Date   
Re: bonsallscalecarshops D&RGW Gondolas

Mark Hemphill
 

Tim O'Connor -- I don't know the time frame of your video, but if it was taken in the 1923-1960 time frame, the pig iron would most likely be from Ironton, Utah, and most likely would be en route to Pittsburg, California.  Ironton was a 600-ton per day blast furnace / byproduct coke oven plant built in 1922-1923 to supply pig iron to Columbia Steel's open-hearth furnaces at Pittsburg and Torrance, Calif. Those open-hearths supplied a plate mill, hot-rolled sheet mill, cold-rolled sheet mill, and tinplate mill at Pittsburg; I don't have the paper in front of me to list what type(s) of rolling mills were at Torrance. (Columbia Steel also purchased an existing steel mill (open-hearths, rolling mills) at Portland, Oregon, at some point.)  US Steel bought Columbia Steel in 1930 and operated it as a subsidiary. US Steel bought the Geneva Works from the Defense Plant Corporation in 1946, and operated it as the subsidiary Geneva Steel Co., until 1951, when the two Utah/California steel companies were merged as Columbia-Geneva Steel Co., a USS subsidiary. A 900-ton blast furnace purchased from a defunct mill at Joliet, Illinois, was re-erected at Ironton in 1943 by the Defense Plant Corporation, to increase the pig-iron supply at Pittsburg. The DPC sold the 900-ton blast furnace to Kaiser Steel post-war; Kaiser at the time was having difficulties getting enough iron out of its blast furnaces at Fontana to supply its open-hearths. Kaiser later resold this to USS. In 1943, Blast Furnace & Steel Plant reported that 75% of the pig iron output of Ironton was going to Pittsburg and Torrance, with the balance sold locally or in California to foundries.

Mark Hemphill

Re: bonsallscalecarshops D&RGW Gondolas

Mark Hemphill
 

Ron, thanks a million for the good start on MoPac.  Is there a MoPac freight guide anywhere, like was done for the Rio Grande by Jim Eager?

Allen -- I'm not aware of any UCR GS gons. If there were, I'd seriously consider chucking 1965 Tennessee Pass, for 1945 Soldier Summit. Fewer trees to build, that's for sure!  Also, those car counts from October 1947 are fascinating.  

Mark Hemphill

Re: bonsallscalecarshops D&RGW Gondolas

Allen Rueter
 

In Oct '47 a fair number GS gons were headed north on the Inside Gateway (Oregon Trunk) at Bieber

44 ATSF XMR 10800 10999
45 DRGW GS 45000 45499
46 ATSF XMR 64200 64699
49 ATSF XAR 9000 9199
49 DRGW GS 71000 71999
56 UCR GS 20000 21999
58 DRGW GS 70000 70699
60 ATSF XMR 9200 9455
98 DRGW GS 40000 42500
532 GN FM 69500 69999

has any one done a UCR GS?

-- Allen Rueter StLouis MO


On Sunday, February 10, 2019, 3:04:40 PM CST, Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:



I have attached my only shot of one of the 36 foot GS gondolas which lasted in service until 1959,
if not later! (Just over 100 were still in service in 1955, a decline from the almost 700 cars in 1950.)

The photo is from Barstow, in the 1940's.

Tim O'Connor




On 2/10/2019 11:48 AM, Corey Bonsall wrote:
Maybe it's time I step out of the shadows to explain some of what I've been doing with these 3D printed cars...

Let's start with some history, most of which I have gleaned from Jim Eager's article in the second quarter 2002 issue of The Prospector (Rio Grande Modeling & Historical Society, Volume 1, Number 2):

Overall, ten series of steel GS gondolas, built between 1908 and 1954, totaling 8,251 cars.

(All lengths are interior)

They started with 2501 of the 36 ft cars (40000-42500) in 1908-09, followed by 350 of the 40 ft cars (43000-43349) in 1912-13.  The big "offset" cars of 46 ft length (700 total in the 70000-70699 series) showed up in 1922, with 500 of the shorter offset 42 ft (45000-45499) cousins in 1926.  

I think Mark Hemphill (Thanks, Mark!) has me beat on the details of the rest of the fleet already in another thread that just showed up in my email...

Those are the cars I have designed and printed to this point, since I really wanted a fleet of D&RGW GS gondolas, but other than the brass W&R cars, and the somewhat close Red Caboose class of 42ft 46k series cars, there wasn't anything close.  As the time spent drafting up the cars is one of the larger investments I have, I started with what I wanted (cast grabs, for durability, and for large fleet expediency), and am working through adding a "blank" option for all of the cars for those who want the option to drill and form their own grab irons, and spend more time on the brakes.

The cars are all printed on a Form 2 printer, using their standard black resin (methyl-acrylic-something-something), but in response to Bill's question, it does NOT carve like styrene.  It can be sanded, or filed, but using a knife-edge makes it crack. Some of the dimensions I have to compromise, due to the limitations of the printer, but I think the overall result has easily passed my normal "Two Foot Rule" I use in my modeling.

Some of my finished cars should be visible in the album links below:

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.2190102484587585&type=1&l=14b0223f99

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.1923391824591987&type=1&l=2cd9241278

I have not attempted resin casting, as there are a lot of overhanging details that I felt would not release from the molds, and I wasn't quite ready to jump into a second new avenue for myself.  I am doing this as a side hobby from my normal day job, so the progress can seem eternally slow.

I am grateful for the support I've received on this endeavor, and I hope to continue working through the many related possibilities in under-represented models as time allows.

Corey Bonsall
Bonsall Scale Carshops


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts

Detail Associates composite side GS gondola kit wanted

Richard Townsend
 

I am looking for a Detail Associates composite side GS gondola kit. If you have one you want to sell, please contact me OFF-LIST at richtownsend@....


Richard Townsend
Lincoln City, OR


Re: bonsallscalecarshops D&RGW Gondolas

Tim O'Connor
 


I have attached my only shot of one of the 36 foot GS gondolas which lasted in service until 1959,
if not later! (Just over 100 were still in service in 1955, a decline from the almost 700 cars in 1950.)

The photo is from Barstow, in the 1940's.

Tim O'Connor




On 2/10/2019 11:48 AM, Corey Bonsall wrote:
Maybe it's time I step out of the shadows to explain some of what I've been doing with these 3D printed cars...

Let's start with some history, most of which I have gleaned from Jim Eager's article in the second quarter 2002 issue of The Prospector (Rio Grande Modeling & Historical Society, Volume 1, Number 2):

Overall, ten series of steel GS gondolas, built between 1908 and 1954, totaling 8,251 cars.

(All lengths are interior)

They started with 2501 of the 36 ft cars (40000-42500) in 1908-09, followed by 350 of the 40 ft cars (43000-43349) in 1912-13.  The big "offset" cars of 46 ft length (700 total in the 70000-70699 series) showed up in 1922, with 500 of the shorter offset 42 ft (45000-45499) cousins in 1926.  

I think Mark Hemphill (Thanks, Mark!) has me beat on the details of the rest of the fleet already in another thread that just showed up in my email...

Those are the cars I have designed and printed to this point, since I really wanted a fleet of D&RGW GS gondolas, but other than the brass W&R cars, and the somewhat close Red Caboose class of 42ft 46k series cars, there wasn't anything close.  As the time spent drafting up the cars is one of the larger investments I have, I started with what I wanted (cast grabs, for durability, and for large fleet expediency), and am working through adding a "blank" option for all of the cars for those who want the option to drill and form their own grab irons, and spend more time on the brakes.

The cars are all printed on a Form 2 printer, using their standard black resin (methyl-acrylic-something-something), but in response to Bill's question, it does NOT carve like styrene.  It can be sanded, or filed, but using a knife-edge makes it crack. Some of the dimensions I have to compromise, due to the limitations of the printer, but I think the overall result has easily passed my normal "Two Foot Rule" I use in my modeling.

Some of my finished cars should be visible in the album links below:

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.2190102484587585&type=1&l=14b0223f99

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.1923391824591987&type=1&l=2cd9241278

I have not attempted resin casting, as there are a lot of overhanging details that I felt would not release from the molds, and I wasn't quite ready to jump into a second new avenue for myself.  I am doing this as a side hobby from my normal day job, so the progress can seem eternally slow.

I am grateful for the support I've received on this endeavor, and I hope to continue working through the many related possibilities in under-represented models as time allows.

Corey Bonsall
Bonsall Scale Carshops


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts

Re: bonsallscalecarshops D&RGW Gondolas

Tim O'Connor
 

I have a steam era video of Donner Pass showing gondolas westbound over Donner loaded
with PIG IRON slugs - piles of them at each end of the cars with an empty space between. Lots
of Utah and Colorado coal also travelled west over Donner. Cement plants use a lot of coal and
I think SP, even in the steam era, would bring coal "east" through the San Joaquin valley over
Tehachapi to Monolith, after it had first come west over Donner.

Tim O'

On 2/10/2019 11:33 AM, Mark Hemphill via Groups.Io wrote:
Bill:  I'm sorry that I didn't see your post while I was in the process of answering Ron's (and doing some work email).  I think I probably answered some of what you were asking.  D&RGW didn't produce much on line in the way of manufactured goods, but rather products of mines, fields, and forests (and not much in the way of forests). If we're thinking about movements east, the only common commodities that moved off D&RGW in gons going east, other than coal, would be zinc concentrates going to Bartlesville, Oklahoma, rail from CF&I, and there was also some round wood that moved to pulp mills in Wisconsin in the 1940-1960 era that was loaded at Dotsero, Fraser, Granby, and some other points on the Moffat. Scrap metal moving east wouldn't get past Minnequa.

CF&I Minnequa was a bar, wire, and rail mill that supplied western markets. It was not competitive with midwestern mills on an as-delivered basis for commodity steel products beyond central Kansas. CF&I also had a substantial output of specialty steel products such as barbed wire, fence posts, nails, and grader blades, and its market for those extended deep into Kansas, Oklahoma, Nebraska, and Texas. But none of those moved in large volumes by rail, just boxcars and gons dribbled out in small numbers each week.

Mark Hemphill
--
*Tim O'Connor*
*Sterling, Massachusetts*

Intermountain modified '37 AAR 10'6" undec boxcar kit

Andy Carlson
 

Hello-
As I continue to sell off my freight car parts and kits, I now wish to find new homes for 5 new Intermountain #40899 undecorated kits of 1937 AAR 10'6" IH box cars with 5/5 early Dreadnaught ends.

Offered for $20 each, shipping to the US included. I accept checks and money orders. With a small fee I also accept PayPal. Contact me off-list for details.
Thanks,
-Andy Carlson
Ojai CA

Six weeks until RPM-East!

Eric Hansmann
 

It is time to make your RPM-East plans and rekindle your modeling efforts! Six weeks remain until this gathering in suburban Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. There will be plenty of action March 22 & 23.

 

  • two days of prototype and model presentations
  • a large display room to share your modeling efforts and learn new techniques
  • a variety of vendors selling goods for prototype modeling
  • Thursday evening operating sessions on local model railroads
  • an informal Saturday buffet
  • Sunday model railroad layouts to visit

 

The last day for $35 early-bird registration is March 1st.

An informal Saturday banquet is $29.

 

There is a special hotel room rate of $95 per night.

 

Registration forms, hotel information and more can be found at the RPM-East website:

http://hansmanns.org/rpm_east/index.htm

 

 

We have over 30 modelers and historians committed to presentations for our meet. Several presentation titles have been posted to our website.

 

Set your schedule and register now for RPM-East!

 

 

Eric Hansmann

RPM-East Publicity and Web Guy

 

Re: bonsallscalecarshops D&RGW Gondolas

mopacfirst
 

Mark:

This could probably be a different thread.

The Stewart MoPac/Mo-Ill car is a good representation. Out of the box, the lettering is pretty decent but the builder's stencil is on it, and the car numbers are not well representative of what we call the 'DeSoto' lettering style.  The old Oddballs and the new Speedwitch decal lettering style are much better.  For your timeframe, the renumbering into six-digit series hadn't seriously begun yet, but many of these cars would have been repainted.  Cars painted before 1961 would have the Eagles slogan on the MP cars, never on the M-I.  Cars repainted after 1961 would be red, still have the 42" buzzsaw, and cars painted after about 1963 would have the 60" buzzsaw and a different, more square and thin lettering style.

The Atlas two-bay car is good, rather than the Athearn.  The Atlas car is available with 30" herald and no slogan, as for cars painted before 1948.  The reporting marks and number are an odd style that ACF actually used on one batch of cars, while other cars had the DeSoto lettering style.  Cars repainted after 1948 had the slogan and 42" buzzsaw.  Atlas offered another paint scheme representing cars built after 1956 with the slogan, but the 1" stripes removed.  Relatively few cars were painted like this due to the narrow time frame.  And very few cars lasted until 1965 when the six-digit renumbering began.

There were four-bay cars built in 1930, like the old Athearn or NLI.  Neither is 100% accurate, but good for two-foot viewing.  These cars were mostly worn out by the early 60s.  See also the mopac.org site for this description from Ed Hawkins:   http://mopac.org/modeling/50-mopac-painting-information-from-ed-hawkins

There were 100-ton four-bay hoppers already in existence, built beginning in 1962, which eventually became a signature MP system car.  But in their first years, numbered in the 67000 series, they were primarily captive in iron pellet loading in Missouri.  The first ones were 3209 cubic feet, shorter than the more famous larger-capacity cars that came later.  I mention this because this later car has been widely modeled.

This should be a good start.

Ron Merrick

Re: bonsallscalecarshops D&RGW Gondolas

Mark Hemphill
 

Ron, I need to have some MoPac hoppers on my 64-65 Rio Grande Tennessee Pass layout. But I'm no expert on the MoPac, and it's hard enough learning about Rio Grande, much less another railroad. (Please don't feel any embarrassment about mixing up Marshall Pass and Monarch :) ... what I know about the MoPac i could write out in 10-15 seconds.) I have some Stewart offset side 70-ton hoppers lettered for MoPac and Missouri-Illinois, and some Atlas 50-ton offset side hoppers also lettered for MoPac.  Are either of these cars even remotely accurate for MoPac?  Are there any other RTR models in HO that are close for MoPac in the 64-65 era?

Mark Hemphill  

Re: D&RGW coal train, which cars appropriate?

Mark Hemphill
 

I can't figure out how to edit these yet.  A couple of corrections are needed.  First, UCR coal gons were of course THE basic fleet car of the Utah Railway, they just weren't common loading on D&RGW mines in the Book Cliffs and Wasatch Plateau Coal Fields. Most of the mines in Spring Canyon were served by Utah and D&RGW on parallel branch lines. Sometimes a mine loading a Utah car would decide to bill it on D&RGW, and vice versa.  Second, I meant to say that box cars were up to 25 percent of the coal loadings in the summer months, not average 25 percent. Some of the mines didn't shipped little or no domestic heating grades and these mines didn't have many box car loadings. Some of the mines shipped mostly domestic heating grades and were mostly box car loadings. Box cars were extremely common on the Moffat-served mines, less so in the Raton Field.

Mark Hemphill 

Truck Journal Conversions

Bob Chaparro
 

With respect to converting solid bearing trucks to roller bearings, I read, "Friction bearing truck sides were not designed for roller bearings and the truck sides cracked."

Any truth to this?

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA

Re: bonsallscalecarshops D&RGW Gondolas

mopacfirst
 

Mark:

Thanks for the specifics.  I get Marshall and Monarch mixed up all the time, but forgive me, I'm a flatlander.  I'm happy to hear more details about the flow of loads out of Colorado, especially for anything coming east.  It would probably have been a rare day for one of these cars showing up in Wichita.  I already know about the scarcity of other Rio Grande cars there.  But, I have plenty of MoPac two-bay and three-bay coal hoppers.  Two-bays rapidly disappeared after 1960, probably related to the demise of the retail coal market.  My Wichita house, built in 1914, shows no sign of ever having a coal bin or a coal furnace, although houses across the street do.

Corey:

For black cars with complex geometries like these, I'd be perfectly happy with cast-on grabs and end ladders.  So I'm not one who wishes to push the envelope all that much.  Thanks for the advice on the material construction.

Ron Merrick

Re: bonsallscalecarshops D&RGW Gondolas

Chuck Soule
 

One of my earliest railroad-related memories is seeing Rio Grande gondolas in Tacoma bound for the Asarco smelter.  They were a major source of copper ore to the smelter from US sources (the smelter also got a lot of ore from overseas by ship).  I think what caught my eye at that young age was the flying Rio Grande logo.

Chuck Soule

Re: bonsallscalecarshops D&RGW Gondolas

Bill Welch
 

Thank you Mark and Corey for you very helpful and thorough responses. Please keep this group posted on your progress with the "Blank Side" option.

Bill Welch

Re: D&RGW coal train, which cars appropriate?

vapeurchapelon
 

Hello Mark,
 
wow! This is quite some information, many thanks! Seems that I misunderstood Tim in regards of composite side gondolas. Only recently I learned that Detail Associates did the steel side version, too - as was done by Red Caboose. So, before this, I did assume Tim meant the composite side type when speaking of the Red Caboose AND the Detail Associates model.
 
So it seems there is no other brass model available for a D&RGW coal train as the W&R model.
 
Then perhaps it will become a new project for me to assemble a train of all versions of the 3D-print models together with the Red Caboose STEEL SIDE GS gondola. Definitely it will look very nice!
 
Thanks again to all.
 
Johannes
Modeling the early post-war years up to about 1953
 
Gesendet: Sonntag, 10. Februar 2019 um 16:45 Uhr
Von: "Mark Hemphill via Groups.Io" <markwmhemphill@...>
An: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Betreff: Re: [RealSTMFC] D&RGW coal train, which cars appropriate?
i don't know what era you are modeling, which would really help. So I tried to give a broad guide for the 1920-1960 era below. 
 

This is the roster for D&RGW gondolas used in coal in the 1930-1960 time frame, not including later renumbers in the 1950s, derived from data provided by Jim Eager.  Other than Corey Bonsall and W&R, none of these cars are directly offered in an accurate model in HO. The 46000-46499 50-ton cars have a close match in the Red Caboose GS gon (absent the Duryea underframe). The problem is the 46000-46499 cars weren’t much used in coal service because they were 50-ton cars in a Western Territory rate structure that wanted 70-ton cars by the time they were manufactured in 1948. They were more often used for sugar beets, round wood, ties, and other low-density commodities.

 

D&RGW coal was as much as 50 percent loaded in box cars in the winter months, and approximately 25 percent loaded in box cars in the summer months. Generally the high-value lump sizes used for domestic heating were loaded in boxcars, and the mine-run and crushed sizes used for industrial fuel, coking, and railroad fuel were loaded in gons.  Box cars used for coal were anything 36’ long or 40’ long that could be obtained, except usually not automobile box cars. Foreign road box cars were very common in coal traffic, more so than home-road cars. Stock cars were also frequently used for large lump sizes, with foreign road cars very common. 

 

Union Pacific and Utah Coal Route GS gons were not uncommon to see in Utah, but generally the Utah Coal Route didn’t filter into D&RGW service, probably because the Utah Railway griped strenuously when that happened. GN and WP gons showed up on occasion. I’ve never seen a photograph of an SP GS gon on D&RGW in coal traffic service. MoPac hoppers were not uncommon to see in Colorado, along with C&EI and Southern. Burlington, C&S, and Santa Fe gons and hoppers appear in photos in the pre-WWI years, but very rarely after WWI. D&SL gons wandered off into D&RGW service; I’ve seen photos of them at Pueblo. I’ve also seen photographs of Colorado Midland gons at Pueblo, before that road shut down. I’ve seen a few photos showing NYC, PRR, B&O, and N&W hoppers in the 1930-1965 time frame, but these are NOT common. Carbon Country Railway hoppers rarely ran east of Utah, but there’s one photograph showing three of them at Salida, circa 1965. – Mark Hemphill

 

40000-41000 – 36’0” IL, 50-ton, 1400 cf, PSC 1908, all steel, inside stakes sides, 10” wood side extensions applied by D&RGW

41001-42500 – 36’0” IL, 50-ton, 1400 cf, PSC 1908, all steel, inside stakes sides, 10” wood side extensions applied by D&RGW

43000-43349 – 40’0” IL, 50-ton, 1750 cf, PSC 1912, all steel, inside stakes sides

43350-43629 – 40’0” IL, 50-ton, 1658 cf, WSCF 1913, all steel, inside stakes sides, ex-D&SL 34001-34300, renumbered/relettered beginning 1947

45000-45499 – 42’0” IL, 55-ton, 2100 cf, PSC 1926, all steel, inside stakes sides

46000-46499 – 42’9” IL, 50-ton, 2100 cf, PSC, 1948, all steel, 7-rib riveted sides, ID 4 ends, Duryea underframe

46500-46999 – 42’9” IL, 50-ton, 2100 cf, PSC, 1948, all steel, 7-rib riveted sides, AAR 4 ends, Duryea underframe

47000-47499 – 42’9” IL, 50-ton, 2100 cf, PSC, 1949, all steel, 7-rib riveted sides, AAR 4 ends

70000-70699 – 46’3” IL, 70-ton, 2400 cf, WSCF 1922, all steel, inside stakes, some had coke racks applied by D&RGW

71000-71779 – 46’0” IL, 70-ton, 2340 cf, PSC 1943, steel UF, 7-rib composite sides, AAR 5 ends, Duryea UF, rebuilt with steel sides beginning 1949

71780-71999 – 46’0” IL, 70-ton, 2340 cf, PSC 1943, steel UF, 7-rib composite sides, AAR 5 ends, Duryea UF, rebuilt with steel sides beginning 1949

72000-73699 – 46’0” IL, 70-ton, 2410 cf, GATC 1953, all steel, 7 rib riveted sides, ID 5 ends

 

ID = Improved Dreadnaught Ends

IL = Inside Length

cf = cubic feet capacity

UF = underframe

GATC = General American Transportation Corp.

PSC = Pressed Steel Car

WSCF = Western Steel Car & Foundry

Re: bonsallscalecarshops D&RGW Gondolas

Mark Hemphill
 

Corey, you know, if you were making the 72000-73699 series, I'd have to have about 70 of them. Just sayin'.

Mark Hemphill

Re: bonsallscalecarshops D&RGW Gondolas

Corey Bonsall
 

Maybe it's time I step out of the shadows to explain some of what I've been doing with these 3D printed cars...

Let's start with some history, most of which I have gleaned from Jim Eager's article in the second quarter 2002 issue of The Prospector (Rio Grande Modeling & Historical Society, Volume 1, Number 2):

Overall, ten series of steel GS gondolas, built between 1908 and 1954, totaling 8,251 cars.

(All lengths are interior)

They started with 2501 of the 36 ft cars (40000-42500) in 1908-09, followed by 350 of the 40 ft cars (43000-43349) in 1912-13.  The big "offset" cars of 46 ft length (700 total in the 70000-70699 series) showed up in 1922, with 500 of the shorter offset 42 ft (45000-45499) cousins in 1926.  

I think Mark Hemphill (Thanks, Mark!) has me beat on the details of the rest of the fleet already in another thread that just showed up in my email...

Those are the cars I have designed and printed to this point, since I really wanted a fleet of D&RGW GS gondolas, but other than the brass W&R cars, and the somewhat close Red Caboose class of 42ft 46k series cars, there wasn't anything close.  As the time spent drafting up the cars is one of the larger investments I have, I started with what I wanted (cast grabs, for durability, and for large fleet expediency), and am working through adding a "blank" option for all of the cars for those who want the option to drill and form their own grab irons, and spend more time on the brakes.

The cars are all printed on a Form 2 printer, using their standard black resin (methyl-acrylic-something-something), but in response to Bill's question, it does NOT carve like styrene.  It can be sanded, or filed, but using a knife-edge makes it crack. Some of the dimensions I have to compromise, due to the limitations of the printer, but I think the overall result has easily passed my normal "Two Foot Rule" I use in my modeling.

Some of my finished cars should be visible in the album links below:

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.2190102484587585&type=1&l=14b0223f99

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.1923391824591987&type=1&l=2cd9241278

I have not attempted resin casting, as there are a lot of overhanging details that I felt would not release from the molds, and I wasn't quite ready to jump into a second new avenue for myself.  I am doing this as a side hobby from my normal day job, so the progress can seem eternally slow.

I am grateful for the support I've received on this endeavor, and I hope to continue working through the many related possibilities in under-represented models as time allows.

Corey Bonsall
Bonsall Scale Carshops
https://www.ebay.com/usr/bonsallscalecarshops
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCq-_HZ-5muFoz5sqjoEwdIQ


Re: D&RGW coal train, which cars appropriate?

Richard Townsend
 

Johannes and Bill,

Look carefully at what they offer. There are both 46' and 40' gons, and both with and without cast on grabs.

Richard Townsend
Lincoln City, OR


-----Original Message-----
From: vapeurchapelon <j.markwart@...>
To: main <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>
Sent: Sun, Feb 10, 2019 5:56 am
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] D&RGW coal train, which cars appropriate?

Hello friends,
 
lots of thanks for your input!
 
Richard, afaik the bonsallscalecarshops model is exactly the same type car I already have from W&R.
 
Many thanks Tim for your comment on the composite sides gon! Some hours ago I compared one of my Red Caboose models with the Precision Scale Brass model linked yesterday - and (to me) they are virtually identical. :-)
 
Garth, many thanks for your input! Seems that I should try to find a photo of one of the Pressed Steel Car Co. 46000-46499 40-foot, 10-inch GS gondolas, maybe these are (almost) similar to the linked UP and SP steel side gons?
 
Did D&RGW not have USRA composite side gondolas?
 
Thanks again and greetings
 
Johannes
 
Gesendet: Samstag, 09. Februar 2019 um 23:33 Uhr
Von: "Richard Townsend via Groups.Io" <richtownsend@...>
An: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Betreff: Re: [RealSTMFC] D&RGW coal train, which cars appropriate?
 
It's too bad you have to have brass, because the 3D printed gondolas from bonsallscalecarshops on eBay otherwise fit your D&RGW train.
 
Richard Townsend
Lincoln City, OR
 
-----Original Message-----
From: vapeurchapelon <j.markwart@...>
To: main <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>
Sent: Sat, Feb 9, 2019 1:28 pm
Subject: [RealSTMFC] D&RGW coal train, which cars appropriate?

 
Hello friends,

please allow another dumb question from a freight car newbie. Part of my "mixed freight" is a cut of D&RGW drop bottom coal gondolas, up to date 13 of the 47' type offered by W&R several years ago. I am assuming that just this one car type would be very unlikely to see and therefore I am looking for other cars to add variety. But I don't know enough to decide which available cars can be credibly painted D&RGW. I recall a posting on this group several months ago that most or all D&RGW's gondolas were special in several details and proportions.

The following drop bottom type gondolas are available (in brass, which is mandatory for me for this train):

USRA composite side drop bottom:
https://www.brasstrains.com/BrassGuide/PDG/Detail/19532

GS composite side:
https://www.brasstrains.com/BrassGuide/PDG/Detail/43214

UP G 50-7:
https://www.brasstrains.com/BrassGuide/Pdg/Detail/19484/HO-Rolling-Stock-Challenger-Imports-LTD-2250-1-Union-Pacific-GONDOLA

https://www.brasstrains.com/BrassGuide/Pdg/Detail/19485/HO-Rolling-Stock-Challenger-Imports-LTD-2251-1-Union-Pacific-GONDOLA

SP G 50-9:
https://www.brasstrains.com/BrassGuide/Pdg/Detail/19360/HO-Rolling-Stock-Challenger-Imports-LTD-2096-1-Southern-Pacific-GONDOLA

SP G 50-12:
https://www.brasstrains.com/BrassGuide/Pdg/Detail/19366/HO-Rolling-Stock-Challenger-Imports-LTD-2249-1-Southern-Pacific-GONDOLA

Is there any model in this list which I can use to make a D&RGW car? And what would be the major changes to do?
Yes I did try to search information, but did not find anything definite. Red Caboose once offered both a wood side GS and a steel side GS gondola lettered D&RGW - but I just don't know if these were correct considering the fact that most all manufacturers were/ are offering "foobies".

I found this photo:
http://www.railgoat.railfan.net/other_cars/drgw_cars/drgw_number/072000-073699.htm

Described here as a 46' type, but if you use "Back to D&RGW Freight Cars Page" you will find it listed as a 40' car (scroll down to the end of the list) - what is correct? To me it looks very similar (please excuse me) to the UP or SP models offered by Challenger.

I would appreciate any kind of help.

Many greetings

Johannes
Modeling the early post-war years up to about 1953

Re: bonsallscalecarshops D&RGW Gondolas

Mark Hemphill
 

Bill:  I'm sorry that I didn't see your post while I was in the process of answering Ron's (and doing some work email).  I think I probably answered some of what you were asking.  D&RGW didn't produce much on line in the way of manufactured goods, but rather products of mines, fields, and forests (and not much in the way of forests). If we're thinking about movements east, the only common commodities that moved off D&RGW in gons going east, other than coal, would be zinc concentrates going to Bartlesville, Oklahoma, rail from CF&I, and there was also some round wood that moved to pulp mills in Wisconsin in the 1940-1960 era that was loaded at Dotsero, Fraser, Granby, and some other points on the Moffat. Scrap metal moving east wouldn't get past Minnequa. 

CF&I Minnequa was a bar, wire, and rail mill that supplied western markets. It was not competitive with midwestern mills on an as-delivered basis for commodity steel products beyond central Kansas. CF&I also had a substantial output of specialty steel products such as barbed wire, fence posts, nails, and grader blades, and its market for those extended deep into Kansas, Oklahoma, Nebraska, and Texas. But none of those moved in large volumes by rail, just boxcars and gons dribbled out in small numbers each week.

Mark Hemphill