Date   

Re: Dimensional Data - wrong assumptions

Dave Parker
 

Dennis, I think you hit the nail on the head.  I am not sure the EXW had to occur above 12 ft, but rather that it be up near the eaves somewhere.  So, a car might have been right at 12 ft to the eaves (or actually the lat running board), but the the relevant widest point could have been the upper door track at something like 11-8 high or thereabouts.  I agree this could account for a lot of the confusion we have been discussing.  It follows then that the EXH dimension for stenciling may not be knowable from the ORER if the reporting road used one of the low protrusions at ~5 ft for the EXH entry. 

I note in passing that some roads seem to have never complied with this part of the standard.  I hoard B&M house-car photos, but have never seen an EXW and EXH stencil on one.
--
Dave Parker
Swall Meadows, CA


Re: Teens and Twenties shipments of Ford cars via box cars

Garth Groff and Sally Sanford <mallardlodge1000@...>
 

Ken,

Alloy Forms used to offer a cast metal Studebaker kit, but it isn't on their current web pages. IIRC, these were 1950 Studebaker Champion two-door coupes, one of those cars with the really weird curved back window. Of course there was no plastic window insert in the kit. I've still got at least one around here someplace, and it's still in the package since I couldn't figure out how to do that rear window. Maybe someday it will appear in a junkyard scene.

It might be getting off topic here, but I learned to drive in a 1962 Lark.

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff  🦆

On Sun, Sep 6, 2020 at 5:56 PM Kenneth Montero <va661midlo@...> wrote:
One of my model railroad friends, Alan Mende, who also is a Studebaker collector, had the following additions to Andy's photo:

These appear to be 1954 Studebaker bodies because it was that year that Studebaker started building station wagons.  The brownish bodies are the wagons.  The rest are either coupes (with a B pillar) or hardtops (without a B pillar).  I like Tony's model.  He can get HO scale Studebaker cars and trucks through Sylvan Scale Models.  They make the bullet nose Studebakers as well as the 1953 hardtops and early 50s trucks in many body styles.


From Ken Montero




On 09/04/2020 4:37 PM Andy Jackson <lajrmdlr@...> wrote:


Here's what looks to me to be Studebakers "stuffed" into a Santa Fe drop bottom gondola. Think these autos only included everything from firewall back, i.e. no motor, body & chassis in front of it. Studebaker had a plant on Los Angeles Junction Ry till it closed in 1956.  A fellow LAJ modeler. Tony Debates,  made the Studebaker plant for his layout (attached).
Andy Jackson
Santa Fe Springs CA




Re: Loading Grain In A Refrigerator Car (1918)

Ray Hutchison
 

Although, why not?  An efficient way to load grain into a car, and the reefers may have been on return shipment, or simply out of season.  Ery interesting, and another example of something that can be modeled ('that's not prototypical')!


Re: Dimensional Data - wrong assumptions

Dennis Storzek
 

On Sun, Sep 6, 2020 at 11:38 AM, Dave Parker wrote:
Dave,
Do I interpret the second point correctly that they only want the extreme width that occurs above 12 feet over the rail, and the height to it? That would make sense if they were mainly concerned with tunnel clearances, as the top corners of the car would be most likely to impinge on the tunnel lining, but this puts this dimension at variance with what is reported in the ORER, which is looking for the widest point of the whole car and the height to it. That may be where some of the confusion comes from, and also explains the comment that one doesn't see low numbers in the EWH stenciling.

Dennis Storzek


Re: I notice the ARMOUR meat distributorship branch house

CJ Riley
 

I like the meat rail running out to the car. My first reaction was it was a long way to carry a side of beef until I looked closer.




Re: N&W 1950 boxcar color

O Fenton Wells
 

Thanks Bill, I'll try to cross reference it
Fenton

On Sun, Sep 6, 2020 at 6:31 PM Bill Welch <fgexbill@...> wrote:
I am planning to use Vallejo's  Model Color "Saddle Brown." This is meant to be brushed on so I use Liquitex "Airbrush Medium" to reduce it for Airbrushing and drop or two Windser-Newton "Flow Improver."

Sorry I cannot help you with the Scale Coat.

Bill Welch



--
Fenton Wells
250 Frye Rd
Pinehurst NC 28374
910-420-8106
srrfan1401@...


Re: N&W 1950 boxcar color

Bill Welch
 

I am planning to use Vallejo's  Model Color "Saddle Brown." This is meant to be brushed on so I use Liquitex "Airbrush Medium" to reduce it for Airbrushing and drop or two Windser-Newton "Flow Improver."

Sorry I cannot help you with the Scale Coat.

Bill Welch


N&W 1950 boxcar color

O Fenton Wells
 

Anyone know the best Scalecoat color for the N&W in the early 1950's?  It looks a little more brown than red but I'm not sure.
Thanking all in advance
Fenton


Re: Teens and Twenties shipments of Ford cars via box cars

Kenneth Montero
 

One of my model railroad friends, Alan Mende, who also is a Studebaker collector, had the following additions to Andy's photo:

These appear to be 1954 Studebaker bodies because it was that year that Studebaker started building station wagons.  The brownish bodies are the wagons.  The rest are either coupes (with a B pillar) or hardtops (without a B pillar).  I like Tony's model.  He can get HO scale Studebaker cars and trucks through Sylvan Scale Models.  They make the bullet nose Studebakers as well as the 1953 hardtops and early 50s trucks in many body styles.


From Ken Montero




On 09/04/2020 4:37 PM Andy Jackson <lajrmdlr@...> wrote:


Here's what looks to me to be Studebakers "stuffed" into a Santa Fe drop bottom gondola. Think these autos only included everything from firewall back, i.e. no motor, body & chassis in front of it. Studebaker had a plant on Los Angeles Junction Ry till it closed in 1956.  A fellow LAJ modeler. Tony Debates,  made the Studebaker plant for his layout (attached).
Andy Jackson
Santa Fe Springs CA




Re: State of Maine Cars

Todd Horton
 

Branchline did some 50' cars on the R/W/B BAR scheme, going off memory, these cars were built in 1957.

Todd Horton


On Saturday, September 5, 2020, 02:51:38 PM EDT, Bob Chapman <chapbob4014@...> wrote:


Victor asks:
I know this has been covered in the past (I looked), but in the more recent time period has anyone come with a accurate car either RTR or as a kit, other than brass?


Here's the Yarmouth car.
Bob Chapman


QUESTION ON SANTA FE Sk-L STOCK CAR

WILLIAM PARDIE
 

When delivered these s  stock/coke cars (58000 series)  did not have end ladders.  As the cars lasted into the 1950's were end ladders ever added?

Thanks for any help.

Bill Pardie



Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone



Question On Santa Fe Sk-L Stock Car



Re: Dimensional Data - wrong assumptions

Dave Parker
 

Hi Dennis.

Yes, I have the digitized copy, and folks who have figured out to gain member access to the Hathi Trust collection (a subject of some prior posts) can find it here, and download the PDF:

https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=mdp.39015021053742&view=1up&seq=5

The discussion and figures are quite interesting (to me), as they tie into the ARA clearance diagrams (for running cars through tunnels) as well as the columns of dimensional data in the ORERs.  Some relevant history as well.

This snippet is the actual change to the official ARA language that was approved by mail ballot:



There were also some minor changes to the Notes in the 1927 standard lettering diagram to bring everything into alignment.  So there should be a 1930/31 revision to that drawing (absent from the 1931 CBC as we have discussed) that has the revised notes as well the the EXW and EXH stencils.

Hope this helps and best regards.
--
Dave Parker
Swall Meadows, CA


Re: Dimensional Data - wrong assumptions

Dennis Storzek
 

On Sat, Sep 5, 2020 at 06:35 PM, Dave Parker wrote:
The CBCs were effectively trade catalogs, and should be considered a secondary source for MCB/ARA/AAR standards or rules.
Dave, I certainly agree. I simply stated what I found to save others the trouble of looking. Now, do you have a copy of the 1929 ARA proceedings and could you quote how the EXH stencil is defined? I think that's what people are looking for, the official word, so to speak.

Dennis Storzek


I notice the ARMOUR meat distributorship branch house

Claus Schlund \(HGM\)
 

Hi List Members,
 
I was getting rid of old calendars, and I remembered this nice image from the New Haven Railroad 2019 calendar, the illustration for July.
 
 
Beyond the obvious ACF Talgo Train on display in New London CT in 1954 there is yet a lot to see in the image. I enjoy the advertizing and billboards on the extreme right side. The tracks the train is displayed upon are free of weeds, indicating they are likely in regular use, they probably serve as team tracks for freight deliveries. I like the 'wheel stop' type end-of-track bumpers, they are of a construction that is new to my eyes. The WESTERN UNION office certainly catches my eye.
 
But in an effort to remain on topic, I notice the ARMOUR meat distributorship branch house. A company truck in the parking lot, and a New Haven switcher delivering an ARMOUR steel reefer. There appear to be overhead rails (seemingly painted green) for meat transport from the rail siding to the branch house interior.
 
All in all, this makes for a seriously model-genic scene for our steam era freight cars.
 
You can even park your ACF Talgo Train on it and nobody can tell you it is not prototypical! Just don't do it at every op session.
 
Claus Schlund


Re: Photo: PRR Depressed Center Flatcar 470011 (1949)

Bruce Smith
 

PRR class F35, #470011. The load looks like a smaller version of the Westinghouse turbod generqator carried by the FD2, 16-axle, flat car.

Regards,
Bruce Smith
Auburn, Al


From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> on behalf of Bob Chaparro via groups.io <chiefbobbb@...>
Sent: Sunday, September 6, 2020 10:58 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Photo: PRR Depressed Center Flatcar 470011 (1949)
 

Photo: PRR Depressed Center Flatcar 470011 (1949)

A photo from the University of Utah Library:

https://collections.lib.utah.edu/ark:/87278/s6rn40vm

This photo can be enlarged quite a bit.

Description:

The 353-megawatt Gadsby Plant is named for George M. Gadsby, a former president of Utah Power & Light Co., now Rocky Mountain Power. Units 1, 2 and 3 were commissioned between 1951 and 1955 on a 2,500-acre site in Salt Lake City. It was fueled primarily by coal until 1987.

Other views:

https://collections.lib.utah.edu/ark:/87278/s6c83287

https://collections.lib.utah.edu/ark:/87278/s60p1r1b

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA


Photo: PRR Depressed Center Flatcar 470011 (1949)

Bob Chaparro
 

Photo: PRR Depressed Center Flatcar 470011 (1949)

A photo from the University of Utah Library:

https://collections.lib.utah.edu/ark:/87278/s6rn40vm

This photo can be enlarged quite a bit.

Description:

The 353-megawatt Gadsby Plant is named for George M. Gadsby, a former president of Utah Power & Light Co., now Rocky Mountain Power. Units 1, 2 and 3 were commissioned between 1951 and 1955 on a 2,500-acre site in Salt Lake City. It was fueled primarily by coal until 1987.

Other views:

https://collections.lib.utah.edu/ark:/87278/s6c83287

https://collections.lib.utah.edu/ark:/87278/s60p1r1b

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA


Photo: UP Gondola 63960 In Discharge Mode (1922)

Bob Chaparro
 

Photo: UP Gondola 63960 In Discharge Mode (1922)

A photo from the University of Utah Library:

https://collections.lib.utah.edu/ark:/87278/s65t5v5t

This photo can be enlarged quite a bit.

Good detail of a G-50-7 car.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA


Re: Dimensional Data - wrong assumptions

Tony Thompson
 

Well said, Dave. Sometimes the EXH of a house car is only 3 feet.
Tony Thompson 


On Sep 5, 2020, at 2:06 PM, Dennis Storzek <destorzek@...> wrote:

On Sat, Sep 5, 2020 at 01:11 PM, Robert kirkham wrote:
Is it the width at those heights?
Rob has it right, the H dimension that follows the EXW dimension tells you how high up the car the extreme width is. Sometimes it's really low, like at the door latch bars on a plug door reefer. At thirteen feet up, it's likely the upper door track.

Dennis Storzek


Re: Dimensional Data - wrong assumptions

Dave Parker
 

Dennis:

The car lettering diagrams in the CBCs are not always up to date. For example, the diagram accompanying the "1920 Revision" that appears in the 1922 CBC dos not show the journal repack stencil that was adopted in 1920.

The absence of the  EXW and EXH stencils in the 1931 CBC is another example.  But, these stencils were proposed (pp. 616-620) and approved (p. 1020) in the 1929 ARA Proceedings.  Effective date to be March 1, 1930. 

The CBCs were effectively trade catalogs, and should be considered a secondary source for MCB/ARA/AAR standards or rules.
--
Dave Parker
Swall Meadows, CA


Re: Dimensional Data - wrong assumptions

Dennis Storzek
 

I looked at the ARA lettering diagram presented in the 1931 CBC, but at that time the arrangement only included EW and EH, which are the width and height of the eaves, with a not explaining that if the latitudinal platform is as wide as the eaves, the height over the platform should be used. I then checked the 1946 CBC, which used the same drawing, with a note that it was last revised in 1936 with the EXW dimension being added, but no mention of the corresponding height. I 'm sure that the data arrangement:

EXW 00-00    H 00-00
EW   00-00    H 00-00

was in use before the war but am at loss to explain why the info in the CBC wasn't updated. We need to chech an AAR field manual from the period, bi, unfortunately, don't have one.

Dennis Storzek

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