Date   

Re: Loading Grain In A Refrigerator Car (1918)

mel perry
 

from the looks of it, it appears to be out
of service or abandoned?
mel perry

On Tue, Sep 8, 2020, 1:08 PM Josh <segorailroadmodels@...> wrote:

I saw this image and thought "huh, that looks familiar."

Then I realized that I literally drove past that elevator yesterday afternoon. You can see the location on google maps here: https://www.google.com/maps/@39.3670186,-112.5858464,3a,75y,144.54h,97.16t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sP4EH_FyLKvQSwaxC7QPrlA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

This spur is screaming with "model railroad" details. There is this little elevator, an oil dealership, and a large truck loading dock where fluorite from the Bell Hill mines northwest of Delta was transferred to gondolas to be shipped to the Geneva Steel plant in Vineyard Utah. Fluorite was used as a flux in the smelting process; it's bright purple, so imagine a train of open hoppers filled with neon lavender rocks. That's a load that will set your layout apart!

 

You can see a larger-resolution version of the image here: https://collections.lib.utah.edu/ark:/87278/s63208r9


Re: Loading Grain In A Refrigerator Car (1918)

Josh
 

I saw this image and thought "huh, that looks familiar."

Then I realized that I literally drove past that elevator yesterday afternoon. You can see the location on google maps here: https://www.google.com/maps/@39.3670186,-112.5858464,3a,75y,144.54h,97.16t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sP4EH_FyLKvQSwaxC7QPrlA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

This spur is screaming with "model railroad" details. There is this little elevator, an oil dealership, and a large truck loading dock where fluorite from the Bell Hill mines northwest of Delta was transferred to gondolas to be shipped to the Geneva Steel plant in Vineyard Utah. Fluorite was used as a flux in the smelting process; it's bright purple, so imagine a train of open hoppers filled with neon lavender rocks. That's a load that will set your layout apart!

 

You can see a larger-resolution version of the image here: https://collections.lib.utah.edu/ark:/87278/s63208r9


Re: Photo: Loading Salt Into A Boxcar (1921)

Josh
 

Photo was taken on the Inland Railway, which was owned by the Inland Crystal Salt Company. It was a tiny little line on the southern edge of the Great Salt Lake that interchanged with Union Pacific and the Salt Lake, Garfield & Western. Owned an 0-6-0 saddle tank switcher and a number of decrepit ancient wood boxcars and gondolas that were used only to transfer salt from the evaporation ponds to the packing plant.

Don Strack has a page for this operation here: https://utahrails.net/industries/inland-crystal-salt.php

 


Re: Photo: UP Gondola 63960 In Discharge Mode (1922)

Josh
 

Far more interesting is the car behind it - SLR19040.

This is the first and only time I have ever seen that reporting mark - the Los Angeles & Salt Lake Railroad used LASL as its normal identifier. SLR refers to the LA&SL's slogan, "The Salt Lake Route."

The car is a Pressed Steel Car Company 40-foot offset side drop bottom car, built in 1914 if I remember correctly. I have seen reference to this batch in surviving PSC records but no details were given except for the date and number of cars built. I am happy that this photo confirms that they were identical to the Utah Coal Route cars jointly owned by the LA&SL and the Utah Railway.

For the HO scale modelers, Bonsall Scale Car Shops offers kits for this car, both in its as-built version and later rebuilt versions.


Re: Photo: Loading Salt Into A Boxcar (1921)

Schuyler Larrabee
 

Dry.  You forgot dry.  Handling salt makes your skin very dry and the skin on your fingers can simply break open.

 

Schuyler

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Bob Chaparro via groups.io
Sent: Tuesday, September 08, 2020 12:38 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Loading Salt Into A Boxcar (1921)

 

Photo: Loading Salt Into A Boxcar (1921)

A photo from the Utah State Historical Society:

https://collections.lib.utah.edu/ark:/87278/s6zp4jhz

This photo can be enlarged quite a bit.

Looks like boring, tough work.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA


Wabash kit bash

Paul Doggett
 

Hi Guys

I have just finished a kit bash of a 17000 series Wabash automobile car, the original kit was a Funaro and Camerlengo car with wood side doors and Murphy ends. I used Rocket Express Youngstown side doors, 3,3,3, Dreadnaught ends and automobile car end doors I did this as I have not long since built the original Wabash version see below.


The kit as intended to be built


The kit bashed version



3,3,3 Dreadnaught ends with Miner brake lever



Automobile door end


Paul Doggett. England 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿


Re: SNX 1609

Schuyler Larrabee
 

I agree, and sometimes do jus that (as you know), but this car should and will have a metal running board.

 

Thanks for your thoughts, Bill

 

Schuyler

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Bill Welch
Sent: Friday, September 04, 2020 10:53 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] SNX 1609

 

Personally I think the Accurail Running Boards are too thick and suggest using scale styrene strip or wood strip to make a new running board for a better scale effect.

Bill Welch


Photo: Loading Salt Into A Boxcar (1921)

Bob Chaparro
 

Photo: Loading Salt Into A Boxcar (1921)

A photo from the Utah State Historical Society:

https://collections.lib.utah.edu/ark:/87278/s6zp4jhz

This photo can be enlarged quite a bit.

Looks like boring, tough work.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA


Re: Swift Tank Car

Barry Bennett
 

According to the 1955 tariff book the Swift tank car fleet is almost entirely made up of nominal 8000 gal cars, with the exceptions of #9100 which is the sole nom 10000 gals, #9500 to 9512 which are nom 4000gals and #9551 to 9560 which are nom 6000 gals. All are steam heated, as to be expected but #8015 to 8022, 8024 to 8031, 8035, 8036 and 8038 to 8046 are insulated as well.

The dome capacities tell a story of of a fleet of bits and pieces in that dome caps vary from 170 gals to 360 gals or so. There are a few small blocks of cars with the same dome cap, mainly 3's or 4's, that would hint they were built as a batch but the rest vary all over the place. Best of luck attaching a manufacturer or date of build to that lot.  

Barry Bennett

On Tue, 8 Sep 2020 at 15:55, Jon Miller <atsfus@...> wrote:
On 9/8/2020 7:45 AM, San Antonio & San Francisco wrote:
but the details on the cars are scant because they are absolutely filthy.

    Interesting tank holding design/s.  Ends look similar but no two seem alike.

-- 
Jon Miller
For me time stopped in 1941
Digitrax  Chief/Zephyr systems, JMRI User
SPROG User
NMRA Life member #2623
Member SFRH&MS


Re: Swift Tank Car

Jon Miller <atsfus@...>
 

On 9/8/2020 7:45 AM, San Antonio & San Francisco wrote:
but the details on the cars are scant because they are absolutely filthy.

    Interesting tank holding design/s.  Ends look similar but no two seem alike.

-- 
Jon Miller
For me time stopped in 1941
Digitrax  Chief/Zephyr systems, JMRI User
SPROG User
NMRA Life member #2623
Member SFRH&MS


Re: Swift Tank Car

San Antonio & San Francisco <sanantonio-sanfrancisco@...>
 

Dave,

Here is the only photograph of Swift Tank Cars that I have. It's a whole yard full of them outside a stock yard. The picture blows up nicely, but the details on the cars are scant because they are absolutely filthy. Odd for Swift, but I guess the "no one cares anymore" syndrome of the railroads was starting to take shape. Picture is Circa 1910-1915.

Levi


Re: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Photo: Gondola At Lumber Yard (Circa 1920s-1930s)

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Yes, I can also confirm this is Carnegie Steel Co. 534 at the Homestead Works outside Pittsburgh on the Monongahela River, in the steel loading yard with lots of rebar in the foreground.

 

Attached:  more info on these trend-setting cars, and another photo of this exact car.

 

Elden Gatwood

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Bob Chaparro via groups.io
Sent: Saturday, September 5, 2020 11:29 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] Photo: Gondola At Lumber Yard (Circa 1920s-1930s)

 

Photo: Gondola At Lumber Yard (Circa 1920s-1930s)

A photo from University of Utah Library:

Blockedhttps://collections.lib.utah.edu/ark:/87278/s6cv5566

This photo can be enlarged quite a bit.

I don't think this is a Colorado & Southern Railway gondola as the reporting marks are suspect.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA


Re: [Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] image from Homestead, PA in 1915

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Group;

 

Some classes of PRR gons had chains on the end sills to act as a safety feature in case the cars uncoupled.  The chains were as-built features of classes GR and GRA, and were removed in twenties/thirties rebuilds.

 

Elden Gatwood

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Eric Hansmann
Sent: Saturday, September 5, 2020 2:45 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] image from Homestead, PA in 1915

 

Mill gondolas had drop-door ends to haul loads that were longer than the car. These may extend onto another car with a bearing plate for the load to ride upon. The chains are a safety to keep the cars together in case of coupler failure.

 

I don’t know if the chain connections were a requirement for these loads. In reviewing the Loading of Materials section of the 1919 Car Builder Directory, I do not see the chain connections noted with loads spanning multiple cars.

 

 

Eric Hansmann

Murfreesboro, TN

 

 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Alex Huff
Sent: Saturday, September 5, 2020 11:53 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] image from Homestead, PA in 1915

 

The BR&P gon has what I think are "safety chains" on the end sill.  Three links are to the right of the coupler, two links and a hook are to the left.  Was this "system" ever an industry requirement?  If not, how widespread was it?  When was it discontinued or least no longer maintained.
   


Re: Swift Tank Car

Steve and Barb Hile
 

Not a photo, but there were still 495 cars listed in 1954.

 

 

Steve Hile

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of David North
Sent: Tuesday, September 8, 2020 7:22 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Swift Tank Car

 

The article in RMJ Feb 1993 issue mentions 499 Swift tank cars in 1948 with SWTX reporting marks.
Car numbers were from 5000 to 9999 and were both 8,000 & 10,000 gallon cars.
Does anyone have a photo of one of these tank cars that they can share with me, please?
cheers
Dave


Swift Tank Car

David North
 

The article in RMJ Feb 1993 issue mentions 499 Swift tank cars in 1948 with SWTX reporting marks.
Car numbers were from 5000 to 9999 and were both 8,000 & 10,000 gallon cars.
Does anyone have a photo of one of these tank cars that they can share with me, please?
cheers
Dave


Re: QUESTION ON SANTA FE Sk-L STOCK CAR

Steve SANDIFER
 

You are correct that the SK-L did not have an end ladder on the A end of the car as built. I do not have a photo or drawing of the B end (brake) that would tell me if there was a ladder on that end or not. The 1912 Car Builders Cyclopedia does not show an end ladder and shows the raised security bars around the brake wheel which would make climbing an end ladder impossible. I therefore speculate that there were no end ladders on either end as built.  

My drawing of “Location of Safety Appliances, SK-L, Stock Cars series 58002-59001, Engineer of Car Construction, Chicago, August 12, 1907” shows a ladder on the B end only and only one grab (technically called handhold) on the left end of each side of the car. This drawing was revised in 1912, 1923, 1924, and 1931, so it is hard to tell exactly what date is accurate for the drawing.

The SK-N cars, for which I have a drawing dated Nov. 16, 1916 (printed in the book) has a ladder on the B end only and has the later style grab on the lateral running board, not the “security bars.” My Builders Photo of the N confirms a ladder on the B end. Likewise the drawings of the 1924 SK-P. I have no photo of the as built A ends.

I am certain that the addition of the B end ladder was in response to the Third Safety Appliance Act passed by Congress in 1910 and mandated by the ICC in 1911. That act mandated that all vehicles be equipped with hand brakes, sill steps, and where appropriate running boards, ladders, and roof handholds. It designated the number, dimensions, location, and manner of application for safety appliances on cars and locomotives.  https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/CFR-2011-title49-vol4/pdf/CFR-2011-title49-vol4-part231.pdf

This act specified one ladder on each end of the car. “(e) Ladders—(1) Number. Four. " “(3) Location. (i) One on each side, not more than 8 inches from right end of car; one on each end, not more than 8 inches from left side of car; measured from inside edge of ladder stile or clearance of ladder treads to corner of car." However, ladder spacing on some cars already in use were exempt. With the 1911 act in place, I wonder why the drawings of the SK-N and SK-P only show a ladder on the B end.

The mandate to add the second handhold on the left end of the car did not come until 1932.  

 

J. Stephen Sandifer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of WILLIAM PARDIE
Sent: Sunday, September 6, 2020 3:59 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] QUESTION ON SANTA FE Sk-L STOCK CAR

 

When delivered these s  stock/coke cars (58000 series)  did not have end ladders.  As the cars lasted into the 1950's were end ladders ever added?

 

Thanks for any help.

 

Bill Pardie

 

 

 

Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone

 

 

 

Question On Santa Fe Sk-L Stock Car

 

 


Re: C&O 1013 Covered Hopper Upgrade

WILLIAM PARDIE
 

Phone?

Hi Lester:

How come I get your emails but for a week now when I call it goes straight to an answering machine?  I was worried and asked George if he had heard from you.

Bill

Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone


-------- Original message --------
From: Lester Breuer <rforailroad@...>
Date: 9/7/20 1:10 PM (GMT-10:00)
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] C&O 1013 Covered Hopper Upgrade

I have upgraded a Chesapeake & Ohio (C&O) 70 Ton, 2 bay, covered hopper, C&O 1013, Class LO.  The upgrade of C&O 1013 covered hopper includes changes and addition of parts including wire grabs and ladder rungs not in the kit.  If you are interested in the upgrade, photos and writeup of the upgrade process including painting and weathering are now available on my blog I have to share photos and writeup of modeling projects on my Minneapolis & Northland Railroad Company.   If you would like to take a look please do at the following link:

 

http://mnrailroadcab100.blogspot.com/

 

 

Lester Breuer


C&O 1013 Covered Hopper Upgrade

Lester Breuer
 

I have upgraded a Chesapeake & Ohio (C&O) 70 Ton, 2 bay, covered hopper, C&O 1013, Class LO.  The upgrade of C&O 1013 covered hopper includes changes and addition of parts including wire grabs and ladder rungs not in the kit.  If you are interested in the upgrade, photos and writeup of the upgrade process including painting and weathering are now available on my blog I have to share photos and writeup of modeling projects on my Minneapolis & Northland Railroad Company.   If you would like to take a look please do at the following link:

 

http://mnrailroadcab100.blogspot.com/

 

 

Lester Breuer


Re: Photo: PRR Depressed Center Flatcar 470011 (1949)

Brian Termunde
 

Bob,
Thanks for sharing this. I especially appreciate knowing some of the background as my uncle worked there for quite some time and it's been a part of Salt Lake for many years. My uncle and his family lived not too far south of the plant (walking distance, although I rather doubt that Uncle Vern would have walked! <G>).

I do want to stress that I am NOT trying to shoot the messenger as the information provided is what's on that very interesting website, however I don't think that it was taken at the actual Gadsby Plant. In the photo;

https://collections.lib.utah.edu/ark:/87278/s6c83287

There's a small hill on the viewers right, the area around the plant, for as long as I can remember. Here's a link to a Google map showing the area;

https://goo.gl/maps/gHHsSy5Phy3yJ7a29

That being said, I am sorry but I cannot offer any suggestion as the the actual location.

Bob, Thanks again for another interesting photo!

Take Care,
 
Brian R. Termunde
Midvale, Utah


Photo: PRR Depressed Center Flatcar 470011 (1949)
From: Bob Chaparro
Date: Sun, 06 Sep 2020 08:58:14 PDT
Photo: PRR Depressed Center Flatcar 470011 (1949)
A photo from the University of Utah Library:
This photo can be enlarged quite a bit.
Description:
The 353-megawatt Gadsby Plant is named for George M. Gadsby, a former president of Utah Power & Light Co., now Rocky Mountain Power. Units 1, 2 and 3 were commissioned between 1951 and 1955 on a 2,500-acre site in Salt Lake City. It was fueled primarily by coal until 1987.
Other views:
Bob Chaparro
Hemet, CA


Re: Salt weathering

Jim Betz
 


  ... having just spent almost 2 hours reading prior posts related to galvanized roofs
I will attempt to answer my own questions:

  1) Galvanized roofs were used for most metal roofs starting in the early part of
       the 20th century - and, for the most part, freight car roofs were metal (over
       a wood structure).

  2) Galvanized roofs were in use long before metal running boards.

  3) I did not find a lot of references to peeling paint on dark colors - but did note
      that more than one 'expert' commented how it was less likely to see
      peeling paint in the steam era than after.  The reasons given were varied
      but my reading of it is that it related as much to frequency of maintenance
      (re-painting) as anything else.  The presence of soot and quantities of same
      also had some part to play in this answer.

  All of these questions were aimed at answering "how often should I be using
salt weathering or other techniques to get the peeling paint effect?".  Since my
layout represents the period from just post WW-II to 1955 I have concluded
that I can answer that with "not often" and be OK with that answer for my
layout.

  None of the above is meant, in any way, to be a comment on how well (or
not) salt weathering represents peeling paint.
                                                                                  - Jim

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