was stuff really traveling in reefers playing the role of insulated boxcars (then an emerging car type), such as packaged beverages, canned or packaged food, frozen food, and dry goods such as crackers.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history






Re: ATSF reefer circular

Aley, Jeff A
 

Hi Paul,

 

               STMFC is set up to strip off any and all attachments.  This is to prevent “the bad guys” from attaching viruses, etc.  Therefore, your document was not sent to the STMFC members.

 

               If you wish to make it accessible to the STMFC membership, please upload it to the FILES area of the STMFC Yahoo!Group:

https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/STMFC/files

 

               When you go to that link, please be sure that you’re logged into Yahoo!Groups.

               Click on the purple buttons at the right to create a new folder and to upload the file.

 

Regards,

 

-Jeff Aley

Deputy Moderator, STMFC

 

 

From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Friday, January 19, 2018 5:59 PM
To: Yahoogroups <stmfc@...>
Cc: John Barry <northbaylines@...>; Al Daumann <sp-blackwidow@...>
Subject: [STMFC] ATSF reefer circular

 

 

I hope this goes through. It is 125 pages long. Paul Catapano

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: Meat Reefers - Backhaul Freight

John Moore
 

Santa Fe Railway did have meat refrigerator cars.  Although outside the 1960 period of this list. Just delete if not interested.

1964 10 ice bunker refrigerator cars from the RR-55 class were modified for meat service with the addition of meat rails and hooks. 
These cars were marked SFRM  38200-38209 
WHEN EMPTY RETURN REVERSE TO AGENT WICHITA KANSAS

1962 20 mechanical refrigerator cars from the RR-56 class were modified for meat service with the addition of meat racks and hooks.  These cars were assigned to Amour Company.
These cars were marked SFRM  38000-38019 
WHEN EMPTY RETURN REVERSE TO AGENT SAN ANGELO TEXAS

These Meat Refrigerator cars were equipped with special equipment and were in captive service so back haul would not have been a consideration.

John B. Moore, Jr.
Albuquerque



From: "'Steve Sandifer' steve.sandifer@... [STMFC]"
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Saturday, January 20, 2018 3:38 PM
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Re: Meat Reefers - Backhaul Freight

 
The question is, was this a meat reefer? Meet reefers had to be kept to a different cleanliness standard than a produce reefer. The use of produce reefers for backhaul is well documented. One of the Santa Fe freight houses at Corwith had a track that was 7” lower than the others so reefers (with a 14” thick floor) could be put on that track for easier LCL loading. No dispute about produce reefers. Santa Fe had no meat reefers, so no application there either.
 
Were matches back hauled in meet reefers? And whose?
 
J. Stephen Sandifer










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Re: ATSF reefer circular

Jim Gates
 

If possible, could you post it in the files?

Jim Gates


Re: New Kadee/Sergent compatible coupler box announcement

Michael Gross
 

Very nice, very detailed coupler boxes, Jim.

Michael Gross
Pasadena, CA


Re: Meat Reefers

Tony Thompson
 

      As several people have mentioned, meat reefers were regarded as contaminated and unsuitable for other kind of food transportation. It was certainly possible to thoroughly clean and sterilize such a car, but it would take quite a car shortage before anyone would want to take on the job; and some produce shippers would not accept ANY meat-equipped car for shipment. That's why produce reefers would be unlikely to be used in meat service, given the need to sterilize afterward, and especially why meat cars could NOT be used for produce.
       Canadian railroad historians like to point out that the CN and CP overhead-bunker reefers were used for both meat and produce. I don't doubt that this was true, but I would express considerably skepticism that the SAME cars were used for both. Having part of the fleet assigned for meat service, and the rest for produce, is quite reasonable. Or perhaps a Canadian historian can provide evidence of the kind of regular cleaning and sterilization going on that would accompany using cars interchangeably.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history






Re: Meat Reefers - Backhaul Freight

np328
 

        First of all, I posted on March 23, 2011 a file to this list: NP Meat Reefer Traffic 1939-1958. It is in the file sections. Check it if you like and note how short hauls outnumber the long hauls greatly, up to 1959 stats that is.

Reviewing that list, I find myself in agreement with those who argue against meat reefers being in anything more than remote use for backhaul.

Why?

1) Up until 1959, and getting very close to the end of this lists timeline, an overwhelming amount of carload meat shipments are of a short haul nature. Though slaughter houses seemed to be concentrated in areas across the US, smaller field branch houses were not. They were found scattered about much more commonly.

       In my own studied area, the large houses were of course in South St. Paul, in addition to Austin and Albert Lea, MN. Not greatly far away were the numerous Iowa slaughter houses. And just a few short miles away on the west end of MN, , the packing houses in West Fargo, ND. However in places like Duluth, MN, and other population centers in Minnesota, branch houses exist. From a list supplied to me (most graciously) by Doug Harding, twenty two branch houses existed in Minnesota. In spite of all these larger slaughter and packing houses, branch houses existed, some in Minneapolis, about a dozen miles from the South St. Paul operations. Some in Red Wing, MN 30 miles or so south of St. Paul.  

    And on the NP, North Dakota, as Montana, had both slaughter and packing houses as well as smaller branch houses. Which would seem to negate long backhaul runs as all these smaller sites would seem to provide many possible places for any empty meat reefer to be further sent to.  Of course, YMMV.

2) Reefers, any reefer is expensive to maintain and traffic, meat traffic especially is extremely competitive. For those reasons, I could see a regional railroad traffic manager keeping a close watch over these cars. One mess-up and I could imagine (and yes, I greatly dislike speculation), in the traffic management upper echelons a decision that it is not worth risking good paying regularly scheduled traffic for the additional marginal income the backhaul revenue would provide.   

   To sum the above, given that any meet reefer that is free of load, would seem to be only free for short hauls, it seems rather unlikely to me that these would be chosen by a car clerk for use as backhaul.

   Of hauling magazines, matches, tires, and so on. These services were normally provided by car-forwarders/freight consolidators like Acme and others. I had/have wanted to do a presentation on freight forwarders for years, however because these were mostly private companies, source and study materials are very scarce.

      I can state however based on factual data two things. 

    The freight forwarders cars were priority traffic and not cheap marginal revenue. If you have access to your railroads train manifesting designations, you may find that freight consolidator’s cars were a priority car when deciding what is flotsam or jetsam regarding train make-up. And secondly, any available empty car was an option for a forwarder as long as it was “tight”, in other words the roof or doors not leaking.  I have several letters, one of a leaky car being chosen, the second of a car not making it across the Twin Cities from the hot Q train inbound to the hot NP train outbound. Both letters read the same in that someone is being called upon to have a whole lot of explaining to do.

     Thus combining the above, statistically speaking, with all those boxcars out there, I would feel that the chances of a meat reefer showing up and being used for back haul? Insignificant. Not impossible, but insignificant.                                    Jim Dick - Roseville, MN 


Re: Meat Reefers - Backhaul Freight

Steve SANDIFER
 

The question is, was this a meat reefer? Meet reefers had to be kept to a different cleanliness standard than a produce reefer. The use of produce reefers for backhaul is well documented. One of the Santa Fe freight houses at Corwith had a track that was 7” lower than the others so reefers (with a 14” thick floor) could be put on that track for easier LCL loading. No dispute about produce reefers. Santa Fe had no meat reefers, so no application there either.

 

Were matches back hauled in meet reefers? And whose?

 

J. Stephen Sandifer

 

From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Friday, January 19, 2018 6:45 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Meat Reefers - Backhaul Freight

 

 

Group

Matches were shipped as back haul.

 

Frank Grimm

Sandwich, IL


Resin Car works 6500 gallon tank car kit

Gary Wildung
 

 Just found this just on e-bay

https://www.ebay.com/itm/263450229144

Gary


www.ebay.com
HO Scale UTLX class X 6500 gallon Insulated Tank Car Resin Kit # 7.02. This is an "CRAFTMANS" level resin kit by R.C.W. Rare limited number made-no longer in production. | eBay!




Re: Tru-color paint

riverman_vt@...
 




---In STMFC@..., <atsfus@...> wrote :

    Well I decided to use Scalecoat.  And even thought it looked good and sprayed on another surface good it came out blotched on the BL sides.  Figured I had a ruined pair of sides but took some Scalecoat gloss and thinned it a bunch.  Lightly sprayed that over and I think everything is OK.  One problem is it's going to take a while to dry.
    What makes me mad about these modern hobby paints is that I have a very old (40 years?) 2 oz bottle of Floquil boxcar red.  This paint works as good as the day it was made.


-- 
Jon Miller
For me time stopped in 1941
Digitrax  Chief/Zephyr systems, 
SPROG, JMRI User
NMRA Life member #2623
Member SFRH&MS

Jeez Jon,
   Count me as one of those who thought Floquil was worthless the day it was made and forever afterward except for weathering. Do you want more of it? There may still be several bottles of it here from a good friend who passed away. If interested contact me off list and I might make you an offer you can't refuse.
Cordially, Don Valentine
 
 

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