Date   

Re: GM&O 4670

Eric Lombard
 

Good morning Bill and All from a really darn cold place!

 "I should emphasize that many'most of these series are likely to have had any influence from ARA or ARR designs." 

That statement was based on the observation that there is variation in the post and brace patterns and underframe arrangements and that most of the series were built before there were ARA/AAR specifications for their size and design. The database tallies 226 series built new with +/-ARA/AAR dimensions: Most +/-1932-like dimensioned cars were built between 1924 and 1929; most +/-1937 dimensioned cars between 1916 and 1930;  all +/-1941 dimensioned cars between 1915 and 1936 and; all +/-1942 dimensioned cars between 1910 and 1938. ARA and AAR safety appliances, brake requirements, etc would of course be adhered to for the date on which the cars were built.  The total of 639 series mentioned prior is formed of  226 series built new and 413 series renumbered or rebuilt without renumbering or rebuilt and renumbered from the originals.

A disclaimer: the database, under construction since 1984 is a work in progress and though I am rather confident that all series built new between 1910 and 1944 are included, there will likely be rebuilt, or renumbered, or rebuilt and renumbered series yet to be uncovered.


On Tue, Jan 29, 2019 at 5:54 PM Bill Welch <fgexbill@...> wrote:
Sorry I do not understand your statement: "I should emphasize that many'most of these series are likely to have had any influence from ARA or ARR designs."

Bill Welch


Re: Alexander scale models

Gene Green <genegreen1942@...>
 

Aha!  Dan Mitchell knows the correct terminology!  Good info to have, Dan.  Thanks.  
Gene Green


Re: Gondola Load

Douglas Harding
 

I was thinking water discharge pipe for a hydro dam. Or could be a mine or tunnel ventilation pipe. The wood crate looks to be a support and protection device for the elevated end. Notice the bracing inside the box.

 

Doug  Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Scott H. Haycock
Sent: Wednesday, January 30, 2019 2:45 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Gondola Load

 

Bruce,

 

My guess would be large scale industrial plumbing, or possibly waste treatment, or a dam. The large crates probably contain parts needed to fit the conduits's into their final location. The conduit seems to be at least 6 feet in diameter.

 

Scott Haycock
Modeling Tarheel country in the Land of Enchantment

On January 30, 2019 at 1:32 AM Bruce Griffin <bdg1210@...> wrote:

Friends,

Attached is a photo of a freight car load on a B&O train I model. It is on a local between Baltimore and western Maryland around 1950. Anyone have an idea what this could be?  It for sure looks to be an interesting load for a pair of gons.  Any insights appreciated.  

i will try to post a higher resolution scan tomorrow. Thank you for your input. 

Best Regards,
Bruce Griffin
Ashland, MD

https://bomodeling.com/blog/


Re: DA composite GS gon FS

Clark Propst
 

Changed the subject line. Thanks for the correction, should have known better I've looked at the box...
CW Propst


Re: Gondola Load

Daniel A. Mitchell
 

Obviously they’re large tubes of some kind … I’d suggest either for a steel mill or some hydro-electric or water supply purpose. The good question is what’s inside the wooden crate portion of the load? It seems to support the upper end of the tube, but there’s more going on inside the crate. Nice find.

Dan Mitchell
==========

On Jan 30, 2019, at 3:32 AM, Bruce Griffin <bdg1210@...> wrote:

Friends,

Attached is a photo of a freight car load on a B&O train I model. It is on a local between Baltimore and western Maryland around 1950. Anyone have an idea what this could be?  It for sure looks to be an interesting load for a pair of gons.  Any insights appreciated.  

i will try to post a higher resolution scan tomorrow. Thank you for your input. 

Best Regards,
Bruce Griffin
Ashland, MD

https://bomodeling.com/blog/ <DD7C253F_AACB_44B6_B441_76932E91FB11.jpeg>


Re: Alexander scale models

Nolan Hinshaw
 

On Jan 29, 2019, at 1:57 PM, Daniel A. Mitchell wrote:

The only Roco Minimovers scrapers I’m familiar with were Caterpillar prototypes. The same scraper bowl came with three tractor versions …
[other spotting features appreciated]

Thank you for updating my old-rons; after I posted I groveled the web for pictures, which overloaded my chagrin circuits.
--
Chagrin, chagrin, yaddida yaddida...


Re: Linkage repair on a brass locomotive

Daniel A. Mitchell
 

Almost all HO steam locos use/used "hollow rivets" (not Pop-Rivets) for the pivot joints in their valve-gear linkages. Precision Scale offers a variety of these. Maybe Greenway too. They come in many diameters and lengths.

A “Hollow Rivet” has a solid shank below the head with a drilled-out hollow (tube-like) point. Once inserted in the links, the hollow point is spread (flared) and then rolled over forming a flange. It thus ends up with the head on one end, and the flange on the opposite end, holding the links together but allowing them to pivot. A special rivet-set tool does this flaring best, but lacking that a center-punch works to start the flare, and some very careful work with a tiny jewler’s ball-peen hammer can finish it.

*IF* you have access to a small lathe, such rivets are not hard to make.

Dan Mitchell
==========

On Jan 29, 2019, at 8:04 PM, Bryian Sones via Groups.Io <bryian.sones@...> wrote:

Hi All,

I had the linkage break on one of my brass locomotives. It appears to have been held together by a tiny brass pop rivet. Does anyone have a suggestion on the best way to replace it and reconnect the linkage?

Thanks,

Bryian Sones
Union Pacific Prototype Modeler
Murrieta, CA


Re: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Gondola Load

Bruce Smith
 

Bruce,

I’ll second Elden here. My immediate response was penstocks and associated hardware.

Regards

The other Bruce


Bruce F. Smith            

Auburn, AL

"Some days you are the bug, some days you are the windshield."




On Jan 30, 2019, at 6:45 AM, Gatwood, Elden J SAD <elden.j.gatwood@...> wrote:

Bruce;

I think it is part of a penstock, large outlet, or possibly, part of a large pumping plant.  There were a lot of dams and waterworks being built in that timeframe in the U.S.

Elden Gatwood

-----Original Message-----
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Bruce Griffin
Sent: Wednesday, January 30, 2019 3:32 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Gondola Load

Friends,

Attached is a photo of a freight car load on a B&O train I model. It is on a local between Baltimore and western Maryland around 1950. Anyone have an idea what this could be?  It for sure looks to be an interesting load for a pair of gons.  Any insights appreciated.  

i will try to post a higher resolution scan tomorrow. Thank you for your input.

Best Regards,
Bruce Griffin
Ashland, MD

Blockedhttps://bomodeling.com/blog/






Re: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Gondola Load

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Bruce;

I think it is part of a penstock, large outlet, or possibly, part of a large pumping plant. There were a lot of dams and waterworks being built in that timeframe in the U.S.

Elden Gatwood

-----Original Message-----
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Bruce Griffin
Sent: Wednesday, January 30, 2019 3:32 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Gondola Load

Friends,

Attached is a photo of a freight car load on a B&O train I model. It is on a local between Baltimore and western Maryland around 1950. Anyone have an idea what this could be? It for sure looks to be an interesting load for a pair of gons. Any insights appreciated.

i will try to post a higher resolution scan tomorrow. Thank you for your input.

Best Regards,
Bruce Griffin
Ashland, MD

Blockedhttps://bomodeling.com/blog/


Parts removal

Eric Hansmann
 

To upgrade a new Rapido boxcar, some parts needed to be removed. It was easier than expected with steps outlined in the latest DesignBuildOp blog post. 

http://designbuildop.hansmanns.org/2019/01/30/alterations/


Eric Hansmann

Murfreesboro, TN


Re: Gondola Load

Scott H. Haycock
 

Bruce,


My guess would be large scale industrial plumbing, or possibly waste treatment, or a dam. The large crates probably contain parts needed to fit the conduits's into their final location. The conduit seems to be at least 6 feet in diameter.


Scott Haycock
Modeling Tarheel country in the Land of Enchantm
ent

On January 30, 2019 at 1:32 AM Bruce Griffin <bdg1210@...> wrote:

Friends,

Attached is a photo of a freight car load on a B&O train I model. It is on a local between Baltimore and western Maryland around 1950. Anyone have an idea what this could be?  It for sure looks to be an interesting load for a pair of gons.  Any insights appreciated.  

i will try to post a higher resolution scan tomorrow. Thank you for your input. 

Best Regards,
Bruce Griffin
Ashland, MD

https://bomodeling.com/blog/


Gondola Load

Bruce Griffin
 

Friends,

Attached is a photo of a freight car load on a B&O train I model. It is on a local between Baltimore and western Maryland around 1950. Anyone have an idea what this could be?  It for sure looks to be an interesting load for a pair of gons.  Any insights appreciated.  

i will try to post a higher resolution scan tomorrow. Thank you for your input. 

Best Regards,
Bruce Griffin
Ashland, MD

https://bomodeling.com/blog/


Modeling a Lever Hand Brake

Richard Bale <Rhbale@...>
 

Gene…

 

I misidentified the lever action hand brakes in Bruce Griffin’s original inquiry posted 1/20/19.

 

On closer examination they are clearly not Universal Type 5790-A devices as I suggested. They share a stirrup handle but beyond that the action is entirely different.

 

Thanks for correcting me.

 

Bye the way, I posted my response on 1/21 and it did not show up until 1/29. Not very timely.

 

Richard Bale

Oceanside CA


Re: Linkage repair on a brass locomotive

Douglas Harding
 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Bryian Sones via Groups.Io
Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2019 9:08 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Linkage repair on a brass locomotive

 

Doug,

 

No, just the rivet broke. The lip on the pop rivet wore out. It probably wasn't maintenance properly and wore down. The linkage is fine.

 

Regards,

 

Bryian Sones

Union Pacific Prototype Modeler

Murrieta, CA

 

On Tuesday, January 29, 2019 6:55 PM, Douglas Harding <doug.harding@...> wrote:

 

Bryian did the rivet break? Or did the linkage itself break? If it is the rivet, Kemtron, among others, at one time sold HO rivets for attaching linkages together. If the linkage rod broke, you may have to trace the broken part on a piece of brass and file out a new one.

 

Doug  Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Bryian Sones via Groups.Io
Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2019 8:02 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Linkage repair on a brass locomotive

 

Hi Tony,

 

Sorry unable to post a pic at the moment but possibly later. The side rod linkage that is broken attaches to the Eccentric; The locomotive is a Ho scale,  Key Imports early Challenger

If that helps any? I'll try and post a pick later.

 

Thanks,

 

Bryian Sones

Union Pacific Prototype Modeler

Murrieta, CA

 

On Tuesday, January 29, 2019 5:36 PM, Todd Horton via Groups.Io <toddchorton@...> wrote:

 

Brian, Can you post a picture of what broke?  

 

Todd Horton

 


From: Bryian Sones via Groups.Io <bryian.sones@...>
To: STMFC <main@realstmfc.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2019 8:04 PM
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Linkage repair on a brass locomotive

 

Hi All,

 

I had the linkage break on one of my brass locomotives. It appears to have been held together by a tiny brass pop rivet. Does anyone have a suggestion on the best way to replace it and reconnect the linkage?

 

Thanks,

 

Bryian Sones

Union Pacific Prototype Modeler

Murrieta, CA

 

 

 


Re: brass groups on Facebook

Bryian Sones
 

Very helpful,  Thanks Hugh!

 
Bryian Sones
Union Pacific Prototype Modeler
Murrieta, CA


On Tuesday, January 29, 2019 7:52 PM, Hugh Guillaume via Groups.Io <mguill1224@...> wrote:


The  Brass Collectors And Operators
The Brass Backshop
The Brass Depot
Brass Locomotive Collectors
Brass Model Train Buy Swap And Sell

Check these out for help with brass models.



brass groups on Facebook

 

The  Brass Collectors And Operators
The Brass Backshop
The Brass Depot
Brass Locomotive Collectors
Brass Model Train Buy Swap And Sell

Check these out for help with brass models.


Re: Linkage repair on a brass locomotive

Bryian Sones
 

Thanks Ralph, 

I'll give Bowser a call in the morning. I appreciate everyone's help.

Thank you! 
  
Bryian Sones
Union Pacific Prototype Modeler
Murrieta, CA


On Tuesday, January 29, 2019 7:41 PM, Ralph W. Brown <rbrown51@...> wrote:


Hi Brian,
 
The Bowser website (www.bowser-trains.com) pages for their now discontinued steam locomotive kits indicates that “Most repair parts are available,” so they may well have the valve gear rivets, which are tiny little things, and the riveting tool, if you need one.
 
Good luck finding what you need.
 
Pax,
 
 
Ralph Brown
Portland, Maine
PRRT&HS No. 3966
NMRA No. L2532

rbrown51[at]maine[dot]rr[dot]com
 
Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2019 10:07 PM
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Linkage repair on a brass locomotive
 
Doug,
 
No, just the rivet broke. The lip on the pop rivet wore out. It probably wasn't maintenance properly and wore down. The linkage is fine.
 
Regards,
 
Bryian Sones
Union Pacific Prototype Modeler
Murrieta, CA


On Tuesday, January 29, 2019 6:55 PM, Douglas Harding <doug.harding@...> wrote:


Bryian did the rivet break? Or did the linkage itself break? If it is the rivet, Kemtron, among others, at one time sold HO rivets for attaching linkages together. If the linkage rod broke, you may have to trace the broken part on a piece of brass and file out a new one.
 
Doug  Harding
www.iowacentralrr.org
 
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Bryian Sones via Groups.Io
Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2019 8:02 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Linkage repair on a brass locomotive
 
Hi Tony,
 
Sorry unable to post a pic at the moment but possibly later. The side rod linkage that is broken attaches to the Eccentric; The locomotive is a Ho scale,  Key Imports early Challenger
If that helps any? I'll try and post a pick later.
 
Thanks,
 
Bryian Sones
Union Pacific Prototype Modeler
Murrieta, CA
 
On Tuesday, January 29, 2019 5:36 PM, Todd Horton via Groups.Io <toddchorton@...> wrote:
 
Brian, Can you post a picture of what broke? 
 
Todd Horton
 

From: Bryian Sones via Groups.Io <bryian.sones@...>
To: STMFC <main@realstmfc.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2019 8:04 PM
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Linkage repair on a brass locomotive
 
Hi All,
 
I had the linkage break on one of my brass locomotives. It appears to have been held together by a tiny brass pop rivet. Does anyone have a suggestion on the best way to replace it and reconnect the linkage?
 
Thanks,
 
Bryian Sones
Union Pacific Prototype Modeler
Murrieta, CA
 
 





Re: Linkage repair on a brass locomotive

Ralph W. Brown
 

Hi Brian,
 
The Bowser website (www.bowser-trains.com) pages for their now discontinued steam locomotive kits indicates that “Most repair parts are available,” so they may well have the valve gear rivets, which are tiny little things, and the riveting tool, if you need one.
 
Good luck finding what you need.
 
Pax,
 
 
Ralph Brown
Portland, Maine
PRRT&HS No. 3966
NMRA No. L2532

rbrown51[at]maine[dot]rr[dot]com
 

From: Bryian Sones via Groups.Io
Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2019 10:07 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Linkage repair on a brass locomotive
 
Doug,
 
No, just the rivet broke. The lip on the pop rivet wore out. It probably wasn't maintenance properly and wore down. The linkage is fine.
 
Regards,
 
Bryian Sones
Union Pacific Prototype Modeler
Murrieta, CA


On Tuesday, January 29, 2019 6:55 PM, Douglas Harding <doug.harding@...> wrote:


Bryian did the rivet break? Or did the linkage itself break? If it is the rivet, Kemtron, among others, at one time sold HO rivets for attaching linkages together. If the linkage rod broke, you may have to trace the broken part on a piece of brass and file out a new one.
 
Doug  Harding
www.iowacentralrr.org
 
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Bryian Sones via Groups.Io
Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2019 8:02 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Linkage repair on a brass locomotive
 
Hi Tony,
 
Sorry unable to post a pic at the moment but possibly later. The side rod linkage that is broken attaches to the Eccentric; The locomotive is a Ho scale,  Key Imports early Challenger
If that helps any? I'll try and post a pick later.
 
Thanks,
 
Bryian Sones
Union Pacific Prototype Modeler
Murrieta, CA
 
On Tuesday, January 29, 2019 5:36 PM, Todd Horton via Groups.Io <toddchorton@...> wrote:
 
Brian, Can you post a picture of what broke? 
 
Todd Horton
 

From: Bryian Sones via Groups.Io <bryian.sones@...>
To: STMFC <main@realstmfc.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2019 8:04 PM
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Linkage repair on a brass locomotive
 
Hi All,
 
I had the linkage break on one of my brass locomotives. It appears to have been held together by a tiny brass pop rivet. Does anyone have a suggestion on the best way to replace it and reconnect the linkage?
 
Thanks,
 
Bryian Sones
Union Pacific Prototype Modeler
Murrieta, CA
 
 



Re: Linkage repair on a brass locomotive

Bryian Sones
 

Thanks Bruce, I'm familiar with rivet tools. I've used them in other application in the automotive field. I used to build show cars for the CES and the SEMA show when I was younger. I wasn't sure if there was a hand tool available to replace rivets that small or if it was stamped during production and the end user was left with fabricating some sort of replacement if it wore out. I'll see if Bowser still sells the tool. Is there anyone else that might sell the rivet tool?

Thanks,

Bryian Sones
Union Pacific Prototype Modeler
Murrieta, CA


On Tuesday, January 29, 2019 7:07 PM, Bruce Smith <smithbf@...> wrote:


​Brian,

There are a number of suppliers of rivets of that size and having a rivet tool is very useful. Micro rivets are usually hollow tubular stock. The rivet will come with one side formed. I insert the rivet, put the formed side on a hard surface and then gently peen the unformed side. The tool I use is about 1/8 diameter stock with a concave end that helps in peening over the rivet end. Mine came from Bowser.

Regards
Bruce


From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> on behalf of Bryian Sones via Groups.Io <bryian.sones@...>
Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2019 8:46 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Linkage repair on a brass locomotive
 
Bruce,
No, I have never had to replace a rivet linkage before. However I have Quartered Repaired and painted also added fixture details and sound decoders to many brass locomotives. I have even painted brass professionally so I'm not afraid to tackle the task. I'm just not aware of the process to produce a replacement rivet. I could easily fabricate a replacement from brass stock as a stand in but I'm not sure if that is how it is done or is there a rivet tool?

Kind regards,
  
Bryian Sones
Union Pacific Prototype Modeler
Murrieta, CA


On Tuesday, January 29, 2019 6:24 PM, Bruce Smith <smithbf@...> wrote:


​I would suggest a tiny brass pop rivet ;)  I realize that you may never have riveted valve gear and it isn't as simple as using a screw, but any owner of steam models should have this skill in their quiver. 

Regards
Bruce Smith
Auburn, AL


From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> on behalf of Bryian Sones via Groups.Io <bryian.sones@...>
Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2019 7:04 PM
To: STMFC
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Linkage repair on a brass locomotive
 
Hi All,

I had the linkage break on one of my brass locomotives. It appears to have been held together by a tiny brass pop rivet. Does anyone have a suggestion on the best way to replace it and reconnect the linkage?

Thanks,

Bryian Sones
Union Pacific Prototype Modeler
Murrieta, CA





Re: Linkage repair on a brass locomotive

Bryian Sones
 

Doug,

No, just the rivet broke. The lip on the pop rivet wore out. It probably wasn't maintenance properly and wore down. The linkage is fine.

Regards,
 
Bryian Sones
Union Pacific Prototype Modeler
Murrieta, CA


On Tuesday, January 29, 2019 6:55 PM, Douglas Harding <doug.harding@...> wrote:


Bryian did the rivet break? Or did the linkage itself break? If it is the rivet, Kemtron, among others, at one time sold HO rivets for attaching linkages together. If the linkage rod broke, you may have to trace the broken part on a piece of brass and file out a new one.
 
Doug  Harding
www.iowacentralrr.org
 
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Bryian Sones via Groups.Io
Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2019 8:02 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Linkage repair on a brass locomotive
 
Hi Tony,
 
Sorry unable to post a pic at the moment but possibly later. The side rod linkage that is broken attaches to the Eccentric; The locomotive is a Ho scale,  Key Imports early Challenger
If that helps any? I'll try and post a pick later.
 
Thanks,
 
Bryian Sones
Union Pacific Prototype Modeler
Murrieta, CA
 
On Tuesday, January 29, 2019 5:36 PM, Todd Horton via Groups.Io <toddchorton@...> wrote:
 
Brian, Can you post a picture of what broke?  
 
Todd Horton
 

From: Bryian Sones via Groups.Io <bryian.sones@...>
To: STMFC <main@realstmfc.groups.io>
Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2019 8:04 PM
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Linkage repair on a brass locomotive
 
Hi All,
 
I had the linkage break on one of my brass locomotives. It appears to have been held together by a tiny brass pop rivet. Does anyone have a suggestion on the best way to replace it and reconnect the linkage?
 
Thanks,
 
Bryian Sones
Union Pacific Prototype Modeler
Murrieta, CA
 
 


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