Date   

Re: Southern 41' low side steel gon - possible HO rerun

Bill Welch
 

Ike, does this Data Pack cover all three of the end variations of the Southern Low side gons?

Bill Welch


Re: HO scale ASF A-3 Ride Control trucks with roller bearings

Peter Ness
 

I just bought some new Athearn trucks for my New Haven TOFC project and I finally found a car diagram.  This was a 100-car series (17800-17899) built in 1954 at the New Haven’s Readville Shops using International Steel underframe. Cars 17800-17849 were equipped with Timken roller bearings, cars 17850-17899 with SKF.

 

I seem to recall at least one manufacturer molded a bearing manufacturers’ name on the bearing cap. I hope it’s not Athearn… that would restrict the range of car numbers I can apply.

 

Peter Ness

website: http://newhavenrailroad1959.webs.com/

 

 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Todd Sullivan via Groups.Io
Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2018 2:45 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] HO scale ASF A-3 Ride Control trucks with roller bearings

 

I recall that the earliest HO Athearn RB truck with rotating caps was pretty much a dog, and it was a fairly early RB truck design and an early Athearn product, as well.  The current HO 70 ton capacity RB truck offering from Athearn is a much better design, more faithful to modern RB truck appearance, and rolls well.  I used to have several that I used under multi-unit container cars back when I was modeling the 1980s-1990s, and they looked and operated well.

 

Todd Sullivan.


HO scale ASF A-3 Ride Control trucks with roller bearings

Andy Carlson
 

I am not too clear on where "Hell" is, but a Neutron Star has a density of 200 BILLION times the density of Earth. I think an HO A-3 truck made with that neutron star material would go way beyond 70-tons!!!!!
-Andy Carlson
Ojai CA


From: John Hagen via Groups.Io <sprinthag@...>
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2018 10:46 AM
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] HO scale ASF A-3 Ride Control trucks with roller bearings

Just for the fun of it seeing as how proper nomenclature has been introduced;
There is no way in hell an HO truck, even a pair of them, could weigh 70 tons.
I’ll now return to my nap.
John Hagen
 
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Brian Carlson via Groups.Io
Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2018 10:17 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] HO scale ASF A-3 Ride Control trucks with roller bearings
 
Kato did Barber S-2 trucks with rotating caps. I think they were 70 ton trucks. 
Brian J. Carlson 


 



Re: HO scale ASF A-3 Ride Control trucks with roller bearings

earlyrail
 

But that bronze was just to hold the Babbit and oil film that was the real bearing material
Howard Garner


Re: Southern 41' low side steel gon - possible HO rerun

George Eichelberger
 

Jim:

SRHA receives requests to purchase your Southern gon quite often. As it is simply one of the best SR freight car kits ever produced, it would be great to see the HO version available again.

As a reminder, the SRHA Company Store (The GRAB) www.srha.net sells a package of 19 tabloid size drawings, photos and a brief history of the prototype. Another plan pack of Southern 50’ “waffle” side box cars and sets of Southern Railway freight car diagram books are also available. (We will have copies at this weekend’s Atlanta train show.)

Ike


Re: HO scale ASF A-3 Ride Control trucks with roller bearings

Todd Sullivan
 

I recall that the earliest HO Athearn RB truck with rotating caps was pretty much a dog, and it was a fairly early RB truck design and an early Athearn product, as well.  The current HO 70 ton capacity RB truck offering from Athearn is a much better design, more faithful to modern RB truck appearance, and rolls well.  I used to have several that I used under multi-unit container cars back when I was modeling the 1980s-1990s, and they looked and operated well.

Todd Sullivan.


Re: HO scale ASF A-3 Ride Control trucks with roller bearings

Curt Fortenberry
 


This could be urban legend, but what I understand is that the roller bearing manufacturers coined the negative term "friction bearing" as a way to market their better roller bearings.

Curt Fortenberry


Re: HO scale ASF A-3 Ride Control trucks with roller bearings

mopacfirst
 

I have a few pair of the Athearn trucks, although they're only under the few most modern cars on the railroad.

I want to be careful here, because I'm not absolutely sure there weren't some other makers of this HO truck, so what I'm about to say may not apply to the current Athearn truck.  But I'll say that some of the early ones with the spinning bearing caps didn't roll all that well, irony of ironies.  Then I dropped one from a height of several hundred HO feet, and one of the bearing caps flew off, never to be seen again.  So its mate is probably still in my truck box somewhere.

Ron Merrick


Southern 41' low side steel gon - possible HO rerun

Jim King
 

I'm bringing the S scale version of my Southern 41'6" low side steel gon back into production after a 10-year hiatus.  This got me thinking there may be some interest in the HO rerun.  You can see the S scale pilot models here:  http://www.smokymountainmodelworks.com/S_rolling_stock.html

If you're interested in seeing these HO kits rerun in Roman and/or Block font decals, please contact me off-list stating which font you prefer (or both).

Thanks,
Jim King
SMMW


Re: HO scale ASF A-3 Ride Control trucks with roller bearings

Tony Thompson
 

 John Hagen wrote:

Just for the fun of it seeing as how proper nomenclature has been introduced;
There is no way in hell an HO truck, even a pair of them, could weigh 70 tons.
I’ll now return to my nap.

      What, you don't know about scale tons?

Tony Thompson




Re: HO scale ASF A-3 Ride Control trucks with roller bearings

John Hagen <sprinthag@...>
 

Just for the fun of it seeing as how proper nomenclature has been introduced;

There is no way in hell an HO truck, even a pair of them, could weigh 70 tons.

I’ll now return to my nap.

John Hagen

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Brian Carlson via Groups.Io
Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2018 10:17 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] HO scale ASF A-3 Ride Control trucks with roller bearings

 

Kato did Barber S-2 trucks with rotating caps. I think they were 70 ton trucks. 

Brian J. Carlson 



 


Re: Whaling car

Brent Greer
 

photo of Pacific Whaling Company set up for display here:

http://www.sideshowworld.com/81-SSPAlbumcover/2015/SS-262/1-262a.html

There’s obviously a railroad car under there but no details can be made out.

________________________________
Dr. J. Brent Greer
________________________________
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> on behalf of Brent Greer <studegator@msn.com>
Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2018 9:29:42 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Whaling car

I cross-posted this question to the N&W Historical Society list and received this response from WJPowers:

"Re: Whale oil delivery to Marion, VA

The Pacific Whaling Company was a traveling maritime display. It consisted of several convertible flats & gons along with a baggage car/kitchen and sleeper. The star of the show was a @50' dead whale. It was preserved with lots of salt and embalming fluid. Also on board were various stuffed or preserved sea creatures from penguins to sea turtles. A small team of actors pretended they were captains and mates. They told the story of high seas adventures - all made up. Some enjoyed the work so much that they dressed as sea going officers for their remaining careers. For a dime, locals had several days to follow their noses to the display and see the marvels. PWC insisted that their troupe always traveled as an addition to a first class train, or as a special movement on freight only trackage. This endeavor was especially lucrative during the depression, as the outfit set up next to a downtown depot rather than out at the fairgrounds. It was easy for the city dwellers to get to it, which infuriated the other carnivals that were not allowed in center city."

WJPowers

Interesting Eh?

Brent
________________________________
Dr. J. Brent Greer
________________________________
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> on behalf of Douglas Harding <doug.harding@iowacentralrr.org>
Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2018 9:25:39 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Whaling car

Check page 96 of Edward S. Kaminski's "Tank Cars--American Car & Foundry Company, 1865 to 1955" for a photo of APWX 7166 built September 1917 and lettered American Pacific Whaling Company.
Also
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Pacific_Whaling_Company
http://www.nakina.net/private/apwx.html
https://oac.cdlib.org/findaid/ark:/13030/c8z03ckh/entire_text/

Doug Harding
www.iowacentralrr.org

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of George Courtney via Groups.Io
Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2018 6:39 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Whaling car

Reading some Dispatcher notes from Southern Railway dated 5/23/32. it reads "No. 65 picked up Pacific Whaling Car 601 from Elizabethton to Bristol in route to Marion, Virginia. Anyone have a photo of a Pacific Whaling car? Or know more about this?

George Courtney


Re: Whaling car

Brent Greer
 

I cross-posted this question to the N&W Historical Society list and received this response from WJPowers:

"Re: Whale oil delivery to Marion, VA

    The Pacific Whaling Company was a traveling maritime display. It consisted of several convertible flats & gons along with a baggage car/kitchen and sleeper. The star of the show was a @50' dead whale. It was preserved with lots of salt and embalming fluid. Also on board were various stuffed or preserved sea creatures from penguins to sea turtles. A small team of actors pretended they were captains and mates. They told the story of high seas adventures - all made up. Some enjoyed the work so much that they dressed as sea going officers for their remaining careers. For a dime, locals had several days to follow their noses to the display and see the marvels. PWC insisted that their troupe always traveled as an addition to a first class train, or as a special movement on freight only trackage. This endeavor was especially lucrative during the depression, as the outfit set up next to a downtown depot rather than out at the fairgrounds. It was easy for the city dwellers to get to it, which infuriated the other carnivals that were not allowed in center city."

    WJPowers     

Interesting Eh?

Brent
________________________________
Dr. J. Brent Greer


From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> on behalf of Douglas Harding <doug.harding@...>
Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2018 9:25:39 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Whaling car
 

Check page 96 of Edward S. Kaminski's "Tank Cars--American Car & Foundry Company, 1865 to 1955" for a photo of APWX 7166 built September 1917 and lettered American Pacific Whaling Company.

Also

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Pacific_Whaling_Company

http://www.nakina.net/private/apwx.html

https://oac.cdlib.org/findaid/ark:/13030/c8z03ckh/entire_text/

 

Doug  Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of George Courtney via Groups.Io
Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2018 6:39 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Whaling car

 

Reading some Dispatcher notes from Southern Railway dated 5/23/32. it reads "No. 65 picked up Pacific Whaling Car 601 from Elizabethton to Bristol in route to Marion, Virginia.  Anyone have a photo of a Pacific Whaling car?  Or know more about this?

George Courtney


Re: HO scale ASF A-3 Ride Control trucks with roller bearings

Daniel A. Mitchell
 

“Plain Bearing" does indeed seem a better term.

I would suggest “plain bearing" implies only ONE moving part (the “journal") and ONE stationary part (the “bearing”). But such is almost never the case (except ox-carts maybe).

And the term “anti-friction” is confusing in that most all bearings of any type attempt to be anti-friction. The term more usually implies use of some form of ball or roller system between the journal and bearing … here the "inner-race” and “outer race” respectively. Such bearings are clearly multi-part and more complex.

In usual usage a “bearing” consists of several parts including the “journal” (usually the end of an axle of some form). The “bearing” component of this is some (hopefully) low-friction material (bronze, babbitt, teflon) that rests upon (or surrounds) the journal. And, while the “bearing” can consist of just one component and be said to be “solid”, in most cases it is actually several parts, so can’t be said to be solid.

Likewise the term “journal” in a “plain” bearing is the moving (usually rotating) part of the bearing. But in roller or ball bearings the end of the axle usually just carries the inner-race of the bearing, and itself takes no part in the motion of the bearing. Is it still a “journal”? Or is the combination of the axle and inner-race now the journal? In such case it’s no longer “plain” or “solid”.

It’s all quite complicated and confusing, with poor terminology used, and differing from one industry or application to another.

In railroad use the bearings were usually bronze, or bronze with babbitt inserts … until anti-friction bearings (mostly “roller” types) became accepted mostly in the 1960’s.

To further complicate the issue, most bearings use lubrication of some form. This forms a film between the journal and bearing … rather like liquid bearing-balls, that further reduce friction. In most cases, however there is still some physical contact (“bearing”) between the journal and bearing surfaces. However some bearings use pressurized oil to lift the so called “bearing” completely off the journal … so NO "solid” contact remains. In this case the fluid bears the weight … so what’s now the “bearing”?

Similarly consider “air” bearings where compressed air carries the weight. Or magnetic-levitation bearings ...

None of these exotic bearings has much to do with railroads. My point is that the terms “solid" and "anti-friction” are confusing and ill-defined.

Dan Mitchell
==========

On Aug 21, 2018, at 11:43 PM, Tony Thompson <tony@...> wrote:

Dan Mitchell wrote:

Yes, but solid bearings are NOT “solid”. And ball and roller bearings still have friction.

  Gee, those bronze blocks look pretty solid . . . my impression from Railway Age and other professional literature is that the term "plain bearing" was more prevalent than "solid bearing."

Tony Thompson





Is there interest in buying photos made from high quality ink-jet printer?

Jim King
 

I'm considering putting my large negative and slide collection to use in the form of creating a catalog of images that can be printed and sold direct, maybe ebay.  Images would be created using an 11-head, high-end color printer on glossy paper after I scanned the originals at high rez, edited arrangement, added a 1-line caption at the bottom and printed in black and white (halftone) or full color.

Does this interest you?  Please let me know off-list at jimking3 at charter dot net.
Thank you.

Jim King
Smoky Mountain Model Works Inc.


Re: Virginian's battleship gons

Bill McClure
 

I simply caution that there are some issues with those drawings, including the brake system and interior details, IIRC.

Bil


Re: HO scale ASF A-3 Ride Control trucks with roller bearings

Tony Thompson
 

Dan Mitchell wrote:

Yes, but solid bearings are NOT “solid”. And ball and roller bearings still have friction.

  Gee, those bronze blocks look pretty solid . . . my impression from Railway Age and other professional literature is that the term "plain bearing" was more prevalent than "solid bearing."

Tony Thompson




Re: Accurail gondola

Matt Smith
 

Mike,

You can get an Accurail version with the logo you are referencing. Here is the link.
http://www.accurail.com/accurail/ART/3700/3703_2.jpg
--
Matt Smith
Bloomington, IL


Re: HO scale ASF A-3 Ride Control trucks with roller bearings

Daniel A. Mitchell
 

Athearn had a crude “rotating caps” version much earlier (1980’s?), but I don’t know what it represented.

Dan Mitchell
==========

On Aug 21, 2018, at 11:16 AM, Brian Carlson via Groups.Io <prrk41361@...> wrote:

Kato did Barber S-2 trucks with rotating caps. I think they were 70 ton trucks. 

Brian J. Carlson 

On Aug 21, 2018, at 10:57 AM, Aley, Jeff A <Jeff.A.Aley@...> wrote:

Who did the truck where the bearing caps actually rotated?  Wasn’t that an ASF A-3?  Was that the Athearn that Ben mentioned?
 
Regards,
 
-Jeff
 
 
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Brian Carlson via Groups.Io
Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2018 5:23 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] HO scale ASF A-3 Ride Control trucks with roller bearings
 

The Kato trucks are not roller bearing equipped. 

Brian J. Carlson 


On Aug 21, 2018, at 6:25 AM, Dave Strahlendorf <das1054@...> wrote:

Kato makes this truck. Here is a link at Lombard Hobbies:
 



Re: HO scale ASF A-3 Ride Control trucks with roller bearings

Daniel A. Mitchell
 

Yes, but solid bearings are NOT “solid”. And ball and roller bearings still have friction.

Ill defined technical terms, varying with application, and mixed with "common usage”. You say “Potato” and I say “Tomato” … or something like that. Mostly we’ll all know what it means.

The term “friction bearing” seems to have appeared as a counterpoint to the term “anti-friction bearing”. Before that they were just bearings.

Such A-F bearings go back well into the 19th century (sometimes earlier), were around in "high-tech” (vehicles, aircraft, and instruments, etc.) from perhaps the 1920’s, were the norm in such apparatus during WWII, but didn’t become common on railroad axles until well after WWII.

Note the term ANTI-friction … they have less friction, but still have some. An some forms of “friction” or “solid’ bearings can have less friction than most anti-friction bearings. And some “anti-friction” bearings can have quite high friction. Confusing?

Dan Mitchell
==========

On Aug 21, 2018, at 10:48 AM, Nelson Moyer <npmoyer@...> wrote:

Agreed, and you may add stirrup step and roof walk to your basket of deplorables.
 
Nelson Moyer
 
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Brian Carlson via Groups.Io
Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2018 9:34 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] HO scale ASF A-3 Ride Control trucks with roller bearings
 

There is no such thing as friction bearings, they are solid bearings.  Sorry that’s my pet peeve. 

Brian J. Carlson 


On Aug 21, 2018, at 10:14 AM, Peter Ness <prness@...> wrote:

Thanks, Dave. Kato makes a friction bearing version, not the roller bearing.
 
Regards,
Peter
 
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Dave Strahlendorf
Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2018 6:26 AM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] HO scale ASF A-3 Ride Control trucks with roller bearings
 
Kato makes this truck. Here is a link at Lombard Hobbies:
 


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