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Re: Roof Name help

Nelson Moyer
 

It looks like an attempt at a Murphy flat panel roof.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Lester Breuer
Sent: Sunday, May 05, 2019 11:57 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Roof Name help

 

Bill Welch wrote, “Lester, it looks like a kit roof. Maybe if you tell us which kit, the someone may know which roof it should be. What I see  looks like a F&C casting intended to be a Hutchins roof.”
  
Bill it is a F&C kit #6652 roof for  CV/GTW double door box car which is per several sources is to be a Hutchins Dry Lading roof which this is definitely not.  Therefore, I know I have to replace this roof with a correct one; however, wondering what is the closest prototype roof if any this kit roof resembles.

Lester Breuer
Re: Roof Name help

Lester Breuer
 

Bill Welch wrote, “Lester, it looks like a kit roof. Maybe if you tell us which kit, the someone may know which roof it should be. What I see  looks like a F&C casting intended to be a Hutchins roof.”
  
Bill it is a F&C kit #6652 roof for  CV/GTW double door box car which is per several sources is to be a Hutchins Dry Lading roof which this is definitely not.  Therefore, I know I have to replace this roof with a correct one; however, wondering what is the closest prototype roof if any this kit roof resembles.

Lester Breuer
All-Beer Train

Garth Groff <sarahsan@...>
 

Friends,

Just back from the Shenandoah Valley Model Train Show in Virginia. On one of the modular layouts a 'vested interest" was running a train of 77 billboard beer refrigerators, all different, and steam-era (mandatory content), though many were decorated for modern craft beers. I rate this somewhere near plastic lawn flamingos on the taste scale. Is there any way we can have this guy locked up?

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff

Re: Roof Name help

Bill Welch
 

Lester, it looks like a kit roof. Maybe if you tell us which kit, the someone may know which roof it should be. What I see  looks like a F&C casting intended to be a Hutchins roof.

Bill Welch
B&O C-16 Question

Nelson Moyer
 

I’m building the Sunshine C-16, and I’d like to learn about the box in the upper center of the A end shown in the attached photo. It appears that it’s got an electrical conduit through the end, so it may be either a power receptacle or marker light attachment. The kit instructions make no mention of this fixture, and there is no part resembling the fixture in the kit. Were these fixtures on both ends of the car? I don’t have any other C-16 photos showing the ends. What was the purpose of this fixture?

 

Nelson Moyer
Re: Phillips Petroleum LNG and PPG gas tank cars.

Steve and Barb Hile
 

At the beginning of 1945, Phillips listed 2679 cars in the ORER
 
 
Three years later, the listing no longer includes the ARA III and ICC 103 cars and is reduced to 668 cars.  This list remained in effect in the July 1950 ORER.
 
 
Steve Hile


From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Thomas Birkett
Sent: Friday, May 03, 2019 7:26 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Phillips Petroleum LNG and PPG gas tank cars.

These were the oldest cars in the fleet, and I believe that many riveted shell cars were not leaded back but Ihave been u able to verify completely.
Tom Birkett, Bartlesville


Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S® 6, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone

-------- Original message --------
From: "Jim Gates via Groups.Io" <jim.gates@...>
Date: 5/3/19 6:58 PM (GMT-06:00)
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Phillips Petroleum LNG and PPG gas tank cars.

According to GATC:  A History of the General American Transportation Corporation, GATC purchased 2046 tank cars from Phillips Petroleum in 1945.  I would guess this was a lease-back arrangement.

Jim Gates
--------------------------------------------
On Fri, 5/3/19, Thomas Birkett <tnbirke@...> wrote:

Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Phillips Petroleum LNG and PPG gas tank cars.
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Date: Friday, May 3, 2019, 5:29 PM

All: I managed the PPCo tank car fleet after the end of this group, but do know some of the history. The first refinery was at Borger, TX the same
you Phillips started selling gasoline at retail stations 1927. The first station was in Wichita, KS but the gasoline came from Hamilton Plant, between
Bartlesville and Dewey, OK. It was "natural gasoline" separated from raw natural gas, not crude oil. The acquisition of Independent Refining from Waite Phillips, one of the other brothers of Frank and LE Phillips brought refineries in Okmukgee, OK and Kansas City, KS into
the fold. Sweeny, TX, and Woods Cross, It came later.I may be able to answer further questions off line if any one has anything further. Tom Birkett,
Bartlesville, OK.
Roof Name help

Lester Breuer
 

What roof type is in the enclosed photo?  My best guess is a Chicago-Cleveland Flexible Outside Metal roof.  Thank You for your time and effort to help in advance.
Lester Breuer
Re: Manufacturers Railway Mather box

Chuck Cover
 

If you carefully examine the photo you will see that the verticals (both on the sides and ends) are all Z-brace supports which gives the car a unique look. (in an earlier response I mistakenly noted that the diagonals were Z-braces).  The Proto Mather boxcars do not model the Z-braces.

 

Chuck Cover

Santa Fe, NM
Re: Manufacturers Railway Mather box

Tim O'Connor
 


Looks like 7-10 IH



On 5/4/2019 7:04 AM, jerryglow2 wrote:
Acc to Sunshine's info they had both the  10'3" and 7'8" ones. Best I can tell the P2K is a 8'5" car numbered for the 7'8" ones and in white lettering. I have one and am going to redo it w/ yellow lettering. Guess whose decals? 

Attachments:



--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts
Re: Manufacturers Railway Mather box

mopacfirst
 

I found a Mather stock car that I'd done when the kits were new, and it has wire grab irons, plus uncoupling levers, that I must have applied.  Then I looked at a couple kits that I bought on eBay recently, and noticed that a couple of them were time-saver.

So my question is, do the plastic grabs come out easily?  Probably no big deal, since I may need to ream the holes with a drill bit anyway.

Ron Merrick
Using contact cement

Eric Hansmann
 

People ask me about Barge cement. I recently used it to attach a couple of boxcar roofs so it's the latest post on my DesignBuildOp blog.

http://designbuildop.hansmanns.org/2019/05/04/contact-cement/



Eric Hansmann
Murfreesboro, TN
Re: Manufacturers Railway Mather box

jerryglow2
 

Acc to Sunshine's info they had both the  10'3" and 7'8" ones. Best I can tell the P2K is a 8'5" car numbered for the 7'8" ones and in white lettering.. Martin said that series had yellow lettering.  I have one and am going to redo it w/ yellow lettering. Guess whose decals I'm going to use?
Re: Phillips Petroleum LNG and PPG gas tank cars.

Kemal Mumcu
 

Perhaps the tangent insulated tank car could be a starting point for a LNG car as in this article featured years ago on the Resin Car Works blog.

http://resincarworks.com/RwyRev_Type22design.pdf

As to where the cars were going; well, north of Newport was basically Canada so these cars were going to industries there. I'd be interested in hearing otherwise but in the late 40s there wouldn't have been much production of LNG and LPG going on in Canada.

Colin Meikle
Re: Phillips Petroleum LNG and PPG gas tank cars.

BillM
 

Curious question, Wade Phillips any relation to the NFL coach?

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 

From: Thomas Birkett
Sent: Friday, May 3, 2019 6:24 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Phillips Petroleum LNG and PPG gas tank cars.

 

All: I managed the PPCo tank car fleet after the end of this group, but do know some of the history. The first refinery was at Borger, TX the same you Phillips started selling gasoline at retail stations 1927. The first station was in Wichita, KS but the gasoline came from Hamilton Plant, between Bartlesville and Dewey, OK. It was "natural gasoline" separated from raw natural gas, not crude oil. The acquisition of Independent Refining from Waite Phillips, one of the other brothers of Frank and LE Phillips brought refineries in Okmukgee, OK and Kansas City, KS into the fold. Sweeny, TX, and Woods Cross, It came later.

I may be able to answer further questions off line if any one has anything further. Tom Birkett, Bartlesville, OK.

 

 

 

 

Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S® 6, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone

 

-------- Original message --------

From: mopacfirst <ron.merrick@...>

Date: 5/3/19 2:59 PM (GMT-06:00)

To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io

Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Phillips Petroleum LNG and PPG gas tank cars.

 

Phillips 66 had several refineries in Oklahoma, with the big one being in Bartlesville.  Other big ones that still exist are Borger, Texas (Panhandle) and Sweeny, Texas (Gulf Coast).  LPG could also have come from gas plants, of which there were several.  Basically, LPG is a light end from a refinery or a heavy end from a gas plant.

To get to the east, the cars would have primarily come through the St. Louis or Chicago gateways.

I came up with a photo of a PSPX car that matched the brass LP tank that (Overland?) made.  This was an earlier prototype than the Atlas car.  This photo may have been in the Kaminski tank car book.  I lettered mine without the herald.

Ron Merrick

 
Re: Phillips Petroleum LNG and PPG gas tank cars.

Donald B. Valentine <riverman_vt@...>
 

Thank you once again Doug. What is shown in your 4th and 7th photos is exactly what I'm looking for. Tim seems to have most of it from his Champ decal set but I'd like to have the Phillips reporting marks rather than SHPX. Time to work on Atlas again as was
donme with the Cudahy car.

My best, Don Valentine
Re: Phillips Petroleum LNG and PPG gas tank cars.

Steve and Barb Hile
 

Doug's photo of PSPX 13206 could lead to a reasonable kitbash of the Athearn
"Chemical" tank car. Its underframe is nominally like the GATX Type 30. A
new, correctly sized valve casing (not an expansion dome) with Yarmouth or
Tangent GATX sill steps could complement the Philgas trade name from the
Champ decal set. You would have to find the PSPX Initials and number, if
not in the Champ set.

The ACF 13313 from 1943 is too long and too early for the Kadee car. To do
a kitbash would involve, lengthening the Intermountain Type 27 underframe
and finding a suitable tank. The Athearn one might work, but I haven't
measured that one.

Steve Hile

-----Original Message-----
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf
Of Tim O'Connor
Sent: Friday, May 03, 2019 3:21 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Phillips Petroleum LNG and PPG gas tank cars.


Unfortunately correct decals for tank cars often don't exist. Champ
HT-66 Philgas is for a GATC tank car.
And of course the lettering is far from correct even for that prototype. :-(

Tim O'



On 5/3/2019 3:24 PM, Lloyd Keyser wrote:
Philgas and Skelgas  were widely seen in the midwest. Several years
ago I sent photos of these cars to Atlas. I received no reply. Champ
decals brought out Philgas HT-66 and I think Skelgas. In stead they
bring out company's I've never heard of. Wouldn't hurt to try again. I
have a photo of Philgas with and without platform. I may have to take
a car strip it , paint it black and decal it.


--
*Tim O'Connor*
*Sterling, Massachusetts*
Re: Phillips Petroleum LNG and PPG gas tank cars.

Thomas Birkett <tnbirke@...>
 

These were the oldest cars in the fleet, and I believe that many riveted shell cars were not leaded back but Ihave been u able to verify completely.
Tom Birkett, Bartlesville


Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S® 6, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone

-------- Original message --------
From: "Jim Gates via Groups.Io" <jim.gates@...>
Date: 5/3/19 6:58 PM (GMT-06:00)
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Phillips Petroleum LNG and PPG gas tank cars.

According to GATC:  A History of the General American Transportation Corporation, GATC purchased 2046 tank cars from Phillips Petroleum in 1945.  I would guess this was a lease-back arrangement.

Jim Gates
--------------------------------------------
On Fri, 5/3/19, Thomas Birkett <tnbirke@...> wrote:

Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Phillips Petroleum LNG and PPG gas tank cars.
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Date: Friday, May 3, 2019, 5:29 PM

All: I managed the PPCo tank car fleet after the end of this group, but do know some of the history. The first refinery was at Borger, TX the same
you Phillips started selling gasoline at retail stations 1927. The first station was in Wichita, KS but the gasoline came from Hamilton Plant, between
Bartlesville and Dewey, OK. It was "natural gasoline" separated from raw natural gas, not crude oil. The acquisition of Independent Refining from Waite Phillips, one of the other brothers of Frank and LE Phillips brought refineries in Okmukgee, OK and Kansas City, KS into
the fold. Sweeny, TX, and Woods Cross, It came later.I may be able to answer further questions off line if any one has anything further. Tom Birkett,
Bartlesville, OK.
Re: Phillips Petroleum LNG and PPG gas tank cars.

Jim Gates
 

According to GATC: A History of the General American Transportation Corporation, GATC purchased 2046 tank cars from Phillips Petroleum in 1945. I would guess this was a lease-back arrangement.

Jim Gates
--------------------------------------------

On Fri, 5/3/19, Thomas Birkett <tnbirke@...> wrote:

Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Phillips Petroleum LNG and PPG gas tank cars.
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Date: Friday, May 3, 2019, 5:29 PM

All: I managed the PPCo tank car fleet after the end of this group, but do know some of the history. The first refinery was at Borger, TX the same
you Phillips started selling gasoline at retail stations 1927. The first station was in Wichita, KS but the gasoline came from Hamilton Plant, between
Bartlesville and Dewey, OK. It was "natural gasoline" separated from raw natural gas, not crude oil. The acquisition of Independent Refining from Waite Phillips, one of the other brothers of Frank and LE Phillips brought refineries in Okmukgee, OK and Kansas City, KS into
the fold. Sweeny, TX, and Woods Cross, It came later.I may be able to answer further questions off line if any one has anything further. Tom Birkett,
Bartlesville, OK.
Re: Phillips Petroleum LNG and PPG gas tank cars.

Thomas Birkett <tnbirke@...>
 

All: I managed the PPCo tank car fleet after the end of this group, but do know some of the history. The first refinery was at Borger, TX the same you Phillips started selling gasoline at retail stations 1927. The first station was in Wichita, KS but the gasoline came from Hamilton Plant, between Bartlesville and Dewey, OK. It was "natural gasoline" separated from raw natural gas, not crude oil. The acquisition of Independent Refining from Waite Phillips, one of the other brothers of Frank and LE Phillips brought refineries in Okmukgee, OK and Kansas City, KS into the fold. Sweeny, TX, and Woods Cross, It came later.
I may be able to answer further questions off line if any one has anything further. Tom Birkett, Bartlesville, OK.




Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S® 6, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone

-------- Original message --------
From: mopacfirst <ron.merrick@...>
Date: 5/3/19 2:59 PM (GMT-06:00)
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Phillips Petroleum LNG and PPG gas tank cars.

Phillips 66 had several refineries in Oklahoma, with the big one being in Bartlesville.  Other big ones that still exist are Borger, Texas (Panhandle) and Sweeny, Texas (Gulf Coast).  LPG could also have come from gas plants, of which there were several.  Basically, LPG is a light end from a refinery or a heavy end from a gas plant.

To get to the east, the cars would have primarily come through the St. Louis or Chicago gateways.

I came up with a photo of a PSPX car that matched the brass LP tank that (Overland?) made.  This was an earlier prototype than the Atlas car.  This photo may have been in the Kaminski tank car book.  I lettered mine without the herald.

Ron Merrick

Re: Phillips Petroleum LNG and PPG gas tank cars.

Tim O'Connor
 


Champ HT-66

On 5/3/2019 4:31 PM, Lloyd Keyser wrote:
Nicely done. What decals did you use.
Lloyd Keyser

On Fri, May 3, 2019 at 3:20 PM Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:

Unfortunately correct decals for tank cars often don't exist. Champ
HT-66 Philgas is for a GATC tank car.
And of course the lettering is far from correct even for that prototype. :-(

Tim O'


On 5/3/2019 3:24 PM, Lloyd Keyser wrote:
> Philgas and Skelgas  were widely seen in the midwest. Several years
> ago I sent photos of these cars to Atlas. I received no reply. Champ
> decals brought out Philgas HT-66 and I think Skelgas. In stead they
> bring out company's I've never heard of. Wouldn't hurt to try again. I
> have a photo of Philgas with and without platform. I may have to take
> a car strip it , paint it black and decal it.

*Tim O'Connor*
*Sterling, Massachusetts*

--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts
29541 - 29560 of 193583