Re: CB&Q XM-25
Garth Groff or Sally Sanford <sarahsan@...>
Friends,
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Remember that Ted Culotta covered the XM-25/26 in his "Essential Freight Cars" series. It was published in the February 2004 RMC. No plans, but excellent model and prototype photos. Yours Aye, Garth Groff 🏴
On 3/1/18 8:53 PM, Jim Hayes
jimhayes97225@... [STMFC] wrote:
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Re: CB&Q XM-25
Jim Hayes
I have the PDS and instructions for Sunshine's XM-25 kit. No measurements but they might be helpful. Just ask. Speedwitch also sold an XM25. They're out of stock but have several nice pictures on their website. Jim
On Thu, Mar 1, 2018 at 3:45 PM, jdcellarmod@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:
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Re: CB&Q XM-25
Nelson Moyer
The XM-25/26 single sheathed boxcars were once available from Sunshine, so you may be able to find one in somebody’s stash. They are unique in their grab iron ladder pattern, some above and some below the bolt heads. I built one of the Sunshine kits, but I don’t have dimensions or drawings.
Nelson Moyer
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Thursday, March 01, 2018 5:46 PM To: STMFC@... Subject: [STMFC] Re: CB&Q XM-25
Hi all,
I am looking for a drawing of this boxcar. I have the BRHS freight car data sheet. This gives me some dimensions but not everything I need as I am scratchbuilding/bashing this car. Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks, Jeff Drennan
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Re: CB&Q XM-25
jdcellarmod@...
Hi all, I am looking for a drawing of this boxcar. I have the BRHS freight car data sheet. This gives me some dimensions but not everything I need as I am scratchbuilding/bashing this car. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks, Jeff Drennan
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Offered: Brass OMI HO Paccar Side dump Car
Andy Carlson
Hello- I have a mint/new, with mint box and foam, Overland Models HO brass Paccar Side Dump Car built by Ajin of Korea. Typical quality one would expect from Ajin with nice underbody detail. Steel body and large air-powered pressure cylinders. Offered for $195, plus buyer to pay $7 shipping by US mail. Pictures can be viewed by internet searching for "OMI-1317 Side dump Car". I accept checks and with a small fee, I accept PayPal. Contact me off-list @ for details. Thanks, -Andy Carlson Ojai CA
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Re: GN front facing goat likelihood
Robert Heninger
Tim,
GN heralds can sure get your goat, can't they? In 1948, the lettering surrounding the goat was changed to "GREAT NORTHERN RAILWAY". It's first application to a freight car, as far as I know, was a series of GN steel boxcars with a NEW date of 2-48. Other cars in the series have a NEW date of 3-48. This photo of GN 11022 shows the 1948 change: The confusion arises in part because GN historical pamphlets show this "GREAT NORTHERN RAILWAY" herald, and state that the first use was in 1936. And they are correct: the GN first used this herald on paper items (timetables, forms, annual reports, etc.) in 1936. It was also used on the FTs which arrived beginning in May/June 1941. It might have been used on diesel switchers a bit earlier, but I'm not sure. I'm also not sure when it was first applied to a steam locomotive tender. It was not used on a freight car until 1948. As best I can tell, the "See America First - Glacier National Park" herald with the side facing goat was applied (to GN freight cars) from February 1941 to February 1948. Before February 1941, the goat faced forward, and had much more detail on the goat's face, and the mountain he's standing on. A book could be (and probably should be) written about the subject, much like the excellent SP/PFE lettering book Dick Harley and Tony Thompson wrote. Maybe when I retire. Regards, Bob Heninger Minot, ND
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More Goat
thecitrusbelt@...
And the risk of beating a dead goat to death, two prototype photos of our friendly forward facing goat:
http://www.protocraft.com/category.cfm?ItemID=867&Categoryid=45
http://www.protocraft.com/category.cfm?ItemID=932&Categoryid=45
And I thank all who posted on this topic as I certainly learned a few things.
Bob Chaparro
Hemet, CA
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Re: ERIE Yellow Diamond
Ray Breyer
You can also review original painting diagrams, several of which are on the Fallen Flags site. For example: LOs 20000-20049. Monogram changed from white to gold 1/17/1944. Back to white 12/30/1946. XMs 71800-71999. White to gold 1/21/1944 (WWII era drawing, so no date for returning to white). XMs 84000-84314 and 95000-95999. White to gold 1/26/1944. Gold to white 12/30/1946. XAs 98200-98699. White to gold 1/17/1944. Gold to white 12/17/1946. So: January 1944 to December 1946. Yellow diamonds are in a VERY small window of time. Ray Breyer Elgin, IL
On Thursday, March 1, 2018, 11:58:02 AM CST, Schleigh Mike mike_schleigh@... [STMFC] wrote:
Hi Bill & Group! The yellow (or Dulux imitation gold) diamond was addressed in the Vol. 30, No. 2 2016 edition of the ELHS magazine, The DIAMOND. The actual time that the small (34") yellow diamond was applied to freight cars ranged "from late 1943 to June or July 1946." This is from the summary paragraph by the author, Dan Biernacki. This was a five page lead article in that issue. After the above date the white diamond was enlarged to 72" where possible, otherwise kept at 34" for smaller spaces. Cars delivered new or repainted during the above period would have had the 34" yellow diamond. Subsequent repainting would wipe out the yellow. I don't remember seeing any in the late 1950s or into E-L times. Regards from wet Grove City in western Penna.----Mike Schleigh
On Thursday, March 1, 2018, 11:14:35 AM EST, fgexbill@... [STMFC] wrote:
Is there documentation for the dates when the Yellow Diamond was applied to their boxcars. Additionally I know in-service photos of the Erie's 1932 boxcars are scarce but is it known if the Yellow Diamond was applied to these cars, drawings for example? Bill Welch
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Re: GN front facing goat likelihood
>> that is just a date range under the side facing "Great Northern Railway" >> side facing goat herald, which was not applied to a Great Northern FREIGHT CAR >> until 1948. Huh, wot? Ok have we moved on from "front vs side" to variations of side facing goats? Because obviously the plywood cars in 1944 had side facing goats w/ "See America First" emblems. Tim O'
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Re: ERIE Yellow Diamond
Schleigh Mike
Hi Bill & Group! The yellow (or Dulux imitation gold) diamond was addressed in the Vol. 30, No. 2 2016 edition of the ELHS magazine, The DIAMOND. The actual time that the small (34") yellow diamond was applied to freight cars ranged "from late 1943 to June or July 1946." This is from the summary paragraph by the author, Dan Biernacki. This was a five page lead article in that issue. After the above date the white diamond was enlarged to 72" where possible, otherwise kept at 34" for smaller spaces. Cars delivered new or repainted during the above period would have had the 34" yellow diamond. Subsequent repainting would wipe out the yellow. I don't remember seeing any in the late 1950s or into E-L times. Regards from wet Grove City in western Penna.----Mike Schleigh
On Thursday, March 1, 2018, 11:14:35 AM EST, fgexbill@... [STMFC] wrote:
Is there documentation for the dates when the Yellow Diamond was applied to their boxcars. Additionally I know in-service photos of the Erie's 1932 boxcars are scarce but is it known if the Yellow Diamond was applied to these cars, drawings for example? Bill Welch
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ERIE Yellow Diamond
Bill Welch
Is there documentation for the dates when the Yellow Diamond was applied to their boxcars. Additionally I know in-service photos of the Erie's 1932 boxcars are scarce but is it known if the Yellow Diamond was applied to these cars, drawings for example?
Bill Welch
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Pickle cars in the PNW
I’m kind of late to the pickle party, but would like to know a little more about pickle cars in the Pacific Northwest. Does anyone know if they were ever used by Nalley’s in Tacoma (on NP I suppose), or Farman’s in Enumclaw (on Milwaukee I suppose)? And if so, when would they have become “extinct” due to using trucks instead of RR cars? Hope someone may have some thoughts on this. Thanks! Doug Paasch
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Re: GN front facing goat likelihood
Robert Heninger
My responses are bolded.
---In STMFC@..., <jimbetz@...> wrote : Clark/Gary/all, My reference for the date for the front facing goat is non other than Scott Thompson's "Great Northern Equipment Color Pictorial" (book 1, page 73). Jim, that is just a date range under the side facing "Great Northern Railway" side facing goat herald, which was not applied to a Great Northern FREIGHT CAR until 1948. Clearly, as has been documented elsewhere, that logo was first used on GN literature in about 1936. In fact, it is on the back cover of my 1940 GN Annual Report. It was also used on diesel locomotives starting about 1940/1941. The FTs might have been the first to use it, but I'm not sure. That's a whole other can of worms. Can you provide photographic evidence of a GN freight car with a side facing goat herald painted between 1936 and 1940? If you can, I will gladly stand corrected. By the way, as useful as it is, Mr. Thompson's book is not a particularly reference for documenting steam era GN paint schemes, inasmuch as the vast majority of the photos in the three volume set are color photographs. I think the earliest photo in Volume 1 is dated 1957. Were there some cars painted in the front facing goat after 1936? Probably. No, certainly. I have photographs of newly painted GN boxcars with 1936, 1937, 1938, 1939, and 1940 dates (over a dozen photos) in my collection. Every single one, across multiple car series, painted both by the GN, or one of three different commercial car builders, has a front facing goat herald. The latest has a November 1940 date. Furthermore, in my last post on this subject, I suggested the possibility of the 52000-52999 cars as the first series to use this herald. However, on page 39 of my copy of the 1940 GN Annual Report, is a photo of a string of cars from this series, the highest numbered being 52783. All of them have the front facing goat herald. It seems unlikely that Pullman would paint the last 200 cars differently from the first 800. Therefore, the first documented evidence I have of the use of the side facing goat herald, on a GN freight car, is GN boxcar 48743, dated February 1941. If others have photographic evidence otherwise, I'd love to see it. Were there very many of them surviving in 1950-51 (the O.P.'s date of interest)? I submit "not many" as my answer. I'll agree with you there. Can he use some of them on his layout? Of course he can. The questions are "how many?" ... and also "what service was the car in?" and "what type of car?". And, of course, the proverbial "it's my RR and this is what I want to be seeing". I did not answer "none". There is no way, at least that I know of, to "know for sure" what percentage of cars would still have the front facing goat. At the same time - as the percentage goes up the "feel" of the early 50's is compromised ... more weathering on those cars would
certainly help. - Jim B. Again, complete agreement. I have a couple photos showing boxcars with front facing goats taken in 1949, and 1952. The white part of the herald has almost completely worn off the side of the car. Only the black background is visible. Well, I've sufficiently flagellated this dead horse. I've annoyed the list enough for one day. Regards, Bob Heninger Minot, ND
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Re: Klasing Hand Brake from Resin Car works
Tim,
The 646 Klasing wheel that TLT did dates from 1949 to the end of production of the malleable wheel and the gear changed from the D-959 to the 1050 in '52 and to the 1150 in circa '54, and that would be the gear on cars built in the late '50's. These gears are very different visually. If memory serves, Moloco does the 1150. Dan Smith
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Re: Klasing Hand Brake from Resin Car works
Dan
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
Actually, Klasings of exactly the same style as the TLT were being installed on brand new cars, Missouri Pacific and Northern Pacific box cars, in 1959 and 1960, respectively. I don't really care about the gear boxes. The wheels are 10x more interesting. Tim O'Connor
Of what Tim? If you mean hand brake wheels, there are at least 6 versions of the 646 wheel that I know of that would be installed on the 650 / 950 series of gears. The TLT wheel dates from the late '40's and the RCW wheel is from the late '30's. I have not received my RCW sets yet but I am pretty sure that gear is a D-959.
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Re: Klasing Hand Brake from Resin Car works
Tom Madden wrote:
The particular Klasing wheel that RCW offers is the only one with spokes heavy enough to print Tom and Frank also, there is an earlier Klasing 646 wheel with a solid center hub. Contact me is you want more info. Dan Smith
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Re: Klasing Hand Brake from Resin Car works
Tim O'Connor wrote:
Also, Klasing had at least two distinctive styles Of what Tim? If you mean hand brake wheels, there are at least 6 versions of the 646 wheel that I know of that would be installed on the 650 / 950 series of gears. The TLT wheel dates from the late '40's and the RCW wheel is from the late '30's. I have not received my RCW sets yet but I am pretty sure that gear is a D-959. Dan Smith
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Re: Klasing Hand Brake from Resin Car works
Tom Madden
The particular Klasing wheel that RCW offers is the only one with spokes heavy enough to print. The spokes on the others are too fine. It was designed by Frank's son, Patrick. Tom Madden
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Re: GN front facing goat likelihood
Clark/Gary/all,
My reference for the date for the front facing goat is non other than Scott Thompson's "Great Northern Equipment Color Pictorial" (book 1, page 73). Were there some cars painted in the front facing goat after 1936? Probably. Were there very many of them surviving in 1950-51 (the O.P.'s date of interest)? I submit "not many" as my answer. Can he use some of them on his layout? Of course he can. The questions are "how many?" ... and also "what service was the car in?" and "what type of car?". And, of course, the proverbial "it's my RR and this is what I want to be seeing". I did not answer "none". There is no way, at least that I know of, to "know for sure" what percentage of cars would still have the front facing goat. At the same time - as the percentage goes up the "feel" of the early 50's is compromised ... more weathering on those cars would certainly help. - Jim B.
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Brake Beams
bill woelfel
I am working on a Sunshine ATSF flat class FT-J and need to install the K brakes. The instructions are unclear as to the brake beams position..are they on the bottom of the double centersill or in slots cut into the sills? There are no slots in the factory castings. i've got plenty of online info on the brake rigging but no clue what to do here.. Thanks, Bill Woelfel,, Homewood, Il
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