Date   

Re: Truck Color

Bill Lugg
 

I see a lot of folks tossing the words "mineral red" around on this list.  What color would that be in terms a modeler (like me) would understand?

Thanks
Bill Lugg

On 11/20/19 11:35 AM, Nelson Moyer wrote:

CB&Q painted trucks mineral red, and there are many others that painted trucks their boxcar color. Probably  not good to generalize too broadly, especially in ALL CAPS.

Nelson Moyer


Re: Truck Color

Nelson Moyer
 

Yes, lots of variables, that’s why I narrowed the range somewhat from 1940s to 1953. Most of the cars I need truck color on are 1932 and 1937 boxcars.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Eric Hansmann
Sent: Wednesday, November 20, 2019 1:07 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Truck Color

 

Consider the era modeled, too. Some companies may have painted the trucks the car color before WW2 or 1930. After that point in time, the railroad may have received freight cars only with black or unpainted trucks.

 

 

Eric Hansmann

Murfreesboro, TN

 


Re: Truck Color

charles slater
 

Santa Fe did, even in the 1953 painting book issued by Santa Fe they were painted with 1 coat of mineral brown.
Charlie Slater

Sent from Outlook



From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> on behalf of Tony Thompson <tony@...>
Sent: Wednesday, November 20, 2019 11:36 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Truck Color
 
     There are likely other roads like SP, that painted trucks and underframes black before WW II but after the war, painted all that body color.

Tony Thompson




Re: Truck Color

Tony Thompson
 

Andy Jackson wrote:

Most RRs DID/DO NOT paint truck side frames so defects could more easily be seen. 

In the era of this list, I think this statement is incorrect. My impression is that most roads DID paint side frames. They were not routinely checked VISUALLY for defects.

Tony Thompson




Re: Truck Color

Tony Thompson
 

     There are likely other roads like SP, that painted trucks and underframes black before WW II but after the war, painted all that body color.

Tony Thompson




Re: Truck Color

Dennis Storzek
 

I just looked through my copy of the Soo Line freightcar book, and it reinforced my impression that the proper color for steam era freightcar trucks is GRUNGE COLOR. Plain journal bearings were lubed with oil, not grease, and it was a total loss system; that is, the carmen added oil, but never drained any out. There was no seal around the axle at the back of the box, just a wooden dust guard to keep dirt out of the box. The oil that worked its way to the back of the bearing was slung off the axle onto the face of the wheel, where it attracted dirt. This mix was then slung off the wheel, where it got on everything in the vicinity. After cars were in service for a few years, it's pretty hard to tell what color they were originally.

I seem to recall that Pullman-Standard painted trucks with 'truck paint', a thin bodied black. unless instructed otherwise. Other builders were likely similar. Some railroads specified that the trucks be painted body color, others, such as the Soo, didn't care, and new cars came with black trucks. However, the railroad's own shops saw things differently, and painted the trucks on re-painted cars body color, because it required no masking. So, one railroad, two different standards. In service, they all quickly turned the same color anyway.

Dennis Storzek


Re: Truck Color

Bill Keene
 

The Santa Fe specified during the transition era that new cars from the manufacture had black painted trucks. Repaints received mineral brown painted trucks. This most likely because it was more convenient for the shop forces. 

Cheers,
Bill Keene
Irvine, CA



On Nov 19, 2019, at 7:54 PM, Nelson Moyer <npmoyer@...> wrote:

About ten years ago I built a large number of assorted boxcars, hoppers, gondolas, and flat cars for many roads, all from Branchline, Intermountain, Red Caboose, and P2K kits. At the time, I was clueless about truck color, so all of the trucks are black. Now that I realize that one color doesn’t fit all roads, I need to know the truck color for all of these cars, i.e. black or boxcar red. Is there a table of roads and truck colors anywhere? I can only afford so many color books, and I can’t be an expert on multiple roads. After ten years, I’m just now getting comfortable with CB&Q practice. To simplify my question, which roads painted trucks boxcar red? I’m modeling 1953, so that limits the range to wood DS and SS boxcars, 1932, 1937, and PS-1 boxcars, and misc. hoppers, gondolas and flat cars appropriate for my era.
 
Nelson Moyer


Re: Truck Color

Eric Hansmann
 

Consider the era modeled, too. Some companies may have painted the trucks the car color before WW2 or 1930. After that point in time, the railroad may have received freight cars only with black or unpainted trucks.

 

 

Eric Hansmann

Murfreesboro, TN

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Nelson Moyer
Sent: Wednesday, November 20, 2019 12:36 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Truck Color

 

CB&Q painted trucks mineral red, and there are many others that painted trucks their boxcar color. Probably  not good to generalize too broadly, especially in ALL CAPS.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Andy Jackson
Sent: Wednesday, November 20, 2019 10:23 AM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Truck Color

 

Most RRs DID/DO NOT paint truck side frames so defects could more easily be seen. Back in the grease bearing days the trucks would be "colored" in grease & dirt. In the current roller bearing days the truck side frames are unpainted so are a rust color. But UP does paint their truck side frames but in their gray color.

Andy Jackson
Santa Fe Springs CA

 


Re: Truck Color

Nelson Moyer
 

CB&Q painted trucks mineral red, and there are many others that painted trucks their boxcar color. Probably  not good to generalize too broadly, especially in ALL CAPS.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Andy Jackson
Sent: Wednesday, November 20, 2019 10:23 AM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Truck Color

 

Most RRs DID/DO NOT paint truck side frames so defects could more easily be seen. Back in the grease bearing days the trucks would be "colored" in grease & dirt. In the current roller bearing days the truck side frames are unpainted so are a rust color. But UP does paint their truck side frames but in their gray color.

Andy Jackson
Santa Fe Springs CA

 


Seatrain Diagrams

Bob Chaparro
 

Seatrain Diagrams

Below are two Seatrain diagrams from the collection of Ralph Heiss which show how boxcars were loaded and secured in a ship.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA


Re: Truck Color

Jeffrey White
 

The IC painted trucks black.  However from 1947 through 1955 open top cars were painted brown and I've seen plenty of color photos that show brown hoppers and gons with brown trucks. I've never seen a photo of a brown flat car with brown trucks though. 

I honestly think it depended on what the guys in the paint shop felt like that day.

Jeff White

Alma IL

On 11/19/2019 9:54 PM, Nelson Moyer wrote:

About ten years ago I built a large number of assorted boxcars, hoppers, gondolas, and flat cars for many roads, all from Branchline, Intermountain, Red Caboose, and P2K kits. At the time, I was clueless about truck color, so all of the trucks are black. Now that I realize that one color doesn’t fit all roads, I need to know the truck color for all of these cars, i.e. black or boxcar red. Is there a table of roads and truck colors anywhere? I can only afford so many color books, and I can’t be an expert on multiple roads. After ten years, I’m just now getting comfortable with CB&Q practice. To simplify my question, which roads painted trucks boxcar red? I’m modeling 1953, so that limits the range to wood DS and SS boxcars, 1932, 1937, and PS-1 boxcars, and misc. hoppers, gondolas and flat cars appropriate for my era.

 

Nelson Moyer


Re: Intermountain PFE Reefer Issue

Bob Chaparro
 

"I'm trying to figure out what you thought that IM would replace your car WITH?"
That would have been up to them. Maybe they did have a car with correct stenciling, though not likely.
Maybe another product.
Maybe a refund.
It's an issue for the reasons others have commented...it's wrong and it requires a rework on my part.
Bob Chaparro
Hemet, CA


Re: SWITFT reefer in billboard lettering

Bob Chaparro
 

I checked my collection of prototype Swift reefer photos and found nine steel-sheathed cars, all in the 15XXX series, that had only two hinges per door.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA


Re: Truck Color

 

Most RRs DID/DO NOT paint truck side frames so defects could more easily be seen. Back in the grease bearing days the trucks would be "colored" in grease & dirt. In the current roller bearing days the truck side frames are unpainted so are a rust color. But UP does paint their truck side frames but in their gray color.
Andy Jackson
Santa Fe Springs CA



Re: tank car UTLX 45622 while on the Western Maryland

Schleigh Mike
 

Agreed, Steve,

The photo shows the heater bracket rivets but the Tariff is silent regarding their presence.  Perhaps the 7900 gallonage (less than 8K) suggests the heaters are present but no longer functional.

I note that your book (UTLX - Steam Era Tank Cars), pages 128 & 129, illustrate two former owners that might be origins of the 45622.

I am grateful for both books----Mike Schleigh in Grove City, Penna.



On Wednesday, November 20, 2019, 10:49:47 AM EST, Steve and Barb Hile <shile@...> wrote:


I will agree with Mike, with one small exception.  Cars in this series did have heaters.  The pairs of rivets along the lower half of the tank sides are a clue, confirmed in the 1952 UTLX listing.
 
Steve Hile


From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Schleigh Mike via Groups.Io
Sent: Wednesday, November 20, 2019 8:49 AM
To: STMFC; main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] tank car UTLX 45622 while on the Western Maryland

Hello Group!

UTLX 45622 appears in the 1955 Tank Car Tariff with 7900 gallons capacity and a 207 gallon dome; a simple tanker with no heater.  Further, to me, it seems a near-dead-on match for the Tangent General American 1917-Design 8000 gallon Tank Car 19005-01 model.  Only the KC brakes and the trucks on the model are different.

Regards from Grove City, Penna----Mike Schleigh 

On Wednesday, November 20, 2019, 09:11:24 AM EST, Claus Schlund \(HGM\) <claus@...> wrote:


Hi List Members,
 
In the image linked below, we get a view of tank car UTLX 45622 while on the Western Maryland
 
 
Some extra image data can be seen at the link below...
 
 
Note the image is mirror reversed.
 
I'm not a tank car expert, but I suspect this particular car was built to a GATX design - am I correct?
 
Enjoy!
 
Claus Schlund
 


Re: tank car UTLX 45622 while on the Western Maryland

Steve and Barb Hile
 

I will agree with Mike, with one small exception.  Cars in this series did have heaters.  The pairs of rivets along the lower half of the tank sides are a clue, confirmed in the 1952 UTLX listing.
 
Steve Hile



From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Schleigh Mike via Groups.Io
Sent: Wednesday, November 20, 2019 8:49 AM
To: STMFC; main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] tank car UTLX 45622 while on the Western Maryland

Hello Group!

UTLX 45622 appears in the 1955 Tank Car Tariff with 7900 gallons capacity and a 207 gallon dome; a simple tanker with no heater.  Further, to me, it seems a near-dead-on match for the Tangent General American 1917-Design 8000 gallon Tank Car 19005-01 model.  Only the KC brakes and the trucks on the model are different.

Regards from Grove City, Penna----Mike Schleigh 

On Wednesday, November 20, 2019, 09:11:24 AM EST, Claus Schlund \(HGM\) <claus@...> wrote:


Hi List Members,
 
In the image linked below, we get a view of tank car UTLX 45622 while on the Western Maryland
 
 
Some extra image data can be seen at the link below...
 
 
Note the image is mirror reversed.
 
I'm not a tank car expert, but I suspect this particular car was built to a GATX design - am I correct?
 
Enjoy!
 
Claus Schlund
 


Re: Truck Color

Nelson Moyer
 

What about roads that painted hoppers and gondolas red early and black later, or vice versa? Are the trucks always body color on those cars, or did some roads red cars have black trucks? I have information on RI, ATSF, and M&StL, but little information on other roads.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of O Fenton Wells
Sent: Wednesday, November 20, 2019 8:44 AM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Truck Color

 

Nelson, most y'all roads trucks are body color, especially repaints.

Fenton

 

On Wed, Nov 20, 2019 at 9:28 AM Nelson Moyer <npmoyer@...> wrote:

Thanks, Fred. I’ll start a spreadsheet to document responses. Hopefully, yours won’t be the only one.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Fred Jansz
Sent: Wednesday, November 20, 2019 1:28 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Truck Color

 

UP painted them red. WP black underframe & trucks.
Fred Jansz


 

--

Fenton Wells
250 Frye Rd

Pinehurst NC 28374
910-420-8106
srrfan1401@...


Re: tank car UTLX 45622 while on the Western Maryland

Schleigh Mike
 

Hello Group!

UTLX 45622 appears in the 1955 Tank Car Tariff with 7900 gallons capacity and a 207 gallon dome; a simple tanker with no heater.  Further, to me, it seems a near-dead-on match for the Tangent General American 1917-Design 8000 gallon Tank Car 19005-01 model.  Only the KC brakes and the trucks on the model are different.

Regards from Grove City, Penna----Mike Schleigh 

On Wednesday, November 20, 2019, 09:11:24 AM EST, Claus Schlund \(HGM\) <claus@...> wrote:


Hi List Members,
 
In the image linked below, we get a view of tank car UTLX 45622 while on the Western Maryland
 
 
Some extra image data can be seen at the link below...
 
 
Note the image is mirror reversed.
 
I'm not a tank car expert, but I suspect this particular car was built to a GATX design - am I correct?
 
Enjoy!
 
Claus Schlund
 


Re: Truck Color

O Fenton Wells
 

Nelson, most y'all roads trucks are body color, especially repaints.
Fenton

On Wed, Nov 20, 2019 at 9:28 AM Nelson Moyer <npmoyer@...> wrote:

Thanks, Fred. I’ll start a spreadsheet to document responses. Hopefully, yours won’t be the only one.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Fred Jansz
Sent: Wednesday, November 20, 2019 1:28 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Truck Color

 

UP painted them red. WP black underframe & trucks.
Fred Jansz



--
Fenton Wells
250 Frye Rd
Pinehurst NC 28374
910-420-8106
srrfan1401@...


Re: Intermountain PFE Reefer Issue

Nelson Moyer
 

Agreed for the mineral red and brown roofs and ends, but not so much for the light oxide roofs. If I can find proper decals to piece together the end lettering, I’ll repaint the roof and ends of those cars. They look worse in person than shown in the photos.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Garth Groff and Sally Sanford
Sent: Wednesday, November 20, 2019 4:46 AM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Intermountain PFE Reefer Issue

 

Nelson, 

 

I appreciate your frustration, but surely you weather your cars? After several years of service, no two PFE reefers would have perfectly matched. Weathering can hide a host of sins.

 

Yours Aye,

Garth Groff

 

 

On Tue, Nov 19, 2019 at 8:21 PM Nelson Moyer <npmoyer@...> wrote:

I hate preordering because we’re buying pigs in pokes, in the most recent case, multi-colored pigs in pokes. I pre-ordered twelve steel and wood PFE reefers. The first six have arrived over the past two years. Among these six cars, there are three distinctly different roof/end colors, as shown in the accompanying photo. We have light oxide, sort of mineral red, and sort of brown. Why can’t Intermountain produce cars with consistent paint colors between batches? Am I doomed to receive three more color variants among the next six cars I preordered? I defer to Tony Thompson as to which if any of the extant roof/end colors is ‘correct’.

 

This ridiculous state of affairs persists because modelers don’t rise up in mass and stop it. If you don’t like multi-colored roofs/ends in your PFE reefer blocks, do something!

 

End of rant.

 

Nelson Moyer

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