Date   

Two New Kadee Running Boards Announced

Ed Hawkins
 

STMFC members,
The Kadee web site is now showing two new running boards for 40’-6” box cars. Both are available in 4 colors. Samples were shown last month at the St. Louis Area RPM.

U.S. Gypsum expanded metal (used from early 1940s to 1954)
https://kadee.com/htmbord/page2015-2018.htm

Morton (used from early 1940s through 1950s)
https://kadee.com/htmbord/page2005-2008.htm

For those who have not yet installed a Kadee running board to their PS-1 roof, something to be aware of is that the Kadee’s running board is “directional.” The running board has 6 notched mounting pins, equally spaced along the longitudinal center line under the running board surface, which are in turn inserted into corresponding precision-cut holes in the roof. The notches must face the right side of the car for the pins to be oriented properly so that they will lock into place. To complete the assembly, the latitudinals each have an additional pin to insert into diagonally-opposite roof holes above the side ladders, and the end supports are inserted into two holes.

The process is simple as long as the notches are properly oriented. If turned 180 degrees, it might cause head scratching and the question “why isn’t this working?” 

For those wondering, Sam Clarke of Kadee advised me that U.S. Gypsum & Morton brake steps are currently in work & a decision will be made at later date regarding availability for separate sale.

Regards,
Ed Hawkins


Re: Speaking of Sunshine - kit questions

Dennis Storzek
 

Wiseman Model Services also does and older Fruehauf 24 footer that was picked up from On-Trak... I did these patterns over thirty years ago for Walker Model service, my one foray into vehicle modeling.
24' Fruehauf

Wiseman has it incorrectly labeled as an "Aerovan", a trade name Fruehauf used after WWII, but it isn't, it's actually an older model, dating to 1940-41. While I developed the patterns from an existing construction trailer that had survived intact into the eighties, I did some research at the time and ran into the Aerovan name repeatedly in the trade press, but the details of the front bonnet are consistently different. There are undoubtedly other unseen differences in construction, the Aerovan name was meant to be a reference to the then new concept of "aircraft construction" where lightweight custom pressings replaced traditional rolled structural steel to reduce weight, and therefore increase the load that could be legally carried. Wiseman offers the trailer in 24, 28, and 32 foot lengths. IIRC, the version I measured was a 28 footer. I suspect the design is really too old to have been built as a 32 footer, but at this late date the trailer looks pretty generic and can stand in for other, later designs.

Dennis Storzek


Re: Modeling Truss Rod Underframe

mrvant@rogers.com
 

Thanks for sharing the great photos. Nice job.


Re: HO scale ASF A-3 Ride Control trucks with roller bearings

Garth Groff <sarahsan@...>
 

Dan and friends,

A lot of early US O-scale was 1:45, including freight cars (mandatory content).
Some models 1:45 were still available using pre-war tooling in the late 1940s. It took a while for things to standardize at 1:48. Let's not get into all the "proto" variations.

Today British O-scale uses 1:43 or 7mm to the foot versus the US 1/4". Since I dabble in British narrow gauge on 16.5 mm (HO gauge) track, this doesn't matter much, though I can't decide if my fictional South Mull Light Railway's gauge is 27" (Tallylyn and Corrris) or 30" (Welshpool & Llanfair). It's only a problem if I stand a 1:43 Phoenix figure next to a 1:48 Grandt Line door.

Yours Aye,

Garth Groff  🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿

On 8/23/18 10:25 PM, Daniel A. Mitchell wrote:
Who says "O Scale is supposed to be 1/4"=1'-0", 1:48?” The scale came from Europe which has been “metric” for many years (mid 1800’s). Not everything happened at once, and the system continues to evolve to this day.

And yes, "O-Scale” is quite confused, with three versions at least. In the USA 1/4” = 1 ft. is the norm. Then there's the “1.5” scale folks who use two track gauges (7.25” and 7.5”) for similar reasons. And some folks change the scale a bit to match the 7.5” track. And the British who use HO track but model in OO scale. Not to mention “G” where all sorts of scales run on the same track gauge. Go figure?   :-((

And historic models have indeed been built in all sorts of scales, before any standardization existed. Of course prototype railroads were also built in all sizes and gauges before standards were evolved as well.

But we certainly are wandering off-topic.

Dan Mitchell
==========
On Aug 23, 2018, at 11:09 AM, Dennis Storzek <destorzek@...> wrote:

On Thu, Aug 23, 2018 at 07:06 AM, Daniel A. Mitchell wrote:
This results from “HO” being half of European “O” gauge, which is 7mm to the foot … another goofy scale. Why did they pick such a congloberation in the first place?
At risk of getting waaaay off topic, it was the result of adopting toy train track with a gauge of 1.25 inches as the standard for O Scale, which is supposed to be 1/4"=1'-0", 1:48. The gauge ends up being a scale 3.5" oversize. By adopting 7mm = 1'-0", 1:43.5, they corrected the scale for the gauge, actually over corrected by several percent, but that was better, because model wheels are overly wide, also. At one time there was a movement here in the US to correct the modeling scale by adopting 17/64" = 1'-0", 1:45, which is almost perfect, but it never went anywhere, although I've seen some trolley models built to that scale.

Why not just use the real numbers? Mechanisms are likely the most difficult part of the model to build, so many people just wanted to adapt toy mechanisms. Meanwhile precision tools that measure to one thousandth of an inch were expensive and not commonly available, so they were always picking some number that could be measured with a machinist scale.

What does this have to do with steam era freight cars? Most of this transpired during the steam era, and there have been freigtcar models built in all these scales.

Dennis Storzek
 



Re: 1937 shot at Ft. Belvoir

Jim Gates
 

To pick a different nit, US Army Engineers spell (and sometimes pronounce) it "ponton".

Jim Gates
--------------------------------------------

On Thu, 8/23/18, Ray Breyer via Groups.Io <rtbsvrr69=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:

Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] 1937 shot at Ft. Belvoir
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Date: Thursday, August 23, 2018, 11:50 AM

The only puttees I see in the photo are being worn by a single staff sergeant with his hands in his pockets, watching the pontoons being loaded. All of the officers (and at least one warrant) are wearing actual riding boots, while most of the enlisted ranks are wearing "shoepac" overboots.
Remember that 1937 was STILL the era of the horse-powered Army, and that any good officer knew how to ride well. Riding boots were a normal part of an officer's uniform, especially that close to DC.
Ray Breyer
Elgin, IL


Re: Safety Refrigeration Inc. Refrigerator Cars

Scott
 

From Rodger Hinmans MDT book the MDT bought all 85 cars in 1936 and rebuilt them and put them into the 700 series.  

It is unknown if they retained the refrigeration equipment but it is not likely it was kept.

Scott McDonald


Re: 1937 shot at Ft. Belvoir

Jack Mullen
 

Bruce,
We can see at least one significant postwar change in uniforms here. Field jackets are the 1926 pattern with rolled collar and lapels, worn over shirt and tie, instead of the WW1 high collar jacket buttoned to the neck. Speaking of jackets, there's quite a variety of jackets and coats here.

As to the Mack AC, it has the earlier style radiator and it a reasonable assumption that at least the basic truck dates to WW1. I don't know whether the Army ordered any equipped with cranes originally, or whether this is a later conversion, as was popular on the civilian side. There were at least a couple different aftermarket halftrack conversions available in the '20s.  The one here is a Christie. Here's a survivor, the only photo I can find on the web right now:
https://www.pinterest.com/pin/494762709039769390/
There might be a photo and brief discussion in John Montville's book "Bulldog", but my copy seems to still be in a moving carton in the future layout room. Oh well.

Jack Mullen


Re: 1937 shot at Ft. Belvoir

Daniel A. Mitchell
 

Those stupid “leggings” were still in use during WWII. Most by then were canvas not leather. Both USA Army and Navy wore them. Among other things, I’m a sometimes military reenactor in the crew of a WWII M-18 “Hellcat” tank destroyer (hey! It runs on "tracks”), and we usually wear them for historical accuracy.



The darn things are a real “pain” to put on since they lace on the OUTSIDE of the ankle (a leg does NOT bend like that!). They were in common use by both officers and enlisted men in many armies (with variations). They do provide good support for the ankles, and keep the bottoms of the pant-legs from getting caught in things. They also provide for “blousing” the pant-legs, which was quite stylish in some circles.

So, any depiction of USA (or some foreign) military from before WWI to after WWII may well find these being worn. Tall boots were also worn, depending on period, unit preferences, rank, and other reasons.

Dan Mitchell
==========

On Aug 23, 2018, at 12:30 PM, Denny Anspach <danspachmd@...> wrote: 

Officer riding boots?  :  More probably they were “puttees”, strapped leather leggings that encased officer's trousers similar to riding britches, and which which fit over the tops of leather shoes. I always assumed that this was a rank-thing that hung over when officers were all on horseback.

Denny

Denny S. Anspach MD
Okoboji, IA






Re: HO scale ASF A-3 Ride Control trucks with roller bearings

Daniel A. Mitchell
 

Who says "O Scale is supposed to be 1/4"=1'-0", 1:48?” The scale came from Europe which has been “metric” for many years (mid 1800’s). Not everything happened at once, and the system continues to evolve to this day.

And yes, "O-Scale” is quite confused, with three versions at least. In the USA 1/4” = 1 ft. is the norm. Then there's the “1.5” scale folks who use two track gauges (7.25” and 7.5”) for similar reasons. And some folks change the scale a bit to match the 7.5” track. And the British who use HO track but model in OO scale. Not to mention “G” where all sorts of scales run on the same track gauge. Go figure?   :-((

And historic models have indeed been built in all sorts of scales, before any standardization existed. Of course prototype railroads were also built in all sizes and gauges before standards were evolved as well.

But we certainly are wandering off-topic.

Dan Mitchell
==========

On Aug 23, 2018, at 11:09 AM, Dennis Storzek <destorzek@...> wrote:

On Thu, Aug 23, 2018 at 07:06 AM, Daniel A. Mitchell wrote:
This results from “HO” being half of European “O” gauge, which is 7mm to the foot … another goofy scale. Why did they pick such a congloberation in the first place?
At risk of getting waaaay off topic, it was the result of adopting toy train track with a gauge of 1.25 inches as the standard for O Scale, which is supposed to be 1/4"=1'-0", 1:48. The gauge ends up being a scale 3.5" oversize. By adopting 7mm = 1'-0", 1:43.5, they corrected the scale for the gauge, actually over corrected by several percent, but that was better, because model wheels are overly wide, also. At one time there was a movement here in the US to correct the modeling scale by adopting 17/64" = 1'-0", 1:45, which is almost perfect, but it never went anywhere, although I've seen some trolley models built to that scale.

Why not just use the real numbers? Mechanisms are likely the most difficult part of the model to build, so many people just wanted to adapt toy mechanisms. Meanwhile precision tools that measure to one thousandth of an inch were expensive and not commonly available, so they were always picking some number that could be measured with a machinist scale.

What does this have to do with steam era freight cars? Most of this transpired during the steam era, and there have been freigtcar models built in all these scales.

Dennis Storzek
 


Re: 1937 shot at Ft. Belvoir

rwitt_2000
 

Garth,

It may be this one or something similar.

Bob Witt


Re: Speaking of Sunshine - kit questions

Peter Ness
 

Looking at the flyer for Sunshine 82.11 – 82.17 32’ Fruehauf ribbed side trailers, the landing gear in the photo looks exactly like that I described so positively made today by Wiseman Model Services, formerly by On-Trak.

 

Peter Ness


Re: Speaking of Sunshine - kit questions

Peter Ness
 

OK, I just found the new home of the Sparrow Point trailers…and, they also offer some Steam Era cabeese and Lackawanna freight cars to boot!

http://shortlinemodelproducts.com/epages/a6a1f973-1632-42bd-913c-db17a5410da2.sf/en_US/?ObjectPath=/Shops/a6a1f973-1632-42bd-913c-db17a5410da2/Categories/002

 

Peter Ness

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Tom Madden via Groups.Io
Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2018 4:45 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Speaking of Sunshine - kit questions

 

Bethlehem Car Works offered some short TOFC trailers in its Sparrows Point line a while back, but I don't see them there now. I picked up two on eBay some time ago, a DL&W and an Erie (or possibly LV), but I'm away from home now and can't tell you any more about them.

Tom Madden


Re: Speaking of Sunshine - kit questions

Peter Ness
 

Good memory, Tom. I can feel my CRS growing by the minute.  I have heard of those but don’t recall seeing them.  I think they’ve been gone from the site for a while now.

 

A couple months back I discovered SS Ltd apparently picked up a few of the Alloy Forms products and lists a 24’ van appropriate for early TOFC service http://scale-structures.com/af7095

 

I will have to look for the Sparrows Point trailers on ebay.

 

Peter Ness

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Tom Madden via Groups.Io
Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2018 4:45 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Speaking of Sunshine - kit questions

 

Bethlehem Car Works offered some short TOFC trailers in its Sparrows Point line a while back, but I don't see them there now. I picked up two on eBay some time ago, a DL&W and an Erie (or possibly LV), but I'm away from home now and can't tell you any more about them.

Tom Madden


Re: Speaking of Sunshine - kit questions

Peter Ness
 

Yep, Don Mills’ trailers are suitable from mid’50’s onward and are types often seen in TOFC Service. He also used to offer a more extensive line of Northeast trucking line decals, but they were produced by Rail Graphics and when they ceased he lost the artwork. As part of my TOFC project I’m working with a few folks to revive some long OOP decals previously offered by Don and a fellow who produced Pen Bay decals years ago now deceased, plus add more trailer decals appropriate for Northeast TOFC service.

 

Wiseman Model Services makes some wonderful Aerovan trailers with the best looking, most detailed landing gear I’ve ever seen – important when the trailer is sitting on the landing gear on the flat car for all to see. http://www.locopainter.com/store/subcategory.php?subcatid=35

I am actually ordering their landing gear to replace the gear on other manufacturers trailers, it’s that good (my opinion).

 

There’s also Sheepscot Models that produces plaster trailer kits, including an MEC TOFC model http://www.sheepscotscale.com/site/2012/09/12/35-foot-van-trailer

 

There are a few resin casters selling from ebay stores as well.

 

If you look around, you will find many produce Aerovan trailers of various lengths to cover all eras of TOFC modeling, and many also offer 1-3 distinctive trailers that may be suitable for a specific era.

 

Peter Ness   

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Bill Welch
Sent: Thursday, August 23, 2018 3:31 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Speaking of Sunshine - kit questions

 

What about the trailers shown on the Don Mills website: http://donmillsmodels.com/product-category/187-scale-truck-construction-kits/

Bill welch


Re: Speaking of Sunshine - kit questions

mopacfirst
 

I saw two vertical-rib 34' trailers on the Don Mills site.  They look perfectly decent, from the point of view of one who doesn't really know squat about trailers and cabs, except what I hear from those of you who do.  Their tractor cab kits are pretty specific as to model, not so much for the years built.  The trailers are not identified as to builder, but I don't know enough to say if they need to be.

The Sunshine Fruehauf trailer looks very nice, it's from a Hodina master.  It may be a challenge to paint.

I have several of the low-numbered Sylvan kits, that I picked up when my LHS still carried a lot of detail and craftsman stuff.  They too look clean and well-molded and I should build a couple of those soon.

Ron Merrick


Accupaint

David Turner
 

Railway Prototype Cyclopedia Vol. 3 has a chart for "Box car painting" which lists Accupaint #12 as recommended for the Red-browns of many railroads.

Since Accupaint is no longer available, what have you found to produce the same color as their #12?

Does Vallejo have anything?

TruColor has adapted the Accupaint line, but they did not copy over the color name/numbers from Accupaint.  Now days, Trucolor has many variations of "Box car color" in the TCP-180 to TCP-224 colors.    Which one matches the old Accupaint #12?

Thanks for any assistance.

Best regards,

David Turner


Re: Speaking of Sunshine - kit questions

Brian Carlson
 

It would have been DL&W and LV.  Pretty sure you bought mine. 

I need Erie trailers instead. 

Brian J. Carlson 

On Aug 23, 2018, at 4:44 PM, Tom Madden via Groups.Io <pullmanboss@...> wrote:

Bethlehem Car Works offered some short TOFC trailers in its Sparrows Point line a while back, but I don't see them there now. I picked up two on eBay some time ago, a DL&W and an Erie (or possibly LV), but I'm away from home now and can't tell you any more about them.

Tom Madden


Re: Speaking of Sunshine - kit questions

Tom Madden
 

Bethlehem Car Works offered some short TOFC trailers in its Sparrows Point line a while back, but I don't see them there now. I picked up two on eBay some time ago, a DL&W and an Erie (or possibly LV), but I'm away from home now and can't tell you any more about them.

Tom Madden


Safety Refrigeration Inc. Refrigerator Cars

Richard Wilkens
 

Anyone have information on a company known as Safety Refrigeration Inc.? It appears that in the 1930's they were offering refrigerator cars that were iceless and were cooled by silica gel. The Spokane, Portland & Seattle Ry. and Oregon Electric Railway entered into a contract with them in November 1931 and Great Northern Railway entered into a contract with them in 1932.

Were any cars actually built?

Thanks,

Rich Wilkens


Re: 1937 shot at Ft. Belvoir

Garth Groff <sarahsan@...>
 

Bob and Friends,

F&C offers a 1930 40' C&O automobile boxcar as their kit 6770. Sorry, I no longer have the original photo to compare.

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff  🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿

On 8/23/18 3:11 PM, rwitt_2000 via Groups.Io wrote:
Bruce,

Buried way, way in the background, there is a C&O double-door box car coupled to a baggage/express car.

The B&O box car is a M-27b. It looks like #295477 with double door. Can't determine if it still has is Evans auto loader.

I appear to be wrong about any kit available for the C&O DD box car.

Bob

30581 - 30600 of 188712