Date   

Re: NP Wood Reefer

Dennis Storzek <destorzek@...>
 

On Mon, Nov 18, 2019 at 05:05 PM, brianleppert@... wrote:
Photo of NP 92238 I bought from Arnold Menke at O Scale West. Photo taken Portland, OR in Nov. 1936 and shows a still different underframe. 
That appears to be the same underframe as in the photo of 94631 that Aaron posted a couple pages back. Might I suggest that this is also a re-built/re-numbered car? You'll notice that these cars with two truss rods have no steel side sills, just the wood sills behind the sheathing. I think lack of a full compliment of steel sills puts them in the steel center sills category, even though they have steel body boldters and crossbearers.

Dennis Storzek


Re: Wedge Plow Blades

mark_landgraf
 

I was hoping somebody would say Milwaukee or Rock Island or MoPac or CNW. 

Mark


On Mon, Nov 18, 2019 at 10:44 PM, Nelson Moyer
<npmoyer@...> wrote:

GN had identical blades as far as I can determine. Maybe the GN faithful will confirm that assertion?

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of mark_landgraf via Groups.Io
Sent: Monday, November 18, 2019 9:31 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Wedge Plow Blades

 

DeGolyer library at SMU, has the freight car drawings for all of the predecessor rr's of BN. They also have the Q locomotive steam drawings collection. 

 

Last I knew, none of this is cataloged, and they may even deny having these collections. Good luck. 

 

Do the Q's plows look like anybody else's?

 

Great Lakes society has a good collection of drawings of a variety of central states rr's. 

 

Mark Landgraf

Albany NY

 

On Mon, Nov 18, 2019 at 8:08 PM, Nelson Moyer

<npmoyer@...> wrote:

The CB&Q used gondola wedge push plows in the early years, but in 1948, they scrapped the gondolas, salvaged the wedge blades, and mounted them on FM-11 and FM-11A flat cars. I’d like to model one of these wedge plows, but I can’t fine scale drawings of the blade. I checked Shapeways, and none of the blades I found match the Q wedge type. It seems like the wedge plow blade would be a natural for 3D printing for someone with CAD skills. Has anyone done a blade drawings suitable for 3D printing? Alternatively, has anyone published an article on construction the blade, including patterns for cutting the blade parts? I have the MR Jan 1957 article, but the blade doesn’t look quite right for the CB&Q. I have several photos of the Q wedge plows to work from, but I don’t do CAD.

 

The Q had over 100 of these cars, and they were distributed at division points, sub-division points, and other yards across the system. Other roads like the GN used them, so there should be a market for a 3D printed version in HO scale.

 

Nelson Moyer

 


Re: Wedge Plow Blades

Nelson Moyer
 

GN had identical blades as far as I can determine. Maybe the GN faithful will confirm that assertion?

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of mark_landgraf via Groups.Io
Sent: Monday, November 18, 2019 9:31 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Wedge Plow Blades

 

DeGolyer library at SMU, has the freight car drawings for all of the predecessor rr's of BN. They also have the Q locomotive steam drawings collection. 

 

Last I knew, none of this is cataloged, and they may even deny having these collections. Good luck. 

 

Do the Q's plows look like anybody else's?

 

Great Lakes society has a good collection of drawings of a variety of central states rr's. 

 

Mark Landgraf

Albany NY

 

On Mon, Nov 18, 2019 at 8:08 PM, Nelson Moyer

<npmoyer@...> wrote:

The CB&Q used gondola wedge push plows in the early years, but in 1948, they scrapped the gondolas, salvaged the wedge blades, and mounted them on FM-11 and FM-11A flat cars. I’d like to model one of these wedge plows, but I can’t fine scale drawings of the blade. I checked Shapeways, and none of the blades I found match the Q wedge type. It seems like the wedge plow blade would be a natural for 3D printing for someone with CAD skills. Has anyone done a blade drawings suitable for 3D printing? Alternatively, has anyone published an article on construction the blade, including patterns for cutting the blade parts? I have the MR Jan 1957 article, but the blade doesn’t look quite right for the CB&Q. I have several photos of the Q wedge plows to work from, but I don’t do CAD.

 

The Q had over 100 of these cars, and they were distributed at division points, sub-division points, and other yards across the system. Other roads like the GN used them, so there should be a market for a 3D printed version in HO scale.

 

Nelson Moyer

 


Re: Wedge Plow Blades

mark_landgraf
 

DeGolyer library at SMU, has the freight car drawings for all of the predecessor rr's of BN. They also have the Q locomotive steam drawings collection. 

Last I knew, none of this is cataloged, and they may even deny having these collections. Good luck. 

Do the Q's plows look like anybody else's?

Great Lakes society has a good collection of drawings of a variety of central states rr's. 

Mark Landgraf
Albany NY


On Mon, Nov 18, 2019 at 8:08 PM, Nelson Moyer
<npmoyer@...> wrote:

The CB&Q used gondola wedge push plows in the early years, but in 1948, they scrapped the gondolas, salvaged the wedge blades, and mounted them on FM-11 and FM-11A flat cars. I’d like to model one of these wedge plows, but I can’t fine scale drawings of the blade. I checked Shapeways, and none of the blades I found match the Q wedge type. It seems like the wedge plow blade would be a natural for 3D printing for someone with CAD skills. Has anyone done a blade drawings suitable for 3D printing? Alternatively, has anyone published an article on construction the blade, including patterns for cutting the blade parts? I have the MR Jan 1957 article, but the blade doesn’t look quite right for the CB&Q. I have several photos of the Q wedge plows to work from, but I don’t do CAD.

 

The Q had over 100 of these cars, and they were distributed at division points, sub-division points, and other yards across the system. Other roads like the GN used them, so there should be a market for a 3D printed version in HO scale.

 

Nelson Moyer

 


Re: Looking for car colors and road numbers (Tichy Flatcars)

radiodial868
 

Huh? Gotta love it. What's a poor modeler to do.  Step 23 of the Owl Mountain SP F-50 flatcar instructions says "Paint Specs called for SP Flatcars to have decks painted flatcar red".   The instructions references some book by a guy named Anthony W. Thompson called "Southern Pacific Freight Cars Vol 3" for photos.    Jason, you got some 'splaining to do!   :>(p
RJ Dial
===============================

  • Another trick, is that for decks that were originally painted (i.e. SP), I'll also add some of the body color to the palette. Similarly, I'll leave a board unpainted now and then to represent replacements. They still get the washes though.
    If by SP you mean Southern Pacific, I can assure you that SP did not paint flat car decks, ever, at least prior to 1960. They did use treated wood, but not paint.
Tony Thompson


Wedge Plow Blades

Nelson Moyer
 

The CB&Q used gondola wedge push plows in the early years, but in 1948, they scrapped the gondolas, salvaged the wedge blades, and mounted them on FM-11 and FM-11A flat cars. I’d like to model one of these wedge plows, but I can’t fine scale drawings of the blade. I checked Shapeways, and none of the blades I found match the Q wedge type. It seems like the wedge plow blade would be a natural for 3D printing for someone with CAD skills. Has anyone done a blade drawings suitable for 3D printing? Alternatively, has anyone published an article on construction the blade, including patterns for cutting the blade parts? I have the MR Jan 1957 article, but the blade doesn’t look quite right for the CB&Q. I have several photos of the Q wedge plows to work from, but I don’t do CAD.

 

The Q had over 100 of these cars, and they were distributed at division points, sub-division points, and other yards across the system. Other roads like the GN used them, so there should be a market for a 3D printed version in HO scale.

 

Nelson Moyer

 


Re: NP Wood Reefer

brianleppert@att.net
 

I've spent too much time trying to research NP wood reefers and really wish someone else would do the job.  The rooster changed over time.  An example is the 92000 series.  An earlier series had "steel center sills", a 43'-4" outside length and 2097 cubic feet.  The Oct. 1940 lists only four cars left, compared to 866 in 1935.  This group totally disappeared in the 1940s but the number series was then used for rebuilt wood reefers.  So be careful.

Photo of NP 92629 is a Ted Culotta scan for ebay of a later car.  Tacoma, WA 2-18-55 from Bob's Photo.

Photo of NP 92238 I bought from Arnold Menke at O Scale West. Photo taken Portland, OR in Nov. 1936 and shows a still different underframe.  Scanned and posted here without his permission.  Better prints can be bought from him.  Arn's Rail Photos, 1429 Franklin St, Bisbee, Arizona 85603  waspman@...


Re: NP Wood Reefer

npin53
 

Here is a 93000. The photo is a tif. I don't see the deep cross bearers.

Aaron


Re: NP Wood Reefer

Dennis Storzek <destorzek@...>
 

On Mon, Nov 18, 2019 at 12:36 PM, Todd Sullivan wrote:
90002-90799 RS - Steel Underframe - L 43'-1" cuft 2086 - 490 cars
90802-90999 RS - Steel Underframe - L 43'-1" cuft 2086 - 135 cars
92001-92942 RS - Steel Underframe - L 43'-0" cuft 2041 - 358 cars
93000-93950 RS - Steel Underframe - L 43'-1" cuft 2086 - 199 cars
94442-94920 RS - Steel Center Sills - L 43'-4" cuft 2086 - 19 cars
99942-99966 RS - Steel Center Sills - L 43'-4" cuft 2148 - 5 cars
     99967       RS - Steel Center Sills - L 43'-4" cuft 2086 - 1 car
99968-99995 RS - Steel Center Sills - L 43'-4" cuft 2148 - 25 cars
Ignoring the 999xx series cars, which all seem to be later rebuilds, It appears the NP worked backward from 94999, so the high numbered cars are the oldest. This seems to be supported by the fact that the 94xxx series cars are marked "steel center sills" while the others are "steel underframe." Those oldest cars would be the cars with truss rods.

It's always iffy to rely on the equipment diagram drawings for this sort of data, because the drawings are little more than caricatures, just diagrams on which to hang dimensions. However, the diagram that Aaron posted for 94400-94899, built 1917, is most definitely showing truss rods, The diagram for 93000-93999, built 1922, has two little rectangles under the sill where one would expect to find the cross bearers, and I'll make the argument that the draftsman is trying to show us the shallow "USRA style" crossbearers. Now, if we had a diagram for the low 90000 cars built in 1931 and it shows the heavy crossbearers running all the way to the bottom of the center sills, we could be pretty sure that these three lots of cars had three different underframes. Better yet, a well lit photo of the 93000 series cars should confirm the form of their crossbearers, but photos that show the details of freightcar underframes are sometimes hard to come by.

Dennis Storzek


     


Photo: DL&W Boxcar 12448

Bob Chaparro
 


Re: NP Wood Reefer

npin53
 

99900 diagram.


Re: NP Wood Reefer

npin53
 
Edited

I think the 99900 cars were the ones with a sliding door for LCL and branch line service. I don't have my reference material here at work, or I could verify that.

Steel center sill cars had the truss rods.

Aaron


Re: NP Wood Reefer

Todd Sullivan
 

I should have checked my January 1952 ORER before I hit send.  Here are the NP wood reefer series listed in it:

90002-90799 RS - Steel Underframe - L 43'-1" cuft 2086 - 490 cars
90802-90999 RS - Steel Underframe - L 43'-1" cuft 2086 - 135 cars
92001-92942 RS - Steel Underframe - L 43'-0" cuft 2041 - 358 cars
93000-93950 RS - Steel Underframe - L 43'-1" cuft 2086 - 199 cars
94442-94920 RS - Steel Center Sills - L 43'-4" cuft 2086 - 19 cars
99942-99966 RS - Steel Center Sills - L 43'-4" cuft 2148 - 5 cars
     99967       RS - Steel Center Sills - L 43'-4" cuft 2086 - 1 car
99968-99995 RS - Steel Center Sills - L 43'-4" cuft 2148 - 25 cars
     99980       RS - Steel Center Sills - L 43'-4" cuft 2148 - 1 car

All cars are 12'-8" to top of running board and have 4'x6' doors.

Todd Sullivan


Re: NP Wood Reefer

Todd Sullivan
 

Thank you Larry, Dennis & Aaron.  I have a copy of Rick Leach's reprint of the 1940 NP freight car diagram book, but it's in storage about 1500 miles from here.  If someone else has a copy, that might help.  I'm pretty certain that the diagrams that Aaron provided would be in that reprint, but there may be more.  I am still amazed at how many diagrams it took to document NP's freight cars, especially the older ones.

Does anyone out there have a copy and can check it?

Todd Sullivan.


Re: NP Wood Reefer

npin53
 

These three diagrams are from the NPRHA site.

I hope we could at lest match a number series to an under frame type. I will look in my 1953 equipment register tonight.

Aaron Gjermundson


Re: NP Wood Reefer

Dennis Storzek <destorzek@...>
 

On Sun, Nov 17, 2019 at 08:39 PM, lrkdbn wrote:
Underfrane type 3- Cars built in 1922 had an underframe which upon study of photos looks to be the same as the USRA standard reefer,except that the NP car is slightly longer and wider:i.e.the NP "scaled up"the USRA design.The number of  rivets used looks to be the same.
Larry, Thanks for injecting some clarity into this discussion. Your refference to the USRA reefer underfranme means it should have crossbearers like this:


Crossbearer shown on the left, body bolster on the right.

In which case the Accurail fishbelly floor would be correct for those cars. Now, if someone had a roster so we could reconcile your built dates with actual car numbers, we would have this sorted. I unfortunately don't have any N.P. material.

Dennis Storzek


PFE

Paul Doggett
 

How I should have finished my R40-24 I will remove the periods 🙄🙄🙄
Paul Doggett. England 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿


Re: Photo: Tank Car With Full Hand Railings

G.J. Irwin
 

This is not far from my late dad's old neighborhood.  There is a little more on the Hoboken Shore Line at hbs.railfan.net (caution: some material beyond the time period of this list).

The photo looks like it was taken near the Maxwell House Coffee plant, one of the main brands of General Foods.  It was a major customer.

Cheers,
George Irwin


Pries corrugated radial roof

Bob Webber
 

Morbid curiosity compels me to ask - has anyone produced a model of a Pries corrugated radial roof?  (used on house cars of the teens - possibly only H&B? (it was a Michigan City concern, actually Williamson & Herman Pries and they had a lot fo patents for various freight car devices, appliances, metal/cast parts, roofs, UF, etc.)))?
Bob Webber


Re: Diagonal Panel Roof

Allan Smith
 

I have what you are looking for.  Contact me off list 
Al Smith
Sonora Ca

On Nov 17, 2019, at 5:42 PM, Bob Chapman <chapbob611@...> wrote:

I'm in need of a HO scale 40' diagonal panel roof for a boxcar project. At one time, Red Caboose offered these as an aftermarket part (#8700-04), but InterMountain's website no longer lists it.

Any suggestions?

Thanks,
Bob Chapman

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