Date   

WM Postwar AAR Boxcar – Front Range Upgrade #3

Bob Chapman
 

WM #4009 was one of series #4001-4050 built 7/51. The prototype featured a 7-foot panel door with unusual rib spacing at panel #3 to accommodate the tack board, improved dreadnaught ends, and a diagonal panel roof.

The Front Range model’s deep-fishbelly sidesill was modified to duplicate the prototype’s tabbed design, and its eight-foot door opening narrowed to the prototype’s seven feet. The height of the third panel of a Detail Associates door was increased to match the prototype’s unusual spacing. Other detail adds include Kadee 7/7 ladders/grabs/Equipco brakewheel, Yarmouth Apex runningboard, and Kato ASF A-3 trucks. Decals are Speedwitch.      

Regards,
Bob Chapman



What's on my workbench

David
 

These are mid-'50s rebuilds of N&W's round-roof box cars originally in classes B-1 and B-2.

https://imagebase.lib.vt.edu/image_viewer.php?q=ns3254
https://imagebase.lib.vt.edu/image_viewer.php?q=ns2907

David Thompson


Re: Interesting cars on the left

tommy boyle
 

The railroad in the photo is the Boston & Maine Regards, Tom Travers


WP 29' Coil Gondola GA Drawing

Garth Groff and Sally Sanford
 

Friends,

If anybody wants to take up Jim's suggestion to model one of these using Andy's photo as a guide, the WP general arrangement drawings are attached. These were similar to the P2K 52' Greenville car, and it would be an easy cut and splice job.

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff  🦆


What's on my workbench

Chad Boas
 

Here is a sneak peak at the new kits I will have available soon.
N&W B1a and B1b
The kit will have sides, ends, roof, floor and decals.
Chad Boas


Re: WP 29' Coil Gondolas

Jim Hayes
 

Might make an interesting project for a mini-kit project for an RPM meet.

Jim


Re: IC boxcar mini-kit build

James Brewer
 


Re: IC boxcar mini-kit build

Armand Premo
 

An address for Resin Car Works Please .Armand Premo

On Sat, Aug 15, 2020 at 6:54 AM Eric Hansmann <eric@...> wrote:
John Golden builds a boxcar mini-kit in the latest Resin Car Works blog post.


Eric Hansmann
RCW web guy


Re: Photo: T&NO Flatcar 20553 (Circa 1912)

Bob Chaparro
 

Another instance where I found a picture otherwise not discovered using a search with railroad terms on a non-railroad website.
I think this one popped-up in a search using the term "factory".
Bob Chaparro
Hemet, CA


WP 29' Coil Gondolas

Garth Groff and Sally Sanford
 

Friends,

A couple of weeks back we were discussing WP'S 29' coil gondolas here, and off-group as well. This month I am scanning up miscellaneous bits and pieces of paper, and ran across the attached advertisement from a 1953 issue of TRAINS which shows these cars in an amusing, but informative way.

Please take note of the Timkin "Roller Bearing" herald. The one surviving car, WP 6424, is at the Western Pacific Railroad Museum in Portola, California, and was restored to this original scheme: https://www.wplives.org/collectionpageimages/freightcarimages/gondolas/wp6424.jpg .

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff  🦆


IC boxcar mini-kit build

Eric Hansmann
 

John Golden builds a boxcar mini-kit in the latest Resin Car Works blog post.


Eric Hansmann
RCW web guy


Re: Galvanized roofs

erieblt2
 

Interesting thread. I’ve learned a lot. I had Kalmbach “Freight Cars of the ‘40’s & ‘50’s” handy. The cover is a high angle color shot of a multi-track Chicago yard in 1942. If you have the book check it out. I’m still a bit unsure of how I’ll choose to weather more of my 1950’s box cars. Bill S


On Aug 14, 2020, at 3:24 PM, Tony Thompson <tony@...> wrote:


Dennis Storzek wrote:

I have always wondered if it wasn't an issue with the paints in use during different periods. During the era before WWI and 'tween the wars, the common freightcar paint was some sort of cheap pigment (almost always iron oxide based) in linseed oil, a naturally polymerizing oil. Linseed oil leaves a lot to be desired as paint, it's a potential fire hazard, takes forever to dry, and stays soft for a while even when dry to the touch. But it does form a tough flexible film that sticks tenaciously.

  Certainly all true, but perhaps oversimplified. I was intrigued, reading issue after issue of _Railway Age_ in the first years of steel cars (up to World War I), how many articles there were about getting paint to stick to galvanized surfaces. Many, many formulations were suggested, with many claimed as "highly effective," then the claim would soon be contradicted by a car supervisor for some other railroad. They definitely weren't just using "body paint," but were striving to devise formulations to achieve paint adhesion to galvanized.

Tony Thompson




Re: Galvanized roofs

Tony Thompson
 

Dennis Storzek wrote:

I have always wondered if it wasn't an issue with the paints in use during different periods. During the era before WWI and 'tween the wars, the common freightcar paint was some sort of cheap pigment (almost always iron oxide based) in linseed oil, a naturally polymerizing oil. Linseed oil leaves a lot to be desired as paint, it's a potential fire hazard, takes forever to dry, and stays soft for a while even when dry to the touch. But it does form a tough flexible film that sticks tenaciously.

  Certainly all true, but perhaps oversimplified. I was intrigued, reading issue after issue of _Railway Age_ in the first years of steel cars (up to World War I), how many articles there were about getting paint to stick to galvanized surfaces. Many, many formulations were suggested, with many claimed as "highly effective," then the claim would soon be contradicted by a car supervisor for some other railroad. They definitely weren't just using "body paint," but were striving to devise formulations to achieve paint adhesion to galvanized.

Tony Thompson




Re: Galvanized roofs

Dennis Storzek
 

I have always wondered if it wasn't an issue with the paints in use during different periods. During the era before WWI and 'tween the wars, the common freightcar paint was some sort of cheap pigment (almost always iron oxide based) in linseed oil, a naturally polymerizing oil. Linseed oil leaves a lot to be desired as paint, it's a potential fire hazard, takes forever to dry, and stays soft for a while even when dry to the touch. But it does form a tough flexible film that sticks tenaciously.

Beginning just before WWII synthetic alkyd enamels became popular. These solved many of the application problems inherent with linseed oil, and the other popular freightcar coating, asphalt based car cement, but perhaps at the cost of lesser adhesion, and that is when peeling roofs became more common. Remember, the railroads weren't looking for the BEST freightcar coating, only the most cost effective. That still holds true today, or freightcars would be painted with Imron. Given the reduced application costs, and the fact that "nobody sees the roofs, anyway", the railroads just made a judgement as to what was sufficient for their needs, eventually deciding that it was a waste of time to paint roofs at all, but somewhat after our period of interest.

Dennis Storzek


Re: Galvanized roofs

np328
 

    I will look for the letters I read the following information from however as Richard Hendrickson used to say at the start of his presentations "to put all this in context". 
Context: The NP built 1000 boxcars for on-line needs in the first half of the fifties that once loaded promptly went off-line and stayed that way for several years. (Why you need to model NP boxcars).  I would like to do a presentation/article on these as routing on five cars through two years was provided and those cars did get around the US and even into east and western Canada. 
   
    In the letters were a survey of the condition of the cars several years after building once a few came back and I do recall words to the effect that some cinder cutting is noted on the the roofing. The word some. No words that paint failure was noted to any large degree which would back up the observations of BC and SL, or that these cars needed to be shopped for repair/repainting. 

     Of roofs being sooty, I seem to recall several times Richard Hendrickson admonished us in presentations that during the steam era cars were sootier than many of us ever model. Photos of Richard's modeled cars back up that he modeled as he stated. Jack Delano photos of the cars seen in the downtown IC Chicago yard area by my prior recent postings underscored this also. And do not show severe flaking or failure of roof paint.  

         Please recall also that on most cars less than 20 years old - the railroad does not own these, the trust that funded the purchase of these cars does. And the railroad needs to keep up these cars to some minimal standards agreed to in the original contract that these were purchased under. Perhaps your studied railroad bought equipment outright with cash however for much of the history of what I have read, my studied railroad these car were purchase through bonds, hence the trust plates on the boxcars in builders photos. I'll see if I can find the paperwork that notes - cars painted under trust agreements - or something to those words.  It is a sizeable group each year in shop records.

So I would petition that this negates to some degree extreme paint failure modeling.

                 At the end years of the STMFC stated time frame, and when some railroads were teetering financially, perhaps an argument can be made to differ. 
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                           Jim Dick - St. Paul, MN 

   


Re: Galvanized roofs

Tony Thompson
 

Schuyler Larrabee wrote:

I know you’re an expert in materials, but a metallurgist once told me that once rust starts, you’re screwed (his term) because even if you get most of it, even what appears to be ALL of it off, once it’s started you simply cannot stop it without extreme measures.

     True, unless you can seal the rust area so no more moisture gets to it (this is never 100 percent successful). But keep in mind that not being able to stop rusting, but stretching out the problem past the economic life of whatever is rusting, is still a win.

Tony Thompson




Re: Photo: T&NO Flatcar 20553 (Circa 1912)

Charles Etheredge
 

Great picture Bob.  We don't get to see very much T&NO stuff.    Thanks.


Re: Interesting cars on the left

Schuyler Larrabee
 

Boston & Maine

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of O Fenton Wells
Sent: Friday, August 14, 2020 10:32 AM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Cc: RealSTMFC@groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Interesting cars on the left

 

What railroad line is this?

 

On Fri, Aug 14, 2020 at 10:30 AM gary laakso <vasa0vasa@...> wrote:

The flat car next to the boxcar does not appear to have bulkheads.

 

Gary Laakso

Northwest of Mike Brock

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Schuyler Larrabee via groups.io
Sent: Friday, August 14, 2020 7:11 AM
To: RealSTMFC@groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Interesting cars on the left

 

Bulkhead flats with tanks loaded on them, or a form of tank car?

 

Snipped out of an ebay listing, still open for bidding if anyone is interested.

 

Schuyler

 


 

--

Fenton Wells
250 Frye Rd

Pinehurst NC 28374
910-420-8106
srrfan1401@...


Re: Galvanized roofs

Schuyler Larrabee
 

Tony, whether they are “brittle” or not depends at some level on how thick the galvanizing was applied.  I have seen galvanizing that would sheet off in large flakes, sometimes all the way down to the bare steel.  And in a case like that, the working of the joints as the car and roof were flexed would wear though the galvanizing.

 

I know you’re an expert in materials, but a metallurgist once told me that once rust starts, you’re screwed (his term) because even if you get most of it, even what appears to be ALL of it off, once it’s started you simply cannot stop it without extreme measures.

 

Schuyler

 

Schuyler Larrabee wrote:

 

I think the greater prominence of peeling in those locations is that the car (and therefore the roof) flexes more at those points, and the “working” of the joints tends to crack whatever protective coating, car cement, paint, galvanizing, whatever, which permits the enemy, water, to penetrate to the victim, steel.

 

     This is certainly true, though galvanized coatings are not brittle. Note also, though, that galvanizing often fails at sharp corners, for example along the edge of the raised panels in a roof. Paint is thinner there. As Schuyler says, as soon as paint/car cement exposes the galvanized. it is at first protective (that's its purpose) but as more and more galvanized is exposed, eventually a pinhole begins to rust. All downhill from there <g>.

 

Tony Thompson

 

 

 


Re: Photo: SFRD 13000 - Stainless Steel Reefer (1946)

Steve SANDIFER
 

Also it depends on your time frame. It was renumbered twice and the door was changed during its life.

 

 

J. Stephen Sandifer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Edward
Sent: Friday, August 14, 2020 1:47 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: SFRD 13000 - Stainless Steel Reefer (1946)

 

Ah, such is progress.
I built the O scale model of SFRD 13000 in 1987, before desk top computers, home linked internet service and good digital cameras were available. 
So the 1953 19th edition of Car Builders' Cyclopedia was my main reference. From that short caption and photo  I even determined the fractional dimensions for the car side data.
It was built using an Athearn reefer roof, ends and underframe. The sides are built up in styrene, with plug door details worked out with wire and a cut up soda pop can for thin sheet aluminum.
A Champion decal set was used for lettering, but the "E" in El Capitan and the word "West" had to be hand painted. The set had a curved "E" and the word "West" was too large.
So much for the RIGHT side of the model.
I pored through my old TRAINS magazines from the late 1940's to see if perhaps there was a photo that showed the LEFT side of SFRD 13000.
But I could not find any coverage at all about that unique car.
I then did what I thought ATSF would do: use  the standard layout with a slogan for the left side, "Ship and Travel Santa Fe All the Way."
It was in the Champ decal set so it went on, carefully fitting it all between the horizontal ribbing.
This model has been in local and NMRA regional model contests and taken to area train meets to run on a display layout. It was well received.

Now jump ahead 33 years and lo, what appears is a photo of the LEFT side of SFRD 13000! That for which I had searched in vain.
What to do?  Ought I try to find another Champ or other O scale decal set with the SFRD "The Super Chief to California" panel and redo the left side (which has also been weathered)?
Or, just break out my spike maul and return that model to the elements of the universe from whence it came, being now found inaccurate and unauthentic.
Still, at my age now (mid-80's), maybe it's best I just only show its RIGHT side from now on!

Ed Bommer, MMR 634