Date   

Re: more real oldies

CJ Riley
 

I had trouble orienting the photo until I realized it was the Panhandle Bridge in the background. My office overlooked this are but it was the 80s and all gone except for the line from the bridge and it was turned into light rail. The terminal building still existed when I left Pittsburgh and I did an architectural examination of the parapets after a collapse on another building caused the city to require it.




Re: More freight cars on Duquesne Way

James E Kubanick
 

I'm agree with Eric on this. You can see the PRR viaduct on the left side of the  photo. Plus the flood level is too low to reach the PRR tracks.

Jim Kubanick
Morgantown WV

On Friday, June 12, 2020, 8:59:23 AM EDT, Eric Hansmann <eric@...> wrote:


Eldon,

I think the MC car is on B&O tracks, formerly Pittsburgh Junction. They served a couple places under the Duquesne Way viaduct down to 9th Street.


Eric Hansmann
Murfreesboro, TN



On June 12, 2020 at 6:25 AM "Gatwood, Elden J SAD " <elden.j.gatwood@...> wrote:


Re: more real oldies

Schuyler Larrabee
 

I don’t think so, as those are real frogs in those switches.  When trolley lines needed a temp switch, they’d often (OK, not ALWAYS) make a trackway that would rise up over the near rails, with the diagonal rails on top of the permanent rails.  Those two guys are doing something though.  I think they might be prepping that crossover to be buried in the pavement.  Notice also that the far track slopes down pretty abruptly just at the right side of the image.

 

Schuyler

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of James SANDIFER
Sent: Friday, June 12, 2020 10:39 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] more real oldies

 

Is the trolly company installing a crossover?

 

 

J. Stephen Sandifer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Eric Hansmann
Sent: Friday, June 12, 2020 8:51 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] more real oldies

 

The Try Street Terminal is a great pocket team yard in an urban canyon. While located fairly close to the original Grant Street freight house and the PRR passenger terminal, a tunnel separates the rail activity. I've used the Try Street terminal to illustrate what can be done in a limited area for maximum model railroad operation. Here are two elevated images from August 1935 I share for inspiration.

 

This is one of the best overall images snapped on August 22, 1935. At the right is the Fourth Avenue passenger station, a commuter stop. In the background is the Try Street Terminal warehouse, which was also rail served. Just to the right of the warehouse is the bridge over the Monongahela River. And of course....freight cars!

 

This image from August 11, 1935 offers a different angle and a slightly better look at the transfer dock and crane. Seen in both images are gondolas on the far track, which served a scrap outfit.

 

Lastly, here's a reference on a great site of city plat maps. These are 1923 maps as later editions remain under copyright. You can zoom in and out to explore more of Pittsburgh. See how many railroad team yards you can find from that era.

 

 

 

Eric Hansmann
Murfreesboro, TN

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

On June 12, 2020 at 6:34 AM "Gatwood, Elden J SAD " <elden.j.gatwood@...> wrote:

https://historicpittsburgh.org/islandora/object/pitt%3A715.122554.CP/viewer

 

ACL and L&N at Try Street yard in downtown Pittsburgh.  Love that ACD logo!

 

Elden Gatwood


Re: more real oldies

Todd Sullivan
 

Yes, I noticed the trolley track and overhead.  The photo is a great illustration of how both looked.  It does look like the trolley track to the right was being reconfigured or rebuilt.  I've never seen that before, and I did some trolley modeling in the 70s and a lot of research into pavement styles.

Todd Sullivan


Re: more real oldies

akerboomk
 

RE: First Try St. terminal photo

I wonder what that “smoke” is coming out of the tank car in the lower-right corner…


--
Ken Akerboom


Re: more real oldies

Bruce Smith
 

It looks like it might be a temporary cross-over with rails at each end that are tapered to allow the trolley cars to get back to the normal rails. It might have been used to allow cars to avoid a construction area or reroute cars temporarily.

Regards,
Bruce Smith
Auburn, AL

On Jun 12, 2020, at 9:38 AM, James SANDIFER <steve.sandifer@...> wrote:

Is the trolly company installing a crossover? 
 
 
J. Stephen Sandifer
 
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Eric Hansmann
Sent: Friday, June 12, 2020 8:51 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] more real oldies
 
The Try Street Terminal is a great pocket team yard in an urban canyon. While located fairly close to the original Grant Street freight house and the PRR passenger terminal, a tunnel separates the rail activity. I've used the Try Street terminal to illustrate what can be done in a limited area for maximum model railroad operation. Here are two elevated images from August 1935 I share for inspiration. 
 
This is one of the best overall images snapped on August 22, 1935. At the right is the Fourth Avenue passenger station, a commuter stop. In the background is the Try Street Terminal warehouse, which was also rail served. Just to the right of the warehouse is the bridge over the Monongahela River. And of course....freight cars! 
 
This image from August 11, 1935 offers a different angle and a slightly better look at the transfer dock and crane. Seen in both images are gondolas on the far track, which served a scrap outfit. 
 
Lastly, here's a reference on a great site of city plat maps. These are 1923 maps as later editions remain under copyright. You can zoom in and out to explore more of Pittsburgh. See how many railroad team yards you can find from that era. 
 
 
 
Eric Hansmann 
Murfreesboro, TN 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

On June 12, 2020 at 6:34 AM "Gatwood, Elden J SAD " <elden.j.gatwood@...> wrote: 

https://historicpittsburgh.org/islandora/object/pitt%3A715.122554.CP/viewer

 

ACL and L&N at Try Street yard in downtown Pittsburgh.  Love that ACD logo!

 

Elden Gatwood



Re: more real oldies

Steve SANDIFER
 

Is the trolly company installing a crossover?

 

 

J. Stephen Sandifer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Eric Hansmann
Sent: Friday, June 12, 2020 8:51 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] more real oldies

 

The Try Street Terminal is a great pocket team yard in an urban canyon. While located fairly close to the original Grant Street freight house and the PRR passenger terminal, a tunnel separates the rail activity. I've used the Try Street terminal to illustrate what can be done in a limited area for maximum model railroad operation. Here are two elevated images from August 1935 I share for inspiration.

 

This is one of the best overall images snapped on August 22, 1935. At the right is the Fourth Avenue passenger station, a commuter stop. In the background is the Try Street Terminal warehouse, which was also rail served. Just to the right of the warehouse is the bridge over the Monongahela River. And of course....freight cars!

 

This image from August 11, 1935 offers a different angle and a slightly better look at the transfer dock and crane. Seen in both images are gondolas on the far track, which served a scrap outfit.

 

Lastly, here's a reference on a great site of city plat maps. These are 1923 maps as later editions remain under copyright. You can zoom in and out to explore more of Pittsburgh. See how many railroad team yards you can find from that era.

 

 

 

Eric Hansmann
Murfreesboro, TN

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

On June 12, 2020 at 6:34 AM "Gatwood, Elden J SAD " <elden.j.gatwood@...> wrote:

https://historicpittsburgh.org/islandora/object/pitt%3A715.122554.CP/viewer

 

ACL and L&N at Try Street yard in downtown Pittsburgh.  Love that ACD logo!

 

Elden Gatwood


Re: more early early box car biz

Charlie Vlk
 

Eric and all-
It would be interesting if this was an item of discussion for standardization amongst master mechanics; either across railroads or internally.   
Of course there were and are plenty of sinister doors...most ventilated and double door cars have two of them!
Charlie Vlk


On Jun 12, 2020, at 9:19 AM, Eric Hansmann <eric@...> wrote:


The Pennsy had more left-opening boxcars on their pre-1930 roster than the total Lehigh Valley boxcar fleet. 

Left-opening doors aren't a wrong way at all, just uncommon by the time most people have focused their early diesel era modeling. 


Eric Hansmann
Murfreesboro, TN



n June 12, 2020 at 8:12 AM Charlie Vlk <cvlk@...> wrote:

All of them wrong way, left hand, southpaw doors!!!
Charlie Vlk



On Jun 12, 2020, at 9:07 AM, Gatwood, Elden J SAD <elden.j.gatwood@...> wrote:


Re: more early early box car biz

Eric Hansmann
 

The Pennsy had more left-opening boxcars on their pre-1930 roster than the total Lehigh Valley boxcar fleet. 

Left-opening doors aren't a wrong way at all, just uncommon by the time most people have focused their early diesel era modeling. 


Eric Hansmann
Murfreesboro, TN



n June 12, 2020 at 8:12 AM Charlie Vlk <cvlk@...> wrote:

All of them wrong way, left hand, southpaw doors!!!
Charlie Vlk



On Jun 12, 2020, at 9:07 AM, Gatwood, Elden J SAD <elden.j.gatwood@...> wrote:


Re: [Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] Box Cars in PRR Duquesne yard 1943

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Eric;

 

It sure is.

 

That’s an interesting area.  I don’t know enough about PSC, but have it on my list.  Some of these photos show exactly what one needs to model freight for these industries.

 

They did such a great job of documenting this rapidly modernizing area, and accompanying RR changes over time.  Much, much better than my timeframe.

 

Elden Gatwood

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Eric Hansmann
Sent: Friday, June 12, 2020 10:00 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] Box Cars in PRR Duquesne yard 1943

 

The Pittsburgh City Photographer Collection has been a gold mine of inspiring images. I'm now focused on the B&O Allegheny Yard Branch which followed the river bank from the Willow Grove yard at Herr's Island down to the Pressed Steel Car Company plant just beyond Brunot Island on the Ohio River. The BR&P also had trackage rights to the School Street yard and a nearby freight house.

 

I can't model it all six miles of the branch but there are portions from Willow Island Yard to the Manchester Bridge that will end up as my layout. The public works documentation from the early Teens into the mid-1930s has been remarkable.

 

I had planned to do research at the Heinz Regional History Center a couple of weeks ago to explore the images and files that are not on line, but that has been postponed to someday.

 

 

Eric Hansmann
Murfreesboro, TN

 

 

 

On June 12, 2020 at 7:18 AM "Gatwood, Elden J SAD " <elden.j.gatwood@...> wrote:

Eric;

 

I periodically go in to the Pitt Digital library to see new stuff, or do research, and these showed up in the Pittsburgh City Photographer collection.  Most of it is street work, paving and such, but some have freight cars peripheral to the subject.

 

That’s very true.  I don’t know why they are uncommon.  It’s not like there weren’t thousands wandering around out there.

 

Elden Gatwood

 


Re: more early early box car biz

Benjamin Hom
 

Charlie Vlk wrote:
"All of them wrong way, left hand, southpaw doors!!!"

Tens of thousands of left-opening door boxcars on the PRR.  Maybe it's YOUR railroad with doors that open the wrong way.


Ben Hom


Re: more early early box car biz

Charlie Vlk
 

All of them wrong way, left hand, southpaw doors!!!
Charlie Vlk


On Jun 12, 2020, at 9:07 AM, Gatwood, Elden J SAD <elden.j.gatwood@...> wrote:


Re: more early early box car biz

Eric Hansmann
 

That B&O boxcar is one of the original batch of M-8 class cars built between 1897-1901. It predates the Pennsy XL cars. The photo is dated March 1913 so the B&O car has seen lots of service. By 1926, only 21 of the M-8 cars in the original number series had avoided rebuilding with steel center sills and still in-service.


Eric Hansmann
Murfreesboro, TN



On June 12, 2020 at 8:04 AM "Gatwood, Elden J SAD " <elden.j.gatwood@...> wrote:



more early early box car biz

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 


Re: [Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] Box Cars in PRR Duquesne yard 1943

Eric Hansmann
 

The Pittsburgh City Photographer Collection has been a gold mine of inspiring images. I'm now focused on the B&O Allegheny Yard Branch which followed the river bank from the Willow Grove yard at Herr's Island down to the Pressed Steel Car Company plant just beyond Brunot Island on the Ohio River. The BR&P also had trackage rights to the School Street yard and a nearby freight house.

I can't model it all six miles of the branch but there are portions from Willow Island Yard to the Manchester Bridge that will end up as my layout. The public works documentation from the early Teens into the mid-1930s has been remarkable.

I had planned to do research at the Heinz Regional History Center a couple of weeks ago to explore the images and files that are not on line, but that has been postponed to someday.


Eric Hansmann
Murfreesboro, TN



On June 12, 2020 at 7:18 AM "Gatwood, Elden J SAD " <elden.j.gatwood@...> wrote:

Eric;


I periodically go in to the Pitt Digital library to see new stuff, or do research, and these showed up in the Pittsburgh City Photographer collection.  Most of it is street work, paving and such, but some have freight cars peripheral to the subject.


That’s very true.  I don’t know why they are uncommon.  It’s not like there weren’t thousands wandering around out there.


Elden Gatwood



Re: more real oldies

Eric Hansmann
 

The Try Street Terminal is a great pocket team yard in an urban canyon. While located fairly close to the original Grant Street freight house and the PRR passenger terminal, a tunnel separates the rail activity. I've used the Try Street terminal to illustrate what can be done in a limited area for maximum model railroad operation. Here are two elevated images from August 1935 I share for inspiration.

This is one of the best overall images snapped on August 22, 1935. At the right is the Fourth Avenue passenger station, a commuter stop. In the background is the Try Street Terminal warehouse, which was also rail served. Just to the right of the warehouse is the bridge over the Monongahela River. And of course....freight cars!

This image from August 11, 1935 offers a different angle and a slightly better look at the transfer dock and crane. Seen in both images are gondolas on the far track, which served a scrap outfit.

Lastly, here's a reference on a great site of city plat maps. These are 1923 maps as later editions remain under copyright. You can zoom in and out to explore more of Pittsburgh. See how many railroad team yards you can find from that era.



Eric Hansmann
Murfreesboro, TN







On June 12, 2020 at 6:34 AM "Gatwood, Elden J SAD " <elden.j.gatwood@...> wrote:

https://historicpittsburgh.org/islandora/object/pitt%3A715.122554.CP/viewer


ACL and L&N at Try Street yard in downtown Pittsburgh.  Love that ACD logo!


Elden Gatwood

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Re: New file uploaded to main@RealSTMFC.groups.io

James Brewer
 

All,

There is some confusion as to the file that was uploaded to RealSTMFC.

I attempted to upload this file to the group's files at the same time it was uploaded to the files of the Plastic Freight Car Modelers and the Resin Freight Car Modelers; however, there was no space available so I forwarded the file to the list owners.

In the meantime, some of you have sent me corrections/additions to the original file that was posted; I have made these corrections/additions to a revised file that I anticipate posting at the beginning of July. 

Within the past few days Jeff Aley kindly uploaded the original file; this file will be updated with the corrections/additions already forwarded, as well as any others that I receive in a timely manner.  Just this morning I received some additional information for DL&W and Erie.

So please, keep the corrections/additions coming and I will get them in the revised file.

Jim Brewer
Glenwood MD


Re: [Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] Box Cars in PRR Duquesne yard 1943

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Eric;

 

I periodically go in to the Pitt Digital library to see new stuff, or do research, and these showed up in the Pittsburgh City Photographer collection.  Most of it is street work, paving and such, but some have freight cars peripheral to the subject.

 

That’s very true.  I don’t know why they are uncommon.  It’s not like there weren’t thousands wandering around out there.

 

Elden Gatwood

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Eric Hansmann
Sent: Friday, June 12, 2020 8:56 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] Box Cars in PRR Duquesne yard 1943

 

Eldon,

 

I had not seen these images! Thank you for sharing. Are they on the Historic Pittsburgh site?

 

A Pennsy X26 is featured in one of those images and it looks like it is wearing the original lettering. I have seen very few in-service images of these cars in original lettering.

 

 

Eric Hansmann
Murfreesboro, TN

 

 

 

On June 12, 2020 at 6:05 AM "Gatwood, Elden J SAD " <elden.j.gatwood@...> wrote:

Eric;

 

Some call it Duquesne Yard, others, Duquesne Way Yard, or others, 11th St Yard (it isn’t).  At times, the PRR did not name it as a specific yard, just tracks serving Duquesne Freight Station.  Like 23rd St Freight Station had tracks, but PRR did not call them 23rd St Yard, so what do you call the yard?

 

Here are some more of Carson St Freight Station yard tracks.

 

Had you seen these?

 

Elden Gatwood


Re: [Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] More freight cars on Duquesne Way

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Eric;

 

That makes sense!  Thanks!

 

Elden Gatwood

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Eric Hansmann
Sent: Friday, June 12, 2020 8:59 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] More freight cars on Duquesne Way

 

Eldon,

 

I think the MC car is on B&O tracks, formerly Pittsburgh Junction. They served a couple places under the Duquesne Way viaduct down to 9th Street.

 

 

Eric Hansmann
Murfreesboro, TN

 

 

 

On June 12, 2020 at 6:25 AM "Gatwood, Elden J SAD " <elden.j.gatwood@...> wrote:


Re: More freight cars on Duquesne Way

Eric Hansmann
 

Eldon,

I think the MC car is on B&O tracks, formerly Pittsburgh Junction. They served a couple places under the Duquesne Way viaduct down to 9th Street.


Eric Hansmann
Murfreesboro, TN



On June 12, 2020 at 6:25 AM "Gatwood, Elden J SAD " <elden.j.gatwood@...> wrote:

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