Date   

Re: Kadee code 88 wheels.

golden1014
 

Hi Brian,

I've used the Kadee .088-tread wheelsets.  Yep, they're made of the same blackened pot metal as the rest of the line.

I have attempted to clean the tread of the Kadee wheels by spinning the wheels with a Dremel equipped with a wire brush on the lowest speed.  The plastic axles have a tendency to melt in the journal box.  Therefore I recommend Reboxx wheelsets if you can still find them.

John Golden
Ramstein-Miesenbach, Germany


Re: Photo: Stenciling Freshly Painted NKP Box Car 27676

thmsdmpsy
 

I would say that is a coupler change.  After replacing the coupler, they'll reinstall the existing knuckle and regage the assembly.  If it still passes the gage, then they will replace the knuckle.  As always, Tom

On Sunday, May 10, 2020, 08:42:46 PM PDT, Charles Peck <lnnrr152@...> wrote:


The coupler is there, but the knuckle is laying on the ground below it.
This rig seems to be using the knuckle pin as a fixed pivot point.  With 
that hefty jack for power, I can see making metal move.  
Chuck Peck 


On Sun, May 10, 2020 at 11:32 PM Lee via groups.io <leetrains=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
the straight arms have a chain and what looks like a hoist, so with that and the missing coupler I would say that's how they are changing out the coupler without having to lift by hand.

Lee Stoermer
Aldie, VA


On Sunday, May 10, 2020, 07:24:00 PM EDT, Richard Brennan <rbrennan@...> wrote:


At 03:59 PM 5/10/2020, Bob Chaparro via groups.io wrote:
><snip>
>http://cdm16066.contentdm.oclc.org/cdm/singleitem/collection/p16066coll27/id/8731/rec/47

Is that a shop-built tool for taking the 'bulge' from freight damage
out of the stamped steel ends?
I didn't even think that was possible!


--------------------
Richard Brennan - San Leandro CA
-------------------- 





Re: Photo: C&O/Pere Marquette/ Gondola

Larry Wolohon
 

Protocraft offers O Scale & Proto 48 models of these in brass,


real nice models. They are Greenville gondola, per RPC # 8. I am finishing up an Erie version of these. Larry Wolohon

On May 10, 2020 at 1:12 PM "Bob Chaparro via groups.io" <chiefbobbb@...> wrote:

Photo: C&O/Pere Marquette/ Gondola

Photo from the Steam Railroading Institute of Owosso, MI:

https://www.michigansteamtrain.com/about/equipment/chesapeake-and-ohio-gondola-31262

Related photo of Pere Marquette gondola 18400:

https://www.michigansteamtrain.com/application/files/4215/8506/7599/PM_Gondola_18400.jpg

Diagram of PM 18400-18649 gondolas:

https://www.michigansteamtrain.com/application/files/3115/8506/7603/PM_Gondola_Diagram.jpg

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA


 


Re: NPRHA decals for Rapido NP box.

golden1014
 

Hi Fred, I may have something I can send.  What are you looking for exactly?

John Golden,
Ramstein, Germany


Re: Photo: Pullman Company Boxcar PLM X2023

Michael Aufderheide
 

All,

See page 200 of RPCYC 31& 32, likely just a static test car.

Regards,  

Mike Aufderheide


Distinctive Flat Car Toothpicks Timber Load

Jeff Helm
 

Here’s an amazing early steam era flat car load of “British Columbia Toothpicks”!  From the days when old growth timber was plentiful.  Courtesy Vancouver BC archives site, circa 1893.

https://searcharchives.vancouver.ca/british-columbia-toothpicks-on-car-at-hastings-sawmill


--
Jeff Helm
Bremerton WA


Re: Kadee code 88 wheels.

Brian Carlson
 

In my case the Kadee wheels would be only in Kadee trucks.

Brian J. Carlson

On May 14, 2020, at 10:23 AM, Daniel A. Mitchell <danmitch@tir.com> wrote:

Two comments based on my experience … YMMV.


Re: Kadee code 88 wheels.

Claus Schlund \(HGM\)
 

Hi Dan and List Members,
 
Dan wrote: “My current rule is, wherever possible: ”plastic sideframes use metal axles, metal sideframes use plastic axles”
 
Some folks (myself included) feel that a plastic axle turning within a plastic truck is undesirable for another reason – it produces a lot of static electricity. This being caused by the constant plastic-on-plastic rubbing action. One way to envision this is the old kids trick of rubbing a balloon on your clothes – the balloon then likes to stick to things because of the static charge that the balloon acquires. The theory is that when this occurs with a plastic wheelset to plastic truck combination, dust and dirt is attracted onto the wheelset, and then later that same dust and dirt gets deposited by the wheel onto the track.
 
It sounds plausible to me, but I have no real way of proving this. I do feel my track stays cleaner longer when I don’t run plastic wheelset to plastic truck combinations.
 
Claus Schlund
 
 
 
 
 

From: Daniel A. Mitchell
Sent: Thursday, May 14, 2020 10:22 AM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Kadee code 88 wheels.
 
Two comments based on my experience … YMMV.
 
1) The kadee plastic axles have a very fibrous structure ... look at the end of one under high magnification. It is ROUGH .. rather like the end of a brush. This seems to cause little if any problem running in metal sideframes, but it is very abrasive to softer plastic sideframes. After long periods of operation it wears the sideframe sockets into oval shapes. This eventually , ruins the sideframes, lowers the car enough to cause coupler-height problems, and destroys rolling qualities. It does take a long time, but is undeniable. I’ve seen it most with Athearn plastic trucks, but that may be because I had so many of them. All these trucks had to be replaced. I don’t have enough experience to know if this also applies to the plastic axle P2K wheelsets. I’ve seen this problem with NO other axles. My current rule is, wherever possible: ”plastic sideframes use metal axles, metal sideframes use plastic axles”.
 
2) The metal-black DOES contribute to the “black gunk” not the rails. I have lots of experience with this problem. Run a long train of cars with “shiny” metal wheels and have little dirt accumulation after HOURS of operation. Insert a half dozen cars with metal blackened wheelsets, and in an hour or two you’ll have “black gunk” on the rails. This applies to Kadee and many other blackened wheels. One problem I see is that many of them have a LOT of “blackening” residue on the wheels (“over blackened”?) ... often its even powdery and will flake off. This is poor quality control. However, even a smooth, hard blackened surface will wear off in operation, and leave residue the track. I am not sure whether this contributes a lot to poor electrical contact, but it surely does make a mess.
 
Both observations above are the result of many LONG hours of train operation on a club layout during public display. It’s not unusual to run a 50-70 car train for 5-6 hours continuously, several days a week, for weeks on end, and I’ve been doing this intermittently for over 40 years.
 
Dan Mitchell
==========
 

On May 14, 2020, at 9:22 AM, Brian Carlson via groups.io <prrk41361@...> wrote:
 
Thanks Denny and Todd. 
 
Interesting comment on the axle length since I was testing reboxx wheels in the kadee ASF A-3RC truck and the best fitting length was 1.030 or so.

Brian J. Carlson

On May 14, 2020, at 1:11 AM, Denny Anspach <danspachmd@...> wrote:

I find the Kadee 88 wheels to be excellent in many ways, not excluding appearance and quality assurance as to gauge, etc.  The blackening will not leave residue on the rails. Shining  the treads certainly looks good, but operationally, it is not necessary.  
 
The axle lengths last measured were a uniform 1.015” (like the current Rapido), but the ends are have currently-unusual thick acetal curved-taper ends.  Unlike most other current high quality metal wheel sets, e.g. IM, Reboxx, Exactrail, Rapido, and (reportedly) Molocco that have straight taper 2mm ends, the combination of acetal (vs. metal), and the thicker ends makes these fine wheels sometimes difficult to adapt effectively to trucks other than Kadee.  I still try to use them as often as I can, but for my purposes (maximum rollability), that is not often as I would like.  I keep  trying, however.
 
Denny
 
Denny S. Anspach, MD
Sacramento, CA 95864
 
 
 
 


Re: Kadee code 88 wheels.

Daniel A. Mitchell
 

Two comments based on my experience … YMMV.

1) The kadee plastic axles have a very fibrous structure ... look at the end of one under high magnification. It is ROUGH .. rather like the end of a brush. This seems to cause little if any problem running in metal sideframes, but it is very abrasive to softer plastic sideframes. After long periods of operation it wears the sideframe sockets into oval shapes. This eventually , ruins the sideframes, lowers the car enough to cause coupler-height problems, and destroys rolling qualities. It does take a long time, but is undeniable. I’ve seen it most with Athearn plastic trucks, but that may be because I had so many of them. All these trucks had to be replaced. I don’t have enough experience to know if this also applies to the plastic axle P2K wheelsets. I’ve seen this problem with NO other axles. My current rule is, wherever possible: ”plastic sideframes use metal axles, metal sideframes use plastic axles”.

2) The metal-black DOES contribute to the “black gunk” not the rails. I have lots of experience with this problem. Run a long train of cars with “shiny” metal wheels and have little dirt accumulation after HOURS of operation. Insert a half dozen cars with metal blackened wheelsets, and in an hour or two you’ll have “black gunk” on the rails. This applies to Kadee and many other blackened wheels. One problem I see is that many of them have a LOT of “blackening” residue on the wheels (“over blackened”?) ... often its even powdery and will flake off. This is poor quality control. However, even a smooth, hard blackened surface will wear off in operation, and leave residue the track. I am not sure whether this contributes a lot to poor electrical contact, but it surely does make a mess.

Both observations above are the result of many LONG hours of train operation on a club layout during public display. It’s not unusual to run a 50-70 car train for 5-6 hours continuously, several days a week, for weeks on end, and I’ve been doing this intermittently for over 40 years.

Dan Mitchell
==========


On May 14, 2020, at 9:22 AM, Brian Carlson via groups.io <prrk41361@...> wrote:

Thanks Denny and Todd.  

Interesting comment on the axle length since I was testing reboxx wheels in the kadee ASF A-3RC truck and the best fitting length was 1.030 or so. 

Brian J. Carlson 

On May 14, 2020, at 1:11 AM, Denny Anspach <danspachmd@...> wrote:

I find the Kadee 88 wheels to be excellent in many ways, not excluding appearance and quality assurance as to gauge, etc.  The blackening will not leave residue on the rails. Shining  the treads certainly looks good, but operationally, it is not necessary.  

The axle lengths last measured were a uniform 1.015” (like the current Rapido), but the ends are have currently-unusual thick acetal curved-taper ends.  Unlike most other current high quality metal wheel sets, e.g. IM, Reboxx, Exactrail, Rapido, and (reportedly) Molocco that have straight taper 2mm ends, the combination of acetal (vs. metal), and the thicker ends makes these fine wheels sometimes difficult to adapt effectively to trucks other than Kadee.  I still try to use them as often as I can, but for my purposes (maximum rollability), that is not often as I would like.  I keep  trying, however.

Denny
 
Denny S. Anspach, MD
Sacramento, CA 95864





Re: Latest run of Intermountain (Wegmann) HO PFE Rebuilt Reefers

William Hirt
 

Intermountain is one of his show's sponsors. That might have something to do with it.

Bill Hirt

On 5/13/2020 7:37 PM, Bob Chaparro via groups.io wrote:

I see Ken Patterson is gushing over the latest InterMountain offerings, including the less-than-perfect PFE reefers, on his "What's Neat This Week in Model Railroading" Show #115:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?reload=9&v=X8YGQwo5jHI

Shows like these remind me why I stopped subscribing to certain car magazines.

Bob Chaparro


Re: Kadee code 88 wheels.

Tim O'Connor
 


I never use Kadee wheels as replacements for wheelsets, but I have decided to keep the 0.088 wheels
that come in the new HGC trucks. I have roll tested them, and they are a HUGE improvement over the old
Kadee metal trucks. For the metal trucks, Reboxx (or similar) wheels are the way to go.

I've also always shined mine up with a Dremel. But I always use a "donor" sideframe to shine them up and
you must be very careful not to let the Kadee wheels "spin" from the Dremel - this will ruin the soft journals
of the Kadee wheels.

Over MANY years of use, Kadee (and other brands of) plastic journals will wear down to the point where
they basically have to be dragged around rather than rolling freely.

All my fat Kadee and Proto wheels end up as replacements for plastic wheels for cars that end up on Ebay.

Tim O'Connor


On 5/14/2020 9:22 AM, Brian Carlson via groups.io wrote:
Thanks Denny and Todd.  

Interesting comment on the axle length since I was testing reboxx wheels in the kadee ASF A-3RC truck and the best fitting length was 1.030 or so. 

Brian J. Carlson 

On May 14, 2020, at 1:11 AM, Denny Anspach <danspachmd@...> wrote:

I find the Kadee 88 wheels to be excellent in many ways, not excluding appearance and quality assurance as to gauge, etc.  The blackening will not leave residue on the rails. Shining  the treads certainly looks good, but operationally, it is not necessary.  

The axle lengths last measured were a uniform 1.015” (like the current Rapido), but the ends are have currently-unusual thick acetal curved-taper ends.  Unlike most other current high quality metal wheel sets, e.g. IM, Reboxx, Exactrail, Rapido, and (reportedly) Molocco that have straight taper 2mm ends, the combination of acetal (vs. metal), and the thicker ends makes these fine wheels sometimes difficult to adapt effectively to trucks other than Kadee.  I still try to use them as often as I can, but for my purposes (maximum rollability), that is not often as I would like.  I keep  trying, however.

Denny
 
Denny S. Anspach, MD
Sacramento, CA 95864


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: Kadee code 88 wheels.

Brian Carlson
 

Thanks Denny and Todd.  

Interesting comment on the axle length since I was testing reboxx wheels in the kadee ASF A-3RC truck and the best fitting length was 1.030 or so. 

Brian J. Carlson 

On May 14, 2020, at 1:11 AM, Denny Anspach <danspachmd@...> wrote:

I find the Kadee 88 wheels to be excellent in many ways, not excluding appearance and quality assurance as to gauge, etc.  The blackening will not leave residue on the rails. Shining  the treads certainly looks good, but operationally, it is not necessary.  

The axle lengths last measured were a uniform 1.015” (like the current Rapido), but the ends are have currently-unusual thick acetal curved-taper ends.  Unlike most other current high quality metal wheel sets, e.g. IM, Reboxx, Exactrail, Rapido, and (reportedly) Molocco that have straight taper 2mm ends, the combination of acetal (vs. metal), and the thicker ends makes these fine wheels sometimes difficult to adapt effectively to trucks other than Kadee.  I still try to use them as often as I can, but for my purposes (maximum rollability), that is not often as I would like.  I keep  trying, however.

Denny
 
Denny S. Anspach, MD
Sacramento, CA 95864




Re: 10' High by 8' Wide Superior Doors

Benjamin Hom
 

Fenton Wells wrote:
"Didn’t Sunshine make the door for their EJ&E mini kit?  Might want to find one of those and copy it in resin."

It had better be a really good door, as going through the trouble to copy it might not be worth the squeeze if you only need one or two.  The irony of this is if you can handle resin, you should be able to scratchbuild a Superior door.


Ben Hom


Re: 10' High by 8' Wide Superior Doorsbu

O Fenton Wells
 

Didn’t Sunshine make the door for their EJ&E mini kit?  Might want to find one of those and copy it in resin
Fenton 


On May 13, 2020, at 9:53 PM, Rick Jesionowski via groups.io <dti406@...> wrote:


Thanks for all the information, I will probably end up scratchbuilding them as I was going to do the EJ&E cars like one of the respondents noted what he had done.

I have made a number of Superior doors for 60' High Cube Boxcars, should not be any more difficult.

Rick Jesionowski


Re: Hopper Car Photo

Garth Groff and Sally Sanford <mallardlodge1000@...>
 

Ben,

When I opened this Westerfield page I noticed the diagonal brace on the models and went elsewhere. Had I scrolled down, I would have seen other examples without the brace. (Oy veh!)

Thanks for the correct ID.

Now the other questions remain for y'all to debate: Whose car is this, and why is at the ACF plant in 1946 (repairs, scrapping, modernizing)? 

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff  🦆

On Thu, May 14, 2020 at 6:56 AM Benjamin Hom <b.hom@...> wrote:
Garth Groff asked:
"An acquaintance sent me this attached photo taken at ACF's Berwick plant in 1946. Our shared interest is the unusual AC&F "critter". Your interest is more likely to be the unusual hopper car in the rear: channel ribs and pressed-steel Fox-type trucks. Too bad there is no lettering showing. The car is a survivor (probably not for long though), since the trucks suggest it was built around 1900.

I checked the Westerfield pages, thinking this could be the PSC model they offer, but the car in question has a straight sill, while their model has a dropped sill. Can anybody ID the builder of this car?"

David Thompson replied:
"Car is the early Standard Steel Car channel-side design without a separate end sill."

You also quit looking at the Westerfield pages too soon.  The 7400 series hopper kits model the version of these cars with the heavy end sill.



Ben Hom


Attachments:


Re: Hopper Car Photo

Benjamin Hom
 

Garth Groff asked:
"An acquaintance sent me this attached photo taken at ACF's Berwick plant in 1946. Our shared interest is the unusual AC&F "critter". Your interest is more likely to be the unusual hopper car in the rear: channel ribs and pressed-steel Fox-type trucks. Too bad there is no lettering showing. The car is a survivor (probably not for long though), since the trucks suggest it was built around 1900.

I checked the Westerfield pages, thinking this could be the PSC model they offer, but the car in question has a straight sill, while their model has a dropped sill. Can anybody ID the builder of this car?"

David Thompson replied:
"Car is the early Standard Steel Car channel-side design without a separate end sill."

You also quit looking at the Westerfield pages too soon.  The 7400 series hopper kits model the version of these cars with the heavy end sill.



Ben Hom



Hopper Car Photo

David
 

Car is the early Standard Steel Car channel-side design without a separate end sill.

David Thompson


Hopper Car Photo

Garth Groff and Sally Sanford <mallardlodge1000@...>
 

Friends,

An acquaintance sent me this attached photo taken at ACF's Berwick plant in 1946. Our shared interest is the unusual AC&F "critter". Your interest is more likely to be the unusual hopper car in the rear: channel ribs and pressed-steel Fox-type trucks. Too bad there is no lettering showing. The car is a survivor (probably not for long though), since the trucks suggest it was built around 1900.

I checked the Westerfield pages, thinking this could be the PSC model they offer, but the car in question has a straight sill, while their model has a dropped sill. Can anybody ID the builder of this car?

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff  🦆


Re: Kadee code 88 wheels.

Denny Anspach <danspachmd@...>
 

I find the Kadee 88 wheels to be excellent in many ways, not excluding appearance and quality assurance as to gauge, etc.  The blackening will not leave residue on the rails. Shining  the treads certainly looks good, but operationally, it is not necessary.  

The axle lengths last measured were a uniform 1.015” (like the current Rapido), but the ends are have currently-unusual thick acetal curved-taper ends.  Unlike most other current high quality metal wheel sets, e.g. IM, Reboxx, Exactrail, Rapido, and (reportedly) Molocco that have straight taper 2mm ends, the combination of acetal (vs. metal), and the thicker ends makes these fine wheels sometimes difficult to adapt effectively to trucks other than Kadee.  I still try to use them as often as I can, but for my purposes (maximum rollability), that is not often as I would like.  I keep  trying, however.

Denny
 
Denny S. Anspach, MD
Sacramento, CA 95864




Re: REMOVING FACTORY LETTERING

spsalso
 

I have had some experience with Lionel hot stamping their lettering.  I am a proud owner of an AB set of their HO T&P Alco FA's.  I intended to convert them to GN.  I had to turn them into undecs.  I found that they had melted their lettering into the plastic shell a bit, and that I had to do some scraping to try to eliminate it.

I do suspect that the process on plastic is different than on metal.  By decades, if no other.


Ed

Edward Sutorik

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