Date   

Weekend paint and decal project

A&Y Dave in MD
 

Friday night, I had some leftover Tru Color paint in my airbrush cup after painting my pulp racks, so I pulled out an Ertl low side gon project car, removed trucks and deck, then painted it black. I had a steam era image from 1929 showing a Southern gondola during construction work at Duke University. So I put together some graphics in Adobe Illustrator to match on Sunday and printed the decal sheet. Tonight I applied the decals. I was in too much of a hurry and screwed up the E, but I managed to finish the whole car on all sides. I added Tahoe trucks and I need to replace some grabs and stirrup steps, but I think it came out decent. Next one will have corner gussets, vertical brake wheel, scale couplers, and proper K brakes. But at least now I have one more example for my presentation on Ghost White decals at the Greensburg RPM meet. See you at my talk 4pm Saturday. The car will be on display.


Dave Bott


8 hatch reefer question.

Scott
 

Do the series six 8 hatch reefers have the thermometer on both sides of the car or one side or neither?  It seems I have run across photos of 8 hatch reefers that dont have the thermometer at least on one side..  But the images are pretty fuzzy.

Thanks
Scott McDonald


Re: Help With Wabash Tank Car ID

Jim Gates
 

That history is available here:


https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=uc1.$b661737;view=1up;seq=1

According to this the name was borrowed from the German-American Provision Company. The implication is this is the company from whom Epstein obtained his original cars.

Jim Gates
--------------------------------------------

On Mon, 3/18/19, Steve and Barb Hile <shile@mindspring.com> wrote:

Subject: Re: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Help With Wabash Tank Car ID
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Date: Monday, March 18, 2019, 8:06 PM

Max Epstein found a freight car leasing company in 1898 and in 1902, changed the name to German American.  During WWI, the name changed, again, to General American, at least partly due to anti-German sentiment at that time.  See http://www.encyclopedia.chicagohistory.org/pages/2681.html for some more details.  There was a 50 year history book published in 1948 that shows up from time to time on eBay or other used book sites.

Steve Hile


Re: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Help With Wabash Tank Car ID

Steve and Barb Hile
 

Max Epstein found a freight car leasing company in 1898 and in 1902, changed the name to German American. During WWI, the name changed, again, to General American, at least partly due to anti-German sentiment at that time. See http://www.encyclopedia.chicagohistory.org/pages/2681.html for some more details. There was a 50 year history book published in 1948 that shows up from time to time on eBay or other used book sites.

Steve Hile

-----Original Message-----
From: vapeurchapelon <j.markwart@gmx.net>
Sent: Mar 18, 2019 4:49 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Help With Wabash Tank Car ID

Hello Tony,

being a German, I would be interested what exactly was german in that company. "Just" a German immigrant as a (co-)founder?

Many thanks

Johannes
Modeling the early post-war years up to about 1953

Gesendet: Montag, 18. März 2019 um 16:28 Uhr
Von: "Tony Thompson" <tony@signaturepress.com>
An: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Betreff: Re: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Help With Wabash Tank Car ID

Elden Gatwood wrote:

I did some more looking, and am pretty convinced: the letters and numbers cast into the bolster looks like GATC predecessor German-American Car Company (hence, GATC, not "General American", as is commonly thought, even though that is the modern version); name changed during WW2 because of "German" as a then dirty word.
Actually that would be World War 1, not 2. Elden probably mistyped, but I wouldn't want wrong info to slide out there.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history










Re: UTLX X design dimensions

Steve and Barb Hile
 

Although the early class X cars were about 6000 gallons capacity, most built later were 6500 gallon capacity and had 3 radial courses on the upper tank. Those converted to narrow gauge service were most likely these slightly larger and later tanks. Some details are in the book, but I did not attempt to define the narrow gauge usages, as there were several renumberings and a few cars that were designated as convertible (Class V cars) that could ride on either narrow or standard gauge trucks when required. There is a pretty complete roster from 1952 in the files section of this list. Those swing cars, I believe, are in the 55xxx range while the X cars are in the 88xxx series.  See https://realstmfc.groups.io/g/main/files/UTLX%201-1952%20TANK%20CAR%20LIST.pdf.

In HO the old MDC tank with Shapeways underframe and running boards models the 6000 gallon cars fairly well.

Steve Hile


-----Original Message-----
>From: Earl Tuson
>Sent: Mar 18, 2019 7:25 PM
>To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
>Subject: [RealSTMFC] UTLX X design dimensions
>
>The 1906 CBD has plans for 6,000 gal UTLX X design tank cars:
>
>https://archive.org/details/carbuildersdict00mast/page/n315
>
>This drawing shows the bolster centers to be 17’, and the 5 horizontal course 76” ID tank length to be 25’
>(26’6” over the heads.)
>
>PBL makes very high quality Sn3 equipment. Their 6,000 gallon tank molding is used in their Type V kit
>and their modified, wide frame, Type X (converted by the prototype from normal standard gauge Type X
>cars.) However, the PBL 3 horizontal course tank is ~77.5” OD but 26’6” long (28’ over the heads,) with
>19’ bolster centers.
>
>Can anyone offer insight into these apparent discrepancies?
>
>Earl Tuson
>
>
>
>


German-American Car Co. [Was "Help With Wabash Tank Car ID"]

Garth Groff <sarahsan@...>
 

Johannes,

Atlantic Seaboard Dispatch was formed in 1898 by a German immigrant named Max Epstein to lease freight cars to shippers. Initially they offered refrigerator cars. The firm was reorganized as the German-American Car Company. in 1902. When the company went public with its stock in 1916, the name was changed to General American Tank Car Company. This better reflected the most common type of car they were offering for lease at that time. The commonly repeated story is that name was changed to make the stock more attractive to investors because of anti-German feeling in the U.S. over the war in Europe, though this is not mentioned in the story linked below.

You can read a brief history of the company at: http://www.fundinguniverse.com/company-histories/gatx-corporation-history/ .

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff


On 3/18/19 5:49 PM, vapeurchapelon wrote:
Hello Tony,

being a German, I would be interested what exactly was german in that company. "Just" a German immigrant as a (co-)founder?

Many thanks

Johannes
Modeling the early post-war years up to about 1953

Gesendet: Montag, 18. März 2019 um 16:28 Uhr
Von: "Tony Thompson" <tony@...>
An: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Betreff: Re: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Help With Wabash Tank Car ID

Elden Gatwood  wrote:

I did some more looking, and am pretty convinced: the letters and numbers cast into the bolster looks like GATC predecessor German-American Car Company (hence, GATC, not "General American", as is commonly thought, even though that is the modern version); name changed during WW2 because of "German" as a then dirty word.
   Actually that would be World War 1, not 2. Elden probably mistyped, but I wouldn't want wrong info to slide out there.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history














UTLX X design dimensions

Earl Tuson
 

The 1906 CBD has plans for 6,000 gal UTLX X design tank cars:

https://archive.org/details/carbuildersdict00mast/page/n315

This drawing shows the bolster centers to be 17’, and the 5 horizontal course 76” ID tank length to be 25’
(26’6” over the heads.)

PBL makes very high quality Sn3 equipment. Their 6,000 gallon tank molding is used in their Type V kit
and their modified, wide frame, Type X (converted by the prototype from normal standard gauge Type X
cars.) However, the PBL 3 horizontal course tank is ~77.5” OD but 26’6” long (28’ over the heads,) with
19’ bolster centers.

Can anyone offer insight into these apparent discrepancies?

Earl Tuson


The Winter issue of The Keystone Modeler (#107) is now available

Bruce Smith
 

Folks,

The Winter 2019 issue of The Keystone Modeler (#107) is now available at the PRRT&HS web site:

Regards,
Bruce

Bruce Smith
Assistant to the Webmaster, PRRT&HS


Re: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Help With Wabash Tank Car ID

vapeurchapelon
 

Hello Tony,

being a German, I would be interested what exactly was german in that company. "Just" a German immigrant as a (co-)founder?

Many thanks

Johannes
Modeling the early post-war years up to about 1953

Gesendet: Montag, 18. März 2019 um 16:28 Uhr
Von: "Tony Thompson" <tony@signaturepress.com>
An: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Betreff: Re: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Help With Wabash Tank Car ID

Elden Gatwood wrote:

I did some more looking, and am pretty convinced: the letters and numbers cast into the bolster looks like GATC predecessor German-American Car Company (hence, GATC, not "General American", as is commonly thought, even though that is the modern version); name changed during WW2 because of "German" as a then dirty word.
Actually that would be World War 1, not 2. Elden probably mistyped, but I wouldn't want wrong info to slide out there.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history









Re: PRR Flatcar

Charlie Vlk
 

The brakewheel and staff have been dismounted and are loose on the deck, being secured by the rod that is part of the load tie-down. There may be some additional hold-downs that we can't see.
Charlie Vlk

-----Original Message-----
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of David Soderblom
Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2019 7:47 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] PRR Flatcar

Now that is a girder! Note the brake wheel is nowhere near the end…



David Soderblom
Baltimore MD USA
drs@stsci.edu, 410-338-4543


Re: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Help With Wabash Tank Car ID

Dave Parker
 

If the car was built pre-WWI, then by definition it was built to an MCB (not ARA) standard, and it almost certainly was Spec II (not III).

Dave Parker
Riverside, CA

On Monday, March 18, 2019, 12:32:46 PM EDT, Gatwood, Elden J SAD <elden.j.gatwood@...> wrote:


You are correct, Tony!  Thanks for catching that!

Elden Gatwood

-----Original Message-----
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Tony Thompson
Sent: Monday, March 18, 2019 11:29 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Help With Wabash Tank Car ID

Elden Gatwood  wrote:

> I did some more looking, and am pretty convinced: the letters and numbers cast into the bolster looks like GATC predecessor German-American Car Company (hence, GATC, not "General American", as is commonly thought, even though that is the modern version); name changed during WW2 because of "German" as a then dirty word.

  Actually that would be World War 1, not 2. Elden probably mistyped, but I wouldn't want wrong info to slide out there.

Tony Thompson            Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705        Blockedwww.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@... Publishers of books on railroad history












Re: steam era freight car images, dating from 1900 to 1942

Ralph W. Brown
 

Hi Bob,
 
In my case, it usually means try a different browser.  For some reason, browsers seem to be picky about some things.  Google can be particularly difficult at times, but none I’ve found are perfect. 
 
Pax,
 
 
Ralph Brown
Portland, Maine
PRRT&HS No. 3966
NMRA No. L2532

rbrown51[at]maine[dot]rr[dot]com
 

From: Bob Thompson
Sent: Monday, March 18, 2019 2:44 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] steam era freight car images, dating from 1900 to 1942
 
When I try to access these images I get the following response:
HTTP Status 404 - /luna/servlet/s/1xy326

type - Status report

message - /luna/servlet/s/1xy326

description - The requested resource is not available.

Apache Tomcat/7.0.67


Does anyone know what this means? I get the same response going to https://digitalcollections.uwyo.edu. I’m in the Great White North (Canada).
 
Bob Thompson
North Saanich, BC
 


Re: steam era freight car images, dating from 1900 to 1942

Bob Thompson
 

When I try to access these images I get the following response:
HTTP Status 404 - /luna/servlet/s/1xy326

type - Status report

message - /luna/servlet/s/1xy326

description - The requested resource is not available.

Apache Tomcat/7.0.67


Does anyone know what this means? I get the same response going to https://digitalcollections.uwyo.edu. I’m in the Great White North (Canada).

Bob Thompson
North Saanich, BC


Re: NKP Consist (Rabbit Skins)

mopacfirst
 

I just looked at this image, and the accompanying information seems to say between 1917-1920.

Ron Merrick


Re: NKP Consist (Rabbit Skins)

Bob Chaparro
 

Here is a link to a photograph showing rabbit skins(?) about to be loaded into a Santa Fe refrigerator car in Liberal, Kansas:

http://www.kansasmemory.org/item/228197/page/1

Of note is that SFRD 12801 (or is it 12901?), a Class Rr-U refrigerator car built in 1917 by AC&F.

The accompanying information says the photograph was taken between 1910 and 1912, but this appears to be incorrect.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA


Re: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Help With Wabash Tank Car ID

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

You are correct, Tony! Thanks for catching that!

Elden Gatwood

-----Original Message-----
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Tony Thompson
Sent: Monday, March 18, 2019 11:29 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Help With Wabash Tank Car ID

Elden Gatwood wrote:

I did some more looking, and am pretty convinced: the letters and numbers cast into the bolster looks like GATC predecessor German-American Car Company (hence, GATC, not "General American", as is commonly thought, even though that is the modern version); name changed during WW2 because of "German" as a then dirty word.
Actually that would be World War 1, not 2. Elden probably mistyped, but I wouldn't want wrong info to slide out there.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 Blockedwww.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@signaturepress.com Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Help With Wabash Tank Car ID

Tony Thompson
 

Elden Gatwood wrote:

I did some more looking, and am pretty convinced: the letters and numbers cast into the bolster looks like GATC predecessor German-American Car Company (hence, GATC, not "General American", as is commonly thought, even though that is the modern version); name changed during WW2 because of "German" as a then dirty word.
Actually that would be World War 1, not 2. Elden probably mistyped, but I wouldn't want wrong info to slide out there.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


FW: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Help With Wabash Tank Car ID

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Gary and all;

I did some more looking, and am pretty convinced: the letters and numbers cast into the bolster looks like GATC predecessor German-American Car Company (hence, GATC, not "General American", as is commonly thought, even though that is the modern version); name changed during WW2 because of "German" as a then dirty word. I also think more certainly, 12-12 is the cast date. So, see ROX 813 on page 3 of attached. Kinda similar, no? Look at the inset double step and associated grab on the tank.

I do not know for sure that this is the original tank, but it might be. The reason I think not is those 5 bands, and how they interact with the frame. Not very "as-built" in my opinion. The odd planks in between tank and cradle are also odd. I cannot tell if the radius is the same, but that much space is odd. Maybe too much wood rotted out....

The vents may have been on top of the missing cap (again, see ROX), or on a side facing away from us; hard to tell.

Pre-WW1, this would have been an ARA car, probably ARA III tank.

Freight cars are such fun!

Elden

-----Original Message-----
From: gary roe [mailto:wabashrr@swbell.net]
Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2019 4:43 PM
To: Gatwood, Elden J CIV CESAW CESAD (US) <Elden.J.Gatwood@usace.army.mil>
Subject: Re: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Help With Wabash Tank Car ID

Elden,

I have some detail pictures of this car; but was afraid they were too big to post on the list. I have attached a couple to this message.

This car is currently at the Monticello Railway Museum in Monticello, Illinois.

gary




On ‎Thursday‎, ‎March‎ ‎14‎, ‎2019‎ ‎12‎:‎57‎:‎18‎ ‎PM‎ ‎CDT, Gatwood, Elden J SAD <elden.j.gatwood@usace.army.mil> wrote:


Gary;

Wow, that's a rare one: a 5-course radial construction tank with 5 bands, and wood cradle, inset stirrup steps, and a "different" looking underframe; probably pre-1915 construction. Some early early GATC cars looked similar to this, but this could also be a predecessor manufacturer. A better look at the bolsters could tell us more, but I cannot seem them. The smallish dome is also a more common feature of these early tank cars. We cannot see the dome vents, which is also an indicator of time period. The dome platform does not look original to the car; it may be a Wabash add.

Elden Gatwood

-----Original Message-----
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> ] On Behalf Of Gary Roe
Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2019 1:43 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>
Subject: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Help With Wabash Tank Car ID

The Wabash purchased 10 tank cars for company service from the American Cotton Oil Company in 1924. They were numbered 3160-3169, and had a capacity of 40 tons - 7700 gallons. Unfortunately, company freight car equipment registers do not state the builder of these cars. I would appreciate any help in determining who built them.

A photo of one is located at this address: BlockedBlockedBlockedhttp://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=4052881

Thank you in advance!

gary roe
quincy, illinois


Re: [Proto-Layouts] Weight and sound in a Steam loco

Philip Taylor
 

Eric

Thanks for posting.  A key point that needs to be re-iterated is that the weight when added to a steam locomotive needs to be done so the balance point is over the center of the drivers.  

Philip Taylor


On Mar 18, 2019, at 7:00 AM, Eric Hansmann <eric@...> wrote:

Pete Hall shares tips to install sound in a steam loco. He also added extra weight to help pull freight cars around. It's the latest post on the Resin Car Works blog.

http://blog.resincarworks.com/adding-weight-and-sound-to-a-steam-loco/



Eric Hansmann
RCW web guy


Re: Reading Flatcar Or Gondola?

gtws00
 

Nicely Done. 
George Toman

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