Date   

Re: An update from Yarmouth Model Works

Jon Miller <atsfus@...>
 

On 8/10/2019 9:58 AM, Tim O'Connor wrote:

Pierre, your link also led me towards a bunch of very impressive looking industrial loads!
We may be into the Golden Age of open loads now. :-)

https://www.ebay.com/itm/303197478401

    While these are very impressive, wouldn't they most likely be shipped covered?  Canvas or something?

-- 
Jon Miller
For me time stopped in 1941
Digitrax  Chief/Zephyr systems, JMRI User
SPROG User
NMRA Life member #2623
Member SFRH&MS


Re: Railway express agency (was LCL)

Tim O'Connor
 

Lee

In those times, interstate regulation was very extensive. Ever see the ICC building
in Washington? It's MASSIVE.

But from 1929 onwards REA was owned by a consortium of railroads with shares proportional
to the amount of express revenues of the 69 owners. From 1961 onwards the REA leased space
on railroad trains and kept 50% of the profits (previously 90% of profits went to the owner
railroads) and the ICC (in the 1960's) prohibited REA from operating all-truck services and
only allowed them to use trucks in conjunction with rail service. This prevented REA from
becoming UPS or Fedex. :-(

As the first major "corporations" in America the railroads were subjected to the greatest
amount of regulation as corporate and anti-trust laws (and unions) were invented during the
100 years after the Civil War. These conditions really circumscribed the railroads' business
and severely limited them. The rest, as they say, is history.

Tim



On 8/10/2019 12:52 PM, Lee Thwaits wrote:
Was  REA legally tied to the railroads?  I always wondered why it didn't become a trucking competitor to UPS.
Lee Thwaits


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: Railway express agency (was LCL)

Charles Peck
 

REA was owned by the railroads.  The Interstate Commerce Commission had rules about carriers competing against themselves and regulated other carriers as well.  Although they did at times make exceptions on a case by case basis, generally they watched out for anti-competitive situations. 
A barge line could not own a railroad and vice versa.  This largely kept the railroads out of the interstate trucking business. In many places they were allowed to do local delivery but even this was often done on a contract basis.
The rules were lawyer-complex but this is the best understanding I have of it.
Chuck Peck

On Sat, Aug 10, 2019 at 12:54 PM Lee Thwaits <leeoldsa@...> wrote:
Was  REA legally tied to the railroads?  I always wondered why it didn't
become a trucking competitor to UPS.
Lee Thwaits




Re: Railway express agency (was LCL)

Dennis Storzek
 

I believe REA was owned by a consortium of railroads same as the Pullman Company in its last years.

Dennis Storzek


An update from Yarmouth Model Works

David
 

What happened to cause the blister at the top door panel?
Probably a load shifted/fell over enough to dent the door.

David Thompson


Re: An update from Yarmouth Model Works

Tim O'Connor
 


Pierre, your link also led me towards a bunch of very impressive looking industrial loads!
We may be into the Golden Age of open loads now. :-)

https://www.ebay.com/itm/303197478401

Tim O'Connor



On 8/10/2019 12:25 PM, Pierre Oliver wrote:

A third party is selling them on Ebay

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Funaro-F-C-T-24-BUCKEYE-CUSHION-Ride-Trucks-2D-F24-5-6-4-Wheel-X37b-X38b-X38/233045357412?hash=item364295f364:g:Lo4AAOSwjQVcEoM2:sc:USPSFirstClass!48060!US!-1

Pierre Oliver
www.elgincarshops.com
www.yarmouthmodelworks.com
On 8/10/19 12:24 p.m., Tim O'Connor wrote:

Roger,

I could have sworn Sharon said they had them. But give her a call.

Tim O'



On 8/9/2019 10:54 PM, Roger Huber via Groups.Io wrote:
Tim,

I can't see them on the F&C site. Could you provide some other info?

Roger Huber
Deer Creek Locomotive Works


On Friday, August 9, 2019, 09:39:16 PM CDT, Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:



Buckeye trucks. The PRR had them as well. F&C makes castings for them.



On 8/9/2019 10:26 PM, Roger Huber via Groups.Io wrote:
The car with the trucks I was asking about is the one on the blog #48826. Very strange trucks I am not familiar with.

Inline image


Roger Huber


I love the B-5 too, although I hesitate to call it the most homely. There
are plenty of candidates for that title! :-D

Photos shows the B-5's with at least FIVE different trucks

1. Buckeye, that Pierre mentioned (date 1956)
2. Allied Full Cushion (1951)
3. National Type B (date 1959)
4. AAR trucks - no spring plank, widely spaced two front springs (1942 builder, etc)
5. AAR trucks - no spring plank, three front springs (1941 builder)

Tim


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: Railway express agency (was LCL)

Lee Thwaits
 

Was  REA legally tied to the railroads?  I always wondered why it didn't become a trucking competitor to UPS.
Lee Thwaits


Re: An update from Yarmouth Model Works

Tim O'Connor
 


Bruce,

Someone else called these 2D-F24 trucks, according to my notes. Are you sure
about your classification? I just want to correct my notes if necessary.

Tim O'



On 8/10/2019 9:48 AM, Bruce Smith wrote:

Folks,

To expand on Tim's comment, these trucks were know as Elsey trucks, class 2D-F17 on the PRR. They are not shown on the F&C web page, but they do have them, so call and ask.


Regards,

Bruce Smith

Auburn, Al 




From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> on behalf of Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...>
Sent: Friday, August 9, 2019 9:39 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] An update from Yarmouth Model Works
 

Buckeye trucks. The PRR had them as well. F&C makes castings for them.



On 8/9/2019 10:26 PM, Roger Huber via Groups.Io wrote:
The car with the trucks I was asking about is the one on the blog #48826. Very strange trucks I am not familiar with.




Roger Huber
Deer Creek Locomotive Works


On Friday, August 9, 2019, 09:15:12 PM CDT, Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:



I love the B-5 too, although I hesitate to call it the most homely. There
are plenty of candidates for that title! :-D

Photos shows the B-5's with at least FIVE different trucks

1. Buckeye, that Pierre mentioned (date 1956)
2. Allied Full Cushion (1951)
3. National Type B (date 1959)
4. AAR trucks - no spring plank, widely spaced two front springs (1942 builder, etc)
5. AAR trucks - no spring plank, three front springs (1941 builder)


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: An update from Yarmouth Model Works

Pierre Oliver
 


Roger,

I could have sworn Sharon said they had them. But give her a call.

Tim O'



On 8/9/2019 10:54 PM, Roger Huber via Groups.Io wrote:

Tim,

I can't see them on the F&C site. Could you provide some other info?

Roger Huber
Deer Creek Locomotive Works


On Friday, August 9, 2019, 09:39:16 PM CDT, Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:



Buckeye trucks. The PRR had them as well. F&C makes castings for them.



On 8/9/2019 10:26 PM, Roger Huber via Groups.Io wrote:
The car with the trucks I was asking about is the one on the blog #48826. Very strange trucks I am not familiar with.

Inline image


Roger Huber
Deer Creek Locomotive Works


On Friday, August 9, 2019, 09:15:12 PM CDT, Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:



I love the B-5 too, although I hesitate to call it the most homely. There
are plenty of candidates for that title! :-D

Photos shows the B-5's with at least FIVE different trucks

1. Buckeye, that Pierre mentioned (date 1956)
2. Allied Full Cushion (1951)
3. National Type B (date 1959)
4. AAR trucks - no spring plank, widely spaced two front springs (1942 builder, etc)
5. AAR trucks - no spring plank, three front springs (1941 builder)

Tim


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts

--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: An update from Yarmouth Model Works

Tim O'Connor
 


Roger,

I could have sworn Sharon said they had them. But give her a call.

Tim O'



On 8/9/2019 10:54 PM, Roger Huber via Groups.Io wrote:
Tim,

I can't see them on the F&C site. Could you provide some other info?

Roger Huber
Deer Creek Locomotive Works


On Friday, August 9, 2019, 09:39:16 PM CDT, Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:



Buckeye trucks. The PRR had them as well. F&C makes castings for them.



On 8/9/2019 10:26 PM, Roger Huber via Groups.Io wrote:
The car with the trucks I was asking about is the one on the blog #48826. Very strange trucks I am not familiar with.

Inline image


Roger Huber
Deer Creek Locomotive Works


On Friday, August 9, 2019, 09:15:12 PM CDT, Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:



I love the B-5 too, although I hesitate to call it the most homely. There
are plenty of candidates for that title! :-D

Photos shows the B-5's with at least FIVE different trucks

1. Buckeye, that Pierre mentioned (date 1956)
2. Allied Full Cushion (1951)
3. National Type B (date 1959)
4. AAR trucks - no spring plank, widely spaced two front springs (1942 builder, etc)
5. AAR trucks - no spring plank, three front springs (1941 builder)

Tim


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts

--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: An update from Yarmouth Model Works

Bruce Smith
 

Folks,

To expand on Tim's comment, these trucks were know as Elsey trucks, class 2D-F17 on the PRR. They are not shown on the F&C web page, but they do have them, so call and ask.


Regards,

Bruce Smith

Auburn, Al 




From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> on behalf of Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...>
Sent: Friday, August 9, 2019 9:39 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] An update from Yarmouth Model Works
 

Buckeye trucks. The PRR had them as well. F&C makes castings for them.



On 8/9/2019 10:26 PM, Roger Huber via Groups.Io wrote:
The car with the trucks I was asking about is the one on the blog #48826. Very strange trucks I am not familiar with.




Roger Huber
Deer Creek Locomotive Works


On Friday, August 9, 2019, 09:15:12 PM CDT, Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:



I love the B-5 too, although I hesitate to call it the most homely. There
are plenty of candidates for that title! :-D

Photos shows the B-5's with at least FIVE different trucks

1. Buckeye, that Pierre mentioned (date 1956)
2. Allied Full Cushion (1951)
3. National Type B (date 1959)
4. AAR trucks - no spring plank, widely spaced two front springs (1942 builder, etc)
5. AAR trucks - no spring plank, three front springs (1941 builder)

Tim


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: Railway express agency (was LCL)

Bob Webber
 

Remember - 90% of us only saw REA in its decline. At one time it was the premier service organization. By 1954, with train-offs and reduction in trackage (and a lot of worn out cars that had been used for Express due to overuse in the war) - and the implementation of trains that no longer would serve Express save for terminals or long stops, the death was imminent. Unlike Fed-Ex & UPS today - they could not go out and purchase their own trains to haul Express - cars, yes, trains no.

By the time of your scenario (Ames to LA), REA was no longer the force it had been. But they always had large fleets of wagons, then trucks - so by that time, yes, they'd simply truck it to an open agency. And...even in that scenario, if all you have on other lines is premier passenger trains that no longer stopped for any length of time (say, to unload a large crate, or trunks, or...) the construct that REA was based upon could not work. You had to have the local trains or at least trains that had to stop anyway (see water & coal refreshing) for it to work. Most premier trains didn't make countless stops.

REA's decline was mostly due to the USPO being allowed Parcel Post. The decline of passenger service didn't help of course - but by that time *ALL* rail service was on a downward spiral. The ability to get a package from anywhere to anywhere in the US in the three-five days stipulated was nearly impossible. The loss of secondary, tertiary and mixed trains on the main and trains on branches were a problem - less frequency always ends up translated as less service. You could no longer put a package on a train headed to some place just outside commuter territory and expect same day service (which is what department stores did in New York, Chicago and other large cities).

LCL was winding down as well - for many of the same reasons.. When your frequency and scheduling reliability take a hit, service does too. The MP was losing money on every attempt, they shifted the service to their own trucking company. They were relatively innovative with the Eagle service, speed pack (containers of sorts that could be pre-packed, wheeled onto a car, wheeled off and unpacked at destination - a lot less handling & damage claims), refrigerated goods, etc. The bottom line is that at the edge of the era, service of all types was declining. One could debate endlessly as to why and how it came to that, and what solutions were available. One could also debate if the railroads intentionally killed the very thing that set them apart.

But the equation for LCL & REA was the same - fewer trains on fewer tracks with less reliability while trucks enjoyed more & better roads coupled with the railroad's desire for fewer stops and longer trains meant decline and end.

Inability to return empties and unwillingness to serve smaller customers was certainly a part of it. Traffic managers trying to get their smaller charges cars were frozen out in the attempt. The result is unit trains and very few mixed lading trains. Try to figure out how an LCL business would work now...The very nature of LCL business was against the railroads. It was, for the most part, local business. As trackage was torn up, as slow orders became more frequent, as congestion became worse in terminal areas, competing for local business just was not possible.



At 08:41 PM 8/9/2019, roy wojahn via Groups.Io wrote:
My only experience with REA was when I shipped my belongings from Ames, Iowa to Southern California. My question is since C&NW at that time had no passenger service to Ames would a truck take it to Des Moines and then route it via the Rock Island to Kansas City and then Rock Island/ Espee to Los Angeles? As passenger service disappeared did REA trucking become more common?
Bob Webber


Re: An update from Yarmouth Model Works

Richard Townsend
 

If it isn't the ugliest it certainly is one of the most un-standard: four panels on each side of the door (of unequal size), odd roof with indented end panels, 10-rung side ladders, odd and deep side sills. OK, the doors are standard (maybe).

Richard Townsend
Lincoln City, OR


-----Original Message-----
From: Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...>
To: main <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>
Sent: Fri, Aug 9, 2019 7:15 pm
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] An update from Yarmouth Model Works


I love the B-5 too, although I hesitate to call it the most homely. There
are plenty of candidates for that title! :-D

Photos shows the B-5's with at least FIVE different trucks

1. Buckeye, that Pierre mentioned (date 1956)
2. Allied Full Cushion (1951)
3. National Type B (date 1959)
4. AAR trucks - no spring plank, widely spaced two front springs (1942 builder, etc)
5. AAR trucks - no spring plank, three front springs (1941 builder)

Tim



On 8/9/2019 10:14 AM, James Brewer wrote:

Like Bill, I am excited and glad and N&W B-5 boxcar is being done....but I think it is beautiful, not homely! LOL!  The other kits look great as well.  Thanks for doing all of these cars.

Jim Brewer

On Fri, Aug 9, 2019 at 8:26 AM Bill Welch <fgexbill@...> wrote:
Very excited about the N&W B5, arguably the most homely boxcar ever built. thank you for doing them Pierre.

Bill Welch


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: An update from Yarmouth Model Works

gary laakso
 

What happened to cause the blister at the top door panel?

Gary Laakso
Northwest of Mike Brock

-----Original Message-----
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Tim O'Connor
Sent: Friday, August 9, 2019 7:24 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] An update from Yarmouth Model Works


fyi


On 8/9/2019 7:19 PM, Pierre Oliver wrote:
Well that's the first image to pop up with a Superior door.
Figures

Pierre Oliver
www.elgincarshops.com
www.yarmouthmodelworks.com

On 8/09/19 6:57 p.m., David via Groups.Io wrote:
I trust the 49000-series B-5 will come with the Superior door option?

https://www.nwhs.org/archivesdb/detail.php?ID=19398

David Thompson

--
*Tim O'Connor*
*Sterling, Massachusetts*


Re: An update from Yarmouth Model Works

Roger Huber <trainpainter@...>
 

Tim,

I can't see them on the F&C site. Could you provide some other info?

Roger Huber
Deer Creek Locomotive Works


On Friday, August 9, 2019, 09:39:16 PM CDT, Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:



Buckeye trucks. The PRR had them as well. F&C makes castings for them.



On 8/9/2019 10:26 PM, Roger Huber via Groups.Io wrote:
The car with the trucks I was asking about is the one on the blog #48826. Very strange trucks I am not familiar with.

Inline                   image


Roger Huber
Deer Creek Locomotive Works


On Friday, August 9, 2019, 09:15:12 PM CDT, Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:



I love the B-5 too, although I hesitate to call it the most homely. There
are plenty of candidates for that title! :-D

Photos shows the B-5's with at least FIVE different trucks

1. Buckeye, that Pierre mentioned (date 1956)
2. Allied Full Cushion (1951)
3. National Type B (date 1959)
4. AAR trucks - no spring plank, widely spaced two front springs (1942 builder, etc)
5. AAR trucks - no spring plank, three front springs (1941 builder)

Tim


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: An update from Yarmouth Model Works

Tim O'Connor
 


Buckeye trucks. The PRR had them as well. F&C makes castings for them.



On 8/9/2019 10:26 PM, Roger Huber via Groups.Io wrote:
The car with the trucks I was asking about is the one on the blog #48826. Very strange trucks I am not familiar with.




Roger Huber
Deer Creek Locomotive Works


On Friday, August 9, 2019, 09:15:12 PM CDT, Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:



I love the B-5 too, although I hesitate to call it the most homely. There
are plenty of candidates for that title! :-D

Photos shows the B-5's with at least FIVE different trucks

1. Buckeye, that Pierre mentioned (date 1956)
2. Allied Full Cushion (1951)
3. National Type B (date 1959)
4. AAR trucks - no spring plank, widely spaced two front springs (1942 builder, etc)
5. AAR trucks - no spring plank, three front springs (1941 builder)

Tim


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: Railway express agency (was LCL)

Tim O'Connor
 


Trucks by the 1950's. If you ever watch reruns of the Beverly Hillbillies on
Amazon Prime (streaming video) they INCLUDE the original commercials for cigarettes
at the beginning of the show - and it is a shot of a RAILWAY EXPRESS truck trailer
with an ad for the cigarettes on the side of the truck!

Winston tastes good like a cigarette should! :-(



On 8/9/2019 9:41 PM, roy wojahn via Groups.Io wrote:
My only experience with REA was when I shipped my belongings from Ames, Iowa to Southern California.  My question is since C&NW at that time had no passenger service to Ames would a truck take it to Des Moines and then route it via the Rock Island to Kansas City and then Rock Island/ Espee to Los Angeles?  As passenger service disappeared did REA trucking become more common?


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: An update from Yarmouth Model Works

Tim O'Connor
 


Some of them had roofs that looked a LOT like PRR X37 or X38 roofs with
the indentation for the laterals.

Some appear to have ordinary SRE (rectangular panel) roofs [attached photo]

Tim O'Connor


On 8/9/2019 9:11 PM, mopacfirst wrote:
Different issue -- does this car have a steeper roof slope than normal?  Or is that an illusion?

Ron Merick

--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: An update from Yarmouth Model Works

Roger Huber <trainpainter@...>
 

The car with the trucks I was asking about is the one on the blog #48826. Very strange trucks I am not familiar with.




Roger Huber
Deer Creek Locomotive Works


On Friday, August 9, 2019, 09:15:12 PM CDT, Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:



I love the B-5 too, although I hesitate to call it the most homely. There
are plenty of candidates for that title! :-D

Photos shows the B-5's with at least FIVE different trucks

1. Buckeye, that Pierre mentioned (date 1956)
2. Allied Full Cushion (1951)
3. National Type B (date 1959)
4. AAR trucks - no spring plank, widely spaced two front springs (1942 builder, etc)
5. AAR trucks - no spring plank, three front springs (1941 builder)

Tim



On 8/9/2019 10:14 AM, James Brewer wrote:

Like Bill, I am excited and glad and N&W B-5 boxcar is being done....but I think it is beautiful, not homely! LOL!  The other kits look great as well.  Thanks for doing all of these cars.

Jim Brewer

On Fri, Aug 9, 2019 at 8:26 AM Bill Welch <fgexbill@...> wrote:
Very excited about the N&W B5, arguably the most homely boxcar ever built. thank you for doing them Pierre.

Bill Welch


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: An update from Yarmouth Model Works

 

UNCLE!

Thanks!
--

Brian Ehni


On 8/9/19, 8:47 PM, "David via Groups.Io" <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io on behalf of jaydeet2001=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:

> It's OK; he'd have to produce a photo of it in service colors, not the
> builder's whitewash.

Lol, here you go:
https://imagebase.lib.vt.edu/image_viewer.php?q=ns2910

David Thompson

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