Date   

Re: Rapido NP boxcar, K brake question

Dennis Storzek
 

Jim,

I haven't seen the model, and so am not entirely familiar with which series of cars it portrays, but this is a steel underframe car with straight sills, right? If so, the brake levers are normally supported on carriers below the sills, so how can the connecting rod be between them? do you mean below the sills on the car center line, perchance?

Dennis Storzek


Re: Poultry Cars

Daniel A. Mitchell
 

You’re missing the point. The geometrical dimensions do NOT describe the way the item LOOKS. I’ve agreed that the mesh is close to scale dimensionally, but it would not appear so on the model. Diffraction from such a fine mesh blurs the visiual appearance, making it look far more opaque than it may actually be. Some things do NOT "scale”.

As I stated: "The problem here is that a real item shrunk to 1/87 of it’s original size would NOT look “right” … the physics of light do not allow it."

Dan Mitchell
=========

On Oct 28, 2018, at 12:03 AM, Ralph W. Brown <rbrown51@...> wrote:

Dan,
 
The “high transparency” mesh I described in my earlier posts is 81% open or transparent.  Both the wire size and the mesh dimensions are very close to the prototype, but in HO scale.  See: https://www.twpinc.com/wire-mesh-material/stainless-steel/80-mesh-stainless-high-transparency-0012.
 
Pax,
 
 
Ralph Brown
Portland, Maine
PRRT&HS No. 3966
NMRA No. L2532

rbrown51[at]maine[dot]rr[dot]com
 
From: Daniel A. Mitchell
Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2018 6:03 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Poultry Cars
 
Yes, I’ve looked at it. I also attended Kristen’s presentation. To me the suggested wire mesh seems about 30% transparent, vs. perhaps 90-plus% for the real poultry cars.I’ve also worked with similar real mesh. It sure does NOT look like the mesh as seen on the real poultry cars. This is undoubtedly due to lighting effects, as the mesh’s dimensions seem close to correct. I suspect a good part of this is due to both lighting angle and diffraction.
 
The problem here is that a real item shrunk to 1/87 of it’s original size would NOT look “right” … the physics of light do not allow it.
 
Dan Mitchell
=========
 
On Oct 27, 2018, at 10:56 AM, Nelson Moyer <npmoyer@...> wrote:
 
Dan, have you visited the TWP, Inc. web page and looked at the sample photos of fine stainless steel mesh? The phots show a model’s hand holding a 3x3 swatch of each available mesh so that prospective buyers can see the transparency. The photos are front lighted, and the mesh specifications, including wire diameter and opening size, are given for each mesh. I believe you will find these photos instructive.
 
Nelson Moyer
 
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Daniel A. Mitchell
Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2018 8:50 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Poultry Cars
 
One only needs about 10% hole-to-matrix size to see through something when backlighted.
 
The poultry cars, however are very transparent when FRONT lighted. This requires more like 90% hole-to-matrix proportion. I’ve never seen really small mesh of any kind that comes even close to this proportion.
 
Thus, to my knowledge, all the really fine mesh available is far to opaque to represent the mesh on the poultry cars.
 
Dan Mitchell
==========
 
 


Re: Rapido NP boxcar, K brake question

Alexander Schneider Jr
 

Thanks to all who responded. ThE discussion has been very informative.

Alex Schneider 


On Sun, Oct 28, 2018 at 2:10 AM, np328
<jcdworkingonthenp@...> wrote:
   Alex,
      I just looked at one of the blueprints of the underframe that I submitted to Rapido years ago when this car was still "a proposal".
Brian is right, there is a connecting rod between the center sill member on the original as built drawing.                                                                Jim Dick - St. Paul MN


Re: Rapido NP boxcar, K brake question

np328
 

   Alex,
      I just looked at one of the blueprints of the underframe that I submitted to Rapido years ago when this car was still "a proposal".
Brian is right, there is a connecting rod between the center sill member on the original as built drawing.                                                                Jim Dick - St. Paul MN


Re: CNJ boxcars in LA circa 1947?

Allan Smith
 

I Have CNJ cars on my conductors lists from the Sierra from 1952 and 1954. I am away from home and will not return until Nov 22. After I return home I can post car numbers and dates. Al Smith Sonora Ca


Re: Poultry Cars

Tim O'Connor
 


Wow, thanks for that link. It's nearly invisible stuff! :-)

Tim O'


Dan,
 
The high transparency mesh I described in my earlier posts is 81% open or transparent.
Both the wire size and the mesh dimensions are very close to the prototype, but in HO scale.
See: https://www.twpinc.com/wire-mesh-material/stainless-steel/80-mesh-stainless-high-transparency-0012

Pax,
 
Ralph Brown
Portland, Maine
PRRT&HS No. 3966
NMRA No. L2532

--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: Poultry Cars

Ralph W. Brown
 

Dan,
 
The “high transparency” mesh I described in my earlier posts is 81% open or transparent.  Both the wire size and the mesh dimensions are very close to the prototype, but in HO scale.  See: https://www.twpinc.com/wire-mesh-material/stainless-steel/80-mesh-stainless-high-transparency-0012.
 
Pax,
 
 
Ralph Brown
Portland, Maine
PRRT&HS No. 3966
NMRA No. L2532

rbrown51[at]maine[dot]rr[dot]com
 

From: Daniel A. Mitchell
Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2018 6:03 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Poultry Cars
 
Yes, I’ve looked at it. I also attended Kristen’s presentation. To me the suggested wire mesh seems about 30% transparent, vs. perhaps 90-plus% for the real poultry cars.I’ve also worked with similar real mesh. It sure does NOT look like the mesh as seen on the real poultry cars. This is undoubtedly due to lighting effects, as the mesh’s dimensions seem close to correct. I suspect a good part of this is due to both lighting angle and diffraction.
 
The problem here is that a real item shrunk to 1/87 of it’s original size would NOT look “right” … the physics of light do not allow it.
 
Dan Mitchell
=========
 
On Oct 27, 2018, at 10:56 AM, Nelson Moyer <npmoyer@...> wrote:
 
Dan, have you visited the TWP, Inc. web page and looked at the sample photos of fine stainless steel mesh? The phots show a model’s hand holding a 3x3 swatch of each available mesh so that prospective buyers can see the transparency. The photos are front lighted, and the mesh specifications, including wire diameter and opening size, are given for each mesh. I believe you will find these photos instructive.
 
Nelson Moyer
 
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Daniel A. Mitchell
Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2018 8:50 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Poultry Cars
 
One only needs about 10% hole-to-matrix size to see through something when backlighted.
 
The poultry cars, however are very transparent when FRONT lighted. This requires more like 90% hole-to-matrix proportion. I’ve never seen really small mesh of any kind that comes even close to this proportion.
 
Thus, to my knowledge, all the really fine mesh available is far to opaque to represent the mesh on the poultry cars.
 
Dan Mitchell
==========
 
 


Re: CNJ boxcars in LA circa 1947?

Tim O'Connor
 


I completely agree with Bill's statement, and it was especially true 1941 to 1945
when normal car service rules were mostly suspended (except for car service directives).
Nevertheless, I've never seen a photo of a CNJ box car anywhere near the west coast in
the steam era (i.e. prior to 1960). I admit I haven't looked for them, but still...
After 1960, however - CNJ acquired LNE "X29" (ARA, really) style box cars and those I
have seen several times in the west in photos. My Dad even took a picture of one in
Pueblo CO in 1967, still wearing LNE reporting marks.

Tim O'Connor


 XM boxcars went everywhere.
 Bill Welch

--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: CNJ boxcars in LA circa 1947?

Bill Keene
 

Bill, 

Yup!  Everywhere.

Cheers from another Bill,
Bill Keene
Irvine, CA


On Oct 27, 2018, at 8:59 AM, bill stanton <bill_stanton60@...> wrote:

thanks...i am particularly interested in steel xm type (ie x-29)




From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> on behalf of Bill Welch <fgexbill@...>
Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2018 8:55 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] CNJ boxcars in LA circa 1947?
 
XM boxcars went everywhere.

Bill Welch


Re: FUTURE

gtws00
 

Bill,
I also spray future straight from the bottle. I do a throughout cleaning of the airbrush after spraying. I slay with a Grex pistol grip airbrush and a .5 mm needle at about 18 to 20 psi

Very pleased with the results
George Toman


Re: Rapido

Peter Ness
 

HI Jon,

 

Rapido has a pretty tight system for pre-ordering from them or your hobby shop.  For most products, you might see stock for a week, maybe a lttlle more or less at the hobby shop and it’s gone. The only way to be assured to get a product directly from Rapido is to preorder.  At the manufacturer they are immediately sold out upon arrival.  Good system for Rapido, but I’ve been asleep at the switch and missed some cars I really wanted.

 

Peter Ness

 

 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Jon Miller
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2018 11:13 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Rapido

 

    I received my Rapido NP boxcars and they are very nice.  Notice from their site that they are totally sold out of all including the unpainted.  Don't know how many but I find it interesting that a $50 (msrp) was totally sold out.

-- 
Jon Miller
For me time stopped in 1941
Digitrax  Chief/Zephyr systems, JMRI User
SPROG User
NMRA Life member #2623
Member SFRH&MS


Re: Poultry Cars

Daniel A. Mitchell
 

Yes, I’ve looked at it. I also attended Kristen’s presentation. To me the suggested wire mesh seems about 30% transparent, vs. perhaps 90-plus% for the real poultry cars.I’ve also worked with similar real mesh. It sure does NOT look like the mesh as seen on the real poultry cars. This is undoubtedly due to lighting effects, as the mesh’s dimensions seem close to correct. I suspect a good part of this is due to both lighting angle and diffraction.

The problem here is that a real item shrunk to 1/87 of it’s original size would NOT look “right” … the physics of light do not allow it.

Dan Mitchell
=========

On Oct 27, 2018, at 10:56 AM, Nelson Moyer <npmoyer@...> wrote:

Dan, have you visited the TWP, Inc. web page and looked at the sample photos of fine stainless steel mesh? The phots show a model’s hand holding a 3x3 swatch of each available mesh so that prospective buyers can see the transparency. The photos are front lighted, and the mesh specifications, including wire diameter and opening size, are given for each mesh. I believe you will find these photos instructive.
 
Nelson Moyer
 
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Daniel A. Mitchell
Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2018 8:50 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Poultry Cars
 
One only needs about 10% hole-to-matrix size to see through something when backlighted.
 
The poultry cars, however are very transparent when FRONT lighted. This requires more like 90% hole-to-matrix proportion. I’ve never seen really small mesh of any kind that comes even close to this proportion.
 
Thus, to my knowledge, all the really fine mesh available is far to opaque to represent the mesh on the poultry cars.
 
Dan Mitchell
==========
 


Re: Poultry Cars

Dave Parker
 

I don't have dog in the fight, as I sincerely hope to never undertake one of those cursed poultry cars, but I agree with Lester.  I have a somewhat similar challenge with some mesh on a ventilated box car and bridal fabrics, or perhaps very sheer nylon stockings, is what I am looking at.

One advantage of such fabrics is that they can almost always be dyed using good old RIT.  So, color can easily be tweaked without paint clogging up all the holes.

Dave Parker
Riverside, CA


Re: Poultry Cars

frograbbit602
 

I know the discussion is wire; however, I want to suggest another alternative. When building the poultry cars I have built I used bridal vale material purchased at a local fabric store as I could get a very small diamond pattern black in color. Other modelers thought it was effective.

Lester Breuer


Re: 55 Ton Fishbelly Hopper Cars

David Payne
 

John Sykes III writes:
I assume you guys are speaking about "late" fishbelly twin hoppers (the Stewart/Bowser model)?  Pressed Steel Car Company first came out with these cars in the late 1890's.  The largest customer was PRR with over 20,000 GLs, GLCs, CLCAs, GLCBs and GLHs, ultimately coming from several car builders, included the railroad itself.  The January 1954 ORER shows over 4,700 of these cars still in service of that late date.


Actually I was looking for a southeastern “home” for the AtlasO model that I have, but it doesn’t appear that many, if any, migrated south.
David Payne


Re: FUTURE

Douglas Harding
 

Bill I have been using is straight from the bottle for a nice gloss coat. For a flat finish I mix Future with Tamiya Flat base, 10 Future to 1 Flat base. My CGW minikit car on display at the Chicagoland RPM had the Future flat finish.

 

Doug  Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of WILLIAM PARDIE
Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2018 1:24 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] FUTURE

 

 

There have been numerous references on this list and RPM seminars on using Future floor finish as a gloss coat.  What is used to think this product for spraying (and what ratio)?

 

Bill Pardie

 

Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone


Re: 55 Ton Fishbelly Hopper Cars

James E Kubanick
 

Ben is right. The Stewart was patterned after the WM prototype and the WM Historical Society made several offerings of the car in various WM number sets and two lettering schemes.

Also, the Cambria & Indiana (C&I 300-series) rostered some of these cars, although they may have been second-hand from one of the roads already cited.

Jim Kubanick
Morgantown WV

On Saturday, October 27, 2018, 2:29:35 PM EDT, william darnaby <wdarnaby@...> wrote:


If I am correct, the AC&Y historical society had Rail Graphics make decals for this car which were numbered in the series 6000-6099.  Per the info sheet these were 2090 cuf and 33' IL.  The Stewart car is makes an acceptable model of this car per the photos includes in the decal info sheet.  Mont Switzer was kind enough to provide me with a set of decals to use on the Stewart model which made a nice car for my railroad.

Bill Darnaby

-----Original Message-----
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of David via Groups.Io
Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2018 7:48 AM
To: RealSTMFC@groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] 55 Ton Fishbelly Hopper Cars

And I just now remembered that AC&Y had some 33' IL cars I have no details on.

David Thompson







Re: FUTURE

Tim O'Connor
 


Lots of good information there, Ben! I like the mixtures of Future with other
paints (Tamiya, Model Master Acrylic). I always liked to add Crystal Coat to
Floquil colors to get a closer-to-gloss finish, rather than the usual flat.

Tim O'Connor


 Bill Pardie asked:
 "There have been numerous references on this list and RPM seminars on using Future floor finish as a gloss coat.  What is used to think this product for spraying (and what ratio)?"

  http://nswbgmodelling.airleague.com.au/PlasticModelPage/TheCompleteFuture.htm
 Ben Hom

--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: FUTURE

Eric Hansmann
 

I use it straight. No thinning is necessary. Here’s more into.

http://blog.resincarworks.com/working-with-future/

 

 

Eric Hansmann

Murfreesboro, TN

 

 

 


From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of WILLIAM PARDIE
Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2018 1:24 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] FUTURE

 

 

There have been numerous references on this list and RPM seminars on using Future floor finish as a gloss coat.  What is used to think this product for spraying (and what ratio)?

 

Bill Pardie

 

Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone


Re: 55 Ton Fishbelly Hopper Cars

william darnaby
 

If I am correct, the AC&Y historical society had Rail Graphics make decals for this car which were numbered in the series 6000-6099. Per the info sheet these were 2090 cuf and 33' IL. The Stewart car is makes an acceptable model of this car per the photos includes in the decal info sheet. Mont Switzer was kind enough to provide me with a set of decals to use on the Stewart model which made a nice car for my railroad.

Bill Darnaby

-----Original Message-----
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of David via Groups.Io
Sent: Saturday, October 27, 2018 7:48 AM
To: RealSTMFC@groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] 55 Ton Fishbelly Hopper Cars

And I just now remembered that AC&Y had some 33' IL cars I have no details on.

David Thompson

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