Date   

Re: Flat Car Load

Donald B. Valentine <riverman_vt@...>
 

     Hate to disappoint you, Schuyler, but I believe the regular routing for these boilers from Schenectady to Bath, Me. was
up the D&H to the Canadian Pacific, east to Brookport,PQ, then down the Newport & Richford (former B&M trackage until 
1926) to Newport, VT, thence down the leased B&M Connecticut & Passumpsic Rivers trackage to St. Johnsbury where 
they were turned over to the Maine Central for transport down the Mountain Division to Portland and then final delivery to 
Bath. This was in regular trains, not special moves. I'll see if I can find where my photos of one of these moves that Uncle 
Warren Fancher and Jack Pontin took are an figure out how to post them. The Hoosac Tunnel still being double iron for 
some years after WW II there may have been a clearance problem there and they were certainly too high and to heavy
to be turned over to the Central Vermont at Rouses Point, NY to move to Swanton, Vt. and hand off to the St. Johnsbury
& Lake Champlain as much as I might wish they had come that way, right through Morrisville to St. Johnsbury!

Cordially, Don Valentine


Shenandoah Valley 40' steel box car

Andy Carlson
 

Garth-
This car you pictured seems to have maybe been a 8-9 foot door car converted to a single 6' door car. Look at the L side has 6 panels while the right side has 7. The lower door track extends out further than the top, perhaps when shortening the door tracks going to the next track support bracket was felt necessary.

Another possibility is that the car was a door and a half car, converted to a 6' single door car with some panel additions/relocations necessitated?
thanks for the picture.
-Andy Carlson   Ojai CA




Andy,

Are you thinking of something like this? Shenandoah Valley MW boxcar, still in service out of Staunton, Virginia.

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff  🦆

On Sun, Apr 19, 2020 at 2:27 PM Andy Carlson <midcentury@...> wrote:
Folks-
There are about three of these cars preserved at Southern California's Orange Empire Trolley Museum. Still in Navy grey colors.

About 12 years ago Dan Smith and I saw some Navy 40' box cars out near Inyokern (Not too far from Ridgecrest) which had characteristics of both X29 and '37 AAR designs. I have never seen anything like this before and none since.
-Andy

On Sunday, April 19, 2020, 10:51:06 AM PDT, Bob Chaparro via groups.io <chiefbobbb=verizon.net@groups.io> wrote:



U.S. Navy San Diego Boxcar

Andy Carlson
 

Yes, that is what I remember. Is the car pictured a former Navy car? Did many former Navy cars go into private RR's revenue use?
-Andy Carlson
Ojai CA


Andy,

Are you thinking of something like this? Shenandoah Valley MW boxcar, still in service out of Staunton, Virginia.

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff  🦆

On Sun, Apr 19, 2020 at 2:27 PM Andy Carlson <midcentury@...> wrote:
Folks-
There are about three of these cars preserved at Southern California's Orange Empire Trolley Museum. Still in Navy grey colors.

About 12 years ago Dan Smith and I saw some Navy 40' box cars out near Inyokern (Not too far from Ridgecrest) which had characteristics of both X29 and '37 AAR designs. I have never seen anything like this before and none since.
-Andy

On Sunday, April 19, 2020, 10:51:06 AM PDT, Bob Chaparro via groups.io <chiefbobbb=verizon.net@groups.io> wrote:

U.S. Navy San Diego Boxcar


Fw: Bx-34 Underframes and Greg Martin

John Barry
 

Forwarding to the STMFC list as I have only 9 attendee responses.  Steve, I'm including you directly given your io issues.

John

John Barry
 
ATSF North Bay Lines 
Golden Gates & Fast Freights 
Lovettsville, VA

707-490-9696 

PO Box 44736 
Washington, DC 20026-4736


----- Forwarded Message -----

From: John Barry <northbaylines@...>
To: Shake-N-Take <shake-n-take@groups.io>
Sent: Sunday, April 19, 2020, 12:25:31 AM EDT
Subject: Bx-34 Underframes and Greg Martin

Please join me in pulling for Greg's recovery from Covid complications.  Several of us are Facebook friends with Greg and are grateful for the updates that his sister has been posting there.  He had been making progress over the last week but has suffered a set back in the last couple days, redeveloping pneumonia.  Please pray for his recovery, but also pray for his medical team that they may be safe and have the insight to select the best treatment for him.

That's the mixed news on the medical front.

Good news on the Bx-34 underframes, I have received all of the parts they still had in stock.  The bad news is there were only 13, leaving us seven short.  Greg was developing a casting master to make up the difference before he became ill.  That's obviously not going to happen for the foreseeable future.  What to do to honor our commitment?

Well, I have found another source of Athearn 50' ice bunker reefer underframes: Athearn 50' ice bunker reefers, some disassembly required.  I've purchased seven of them to make up for the rest of the underframes.  These come with bonus parts that you may find useful in your build like the brake gear, bracket grabs and National B1 trucks.  I don't yet have these RTD (ready to disassemble) models, but should have them in the next week or so.  

Which brings me to our next issue.  I don't know who got the kits at Cocoa, nor do I know which of you who got kits did get underframes.  I also don't know who got which decals.  When I was told that the underframes were on the way, I spoke with Greg and asked for the list of participants.  Unfortunately, Covid intervened.  Watching Greg struggle confirms my personal risk assessment that with my age and underlying conditions, I can't afford to catch this, so I'm not sure when I'll be able to get out to mail the missing parts.  That said, we now have enough parts on hand or on the way to cover the other 20 kits.

What I need from all of you who got a kit at CCB is an email to NorthBayLines@... 

Please make the Subject

SnT2020 Participant

That will allow me to filter the responses to build the list.  Please only send one email with that subject.  I will send you confirmation with a different subject line.

In the body of the email please copy and past the following and fill in the blanks:

Name: __________
Last three of car number on decal _____
Underframe received? Yes or No



If no, please provide your shipping address.  
Also indicate if you would accept or prefer one of the RFD cars to make your underframe.  I will prioritize those whose cars need National B1 trucks if there are too many requests.




Once I have the list of participants I will get these out to all of you, likely by Priority Mail flat rate box as I can get the postman to schedule a pickup.  

I still have about a dozen extra decal sets available at $5 each.
I also purchased some of the brake rigging sets for my own use when I bought the rest of the underframes.  If you are interested, I can add that to your underframe package for $7.00.  

In summary, please send one and only one email with the requested subject line as it is set to automatically go to a folder where I can get the list together.  Please  include the requested information and I will get the parts out to you all.

John

John Barry
 
ATSF North Bay Lines 
Golden Gates & Fast Freights 
Lovettsville, VA

707-490-9696 

PO Box 44736 
Washington, DC 20026-4736


Re: U.S. Navy San Diego Boxcar

Garth Groff and Sally Sanford <mallardlodge1000@...>
 

Andy,

Are you thinking of something like this? Shenandoah Valley MW boxcar, still in service out of Staunton, Virginia.

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff  🦆

On Sun, Apr 19, 2020 at 2:27 PM Andy Carlson <midcentury@...> wrote:
Folks-
There are about three of these cars preserved at Southern California's Orange Empire Trolley Museum. Still in Navy grey colors.

About 12 years ago Dan Smith and I saw some Navy 40' box cars out near Inyokern (Not too far from Ridgecrest) which had characteristics of both X29 and '37 AAR designs. I have never seen anything like this before and none since.
-Andy

On Sunday, April 19, 2020, 10:51:06 AM PDT, Bob Chaparro via groups.io <chiefbobbb=verizon.net@groups.io> wrote:



Re: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Flat Car Load

Garth Groff and Sally Sanford <mallardlodge1000@...>
 

Elden,

The Southern had some special flat cars with a sort of table that was rotated up at an angle using hydraulic pistons. Like your G26S, these were used for pre-assembled turnouts, but I suppose they could have been used for a special paid shipment at need. I have a photo or two of them, but they were moving at speed and are not very sharp. I'm pretty sure they were also beyond our period of interest.

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff  🦆

On Sun, Apr 19, 2020 at 3:43 PM Gatwood, Elden J SAD <elden.j.gatwood@...> wrote:

Hudson;

 

Yes.  This is another diagonal loader on the PRR, this one a MW version, the PRR G26S, converted from a standard G26.  The G26 was a 65-footer, so it was specifically converted to accommodate a big turnout.

 

Elden Gatwood

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Hudson Leighton
Sent: Sunday, April 19, 2020 3:15 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Flat Car Load

 

This is also how the RRs ship prefabbed switches.

-Hudson


Re: Swift 3300

Douglas Harding
 

The message arrived in my inbox yesterday afternoon at 1:30pm, though it was sent on April 4th when the list were having a discussion about the rerelease of the Rapido meat reefer I assumed Steve would have a more informed answer than I about the Swift reefer, and I was getting ready for this morning.

 

I’ve been having this type a problem for some time. Apparently my Internet provider or my email provider sees group.io messages as spam and delays them.

 

As for the Swift cars in question, the only photos I have of 3300 series car I got from Steve, so not much help.

 

Doug  Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org

 

 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of vapeurchapelon
Sent: Sunday, April 19, 2020 3:27 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Swift 3300

 

Hello Steve,

 

I am in a similar situation from time to time, as it was the case with exactly that Email. I got it yesterday. Please have a look at the exact date: -it has been sent FIFTEEN DAYS ago! But I got it yesterday...

 

Best regards

 

Johannes

Modeling the early post-war years up to about 1953

 

Gesendet: Sonntag, 19. April 2020 um 22:22 Uhr
Von: "Steve and Barb Hile" <shile@...>
An: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Betreff: Re: [RealSTMFC] Swift 3300

I am currently getting my groups.io emails with a delay of 12 or more hours.  This one wasn't received here until 3:04 AM today.

 

By 1950 in the ORER, the 3300 series reefers extend from 3300 - 5199 with 1602 cars, in total.  But known photos show that they were not all alike in appearance.  There were more than a few 4 hinge doors in this range and some had inset by tabbed side sills.  Many looked like Sunshine resin kit 24.x, if you can find one.

 

Steve Hile

 

 

 


From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of nyc3001 .
Sent: Saturday, April 4, 2020 4:38 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Swift 3300

 

 

In light of the recent discussion about the Swift 2500 series reefer that will be released by Rapido, I was wondering if anyone had ever kitbashed or produced a 3300-series reefer. This series seems to comprise the most-numerous wood Swift reefer. 


Re: Swift 3300

vapeurchapelon
 

Hello Steve,
 
I am in a similar situation from time to time, as it was the case with exactly that Email. I got it yesterday. Please have a look at the exact date: -it has been sent FIFTEEN DAYS ago! But I got it yesterday...
 
Best regards
 
Johannes
Modeling the early post-war years up to about 1953
 
Gesendet: Sonntag, 19. April 2020 um 22:22 Uhr
Von: "Steve and Barb Hile" <shile@...>
An: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Betreff: Re: [RealSTMFC] Swift 3300
I am currently getting my groups.io emails with a delay of 12 or more hours.  This one wasn't received here until 3:04 AM today.
 
By 1950 in the ORER, the 3300 series reefers extend from 3300 - 5199 with 1602 cars, in total.  But known photos show that they were not all alike in appearance.  There were more than a few 4 hinge doors in this range and some had inset by tabbed side sills.  Many looked like Sunshine resin kit 24.x, if you can find one.
 
Steve Hile
 
 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of nyc3001 .
Sent: Saturday, April 4, 2020 4:38 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Swift 3300

 
 
In light of the recent discussion about the Swift 2500 series reefer that will be released by Rapido, I was wondering if anyone had ever kitbashed or produced a 3300-series reefer. This series seems to comprise the most-numerous wood Swift reefer. 


Re: [Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] Flat Car Load now diagonal loading cars

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Here’s another PRR diagonal loader, the ex-PRR (now CR) G36H.

 

Also, one of my favorites, the PRR’s F25E.  To get every inch out of this well car, they removed the original floor supports and flooring, and replaced them with steel plates supported by brackets riveted to the bottom of the sides.  A truly unique car.

 

Elden Gatwood

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Schuyler Larrabee via groups.io
Sent: Sunday, April 19, 2020 3:55 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] Flat Car Load

 

If you were shipping it on the ERIE, you’d have a chance, but even so that’s pretty wide.

 

The ERIE was originally built to 6’-0” gauge, so the clearances were set early on very wide.  Throughout it’s history, it was well known for being able to handle oversize shipments.

 

But typically, on most roads, I’d say that could only go as a very special movement.

 

Schuyler

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Randy Williamson
Sent: Sunday, April 19, 2020 12:44 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Flat Car Load

 

Hi All,

I have an item I would like to make into a load for a HO 40' flat car.  The item measures out to 14' (HO Scale) width and the flat car deck is at 9' width.  Would that be allowable or is the item too wide for this flat car.

Thanks,

Randy Williamson


Re: Swift 3300

Steve and Barb Hile
 

I am currently getting my groups.io emails with a delay of 12 or more hours.  This one wasn't received here until 3:04 AM today.
 
By 1950 in the ORER, the 3300 series reefers extend from 3300 - 5199 with 1602 cars, in total.  But known photos show that they were not all alike in appearance.  There were more than a few 4 hinge doors in this range and some had inset by tabbed side sills.  Many looked like Sunshine resin kit 24.x, if you can find one.
 
Steve Hile
 
 



From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of nyc3001 .
Sent: Saturday, April 4, 2020 4:38 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Swift 3300

In light of the recent discussion about the Swift 2500 series reefer that will be released by Rapido, I was wondering if anyone had ever kitbashed or produced a 3300-series reefer. This series seems to comprise the most-numerous wood Swift reefer. 


Re: Flat Car Load

Randy Williamson
 

I got it.  I took a height measurement of the item and it was about 19' above the railhead stood straight up.  Diagonal loading sounds like the best bet.

Thanks,

Randy


Offered: Sunshine resin kits for PFE and ACF 8K gal. insulated tank car

Andy Carlson
 

Hello folks-
I have 2 new Sunshine HO resin kits which I am offering for sale. These are new, unbuilt. Free Shipping
1) Sunshine #36.1 ACF 8,000 gal. Insulated Tankcar Shippers Car Line $55
2) Sunshine #25.10 P.F.E. R-30-9/R-40-9 wood reefer        $49

-Andy Carlson      Ojai CA
I accept checks and money orders. With a small fee PayPal is welcomed. Contact me off-list (Please) at <midcentury@...> with questions.
Thanks,





Re: Flat Car Load

Schuyler Larrabee
 

If you were shipping it on the ERIE, you’d have a chance, but even so that’s pretty wide.

 

The ERIE was originally built to 6’-0” gauge, so the clearances were set early on very wide.  Throughout it’s history, it was well known for being able to handle oversize shipments.

 

But typically, on most roads, I’d say that could only go as a very special movement.

 

Schuyler

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Randy Williamson
Sent: Sunday, April 19, 2020 12:44 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Flat Car Load

 

Hi All,

I have an item I would like to make into a load for a HO 40' flat car.  The item measures out to 14' (HO Scale) width and the flat car deck is at 9' width.  Would that be allowable or is the item too wide for this flat car.

Thanks,

Randy Williamson


Re: Boiler Load On Flat Car (Multiscale Digital Boilers)

Bruce Smith
 

John is correct. I modified a Chooch boiler by taking a slice out of the center and adding a wrapper, rivets, tie down points, loading pads, and created an "AMERICAN LOCOMOTIVE Co." decal for it. I loaded it onto an ECW 90 ton depressed center NYC flat car.
Regards
Bruce Smith
Auburn, AL


From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> on behalf of John Barry <northbaylines@...>
Sent: Sunday, April 19, 2020 9:34 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Boiler Load On Flat Car (Multiscale Digital Boilers)
 
Don,

I believe that Bruce modified a Chooch boiler.  That was a variant of the "Scotch boiler" and not the type used in warships.  The Birchfield boilers of the current discussion originated at Tacoma Washington (State not District) at the Birchfield Shipbuilding & Boiler Co., Inc.,  located on the west side of the Blair Waterway, in the Port of Tacoma.

John Barry
 
ATSF North Bay Lines 
Golden Gates & Fast Freights 
Lovettsville, VA

707-490-9696 

PO Box 44736 
Washington, DC 20026-4736


On Sunday, April 19, 2020, 10:13:38 AM EDT, Donald B. Valentine via groups.io <riverman_vt@...> wrote:


   Who was the firm that offered similar boilers but I believe they were sectional and for ships? Was it
Bruce Smith that posted photos of such a boiler as a flat car load some years ago? Those I could 
easily justify here as opposed to an industrial boiler from a mid-western manufacturer. I believe it 
was Alco that supplied ship boiler that passed through Vermont via a somewhat circuitous route to 
Bath Iron Works in Bath, Me to be used in the destroyers they built during WW II.

Cordially, Don Valentine


Re: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Flat Car Load

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Hudson;

 

Yes.  This is another diagonal loader on the PRR, this one a MW version, the PRR G26S, converted from a standard G26.  The G26 was a 65-footer, so it was specifically converted to accommodate a big turnout.

 

Elden Gatwood

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Hudson Leighton
Sent: Sunday, April 19, 2020 3:15 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Flat Car Load

 

This is also how the RRs ship prefabbed switches.

-Hudson


Re: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Flat Car Load

Andy Cich
 

Yes, that is the kit I was thinking of.

Andy Cich


Re: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Flat Car Load

Bruce Smith
 

Andy, folks,

This Sunshine kit?  😉 (F10 Ship Plate Loads)

Regards
Bruce


From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> on behalf of Andy Cich <ajc5150@...>
Sent: Sunday, April 19, 2020 2:20 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Flat Car Load
 

This looks like a variation of the type of load modeled by a Sunshine kit. I’m not sure who the model builder is for the photos I attached. I’m sure I saved them from one of the email lists.

 

Andy Cich

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gatwood, Elden J SAD
Sent: Sunday, April 19, 2020 1:45 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Flat Car Load

 

Randy;

 

This is a PRR F25C dedicated diagonal loading car, for boiler heads or plate steel wider (or taller) than the maximum of the clearance diagram.  Loads were tilted up diagonally, against the timbers, and secured with chains running from the floor, up over the top of the load, and attached to the timbers.  The entire load and car had to fit inside the clearance diagram.  The loaded cars were shipped in “High and Wide” shipments in certain trains, and were continuously checked along the way to ensure no load shifting occurred that would cause a load to hit something, like a bridge entry, tunnel entry, etc.

 

Elden Gatwood

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Randy Williamson
Sent: Sunday, April 19, 2020 1:50 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Flat Car Load

 

Hi Elden,

I have never heard or diagonal loading of cars.  Would it entail opposite corners of the load being off the car?

Randy


Re: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Flat Car Load

Andy Cich
 

This looks like a variation of the type of load modeled by a Sunshine kit. I’m not sure who the model builder is for the photos I attached. I’m sure I saved them from one of the email lists.

 

Andy Cich

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gatwood, Elden J SAD
Sent: Sunday, April 19, 2020 1:45 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Flat Car Load

 

Randy;

 

This is a PRR F25C dedicated diagonal loading car, for boiler heads or plate steel wider (or taller) than the maximum of the clearance diagram.  Loads were tilted up diagonally, against the timbers, and secured with chains running from the floor, up over the top of the load, and attached to the timbers.  The entire load and car had to fit inside the clearance diagram.  The loaded cars were shipped in “High and Wide” shipments in certain trains, and were continuously checked along the way to ensure no load shifting occurred that would cause a load to hit something, like a bridge entry, tunnel entry, etc.

 

Elden Gatwood

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Randy Williamson
Sent: Sunday, April 19, 2020 1:50 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Flat Car Load

 

Hi Elden,

I have never heard or diagonal loading of cars.  Would it entail opposite corners of the load being off the car?

Randy


Re: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Flat Car Load

Hudson Leighton
 

This is also how the RRs ship prefabbed switches.

-Hudson


Re: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Flat Car Load

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Randy;

 

This is a PRR F25C dedicated diagonal loading car, for boiler heads or plate steel wider (or taller) than the maximum of the clearance diagram.  Loads were tilted up diagonally, against the timbers, and secured with chains running from the floor, up over the top of the load, and attached to the timbers.  The entire load and car had to fit inside the clearance diagram.  The loaded cars were shipped in “High and Wide” shipments in certain trains, and were continuously checked along the way to ensure no load shifting occurred that would cause a load to hit something, like a bridge entry, tunnel entry, etc.

 

Elden Gatwood

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Randy Williamson
Sent: Sunday, April 19, 2020 1:50 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Flat Car Load

 

Hi Elden,

I have never heard or diagonal loading of cars.  Would it entail opposite corners of the load being off the car?

Randy

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