1. main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
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Re: Printing White Decals

Steve and Barb Hile
 

Even without a true graphics program, the letter spacing can managed by inserting spaces of very small type sizes between the letters, as needed.  I have done this successfully in MS Word, for example.
 
Steve Hile


From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Dennis Storzek
Sent: Sunday, May 26, 2019 11:40 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Printing White Decals

On Sun, May 26, 2019 at 08:41 PM, Barry Roth wrote:
Where does one get Railroad Roman or gothic “fonts” to create the artwork to be printed this way?
A good place to start is railfonts.com  While not perfect, and many people argue they are not perfect, they are darned good. The biggest complaint would be that the designer went beyond what the railroad designed to create complete alphabets that can be used to typeset more than just the railroad name. Also, the built in auto kerning may not result in the same letter spacing in the roadname that the railroad actually used on its equipment, which can be determined from photos and is easy enough to correct in a graphics program.

Dennis Storzek

Re: Printing White Decals

Dennis Storzek
 

On Sun, May 26, 2019 at 08:41 PM, Barry Roth wrote:
Where does one get Railroad Roman or gothic “fonts” to create the artwork to be printed this way?
A good place to start is railfonts.com  While not perfect, and many people argue they are not perfect, they are darned good. The biggest complaint would be that the designer went beyond what the railroad designed to create complete alphabets that can be used to typeset more than just the railroad name. Also, the built in auto kerning may not result in the same letter spacing in the roadname that the railroad actually used on its equipment, which can be determined from photos and is easy enough to correct in a graphics program.

Dennis Storzek
SAL AF-5

Chad Boas
 

I'll have a new kit or two for the Collinsville meet.
Fenton and I have worked together and come up with ends, doors and lower side sills to make the SAL AF-5.
I used a Branchline AAR kit. Here it is still needing some work.
Chad Boas
Re: Printing White Decals

Tony Thompson
 

Where does one get Railroad Roman or gothic “fonts” to create the artwork to be printed this way?
Just a reminder: in the era of this list, very few railroad lettering designs were actually fonts used for printing. They were mostly drawings prepared by company draftsmen and might well not match ANY font we now have.
I believe that "Railroad Roman" is a myth, evidently started when Max Gray first made decals. It is true that the Master Car Builders recommended a specific letter outline, but I do not know for sure of ANY railroad that actually followed it. Some claim that the CB&Q did so, though I can't verify that. There are none others even claimed. So even if there were decals for the MCB lettering, it would still NOT match actual railroads.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history
Re: Printing White Decals

Barry Roth
 

Where does one get Railroad Roman or gothic “fonts” to create the artwork to be printed this way?

Barry Roth

On May 26, 2019, at 7:30 PM, Richard Brennan <rbrennan@tt-west.com> wrote:

At 05:52 PM 5/26/2019, Jeff wrote:
So having acquired the toner, is it just a case of printing your text/design on decal paper, cutting it out and doing the wet-slide thing?
The Ghostwhite cartridge physically replaces the 'K' (blacK) toner cartridge in compatible CMYK color laser printers, including many HP and some others.

Set-up decal artwork for 'true black' (CMYK = 0-0-0-100)... not 'rich black' (CMYK = 100-100-100-100) and your black artwork will print as white. I print on TangoPapa decal paper.

A presentation on artwork and printing white decals from the 2018 PCR NMRA convention should be available shortly (and belatedly) at: http://www.pcrnmra.org/pcr/clinics/clinics.shtml
and discusses artwork preparation and a brief overview of the three most-available white decal digital printing options; ALPS, Ghostwhite, and UV-LED.

An example of use on an early P&R HKa hopper is at: https://groups.io/g/EarlyRail/message/46956
with an embedded link to an MRH blog at: https://model-railroad-hobbyist.com/node/34605 ...
The decal discussion is in the more recent (5/21/2019) posts.



----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Richard Brennan - TT-west
www.tt-west.com
----------------------------------------------------------------------------


Re: Printing White Decals

Richard Brennan
 

At 05:52 PM 5/26/2019, Jeff wrote:
So having acquired the toner, is it just a case of printing your text/design on decal paper, cutting it out and doing the wet-slide thing?
The Ghostwhite cartridge physically replaces the 'K' (blacK) toner cartridge in compatible CMYK color laser printers, including many HP and some others.

Set-up decal artwork for 'true black' (CMYK = 0-0-0-100)... not 'rich black' (CMYK = 100-100-100-100) and your black artwork will print as white. I print on TangoPapa decal paper.

A presentation on artwork and printing white decals from the 2018 PCR NMRA convention should be available shortly (and belatedly) at: http://www.pcrnmra.org/pcr/clinics/clinics.shtml
and discusses artwork preparation and a brief overview of the three most-available white decal digital printing options; ALPS, Ghostwhite, and UV-LED.

An example of use on an early P&R HKa hopper is at: https://groups.io/g/EarlyRail/message/46956
with an embedded link to an MRH blog at: https://model-railroad-hobbyist.com/node/34605 ...
The decal discussion is in the more recent (5/21/2019) posts.



----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Richard Brennan - TT-west
www.tt-west.com
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Re: Super Clean Degreaser to remove lettering

Paul Woods <paul@...>
 

Speaking as someone who has handled sodium hydroxide in large quantities, I need to stress the part of Nelson's message regarding eye protection - it is crucial, because the stuff is quite nasty with respect to damaging vision.  Always wear eye protection.

Sodium hydroxide has a high reactivity with the eyes, causing permanent damage (unlike some kinds of chemical burns that will heal), so fGs don't get it in your eyes!  And if you do, run like aitch-E-double-toothpicks for the bathroom and rinse it out thoroughly.  For being a low concentration, the effects would not be immediately obvious - enclosed environment probably okay but I would work with a small fan nearby to prevent local build-up of vapor, just in case.  I always do that if dealing with any fumes, smoke from soldering, painting etc., regardless of how safe it may seem.

Would you believe, I have just found a safety guideline that advises in the event of contact with the eyes to flush the affected eye with running lukewarm water for 60 minutes - this is for concentrated sodium hydroxide, not the degreaser , but it should serve to demonstrate how nasty the stuff is.

Regards
Paul Woods

NYCSHS #7172
Re: Printing White Decals

Nelson Moyer
 

InkJet ink is water soluble, so you have to seal the decals after printing. I’ve used Krylon Krystal Clear, but that makes them stiff and it takes several application of Micro Sol to get them to settle down over rivets. Some use Micro Liquid decal Film. As long as you don’t cut too close to the ink, the decals handle like regular decals. Laser printed decals don’t require sealing, but they will bleed a little if exposed to water too long. I seal them the same way I seal ink jet decals.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Jeff
Sent: Sunday, May 26, 2019 7:53 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Printing White Decals

 

So having acquired the toner, is it just a case of printing your text/design on decal paper, cutting it out and doing the wet-slide thing? 

 

I tried inkjet decals once, and there was a fixative... and let's just say it was a useless mess. 

Jeff Shultz

 

On Sun, May 26, 2019, 14:57 Garth Groff <sarahsan@...> wrote:

Friends,

If you haven't been there, check the Ghost White web site at https://www.ghost-white-toner.com/ghost-white-toner-transfer-for-everyone/ . It appears that their cartridges fit various HP, Oki and Samsung laser printers. Actually, if you have the right printer already, the cost may not be prohibitive, with cartridges for some printers at around $120. For professional machines the cost can be over $1,000. There is a search feature which matches their products to various printers.

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff

On 5/26/19 1:37 PM, A&Y Dave in MD wrote:

This is my hobby. I couldn’t make enough at decals to compete with my day job. I have done special runs for friends at cost and supported the Carolina RPM with the Southern vent boxcar, but have no interest in a second career. I’ve seen what that can do to people.

 

 I bought a $200 printer and a $200 (with shipping from Germany) cartridge and i’m set for life.  I have printed about 30 8x11 sheets of decals so far and i haven’t gone below 95% full on cartridge. Some cannot afford $400 for all the custom white decals you’ll need, but for about a DCC sound loco cost, i felt it was worth the advantage to add a second number to a commercial car like the Kadee boxcar or create accurate 1934 era data and lettering.  I was looking to replace my ALPS and those are not made or supported commercially any more. The Ghost White AND printer was less than my investment in track/switches or DCC system or a single locomotive. Seems worth it to have my fleet of steam era cars be equally accurate.

 

Btw there is a US source for Ghost White now, so shipping will be less. 

 

David Bott, modeling the A&Y in '34

 
Re: Printing White Decals

Jeff
 

So having acquired the toner, is it just a case of printing your text/design on decal paper, cutting it out and doing the wet-slide thing? 

I tried inkjet decals once, and there was a fixative... and let's just say it was a useless mess. 

Jeff Shultz


On Sun, May 26, 2019, 14:57 Garth Groff <sarahsan@...> wrote:
Friends,

If you haven't been there, check the Ghost White web site at https://www.ghost-white-toner.com/ghost-white-toner-transfer-for-everyone/ . It appears that their cartridges fit various HP, Oki and Samsung laser printers. Actually, if you have the right printer already, the cost may not be prohibitive, with cartridges for some printers at around $120. For professional machines the cost can be over $1,000. There is a search feature which matches their products to various printers.

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff

On 5/26/19 1:37 PM, A&Y Dave in MD wrote:
This is my hobby. I couldn’t make enough at decals to compete with my day job. I have done special runs for friends at cost and supported the Carolina RPM with the Southern vent boxcar, but have no interest in a second career. I’ve seen what that can do to people.

 I bought a $200 printer and a $200 (with shipping from Germany) cartridge and i’m set for life.  I have printed about 30 8x11 sheets of decals so far and i haven’t gone below 95% full on cartridge. Some cannot afford $400 for all the custom white decals you’ll need, but for about a DCC sound loco cost, i felt it was worth the advantage to add a second number to a commercial car like the Kadee boxcar or create accurate 1934 era data and lettering.  I was looking to replace my ALPS and those are not made or supported commercially any more. The Ghost White AND printer was less than my investment in track/switches or DCC system or a single locomotive. Seems worth it to have my fleet of steam era cars be equally accurate.

Btw there is a US source for Ghost White now, so shipping will be less. 

David Bott, modeling the A&Y in '34
Re: Super Clean Degreaser to remove lettering

Douglas Harding
 

Nelson if you go to their website you can find if a white toner cartridges is available for your printer. https://www.ghost-white-toner.com/ghost-white-toner-for-your-printer/

When I looked into this a while back, white toner cartridges were only available for HP color laser printers. The technology will not work with a black/white laser printers.

It appears the company is now offering white toner cartridges that work in HP, Samsung, Canon and a few other brands of printers.

 

Doug  Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Nelson Moyer
Sent: Sunday, May 26, 2019 4:12 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Super Clean Degreaser to remove lettering

 

What brand and model of printer do you use? I looked on the HP web site, but didn’t find any mention of a ghost white printer, must black and white and color. I have a LaserJet 1200, which is pretty old, so I doubt that a white toner cartridge would be available. Actually, the HP web site produced no hits when I searched for white toner.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of A&Y Dave in MD
Sent: Sunday, May 26, 2019 12:25 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Super Clean Degreaser to remove lettering

 

Nelson,

 

The Ghost White is a cartridge that replaces the black. I can switch.  I gave a clinic at the Greensberg, PA RPM on the Ghost White. I plan to give it at Winston-Salem’s Carolina RPM too.

 

Dave

Sent from Dave Bott' iPhone


--
____________________________
David Bott, modeling the A&Y in '34

Re: Printing White Decals

Garth Groff <sarahsan@...>
 

Friends,

If you haven't been there, check the Ghost White web site at https://www.ghost-white-toner.com/ghost-white-toner-transfer-for-everyone/ . It appears that their cartridges fit various HP, Oki and Samsung laser printers. Actually, if you have the right printer already, the cost may not be prohibitive, with cartridges for some printers at around $120. For professional machines the cost can be over $1,000. There is a search feature which matches their products to various printers.

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff

On 5/26/19 1:37 PM, A&Y Dave in MD wrote:
This is my hobby. I couldn’t make enough at decals to compete with my day job. I have done special runs for friends at cost and supported the Carolina RPM with the Southern vent boxcar, but have no interest in a second career. I’ve seen what that can do to people.

 I bought a $200 printer and a $200 (with shipping from Germany) cartridge and i’m set for life.  I have printed about 30 8x11 sheets of decals so far and i haven’t gone below 95% full on cartridge. Some cannot afford $400 for all the custom white decals you’ll need, but for about a DCC sound loco cost, i felt it was worth the advantage to add a second number to a commercial car like the Kadee boxcar or create accurate 1934 era data and lettering.  I was looking to replace my ALPS and those are not made or supported commercially any more. The Ghost White AND printer was less than my investment in track/switches or DCC system or a single locomotive. Seems worth it to have my fleet of steam era cars be equally accurate.

Btw there is a US source for Ghost White now, so shipping will be less. 

David Bott, modeling the A&Y in '34
Re: Clover House Chalk Marks

Dave Lawler
 

I bought a pack of the Clover House chalk marks a couple of years ago and found that
they would not transfer from the backing sheet no matter what surface I tried to put them on.
I contacted Clover House and was told the were having problems with the white transfers.
They sent me a replacement set and I had the same problem.
The black transfers work fine. I hope they have corrected the problem as I think dry transfer
chalk marks are a good way to go in many applications.
Dave Lawler
Re: Doors with inside detail

hubert mask
 

Very nice.  


On May 26, 2019, at 1:02 PM, O Fenton Wells <srrfan1401@...> wrote:

Looking good Tim, nicely done.
Fenton

On Sun, May 26, 2019 at 12:38 PM Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:

well done!


On 5/26/2019 12:28 PM, StephenK wrote:
After potting around with this for a few weeks, I finally got a good result.   I tried several ways of pressing aluminum foil on the outside of the door, but nothing would get the detail to show properly.   An attempt at using strip styrene was more trouble than it was worth.  In addition, I realized that the kit door had latch detail molded in which would show on the inside.  I ended up making a simple casting.   I used a similar door out of my stash and carved off the latches, etc.   I attached the door to a sheet of plastic and poured Elmer's School Glue over the door.   I poked around in it to remove the bubbles and let it dry overnight.   The next day the glue was mostly dry and peeled off easily.  I ACC's it to the kit door, trimmed the excess and painted it Floquil Old Silver.   A little rust powder, and the door was done.   

A few other notes:  The wood interior walls had to be trimmed a bit to clear the kit roof.   I chose not to use the wood floor from the interior kit because it added a layer to the car that I though looked wrong--I painted the plastic kit floor instead.    I built bulkheads at each end of the car and filled the space with BBs for weight--a normal interior weight would add to the floor height and again I didn't want that.   I have left the car unweathered and the roof unattached until I decide what the load should be and get it built and installed (a car carrying bags of flour will have different weathering than a car carrying boxes of  merchandise).  In any case, the kit went together well and I am happy with the result.  

Attachments:



--
Fenton Wells
250 Frye Rd
Pinehurst NC 28374
910-420-8106
srrfan1401@...
Re: Super Clean Degreaser to remove lettering

Nelson Moyer
 

What brand and model of printer do you use? I looked on the HP web site, but didn’t find any mention of a ghost white printer, must black and white and color. I have a LaserJet 1200, which is pretty old, so I doubt that a white toner cartridge would be available. Actually, the HP web site produced no hits when I searched for white toner.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of A&Y Dave in MD
Sent: Sunday, May 26, 2019 12:25 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Super Clean Degreaser to remove lettering

 

Nelson,

 

The Ghost White is a cartridge that replaces the black. I can switch.  I gave a clinic at the Greensberg, PA RPM on the Ghost White. I plan to give it at Winston-Salem’s Carolina RPM too.

 

Dave

Sent from Dave Bott' iPhone


--
____________________________
David Bott, modeling the A&Y in '34

Re: Clover House Chalk Marks (An Alternative)

WILLIAM PARDIE
 

I agree with Bob Chaparro's assesment of Prismacolor pencils.  I would encourage taking this a step further and combining this with decals or dry transfers.  Michael Gross on one of his tutorials on boxcars used either decals or dry transfers,  weathered the car and then applied pencil chalk marks.  This gave a combination of new and old chalk marks.  The results are the best I have ever seen for realistic looking chalk marks.

Bill Pardie



Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone

-------- Original message --------
From: "Bob Chaparro via Groups.Io" <chiefbobbb@...>
Date: 5/26/19 7:59 AM (GMT-10:00)
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Clover House Chalk Marks (An Alternative)

Peter, I can't help you with this problem but as an alternative I recommend using Prismacolor Verithin (not regular Prismacolor) art pencils. I've conducted several 'hands-on" chalk marking clinics and most modelers learn to simulate good chalk marks within minutes.

Plus, you are not limited to the contents of a decal or dry transfer sheet.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA
Re: Clover House Chalk Marks (An Alternative)

Bob Chaparro
 

Peter, I can't help you with this problem but as an alternative I recommend using Prismacolor Verithin (not regular Prismacolor) art pencils. I've conducted several 'hands-on" chalk marking clinics and most modelers learn to simulate good chalk marks within minutes.

Plus, you are not limited to the contents of a decal or dry transfer sheet.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA
Re: Clover House Chalk Marks

Paul Doggett
 

Quite possibly it’s purple in colour and stinks to try and stop tramps drinking it.

Paul Doggett.  England 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿 


On 26 May 2019, at 18:47, steve_wintner via Groups.Io <steve_wintner@...> wrote:

I think we call methylated spirits "denatured alcohol" over here in the states

Liquid Poured On A Grain Load

Bob Chaparro
 

Liquid Poured On A Grain Load

In response to a photo of grain in a box car, Red Battreall commented that he worked at an elevator in the early 1950s. He stated, ..."after we filled the car to the proper height we would dump gallon jugs of some kind of pungent liquid that would take your breath away. I assume it was to fumigate the grain."

Does anyone know what this liquid was? If so, was this a common practice?

Thanks.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA
Re: Clover House Chalk Marks

steve_wintner
 

I think we call methylated spirits "denatured alcohol" over here in the states
Re: Printing White Decals was Super Clean Degreaser to remove lettering

A&Y Dave in MD
 

This is my hobby. I couldn’t make enough at decals to compete with my day job. I have done special runs for friends at cost and supported the Carolina RPM with the Southern vent boxcar, but have no interest in a second career. I’ve seen what that can do to people.

 I bought a $200 printer and a $200 (with shipping from Germany) cartridge and i’m set for life.  I have printed about 30 8x11 sheets of decals so far and i haven’t gone below 95% full on cartridge. Some cannot afford $400 for all the custom white decals you’ll need, but for about a DCC sound loco cost, i felt it was worth the advantage to add a second number to a commercial car like the Kadee boxcar or create accurate 1934 era data and lettering.  I was looking to replace my ALPS and those are not made or supported commercially any more. The Ghost White AND printer was less than my investment in track/switches or DCC system or a single locomotive. Seems worth it to have my fleet of steam era cars be equally accurate.

Btw there is a US source for Ghost White now, so shipping will be less. 

Dave

Sent from Dave Bott' iPhone

--
____________________________
David Bott, modeling the A&Y in '34
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