Date   

Help with early steel shipment and coiled steel shipment cars

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Gang;

I am putting together a presentation on this subject, and am in the next phase of research. I am finding very much info on the story behind the shipment of steel sheet and coiled steel sheet, and numerous railroads' involvement, but have not yet found enough photos to show how the cars looked when complete. Do any of you have photos of pre-dedicated, or dedicated steel shipment cars? Or sources of same? I would be happy to share the story when complete!

Thanks!

Elden Gatwood


Re: freight car roster shots

Eric Hansmann
 

Thanks for your comments, Lester and Jim.

 

 

Eric Hansmann

Murfreesboro, TN

 

 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Lester Breuer
Sent: Wednesday, December 11, 2019 1:10 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] freight car roster shots

 

Eric fine work.   Especially like the C&O and the ACL stands out.   Thanks for sharing.
Lester Breuer


Re: Assembling Truss Rods

Doug MacLeod
 

Very nice work.  I have to use a bending form to make truss rods.

Doug

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 


Re: 1/12 scale R-40-23 reefer Dreadnaught end

mark_landgraf
 

Andy

If you have a Deckel photograph available, wouldn't it have been easier to make the first generation master  rib and then use it to panto all 5 ribs, using an offset method into a ABS sheet?

I model in 1/8 scale and have done steel tooling for 5 rib Murphy end panels. Now insert a piece .030 thick steel and apply 40 tons. 

Are you envisioning resin or vacuum formed or fiberglass sides and roof?

What ever your choice, I'd recommend making sure it is UV and age/heat stable. 

Sometimes it is easier to make your master 2 or 3 times larger and then panto it down to the correct scale. 

Mark Landgraf
Albany NY



On Wed, Dec 11, 2019 at 7:43 PM, Dennis Storzek
<destorzek@...> wrote:
On Wed, Dec 11, 2019 at 11:51 AM, Andy Carlson wrote:
The IM part is from a mold made with CNC tool cutting technology, and the resin HO part is from the old-school method.
If you compare the two, it is obvious that IM screwed up the geometry at the end of the ribs. CNC is only as good as the programming, and the computer visualization of the surface sometimes makes these errors hard to spot.

Dennis Storzek


Re: Assembling Truss Rods

Curt Fortenberry
 

Bill,

Nice work for sure.  I still use my old method from narrow gauge modeling days and use fishing line and heat flare the ends.  

Curt Fortenberry 


Re: 1/12 scale R-40-23 reefer Dreadnaught end

Dennis Storzek
 

On Wed, Dec 11, 2019 at 11:51 AM, Andy Carlson wrote:
The IM part is from a mold made with CNC tool cutting technology, and the resin HO part is from the old-school method.
If you compare the two, it is obvious that IM screwed up the geometry at the end of the ribs. CNC is only as good as the programming, and the computer visualization of the surface sometimes makes these errors hard to spot.

Dennis Storzek


Re: Stencil: Heavy Repairs

Dennis Storzek
 

On Wed, Dec 11, 2019 at 09:36 AM, mopacfirst wrote:
Those four brackets attached to the car fascia at each end are attached to the ends of the four pieces of lumber that support the ice hatch platform, which surrounds the ice hatch proper.
The reason for doing it this way is to avoid having the attachment bolts penetrate the roof sheet. Bolts through the fascia are less likely to leak on the load. This is the same reason why many of the early steel roofs had clasps that came over the corner and were screwed to the fascia.

Dennis Storzek


Re: Assembling Truss Rods

Walter Cox
 

That is really nice work Bill, quite inspirational. If  I ever get my layout running and my stash of kits built I'll definitely be kitbashing a few old MDC wooden 12-1's into commuter cars.
Walt

In a message dated 12/11/2019 7:32:39 AM Eastern Standard Time, fgexbill@... writes:

CAUTION: Slotted Screws Visible

I have started rigging the truss rod system for my CB&Q model’s underframe. I use .015-brass wire for the rods so prior to gluing the Queen Posts in place I used a new Single Edge Razor Blade to widen the slots in the Grandt Line parts, carefully cleaving away hair width slivers of styrene on each of the sixteen parts. This took about three hours with frequent checks to make sure the .015-wire would nest in the slot. Next I drilled #77 holes in floor just inside the bolsters so one end of the .015 wire could pass through the floor.

I did the interior pair first, bending a section of wire at about 75° on the end that goes through the floor and putting it through the hole I had drilled. Then I let the wire sit in the Queen Post’s slot. Resting my small Tamiya pliers against the Post I made a slight bend. Inevitably I had to adjust this bend until the wire now rests in both Posts to achieve the exact bend. I had already measured the distance between the Posts with my Mitutoyo Digimatic Caliper and then divided this calculation by two to determine the midpoint. I used this calculation to trim the wire. Then I repeated the process for the other truss rod section.

Over the years I have accumulated a few packets of Grandt Line Brass Turnbuckles, These are very nicely detailed—albeit very small—parts. Because cyanoacrylate or CA is an effective glue in this situation, it is main reason I use brass wire with these parts. After I have made two good truss rods I trim each one just enough to create a small gap so that I can see through the turnbuckle. Once happy with each brass wire section, I filed each end to rough them up and then put them back in place resting on their respective Queen Post. Next I slipped the turnbuckle back on and make sure it is oriented so I can see through it. When I am happy, I apply a tiny drop of CA to the Queen Post/Brass Wire joints and to only one end of the turnbuckle, creating a slip joint. After these three joints have cured, I bent the wire ends locking them in the slightly oversized holes. With three glued joints and three that are not glued, this assembly can withstand a fair amount deflection without anything breaking.

My goal is to align each of the turnbuckles so that I can slip a piece of scale scrap lumber through the turnbuckles, hopefully all eight but if not four on each side. (As I was taking the photos clouds were playing with the Sun changing the light so I included extras showing the turnbuckles in different lighting.)


Bill Welch


1/12 scale R-40-23 reefer Dreadnaught end

Andy Carlson
 

Hello-

Pictured is a tooling resin 1/12 scale PC&F R-40-23 Refrigerator car Dreadnaught end. This is a classic example of an old-school method of tool making. An individual rib is carefully shaped and upon completion a 2nd generation part is mated with 5 others and skillfully joined together to make the 1st generation tooling resin reefer end.

A time intensive large scale model of the end is used as a tracing pattern for cutting a hard tool aluminum mold using a Deckel 3-D pantograph.

The pantograph allows several different scales as recipients for this large scale design. 5.33:1 reduction gives you an S scale part, and a  7.25:1 reduction yields an HO part. The parent large pattern is pictured below.

I have also included a picture of a pair of R-40-23 HO ends. The NP numbered part is from an Intermountain R-40-23 kit, and the grey resin part is a next generation part from the parent large scale pattern. The IM part is from a mold made with CNC tool cutting technology, and the resin HO part is from the old-school method.


Regards,

-Andy Carlson
Ojai CA





Re: freight car roster shots

Lester Breuer
 

Eric fine work.   Especially like the C&O and the ACL stands out.   Thanks for sharing.
Lester Breuer


Re: Stencil: Heavy Repairs

mopacfirst
 

Those four brackets attached to the car fascia at each end are attached to the ends of the four pieces of lumber that support the ice hatch platform, which surrounds the ice hatch proper.

Ron Merrick


Photo: SFRD Reefer 6719

Bob Chaparro
 

Photo: SFRD Reefer 6719

A link courtesy of Brian Rochon previously posted on this group: 

http://lists.railfan.net/erielackphoto.cgi?erielack-12-10-19/X4544.jpg

Not a great photo but this can be improved with photo editing software.

SFRD 6719 is a Class Rr-P refrigerator car from the series 6701-7200. These cars were built in 1909 by AC&F.

The cars had a wood exteriors and wood superstructures. The original underframe was wood supported by truss rods. In later years some of these cars received steel channels along the center sills to reinforce the underframe as well as flexible metal roofs. The cars had Bohn ice tanks.

There is a drawing of  Rr-P 6702 on Page 67 of the Santa Fe reefer book. The drawing indicates some of these cars had Garland ventilators. These ventilators were discussed in this message post:

https://groups.io/g/RailroadCitrusIndustryModelingGroup/message/519?p=,,,20,0,0,0::Created,,garland,20,2,0,31132621

There also were additional message posts on this subject. These can be accessed with the Message Search feature.

A photo of Rr-P 7140 is on Page 68 of the Santa Fe reefer book*.

The last five Rr-P reefers left the live list in 1936.

I cannot find evidence that any of these cars were rebuilt into later classes. It is possible some went into company service, however.

I also could not find a listing for a Class Rr-P reefer model in Westerfield's catalog listing.

Bob Chaparro

Moderator

Railroad Citrus Industry Modeling Group

https://groups.io/g/RailroadCitrusIndustryModelingGroup

*Santa Fe Refrigerator Cars Ice Bunker Cars 1884-1979

(Volume 2, Rolling Stock Reference Series)

By C. Keith Jordan, Richard H. Hendrickson, John B. Moore and A. Dean Hale and the Santa Fe Modeler Organization (1994)


Re: Stencil: Heavy Repairs

Michael Gross
 

And interesting to note the hooks above the trucks for attaching Keeley journal box cooling cans.  In an earlier post, someone had remarked that The Illinois Central often equipped freight cars with these hooks for a time.
--
Michael Gross
Pasadena, CA


Re: [External] [RealSTMFC] freight car roster shots

naptownprr
 

Good looking models, Eric.  Nice weathering


From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> on behalf of Eric Hansmann <eric@...>
Sent: Wednesday, December 11, 2019 8:10 AM
To: RealSTMFC@groups.io; Proto-Layouts@groups.io; ResinFreightCarBuilders@groups.io
Subject: [External] [RealSTMFC] freight car roster shots
 
This message was sent from a non-IU address. Please exercise caution when clicking links or opening attachments from external sources.

Taking roster shots of your completed freight cars can document your fleet as it grows. I get caught up with several models recently and posted some thoughts on the process in my latest blog post.



Eric Hansmann
Murfreesboro, TN


Re: Assembling Truss Rods

al.kresse <water.kresse@...>
 

Beautiful . . . . such patience!  I gave up on O-scale being too small to work with . . . ugh!

Al Kresse

On December 11, 2019 at 7:31 AM Bill Welch <fgexbill@...> wrote:

CAUTION: Slotted Screws Visible

I have started rigging the truss rod system for my CB&Q model’s underframe. I use .015-brass wire for the rods so prior to gluing the Queen Posts in place I used a new Single Edge Razor Blade to widen the slots in the Grandt Line parts, carefully cleaving away hair width slivers of styrene on each of the sixteen parts. This took about three hours with frequent checks to make sure the .015-wire would nest in the slot. Next I drilled #77 holes in floor just inside the bolsters so one end of the .015 wire could pass through the floor.

I did the interior pair first, bending a section of wire at about 75° on the end that goes through the floor and putting it through the hole I had drilled. Then I let the wire sit in the Queen Post’s slot. Resting my small Tamiya pliers against the Post I made a slight bend. Inevitably I had to adjust this bend until the wire now rests in both Posts to achieve the exact bend. I had already measured the distance between the Posts with my Mitutoyo Digimatic Caliper and then divided this calculation by two to determine the midpoint. I used this calculation to trim the wire. Then I repeated the process for the other truss rod section.

Over the years I have accumulated a few packets of Grandt Line Brass Turnbuckles, These are very nicely detailed—albeit very small—parts. Because cyanoacrylate or CA is an effective glue in this situation, it is main reason I use brass wire with these parts. After I have made two good truss rods I trim each one just enough to create a small gap so that I can see through the turnbuckle. Once happy with each brass wire section, I filed each end to rough them up and then put them back in place resting on their respective Queen Post. Next I slipped the turnbuckle back on and make sure it is oriented so I can see through it. When I am happy, I apply a tiny drop of CA to the Queen Post/Brass Wire joints and to only one end of the turnbuckle, creating a slip joint. After these three joints have cured, I bent the wire ends locking them in the slightly oversized holes. With three glued joints and three that are not glued, this assembly can withstand a fair amount deflection without anything breaking.

My goal is to align each of the turnbuckles so that I can slip a piece of scale scrap lumber through the turnbuckles, hopefully all eight but if not four on each side. (As I was taking the photos clouds were playing with the Sun changing the light so I included extras showing the turnbuckles in different lighting.)


Bill Welch


 


freight car roster shots

Eric Hansmann
 

Taking roster shots of your completed freight cars can document your fleet as it grows. I get caught up with several models recently and posted some thoughts on the process in my latest blog post.



Eric Hansmann
Murfreesboro, TN


Assembling Truss Rods

Bill Welch
 

CAUTION: Slotted Screws Visible

I have started rigging the truss rod system for my CB&Q model’s underframe. I use .015-brass wire for the rods so prior to gluing the Queen Posts in place I used a new Single Edge Razor Blade to widen the slots in the Grandt Line parts, carefully cleaving away hair width slivers of styrene on each of the sixteen parts. This took about three hours with frequent checks to make sure the .015-wire would nest in the slot. Next I drilled #77 holes in floor just inside the bolsters so one end of the .015 wire could pass through the floor.

I did the interior pair first, bending a section of wire at about 75° on the end that goes through the floor and putting it through the hole I had drilled. Then I let the wire sit in the Queen Post’s slot. Resting my small Tamiya pliers against the Post I made a slight bend. Inevitably I had to adjust this bend until the wire now rests in both Posts to achieve the exact bend. I had already measured the distance between the Posts with my Mitutoyo Digimatic Caliper and then divided this calculation by two to determine the midpoint. I used this calculation to trim the wire. Then I repeated the process for the other truss rod section.

Over the years I have accumulated a few packets of Grandt Line Brass Turnbuckles, These are very nicely detailed—albeit very small—parts. Because cyanoacrylate or CA is an effective glue in this situation, it is main reason I use brass wire with these parts. After I have made two good truss rods I trim each one just enough to create a small gap so that I can see through the turnbuckle. Once happy with each brass wire section, I filed each end to rough them up and then put them back in place resting on their respective Queen Post. Next I slipped the turnbuckle back on and make sure it is oriented so I can see through it. When I am happy, I apply a tiny drop of CA to the Queen Post/Brass Wire joints and to only one end of the turnbuckle, creating a slip joint. After these three joints have cured, I bent the wire ends locking them in the slightly oversized holes. With three glued joints and three that are not glued, this assembly can withstand a fair amount deflection without anything breaking.

My goal is to align each of the turnbuckles so that I can slip a piece of scale scrap lumber through the turnbuckles, hopefully all eight but if not four on each side. (As I was taking the photos clouds were playing with the Sun changing the light so I included extras showing the turnbuckles in different lighting.)


Bill Welch


Re: Building GN and CB&Q Truss Rod 40-Foot Boxcars

Paul Doggett
 

Bill
You are not on your own using slotted screws I us BA screws as US screws are not readily available over here, BA ( British Association) are slotted.
Paul Doggett.   England 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿 


On 10 Dec 2019, at 21:43, Bill Welch <fgexbill@...> wrote:

I knew there are "Prototype Police," had no idea there was a "Slotted Screw" police force. I better be careful about "screwing up."

Bill Welch


Re: WP conversion

Fred Jansz
 

Randy,

you can purchase the drawings at the Pullman Library, Illionois Railway Museum.
The original drawings state: 3/32" roof plates and rivets, see drawing.
The wooden construction must have been applied afterwards because WP MW2711 was converted from a caboose (that was converted from a 15001-series boxcar early 1940's).
Cabooses did NOT have steel roofs anymore, they were rebuilt with wooden roofs, covered with muleskin.
(© Picture: John Ryczkowski)

regards
Fred Jansz


Re: WP conversion

Fred Jansz
 
Edited

Dear Garth,
the store cars were still on the system in the 1950's, see picture: SAC 7-56.
They were numbered 8051-8085 from the start and went into MW/scrapped.

Why are boxcars assigned to plaster service not assigned to general service?
Not all of them loaded plaster, only 35 of the 125 cars numbered into 26001-26125 had either 2 or 4 roof hatches, see enclosed copy of my 1950 ORER.
The rest was as built -only renumbered and with AB brakes- these cars stayed into service untill the end of WP in 1983.
See diagram & picture in my previous post and enclosed photo by Bob Larson taken in 1970.
cheers
Fred Jansz

19941 - 19960 of 188546