Date   

Re: coil gondola shipping early problems

Schuyler Larrabee
 

Indeed.  Beautiful model.

 

Schuyler

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of O Fenton Wells
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2020 3:54 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] coil gondola shipping early problems

 

Good looking car Eric

Fenton

 

On Fri, Jul 17, 2020 at 3:47 PM Eric Hansmann <eric@...> wrote:

I wonder if these coils are for can stock.

 

BTW, the Reading gondola has an 8-1937 journal repack stencil. It’s also wearing original lettering applied shortly after the corporate name change from P&R to Reading. This photo inspired the lettering on my F&C Reading gondola.

https://i0.wp.com/designbuildop.hansmanns.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/201705_reading_gm1.jpg

 

 

Eric Hansmann

Murfreesboro, TN

 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gatwood, Elden J SAD
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2020 9:35 AM
To: RealSTMFC@groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] coil gondola shipping early problems

 

Group;

 

Any insights into what uses these coils would have been for?

 

Any translation of the writing?

 

Nice RDG gon, BTW!

 

Elden Gatwood


 

--

Fenton Wells
250 Frye Rd

Pinehurst NC 28374
910-420-8106
srrfan1401@...


Re: And we're shipping kits

Guy Wilber
 

Pierre Oliver,

You’ve done an excellent job on these various kits. Are you offering the appropriate decals for the 65100-65199 series cars which were equipped with Evans Auto~Loaders?

Regards,

Guy Wilber
Reno, Nevada


Re: [Espee] Photos: S.P. Boxcar 84993 / route cards

Todd Sullivan
 

Bill Welch said,
"I think little bit of decals would do the trick ... However not sure how to make them removable."

Well, Bill, I couldn't resist replying to that one. Canopy cement (or Hob-e-Tak which I use) is hte answer.  Apply a very small dot on the car side, apply the decal mostly dry, do not use setting solution, then remove the decal when desired!

Todd Sullivan


Re: [Espee] Photos: S.P. Boxcar 84993

Douglas Harding
 

I note two of those route cards are for the M&StL and the MILW, indicating this car was traveling in the upper Midwest.

 

Doug Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Tony Thompson
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2020 4:09 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] [Espee] Photos: S.P. Boxcar 84993

 

Brent Greer wrote:



I know that most of this detail would be too small to see with normal vision in HO scale (but that certainly doesn't stop Bill from doing the incredible detailing that he does), so it makes me wonder, has anyone ever made route card decals in HO scale?   

 

     Once could do so, within limits. Most of them have writing too small to reasonably see, but some have a large number or initial on it, and that could be done with decals. After all, we have repack decals with truly small lettering.

      My personal approach has always been to use plain rectangles of paper, white or manila or other color. I have written a number of blog posts on the topic; if you're interested, there is a link below to a late one in the series, containing links to earlier ones.

 

 

The idea here, in my mind, matches Richard Hendrickson's admonition, that in some places on a model there should be SOMETHING there. A tiny white rectangle, where a route card ought to be, satisfies that for me.

 

Tony Thompson

 

 

 


Re: Photo: Jeeps On Chicago Great Western Flat Car

Bruce Smith
 

In the inimitable words of Sherman Potter, that's "Horse Hockey". I can cite hundreds of pieces of evidence that military loads in the use were tied down. That occurs in multiple ways, with multiple means and is demonstrated in the US Army's own technical manuals. I will confine my further remarks to WWII, where I have the most expertise.

When units moved with their own equipment, which was generally confined to the pre-war and immediate period of 18 months after the start of the war, equipment was blocked with solid pieces of wood and tied down with twisted wire at multiple points, typically fore and aft, on both sides. Blocks were also positioned to prevent front and back, side to side, and even vertical movement with some vehicles

As the depot system became established, mid 1943, troops rarely traveled with their equipment, with the exception of specialized units such as some engineering units being moved between domestic construction assignments. Blocking started to consist of built up blocks as the stock of solid timber were requisitioned for other, more important war-time uses. Tie downs often consisted of threaded rod, with turn-buckles for tensioning and retaining plates with nuts at the bottom of flat car stake pockets. In some cases, where cars were captured for service, I have seen steel plates with eyes on top bolted to flat car decks as the tie down location. I have no evidence that it was eliminated and certainly none that it was done so to facilitate emergency removal. 

As a final note, chains and chain binders, were very uncommon tie downs in WWII, unlike today. I theorize that might be due to the free roaming nature of flat cars and the difficulty in getting that gear back to the factory or depot that shipped the vehicle.

Regards,
Bruce
Bruce Smith
Auburn, AL


From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> on behalf of Bob Chaparro via groups.io <chiefbobbb@...>
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2020 4:59 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Jeeps On Chicago Great Western Flat Car
 
I received this comment:
"Generally military vehicles were not tied down, to facilitate emergency removal from the rail cars."
Can anyone verify or dispute this?
Thanks.
Bob Chaparro
Hemet, CA


coil gondola shipping early problems

David
 

And on another tangent, the third pic seems to show P&WV's 1920s project to rebuild their 1905CD hoppers.

David Thompson


Making pickles: vinegar and such

David Soderblom
 

Just to fill in…  When traditional cucumber pickles are made, you dump them into a vat in brine.  The brine suppresses bad bacteria and having them in a liquid suppressed aerobes, and then there’s a malo-lactic fermentation, with the source being airborne natural critters, and that is bacterial (as opposed to wine fermentation which uses yeast, but wines also go through malo-lactic fermentations later, sometimes, and that is complex).  As part of that, lactic acid is created (plus CO_2, and that makes a foam on top).  Thus pickles and acid.  When they are packed/canned/put in bottles, then vinegar is added, partly to preserve.  But if you saw a (really) old-fashioned pickle barrel, it didn’t have vinegar added.

And don’t forget the dill, unless, like me, you really like sour spears, and I can’t find them any more.  Our taste in the US has distinctly moved to sweeter pickles in my lifetime.

David Soderblom
Baltimore MD USA







Re: Photo: Jeeps On Chicago Great Western Flat Car

Tony Thompson
 

Doug Harding wrote:

May be true today, but the various photos I have of military loads show tiedowns. Attached are a couple of examples.

     I agree. The 1940s and 50s photos I have, definitely show tie-downs on all kinds of  military loads, though chocks seemed to be the main restraint.

Tony Thompson




Re: Photo: Jeeps On Chicago Great Western Flat Car

Douglas Harding
 

May be true today, but the various photos I have of military loads show tiedowns. Attached are a couple of examples.

 

Doug Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Bob Chaparro via groups.io
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2020 5:00 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Jeeps On Chicago Great Western Flat Car

 

I received this comment:
"Generally military vehicles were not tied down, to facilitate emergency removal from the rail cars."
Can anyone verify or dispute this?
Thanks.
Bob Chaparro
Hemet, CA


Re: Photo: Jeeps On Chicago Great Western Flat Car

Bob Chaparro
 

I received this comment:
"Generally military vehicles were not tied down, to facilitate emergency removal from the rail cars."
Can anyone verify or dispute this?
Thanks.
Bob Chaparro
Hemet, CA


Re: coil gondola shipping early problems

Jim Hayes
 

Somehow this shorty gon looks fascinating to me. I may build one.

   Jim

On Fri, Jul 17, 2020 at 1:29 PM Andy Carlson <midcentury@...> wrote:
A rather simple kit bash from a P2K 52" Greenville gondola. Made in 1953 and came new with roller bearing trucks. Like others mentioned, since this was in direct service on the WP (straying off the WP only to get to Pittsburg CA's steel mill on the Sacramento Northern-a subsidary of the WP).

Western Pacific had 29' gondolas made specifically to haul coil steel. The coils were loaded over the trucks only. They were loaded on their sides in cradles.
Andy Jackson
Santa Fe Springs CA


_._,_.


Re: coil gondola shipping early problems

Steve Salotti
 

My guess would be (based on Reading Gons) they could be coils produced by Carpenter Steel, located on the Reading main just West of Reading, PA.  Drive by there on a somewhat regular basis.
Steve Salotti


Re: [Espee] Photos: S.P. Boxcar 84993

Bill Welch
 

I think little bit of decals would do the trick, white and maybe the nice beige color from L&N F7, GP7, ALCO RS3 and FA2.

However not sure how to make them removable, LOL.

Bill Welch


Re: [Espee] Photos: S.P. Boxcar 84993

Tony Thompson
 

Brent Greer wrote:

I know that most of this detail would be too small to see with normal vision in HO scale (but that certainly doesn't stop Bill from doing the incredible detailing that he does), so it makes me wonder, has anyone ever made route card decals in HO scale?   

     Once could do so, within limits. Most of them have writing too small to reasonably see, but some have a large number or initial on it, and that could be done with decals. After all, we have repack decals with truly small lettering.
      My personal approach has always been to use plain rectangles of paper, white or manila or other color. I have written a number of blog posts on the topic; if you're interested, there is a link below to a late one in the series, containing links to earlier ones.


The idea here, in my mind, matches Richard Hendrickson's admonition, that in some places on a model there should be SOMETHING there. A tiny white rectangle, where a route card ought to be, satisfies that for me.

Tony Thompson




coil gondola shipping early problems

Andy Carlson
 

A rather simple kit bash from a P2K 52" Greenville gondola. Made in 1953 and came new with roller bearing trucks. Like others mentioned, since this was in direct service on the WP (straying off the WP only to get to Pittsburg CA's steel mill on the Sacramento Northern-a subsidary of the WP).

Western Pacific had 29' gondolas made specifically to haul coil steel. The coils were loaded over the trucks only. They were loaded on their sides in cradles.
Andy Jackson
Santa Fe Springs CA


_._,_.


Re: coil gondola shipping early problems

 

Western Pacific had 29' gondolas made specifically to haul coil steel. The coils were loaded over the trucks only. They were loaded on their sides in cradles.
Andy Jackson
Santa Fe Springs CA



Re: pickle cars in California (was Re: Heinz plant locations)

Claus Schlund \(HGM\)
 


Hi Gene and List Members,
 
I don't know if this is a 'salting station', but the image linked below proclaims itself to be the PACIFIC VINEGAR & PICKLE WORKS in Hayward CA. It is served by rail. No pickle cars in sight, but that does not mean there weren't any ever there!
 
 
Claus Schlund
 

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2020 2:48 PM
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] pickle cars in California (was Re: Heinz plant locations)

Pickles and vinegar have little in common other than they shipped in wood vats or tanks.   I have not found any information on salting stations within Cali.  Pickles were packed in the Seattle area by Nalleys.  

Vinegar production facilities did exist in California.  There was a large plant in the East Bay for a number of years. Some of the wine produced in California ended up as vinegar.   

Gene Deimling 


Re: coil gondola shipping early problems

O Fenton Wells
 

Good looking car Eric
Fenton

On Fri, Jul 17, 2020 at 3:47 PM Eric Hansmann <eric@...> wrote:

I wonder if these coils are for can stock.

 

BTW, the Reading gondola has an 8-1937 journal repack stencil. It’s also wearing original lettering applied shortly after the corporate name change from P&R to Reading. This photo inspired the lettering on my F&C Reading gondola.

https://i0.wp.com/designbuildop.hansmanns.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/201705_reading_gm1.jpg

 

 

Eric Hansmann

Murfreesboro, TN

 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gatwood, Elden J SAD
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2020 9:35 AM
To: RealSTMFC@groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] coil gondola shipping early problems

 

Group;

 

Any insights into what uses these coils would have been for?

 

Any translation of the writing?

 

Nice RDG gon, BTW!

 

Elden Gatwood



--
Fenton Wells
250 Frye Rd
Pinehurst NC 28374
910-420-8106
srrfan1401@...


Re: Heinz plant locations

Eric Hansmann
 

There are a couple sets of vats in that image. There are a host of slightly smaller vats on the right side of the plant. I also see two spurs to the facility. These other vats sit between the two spurs.

 

There seem to be freight cars sitting on the lower spur to the right near a parking lot.

 

 

Eric Hansmann

Murfreesboro, TN

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Craig Wilson
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2020 10:35 AM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Heinz plant locations

 

Heinz (now Heinz North America) still has a facility located along W. 16th Street in Holland Michigan.  See the attached Google Earth image.  There are still large vinegar vats that are visible in the upper left in the image (sitting in line next to them while waiting to load there can be no doubt what they are).  No rails into the plant any more but the roadbed (Pere Marquette/C&O) can be seen curving in from the northeast in the upper right corner of the image.

 

Last time I was there the plant was shipping out small condiment ("relish") packets in semi-trucks and marine containers - which traveled by RAIL from Chicago.  Everyone I dealt with there seemed to have an unpleasant attitude - which might be a consequence of having to work every day in a place with a strong odor of vinegar!

 

Craig Wilson

 

 

 

 


Re: coil gondola shipping early problems

Eric Hansmann
 

I wonder if these coils are for can stock.

 

BTW, the Reading gondola has an 8-1937 journal repack stencil. It’s also wearing original lettering applied shortly after the corporate name change from P&R to Reading. This photo inspired the lettering on my F&C Reading gondola.

https://i0.wp.com/designbuildop.hansmanns.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/201705_reading_gm1.jpg

 

 

Eric Hansmann

Murfreesboro, TN

 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Gatwood, Elden J SAD
Sent: Friday, July 17, 2020 9:35 AM
To: RealSTMFC@groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] coil gondola shipping early problems

 

Group;

 

Any insights into what uses these coils would have been for?

 

Any translation of the writing?

 

Nice RDG gon, BTW!

 

Elden Gatwood

6361 - 6380 of 182166