Date   

Re: NC&StL HM-11 Two-Bay Hopper

Bill Welch
 

There is an error Armand but not enough to bother me. Alternative is spend time carving detail off an Accurail version then putting it back on. I would rather spend my time detailing instead of removing details, especially if I am building more than one of something like these hoppers. Just my 2-cents.

Bill Welch


Re: NC&StL HM-11 Two-Bay Hopper

O Fenton Wells
 

Excellent Bill.  
Fenton

On Sat, Sep 8, 2018 at 1:20 PM, Armand Premo <arm.p.prem@...> wrote:
Bill,In the past it was  suggested that the kit was not accurate because of the rib spacing was not the USRA design.Did you have a problem with that ?Armand Premo

On Sat, Sep 8, 2018 at 1:05 PM, Bill Welch <fgexbill@...> wrote:
The boys at the Clearwater Car Shops have another car ready for the Paint Shop. The NC&StL owned two groups of USRA design 2-bay hoppers that except for their trucks are exact copies of that design. The CCS used the Tichy kit and added a few enhancements like the Train Line along the right side of the car along with brackets, a Route Card Holder and A-Line sill Steps manipulated into prototype shape. The "B" ends features the Plate "A" Hand Brake arrangement. The Boys used 0.005 styrene to make the bracket for the Brake Reservoir and the Bracket used to secure the Brake Shaft.

Arguably the sweetest detail is the beautifully tooled Dalman Two-Level trucks from Tahoe/ Eventually the car will be painted Oxide Red and decaled with a Curt Fortenburry set.

Already built are three Clinchfield USRA and one  L&N copy or clone with more L&N to build. Wish I could find photo of camera shy Tenn. Central version.

Bill Welch





--
Fenton Wells
250 Frye Rd
Pinehurst NC 28374
910-420-8106
srrfan1401@...


Re: NC&StL HM-11 Two-Bay Hopper

Armand Premo
 

Bill,In the past it was  suggested that the kit was not accurate because of the rib spacing was not the USRA design.Did you have a problem with that ?Armand Premo

On Sat, Sep 8, 2018 at 1:05 PM, Bill Welch <fgexbill@...> wrote:
The boys at the Clearwater Car Shops have another car ready for the Paint Shop. The NC&StL owned two groups of USRA design 2-bay hoppers that except for their trucks are exact copies of that design. The CCS used the Tichy kit and added a few enhancements like the Train Line along the right side of the car along with brackets, a Route Card Holder and A-Line sill Steps manipulated into prototype shape. The "B" ends features the Plate "A" Hand Brake arrangement. The Boys used 0.005 styrene to make the bracket for the Brake Reservoir and the Bracket used to secure the Brake Shaft.

Arguably the sweetest detail is the beautifully tooled Dalman Two-Level trucks from Tahoe/ Eventually the car will be painted Oxide Red and decaled with a Curt Fortenburry set.

Already built are three Clinchfield USRA and one  L&N copy or clone with more L&N to build. Wish I could find photo of camera shy Tenn. Central version.

Bill Welch



NC&StL HM-11 Two-Bay Hopper

Bill Welch
 

The boys at the Clearwater Car Shops have another car ready for the Paint Shop. The NC&StL owned two groups of USRA design 2-bay hoppers that except for their trucks are exact copies of that design. The CCS used the Tichy kit and added a few enhancements like the Train Line along the right side of the car along with brackets, a Route Card Holder and A-Line sill Steps manipulated into prototype shape. The "B" ends features the Plate "A" Hand Brake arrangement. The Boys used 0.005 styrene to make the bracket for the Brake Reservoir and the Bracket used to secure the Brake Shaft.

Arguably the sweetest detail is the beautifully tooled Dalman Two-Level trucks from Tahoe/ Eventually the car will be painted Oxide Red and decaled with a Curt Fortenburry set.

Already built are three Clinchfield USRA and one  L&N copy or clone with more L&N to build. Wish I could find photo of camera shy Tenn. Central version.

Bill Welch


Re: Can someone identify this truck?

Dave Parker
 

Garth:

The pedestal truck wasn't "loosely called"; it is precisely defined as such in my 1912 CBC.

In general, I would say these truck were rare.  Among northeastern roads, Fox trucks were as popular as they were anywhere, but even they only show up on a few roads and on certain classes of cars. The other designs (Schoen, Kindl) are even rarer in my experience.  In his June MRH article, Richard Bale says that the Schoen design was dropped in 1899 when Schoen and Fox merged to form Pressed Steel.

This has come up before, but my understanding/recollection is that Fox trucks were never banned from interchange, at least within the scope of the group (up to 1960).  Or, at least I am not aware of a ban on pedestal trucks generally.  Note that the Kindl truck that began this thread does not have a pressed steel sideframe as does the Fox.  It is built up of various shapes (including L-section it appears), and might have been subject to the ban on non-U-shaped trusses in the late 1950s.  Assuming there were any left in service of course.

Don, the ad that Brian posted only shows the image of the Cloud pedestal  (aka pressed steel) truck (the lower image).  There was also a Cloud archbar truck that can be seen in other ads from the same period.

Dave Parker
Riverside, CA


Re: Can someone identify this truck?

Bill Daniels <billinsf@...>
 

Why are you shouting, Don. Oh, I see... you had caps lock on and didn’t notice it.

Bill Daniels


On Sep 8, 2018, at 7:50 AM, Donald B. Valentine via Groups.Io <riverman_vt@...> wrote:

Hello Brian,

     ISN'T THE NAME RIGHT IN THE AD? i WOULD SAY IT IS A "CLOUD ARCH BAR TRUCK".

CORDIALLY, DON VALENTINE

Virus-free. www.avast.com


Re: Can someone identify this truck?

Donald B. Valentine <riverman_vt@...>
 

Hello Brian,

     ISN'T THE NAME RIGHT IN THE AD? i WOULD SAY IT IS A "CLOUD ARCH BAR TRUCK".

CORDIALLY, DON VALENTINE

Virus-free. www.avast.com


Re: Decal Set for Sunshine Models Kit No. 60.3 for Standard Brands Vinegar Tanker (Black Decals)

charles slater
 

Of course it is, did I say something wrong?
Charlie

Sent from Outlook



From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> on behalf of Bill Welch <fgexbill@...>
Sent: Saturday, September 8, 2018 4:55 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Decal Set for Sunshine Models Kit No. 60.3 for Standard Brands Vinegar Tanker (Black Decals)
 
Just to clear Trisha's last name is Lofton as in Trisha Lofton.

Bill Welch


Re: Decal Set for Sunshine Models Kit No. 60.3 for Standard Brands Vinegar Tanker (Black Decals)

Bill Welch
 

Just to clear Trisha's last name is Lofton as in Trisha Lofton.

Bill Welch


Re: Can someone identify this truck?

Garth Groff <sarahsan@...>
 

Friends,

This discussion of the Kindl and now Cloud trucks has been very interesting. These trucks are, I believe, loosely called "pedestal" trucks, and seem to have a lot in common with the better-known Fox trucks.

So to keep this topic relevant to our group, how common would these pedestal trucks have been in their early years of our period? Were they eventually banned from interchange service, and if so when?

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff  🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿

On 9/7/18 7:47 PM, brianleppert@... wrote:
Here is a Kindl ad from The Daily Railway Age Magazine, June 23, 1904.

Brian Leppert
Tahoe Model Works
Carson City, NV
please visit www.resincarworks.com/tahoe.htm


Re: Decal Set for Sunshine Models Kit No. 60.3 for Standard Brands Vinegar Tanker (Black Decals)

robertb@smartchat.net.au
 

Mike,

I have a part of the set you require, in fact most of it. I bought one of these cars built up from Pierre Oliver of Elgin Car Shops/Yarmouth Model Works. When Pierre sent the model he also included the instructions, prototype data sheet and the the unused portion of the decal sheet. I've attached a scan.

If you're interested in it, let me know.

Regards,

Robert Bogie

Melbourne, Australia

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Schleigh Mike via Groups.Io

Sent: Thursday, September 06, 2018 6:25 PM
To: STMFC <main@realstmfc.groups.io>
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Decal Set for Sunshine Models Kit No. 60.3 for Standard Brands Vinegar Tanker (Black Decals)

 

Hello Group!

 

I recently discovered my long-ago-purchased Sunshine Models Kit No. 60.3 for Standard Brands Vinegar Tanker (Black Decals) only to find that no decals were inside.  Is there a chance one of you have an extra set to spare?  If not, can anyone suggest a source for these with the 'RR Roman' style lettering.  Failing any help, I will venture a note to Trisha Martin.

 

Thanking in advance for your consideration.

 

Mike Schleigh in Gro



Re: Can someone identify this truck?

brianleppert@att.net
 

Here is a Kindl ad from The Daily Railway Age Magazine, June 23, 1904.

Brian Leppert
Tahoe Model Works
Carson City, NV
please visit www.resincarworks.com/tahoe.htm


Re: Can someone identify this truck?

Eric Hansmann
 

I think there may have been a couple of variations on this Kindl truck design.


Eric Hansmann

Murfreesboro, TN



On September 7, 2018 at 3:42 PM Eric Lombard <elombard@...> wrote:

Well, Steve, I think you nailed it! Thank you for the information and references. I am butting heads with the Illinois Central box cars at the turn of the Century and this truck pops up on many series built by AC&F.

Cheers,
Eric


Re: Can someone identify this truck?

Eric Lombard
 

Well, Steve, I think you nailed it! Thank you for the information and references. I am butting heads with the Illinois Central box cars at the turn of the Century and this truck pops up on many series built by AC&F.

Cheers,
Eric

On Fri, Sep 7, 2018 at 1:22 PM Steve and Barb Hile <shile@...> wrote:
Here is a close match to your trucks, from the Kindl Truck Company in the 1903 CBD.
 
 
There is an article in the Daily Railway Age in 1901 at
 
 
Hope this helps.
 
Steve Hile


From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Eric Lombard
Sent: Friday, September 07, 2018 12:49 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Can someone identify this truck?

Here is clearer photo of the truck on IC 22890 built 3-1902 by AC&F lot 1806. There are no drawings or photos in the 1888, 1906 or 1909 Cyclopedias.


Re: PFE (WP) Hutchins Roof Photo Needed

Garth Groff <sarahsan@...>
 

Alfred,

Tony Thompson, others and I batted around the question of WP R-30-12 clones several years ago on the old group (or maybe it was the old old USNET group). I don't believe we came to any definite conclusions.

The builder's photo of the first car, lettered Western Refrigerator Line 7001 (later PFE 50001) clearly shows features of the PFE R-30-13s. This can be seen on page 105 of the Thompson/Church/Jones PFE book (original edition). In the text it says some car cards were marked as R-30-12s. It would be extremely odd if some of those older underframes were mixed into the production cycle, and this might just be a clerical error. No photographic evidence has yet surfaced for a WP PFE car with an R-30-12 underframe. Given the paucity of data, I recommend you do your WP car with the R-30-13 underframe, and make your PFE-owned car an R-30-12.

This is what I did I when I was building my collection of Red Caboose models, which as offered were all variations of the R-30-12s, I wanted my two WP cars to be as close to correct as my minimal modeling skills allowed. Fortunately, in one of his RMJ articles Richard Hendrickson showed how to do a conversion using parts from the Tichy R-40-4 kit. While this underframe is a bit beefier, it is still visually close. I did one car for revenue service and one as a silver ice service car. I also kitbashed a couple of others as typical PFE R-30-13s.

The whole question of a Hutchins roof is a bigger problem. I have never seen an overhead view of a WP PFE reefer. There must be at least one out there someplace. Your best bet might be to contact the Portola Railroad Museum. They have 52138, what may be the only one of these to still survive, rescued and donated by John Ryczkowski. At last report the car is still waiting restoration, but they might be able to provide a photo of the roof (I'm sure John shot from every angle!). This car was last rebuilt in 1943 before being sold off as a farm shed, and may still have a Hutchins roof. You can see a low-level photo on page 44 of Jim Eager's WESTERN PACIFIC COLOR GUIDE TO FREIGHT AND PASSENGER EQUIPMENT.

Best of luck with your models, and thank you for including my second-favorite railroad in your fleet (the SN comes first).

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff 

On 9/7/18 12:23 PM, Bob Chaparro wrote:

Alfred Fickensher posted the request below on my Railroad Citrus Industry Modeling Group. I have several WP reefer photos but none showing car roofs. Can anyone help Alfred? Thanks.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA

++++

Folks, I’m hoping someone might have a roof-view photo of one of the WP PFE R-30s that gives a good view of the Hutchins roof. Apparently there were different Hutchins roofs over the years between the wars, so a picture for example of an XY&Z RY box car with a Hutchins roof won’t be trustworthy enough for my purposes. This has to be identifiable as a PFE reefer and of course has to show at least one and a half segments of the Hutchins roof for me to be able to model it.

I’m scratchbuilding two 1:48 PFE reefers, one R-30-12 with Bettendorf underframe and one R-30-13 with the PFE “company” u/f. My intentions are to paint one as a WP car and at this point in the project it’s not yet decided whether the WP will be the -12 or the -13, both were on the roster although only a small percentage of the WPs were the Bettendorfs.

The Hutchins roof however apparently was on 2000 of the 2750 WP cars so its surprising to me that no photos have shown up for me so far.

Hopefully. . .

Thanks for looking,

Alfred Fickensher

Bettendorf, Iowa



FOR SALE - Southern Pacific Books

Storey Lindsay
 

Group,

 

Please note that all of these books are physically located in Slovenia, Europe. They are duplicates of those I already have. Postage is additional. I will ship worldwide. Airmail postage will be determined for individual purchases. Transit time is 4 to 6 weeks although shorter and longer times have happened. I only accept PayPal.

 

If you are interested, please contact me OFF LIST at – storey.lindsay@...

 

ITEM                                                                                                 US$ PRICE

The Southern Pacific 1901-1985                                                        $35.00

Don L. Hofsommer

Southern Pacific Steam Locomotive Compendium                           $65.00

Diebert / Strapac

Tehachapi - Southern Pacific-Santa Fe                                              $20.00

John R. Signor

Diesels of the Espee, Volume One: Alco PAs                                   $  5.00

Roger M. Cortani

Southern Pacific Lines – Maintenance of Way Equipment                $20.00

Bruce R. Petty

Southern Pacific Lines – Pacific Lines Stations Volume 1                $10.00

John R. Signor

            I have two extra copies, one book is in original shrink-wrap

Southern Pacific Lines – Pacific Lines Stations Volume 2                $10.00

John R. Signor

            I have two extra copies, one book is in original shrink-wrap

Southern Pacific Steam Switchers of the Pacific Lines                      $20.00

Gene Deimling

Southern Pacific Company Equipment Circular No. 14                    $  5.00

Southern Pacific Lines Common Standard Plans Volume 4              $20.00

 

The Fabulous ‘50s – The Cars, The Culture                                       $20.00

John A. Gunnell / Mary L. Sieber

            Book is in original shrink-wrap

Cars of the Fabulous ‘50s                                                                   $30.00

James M. Flammang

 

Thank you,

 

Storey Lindsay

Celje, Slovenia


Re: Can someone identify this truck?

Steve and Barb Hile
 

Here is a close match to your trucks, from the Kindl Truck Company in the 1903 CBD.
 
 
There is an article in the Daily Railway Age in 1901 at
 
 
Hope this helps.
 
Steve Hile



From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Eric Lombard
Sent: Friday, September 07, 2018 12:49 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Can someone identify this truck?

Here is clearer photo of the truck on IC 22890 built 3-1902 by AC&F lot 1806. There are no drawings or photos in the 1888, 1906 or 1909 Cyclopedias.


Re: My railroad materials

Tim O'Connor
 


Which is WHY I mentioned them as exceptions.


Tim, I would say that the Conductors books are in fact genuine, primary archival materials.  They were created by actual railroaders in the pursuit of their work, it doesnt get much more authentic, on-the-ground recording of what really happened.:  Granted a single book may contain anomalies, but an entire book will cover the normal run of what was carried in regular normal trains.
 
Schuyler
 
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Tim O'Connor
Sent: Tuesday, September 04, 2018 2:04 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] My railroad materials
 

For people with genuine, primary archival materials - of whatever kind -
I agree this can be difficult to figure out. I have virtually no materials
of this kind - conductor's books, cyclopedias, a few other genuine railroad
publications is all. I'm confident that none of them are unique, and therefore
I'm happy to instruct my heirs to sell them (Ebay etc) - or keep anything they
like. I figure if someone is willing to pay money to own them, then whatever
protection they receive will be because a new person values them. In the end
I think "continuous custody" is the only long term solution. Even museums and
official archives can be impermanent. (Maybe I'm thinking of the horrific fire
yesterday in Brazil that destroyed literally millions of items collected over
the previous 200 years.)


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts
--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: Tank Car: HMHX 6012

Tim O'Connor
 


Yes, 6012. A 6,000 gallon ACF tank car, a loner - ONE of a series of ONE. :-)

That's a great website !

Tim O'Connor





Here is another photo link from the Free Library of Philadelphia:
https://libwww.freelibrary.org/digital/item/44466
Click on the photo to enlarge it.
The three compartment tank car appears to be HMHX 6012. Two sources list the owner as Tank Car Corp. Of America.
Comment for the photo: "View of a vacated industrial plant. Location was the site of the Union Petroleum Company, circa 1910. Then the Sinclair Refining Company, circa 1942. Circa 1962 the location belonged to the Paint Manufacturing Company. Demolish date sometime after 1962."
Bob Chaparro
Hemet, CA

--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: Can someone identify this truck?

Eric Lombard
 

Here is clearer photo of the truck on IC 22890 built 3-1902 by AC&F lot 1806. There are no drawings or photos in the 1888, 1906 or 1909 Cyclopedias.

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