Date   

Re: Scratchbuilding a car in styrene

Ralph W. Brown
 

Nice, Jack!
 
 
Ralph Brown
Portland, Maine
PRRT&HS No. 3966
NMRA No. L2532

rbrown51[at]maine[dot]rr[dot]com
 

From: Jack Burgess
Sent: Monday, April 15, 2019 6:50 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Scratchbuilding a car in styrene
 

Car siding is T&G with a V-grove. Floor material is also typically T&G without the reveal…the advantage of T&G is that the boards will stay flat (for floors) or even with box cars.

 

You can still buy 3 ¼” V-groove T&G from a lumber yard (that is the same size boards typically use for freight cars). I bought some a few months ago and used it to fill in what had originally been lattice work. The hardware was (with permission) removed from a Yosemite Valley Railroad stock car.

 

Jack Burgess

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Charlie Vlk
Sent: Monday, April 15, 2019 2:13 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Scratchbuilding a car in styrene

 

Randy Hees and all-

A question not directly related to Freight Cars other than being a load or possibly mislabeled car siding….

One of the cable TV home remodeling shows has an interior designer that has to use what she calls “shiplap” on every project episode…to the point it could be a drinking game of a shot for every time she mentions it.

I always thought “shiplap” was a profile that had overlapping boards like those on a traditional wooden runabout….somewhat akin to clapboard house siding.   The material she calls “shiplap” is to me a form of tongue and groove siding with a small reveal between boards (more than car siding).  

Modern usage of the term is confused as Wikipedia shows a building with “shiplap” that is a form of Novelty Siding….flat faced vertical board with a scalloped top that fits underneath the next board up.

Anyone have old millwork references that might show correct terminology?

Charlie Vlk 


Re: Scratchbuilding a car in styrene

Tony Thompson
 

Ralph Brown wrote:

In the seafaring sense, “shiplap,” is more correctly called “lapstrake” (typically pronounced lap-strack) or “clinker-built.”  The architectural equivalent would be clapboard (sometimes pronounced kla-bord).  So, what you “always thought” is correct.

    Sorry, Ralph, not so. Clapboard and lap-strake have similarities, but they are NOT the same as shiplap. True shiplap is just a plain board rabbeted top and bottom for a snug fit. That is not true of clapboard. Novelty or Drop siding has a more sculptured overlap, but shiplap has none. Sometimes shiplap is laid with a slight gap between boards (revealing the rabbet) but is normally laid tight.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history






Re: Scratchbuilding a car in styrene

Ralph W. Brown
 

Hi Charlie,
 
Most of the home improvement “shiplap” images I’ve seen are real more like the tongue and groove siding used on some wood freight and passenger cars.
 
In the seafaring sense, “shiplap,” is more correctly called “lapstrake” (typically pronounced lap-strack) or “clinker-built.”  The architectural equivalent would be clapboard (sometimes pronounced kla-bord).  So, what you “always thought” is correct.
 
I suspect some ignorant home improvement guru called it “shiplap,” others liked the name, and the misnomer stuck.  Oh, well . . .
 
In any event, I don’t know of any instances in which such siding was used on either freight or passenger cars.  Not to say it wasn’t, but I’ve yet to see or hear of examples of it.
 
Pax,
 
Ralph Brown
Portland, Maine
PRRT&HS No. 3966
NMRA No. L2532

rbrown51[at]maine[dot]rr[dot]com
 

From: Charlie Vlk
Sent: Monday, April 15, 2019 5:12 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Scratchbuilding a car in styrene
 

Randy Hees and all-

A question not directly related to Freight Cars other than being a load or possibly mislabeled car siding….

One of the cable TV home remodeling shows has an interior designer that has to use what she calls “shiplap” on every project episode…to the point it could be a drinking game of a shot for every time she mentions it.

I always thought “shiplap” was a profile that had overlapping boards like those on a traditional wooden runabout….somewhat akin to clapboard house siding.   The material she calls “shiplap” is to me a form of tongue and groove siding with a small reveal between boards (more than car siding).  

Modern usage of the term is confused as Wikipedia shows a building with “shiplap” that is a form of Novelty Siding….flat faced vertical board with a scalloped top that fits underneath the next board up.

Anyone have old millwork references that might show correct terminology?

Charlie Vlk 


Re: Scratchbuilding a car in styrene

Tony Thompson
 

Google it and you’ll find that Novelty, Dutch Drop, German Drop, Cove, and Drop siding are all the same thing.
Tony Thompson 


On Apr 15, 2019, at 6:10 PM, Jake Schaible <jjschaible@...> wrote:


Overland Poultry Car

dale florence <dwwesley@...>
 

I would like to purchase an HO Overland Models Palace Poultry Car for $400.00 plus $10.00 foe shipping. This is for an unpainted model. If painted and decaled, will pay more.

Dale Florence


Re: Scratchbuilding a car in styrene

Nelson Moyer
 

I guess there aren’t  all that many Dutch immigrants in Southern California compared to the Midwest. Here in Iowa, siding that’s vertical with an inward curve and a short flat at the top is Dutch Lap. I have it on my house. CB&Q used it on many of their wood depots, usually on the bottom three to four feet, with board and batten above. The CB&Q depot at Donaldsonville, IA is an example. Clapboard is flat sloping inward from bottom to top.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Tony Thompson
Sent: Monday, April 15, 2019 7:09 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Scratchbuilding a car in styrene

 

Gosh, Nelson, SP called “this stuff” Novelty on their structures . . .

Tony Thompson 


On Apr 15, 2019, at 4:17 PM, Nelson Moyer <npmoyer@...> wrote:

Evergreen Novelty Siding is actually Dutch Lap.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Charlie Vlk
Sent: Monday, April 15, 2019 4:13 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Scratchbuilding a car in styrene

 

Randy Hees and all-

A question not directly related to Freight Cars other than being a load or possibly mislabeled car siding….

One of the cable TV home remodeling shows has an interior designer that has to use what she calls “shiplap” on every project episode…to the point it could be a drinking game of a shot for every time she mentions it.

I always thought “shiplap” was a profile that had overlapping boards like those on a traditional wooden runabout….somewhat akin to clapboard house siding.   The material she calls “shiplap” is to me a form of tongue and groove siding with a small reveal between boards (more than car siding).  

Modern usage of the term is confused as Wikipedia shows a building with “shiplap” that is a form of Novelty Siding….flat faced vertical board with a scalloped top that fits underneath the next board up.

Anyone have old millwork references that might show correct terminology?

Charlie Vlk 


Re: Scratchbuilding a car in styrene

Tony Thompson
 

Gosh, Nelson, SP called “this stuff” Novelty on their structures . . .
Tony Thompson 


On Apr 15, 2019, at 4:17 PM, Nelson Moyer <npmoyer@...> wrote:

Evergreen Novelty Siding is actually Dutch Lap.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Charlie Vlk
Sent: Monday, April 15, 2019 4:13 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Scratchbuilding a car in styrene

 

Randy Hees and all-

A question not directly related to Freight Cars other than being a load or possibly mislabeled car siding….

One of the cable TV home remodeling shows has an interior designer that has to use what she calls “shiplap” on every project episode…to the point it could be a drinking game of a shot for every time she mentions it.

I always thought “shiplap” was a profile that had overlapping boards like those on a traditional wooden runabout….somewhat akin to clapboard house siding.   The material she calls “shiplap” is to me a form of tongue and groove siding with a small reveal between boards (more than car siding).  

Modern usage of the term is confused as Wikipedia shows a building with “shiplap” that is a form of Novelty Siding….flat faced vertical board with a scalloped top that fits underneath the next board up.

Anyone have old millwork references that might show correct terminology?

Charlie Vlk 


Re: Menzies Metal Door to create backside of Door

Tim O'Connor
 


that's awesomely cool Bill... very well done

Did you write an article about this door?

On 4/15/2019 5:56 PM, Bill Welch wrote:
Time of day/angle of the sun made getting a good photo difficult but here are four angles, some with aid of flash showing  my Sunshine model of Warrior River Terminal 1932 car with Sunshine interior and the three sections of Menzies doors to replicate the backside of a Youngstown door. Each joint is just above the large ribs. I really like the little bit of corrosion on the metal. My thinking in doing this is that the car would be spotted at a siding or Team Track to loaded or unloaded. The interior tells the viewer something about how cars were built and equipped. I have a one SS MILW model and one S&A DS model with one door open to see the back side of the opposite side wood door interior and how they were constructed.

Bill Welch

Attachments:




--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: Scratchbuilding a car in styrene

Nelson Moyer
 

Evergreen Novelty Siding is actually Dutch Lap.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Charlie Vlk
Sent: Monday, April 15, 2019 4:13 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Scratchbuilding a car in styrene

 

Randy Hees and all-

A question not directly related to Freight Cars other than being a load or possibly mislabeled car siding….

One of the cable TV home remodeling shows has an interior designer that has to use what she calls “shiplap” on every project episode…to the point it could be a drinking game of a shot for every time she mentions it.

I always thought “shiplap” was a profile that had overlapping boards like those on a traditional wooden runabout….somewhat akin to clapboard house siding.   The material she calls “shiplap” is to me a form of tongue and groove siding with a small reveal between boards (more than car siding).  

Modern usage of the term is confused as Wikipedia shows a building with “shiplap” that is a form of Novelty Siding….flat faced vertical board with a scalloped top that fits underneath the next board up.

Anyone have old millwork references that might show correct terminology?

Charlie Vlk 


Re: Scratchbuilding a car in styrene

Jack Burgess
 

Car siding is T&G with a V-grove. Floor material is also typically T&G without the reveal…the advantage of T&G is that the boards will stay flat (for floors) or even with box cars.

 

You can still buy 3 ¼” V-groove T&G from a lumber yard (that is the same size boards typically use for freight cars). I bought some a few months ago and used it to fill in what had originally been lattice work. The hardware was (with permission) removed from a Yosemite Valley Railroad stock car.

 

Jack Burgess

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Charlie Vlk
Sent: Monday, April 15, 2019 2:13 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Scratchbuilding a car in styrene

 

Randy Hees and all-

A question not directly related to Freight Cars other than being a load or possibly mislabeled car siding….

One of the cable TV home remodeling shows has an interior designer that has to use what she calls “shiplap” on every project episode…to the point it could be a drinking game of a shot for every time she mentions it.

I always thought “shiplap” was a profile that had overlapping boards like those on a traditional wooden runabout….somewhat akin to clapboard house siding.   The material she calls “shiplap” is to me a form of tongue and groove siding with a small reveal between boards (more than car siding).  

Modern usage of the term is confused as Wikipedia shows a building with “shiplap” that is a form of Novelty Siding….flat faced vertical board with a scalloped top that fits underneath the next board up.

Anyone have old millwork references that might show correct terminology?

Charlie Vlk 


Re: Old square bottle Floquil paints.

Lester Breuer
 

I misquoted Nelson  when I said Nelson said Scale coat was a mix of xylene and toluene.  He said that about Diosol rather than Scalecoat.  My error.  Forgive.
Lester Breuer


Menzies Metal Door to create backside of Door

Bill Welch
 

Time of day/angle of the sun made getting a good photo difficult but here are four angles, some with aid of flash showing  my Sunshine model of Warrior River Terminal 1932 car with Sunshine interior and the three sections of Menzies doors to replicate the backside of a Youngstown door. Each joint is just above the large ribs. I really like the little bit of corrosion on the metal. My thinking in doing this is that the car would be spotted at a siding or Team Track to loaded or unloaded. The interior tells the viewer something about how cars were built and equipped. I have a one SS MILW model and one S&A DS model with one door open to see the back side of the opposite side wood door interior and how they were constructed.

Bill Welch


Re: Scratchbuilding a car in styrene

Charlie Vlk
 

Randy Hees and all-

A question not directly related to Freight Cars other than being a load or possibly mislabeled car siding….

One of the cable TV home remodeling shows has an interior designer that has to use what she calls “shiplap” on every project episode…to the point it could be a drinking game of a shot for every time she mentions it.

I always thought “shiplap” was a profile that had overlapping boards like those on a traditional wooden runabout….somewhat akin to clapboard house siding.   The material she calls “shiplap” is to me a form of tongue and groove siding with a small reveal between boards (more than car siding).  

Modern usage of the term is confused as Wikipedia shows a building with “shiplap” that is a form of Novelty Siding….flat faced vertical board with a scalloped top that fits underneath the next board up.

Anyone have old millwork references that might show correct terminology?

Charlie Vlk 


Doors with inside detail

Andy Carlson
 

A little work, but builds up a foundation of skills which can be very useful in the future.

If I wanted an inside piece of a Youngstown door, I would make a quick mold of a door with either the craft store Michael's  AMAZING PUTTY, an RTV type of product which makes good molds without mold boxes (easing the effort to make molds). If using this product, make sure the top of the mold (which will become the future "back" of the mold) is even and straight, as this will help keep castings straight afterwards. When the mold is cured, apply a good, even coating of petrolatum (Vaseline) to the cavity. Now add a new mix of putty, essentially making a door casting with RTV instead of resin. This "Mold-of-a-Mold" will make suitable inside parts of a Youngstown door with a coating of a small amount of JB Weld epoxy, the traditional type, available from Auto Parts Stores.

As a bonus, you also have a mold to make extra Youngstown doors. An alternative to the amazing Putty, is also found at an auto parts store. Buy a tube of high-temp 1200 degree exhaust gasket, such as made by Permatex. Build up thin coatings of this material with a flat sided toothpick several times until a casting of proper thickness is achieved.
-Andy Carlson
Ojai CA


Re: Old square bottle Floquil paints.

 

Many years ago I questioned a Floquil representative about why colors purchased years apart looked so different.  He told me they didn’t have standards  (drift cards), but simply compared the new batch to the previous batch.  I started my career matching cosmetic colors for a pigment manufacturer.  I can tell you it’s a really bad idea. – Al Westerfield

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Jerry Michels
Sent: Sunday, April 14, 2019 11:12 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Old square bottle Floquil paints.

 

  Uh, maybe yours was (or is), but mine is a faint yellow color, nearly clear. Still works fine and must be over 30 years old.

 

Tony,

 

The choice of words might not have been accurate.  I'd agree that light yellow was the original color, but I have some old Glaze that looks like a good Canadian Whisky.

 

Jerry Michels

 


Re: Doors with inside detail

Richard Townsend
 

My oversight


Re: Doors with inside detail

Bill Welch
 

I noted that in my post on April 13 I cut the door in Sections and re-assembled to get the proper look of the corrugations.

Bill Welch


Re: Old square bottle Floquil paints.

Jerry Michels
 

  Uh, maybe yours was (or is), but mine is a faint yellow color, nearly clear. Still works fine and must be over 30 years old.

Tony,

The choice of words might not have been accurate.  I'd agree that light yellow was the original color, but I have some old Glaze that looks like a good Canadian Whisky.

Jerry Michels


Re: Doors with inside detail

Richard Townsend
 

If you want to use the stamped Athearn/Menzies/Baker doors you will have to do some cutting and reassembly. The doors have the placard boards stamped into them as well as the corrugations. It’s not difficult (I have done it). Maybe the auxiliary doors from a double door kit don’t have that issue.


Re: Old square bottle Floquil paints.

Tony Thompson
 

Jerry Michels wrote:

Glaze was amber

    Uh, maybe yours was (or is), but mine is a faint yellow color, nearly clear. Still works fine and must be over 30 years old.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history