Date   

Leider's B&OCT book

Tony Thompson
 

David J. Leider's new book on the B&OCT, mentioned here earlier this month, is a new acquisition of mine, and I've reviewed the book in my blog. If you're interested, a link to this post is below.

https://modelingthesp.blogspot.com/2020/10/david-leiders-new-book-on-b.html

Tony Thompson
tony@signaturepress.com


Re: Identity Of This Car? (Undated)

Don Burn
 

From the CERA Bulletin 112 on the TMER&LC this was part of M33-M43 which were Double Truck Express Container Trailers.

Don Burn

-----Original Message-----
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Bob Chaparro via groups.io
Sent: Friday, October 23, 2020 12:53 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Identity Of This Car? (Undated)

Identity Of This Car? (Undated)

A photo from the Detroit Public Library:

https://digitalcollections.detroitpubliclibrary.org/islandora/object/islandora%3A256620

Click and hold to enlarge photo.

Description:

View of the trailer of a Yellow Truck and Coach truck for the T.M.E.R. & L. Co. being loaded into a railroad freight car. Handwritten on back: "Yellow Truck & Coach."

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA


Re: Identity Of This Car? (Undated)

Todd Sullivan
 

Pretty much looks like the box is a container being slide off (or on) the trailer to/from the trolley boxcar.  Interesting! 

Todd Sullivan


Cotton Belt dbl door boxcar

Andy Carlson
 

Hi folks-

Years ago, after discovering one of these Cotton Belt USRA Clone DS double door rebuilds in the Henderson box car book, I made a scale drawing. The cars seem to have been in the 46000 series of  the SSW. I have an HO model I built of this car about 23 years ago which I would like to update. I never knew what power brake brand was used. I used a Ajax back then.

The rebuilds besides reusing the original ends (with mods) also reused the fishbelly USRA style of underframe. With a modified rectangular panel roof and noticeable side sill mods, I think this is a fine looking rebuilt car. The pair of pre-war Youngstown doors and riveted sides work well together for coolness.


Inline image

I read , perhaps in the caption, that these cars after rebuilding were used for Blue Bird bus company seats and also for general service.

I see from this picture grabbed from Ebay that at least two methods were used in splicing the ends for increased height. My model has the center section with 3 Murphy ribs, as shown on SSW 46029 to the left.

Anyhow, hearing from some gifted person on what brake equipment was used is appreciated in advance.
Thanks,
-Andy Carlson
Ojai CA




Re: Identity Of This Car? (Undated)

Jack Mullen
 

Spot on, except that nobody is calling the railcar a coach.
Yellow Truck and Coach is the builder of the truck. It was an offshoot if the Yellow Cab empire, and though only a minor truck maker, was a major player in the bus market, eventually becoming GM's Truck and Coach Division.

Jack Mullen


Re: Identity Of This Car? (Undated)

Claus Schlund \(HGM\)
 


Hi Bob and List Members,
 
I notice the container is numbered C-40. Does that mean there is a C-1 thru C-39 also?
 
You can see the image at full resolution, without having to walk and chew gum at the same time, by clicking on the link below
 
 
Claus Schlund
 
 

----- Original Message -----
Sent: Friday, October 23, 2020 1:22 PM
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Identity Of This Car? (Undated)

Bob Chaparro asked:
"Identity Of This Car? (Undated)

A photo from the Detroit Public Library:

Click and hold to enlarge photo.

Description:
View of the trailer of a Yellow Truck and Coach truck for the T.M.E.R. & L. Co. being loaded into a railroad freight car. Handwritten on back: 'Yellow Truck & Coach.'"

TMER&L Co. = The Milwaukee Electric Railway & Light Company.

The North Shore (CNS&M) and South Shore (CSS&SB) were early offerors of piggyback service in the 1930s, so TMER&L experiments with intermodal isn't surprising, but this photo does raise more questions on this particular experiment.


Ben Hom


Re: Identity Of This Car? (Undated)

Benjamin Hom
 

Bob Chaparro asked:
"Identity Of This Car? (Undated)

A photo from the Detroit Public Library:

Click and hold to enlarge photo.

Description:
View of the trailer of a Yellow Truck and Coach truck for the T.M.E.R. & L. Co. being loaded into a railroad freight car. Handwritten on back: 'Yellow Truck & Coach.'"

TMER&L Co. = The Milwaukee Electric Railway & Light Company.

The North Shore (CNS&M) and South Shore (CSS&SB) were early offerors of piggyback service in the 1930s, so TMER&L experiments with intermodal isn't surprising, but this photo does raise more questions on this particular experiment.


Ben Hom


Re: Identity Of This Car? (Undated)

Todd Sullivan
 

TMER&LCo is The Milwaukee Electric Railway & Light Company, a large electric street and interurban railway operation in and around Milwaukee, WI that also hauled freight. I think the  "coach" is actually a 'trolley freight car'.  If you look carefully, you can see a trolley wire above the tracks, and the "coach" has lots of clearance around the trucks to allow them to pivot on sharp curves.

Todd Sullivan


Re: Identity Of This Car? (Undated)

Schuyler Larrabee
 

For starters, google TMER&L, no periods required.

 

Schuyler

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Bob Chaparro via groups.io
Sent: Friday, October 23, 2020 12:53 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Identity Of This Car? (Undated)

 

Identity Of This Car? (Undated)

A photo from the Detroit Public Library:

https://digitalcollections.detroitpubliclibrary.org/islandora/object/islandora%3A256620

Click and hold to enlarge photo.

Description:

View of the trailer of a Yellow Truck and Coach truck for the T.M.E.R. & L. Co. being loaded into a railroad freight car. Handwritten on back: "Yellow Truck & Coach."

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA


Identity Of This Car? (Undated)

Bob Chaparro
 

Identity Of This Car? (Undated)

A photo from the Detroit Public Library:

https://digitalcollections.detroitpubliclibrary.org/islandora/object/islandora%3A256620

Click and hold to enlarge photo.

Description:

View of the trailer of a Yellow Truck and Coach truck for the T.M.E.R. & L. Co. being loaded into a railroad freight car. Handwritten on back: "Yellow Truck & Coach."

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA


ATSF in California

Paul Doggett
 

Hi

Does anyone know if the ATSF hauled sugar beets in California in the early 1950s if so whereabouts.

Many thanks
Paul Doggett. England 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿


Re: Photo: FGEX 35754 With Potato Load (1943)

Bill Parks
 

Bill - 

You are correct.
--
Bill Parks
Cumming, GA
Modelling the Seaboard Airline in Central Florida


Re: Library of Congress photo (was CB&Q boxcar colour - Delano images?)

Robert kirkham
 

Mangled that.  Meant Way of the Zephyrs.

Rob 

On Oct 22, 2020, at 6:19 PM, Robert kirkham <rdkirkham@...> wrote:


Two more CB&Q cars are evident in the back of this photo - both are near the centre (side to side), and (counting front to back, only tracks with cars on them) on tracks 7 and 9 (I think).  Both steel cars.  Both have "Way of the West” slogans facing the camera, and the white Burlington Route with the main car colour (no black) background.  I have the impression the further car has a galvanized roof and paint on the seem caps only.  Less obvious about the nearer car - could that be a black roof?

Rob

On Oct 22, 2020, at 3:09 PM, akerboomk <ken-akerboom@...> wrote:

I like the roof (and roofwalk) colors
And note the ratio of wood roofwalks (most) to steel (very few)
Ken

-- 
Ken Akerboom



Re: Library of Congress photo (was CB&Q boxcar colour - Delano images?)

Robert kirkham
 


Two more CB&Q cars are evident in the back of this photo - both are near the centre (side to side), and (counting front to back, only tracks with cars on them) on tracks 7 and 9 (I think).  Both steel cars.  Both have "Way of the West” slogans facing the camera, and the white Burlington Route with the main car colour (no black) background.  I have the impression the further car has a galvanized roof and paint on the seem caps only.  Less obvious about the nearer car - could that be a black roof?

Rob

On Oct 22, 2020, at 3:09 PM, akerboomk <ken-akerboom@...> wrote:

I like the roof (and roofwalk) colors

And note the ratio of wood roofwalks (most) to steel (very few)

Ken


--
Ken Akerboom


Re: Photo: FGEX 35754 With Potato Load (1943)

Bill Welch
 

It is my understanding that Hastings grown potatoes are particularly well suited for Potato Chips.

Bill Welch


Re: Photo: Wabash Gondola 2963 (Undated)

earlyrail
 

Checking the ORER's
All coal cars from 1893 on were in the 3xxxx series
the 32963 is not listed in the March 1899 ORER
Listed in the Jun 1900 ORER with an interior of 33ft.

Howard Garner


Re: Library of Congress photo (was CB&Q boxcar colour - Delano images?)

akerboomk
 

I like the roof (and roofwalk) colors

And note the ratio of wood roofwalks (most) to steel (very few)

Ken


--
Ken Akerboom


Re: CB&Q boxcar colour - Delano images?

Nelson Moyer
 

Understood, but I later said I used semi-gloss and satin, not gloss.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Tony Thompson
Sent: Thursday, October 22, 2020 4:15 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] CB&Q boxcar colour - Delano images?

 

Nelson Moyer wrote:

Then there is the topcoat issue. Prototype freight cars aren’t dead flat when newly painted, despite the fact that model railroad tradition demands a flat finish, typically Dullcote. Lately, it’s not uncommon to see various degrees of paint shine from fairly glossy to satin and flat, again depending upon the car age since last painting. 

   It's quite true that freshly painted prototype freight cars were glossy. But within a month on the road, that shine had become dull, as numerous photos of very recently built but not new cars will document. Accordingly, I would hesitate to suggest any gloss on a model freight car -- unless you model a paint shop.

      There is also the factor that reflections "don't scale." By that I mean that the light reflections look far too big on models. It's most noticeable on model automobiles, which really do not look right with shiny paint, even though the prototypes, when washed, do look that way. My own view is that shiny paint is very rarely looks "right" on an HO scale model. Of anything.

 

Tony Thompson

 

 

 


Re: CB&Q boxcar colour - Delano images?

Tony Thompson
 

Nelson Moyer wrote:

Then there is the topcoat issue. Prototype freight cars aren’t dead flat when newly painted, despite the fact that model railroad tradition demands a flat finish, typically Dullcote. Lately, it’s not uncommon to see various degrees of paint shine from fairly glossy to satin and flat, again depending upon the car age since last painting. 

   It's quite true that freshly painted prototype freight cars were glossy. But within a month on the road, that shine had become dull, as numerous photos of very recently built but not new cars will document. Accordingly, I would hesitate to suggest any gloss on a model freight car -- unless you model a paint shop.
      There is also the factor that reflections "don't scale." By that I mean that the light reflections look far too big on models. It's most noticeable on model automobiles, which really do not look right with shiny paint, even though the prototypes, when washed, do look that way. My own view is that shiny paint is very rarely looks "right" on an HO scale model. Of anything.

Tony Thompson




Re: CB&Q boxcar colour - Delano images?

Robert kirkham
 

Good thing no one is suggesting oversimplification.

Rob

On Oct 22, 2020, at 1:03 PM, Nelson Moyer <npmoyer@...> wrote:

Photos are good for weathering, chalk marks, etc. but not so good for color. There are two basic approaches to painting freight cars, paint for a new car paint job and weather according to age after painting and car usage, or paint to resemble faded oxidized paint and weather from there. Obviously the first approach requires more fading and weathering effort for an old paint heavily used look. I use the first approach, paint as new, and do the fading and weather later, or not for some cars.

 

As for freight car reds and browns, by far the most accurate paints are from Tru Color because they went to great effort to hire color consultants with access to prototype railroad color drift cards, and they matched their colors to the prototype as closely as possible. If you want the new paint look use Tru Color. If you want faded oxidized paint, it really doesn’t matter that color use as long as you’re in the right red or brown family.

 

Then there is the topcoat issue. Prototype freight cars aren’t dead flat when newly painted, despite the fact that model railroad tradition demands a flat finish, typically Dullcote. Lately, it’s not uncommon to see various degrees of paint shine from fairly glossy to satin and flat, again depending upon the car age since last painting. Tru Color dries glossy, which means you don’t have to spray a gloss coat before decaling – one less step than using a flat freight car color. I use semi-gloss, satin, and flat clear coats to provide another indication of age since painting.

 

Be aware that some acrylic clear coats cloud paint color, whereas lacquers typically don’t cloud the color. Future is an exception to the acrylic clouding issue.

 

Then there’s the issue of color temperature of layout lighting, which has been exhaustively discussed here, so look at the archives. Your freight car reds and browns will look quite different under warm lighting than under cool lighting. I use 5000 K lights with a high CRI index for true color rendition.

 

Color rendition of film has already been discussed. Time of day and sun angle were not mentioned, but they affect color, as does atmospheric haze, etc., etc.

 

So selecting paint colors by matching color photographs is a gross oversimplification, especially with color photographs from the 1940s and 1950s.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Robert kirkham
Sent: Thursday, October 22, 2020 2:06 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] CB&Q boxcar colour - Delano images?

 

Fair enough.  But I like to start with a photo and go from there.  One of my challenges is that 1950’s paint isn’t a great reference for my 1946 model era.  And my other challenge is that I wasn’t born yet, and have no memories from that time - so need to start somewhere. 

 

I found one image so far this morning: https://www.loc.gov/resource/fsac.1a34690/.   There, in the middle distance, behind the concrete block building, is a CB&Q single sheathed car.  I find the comparison with what is shown on other cars in this yard view helpful modelling information.  

 

Rob

On Oct 22, 2020, at 11:40 AM, Bill McClure <virginianbill@...> wrote:

 

Rob,

 

I know nothing about those cars, but do know a little about photography. So I pass along that the color palette of WWII era Kodachrome, which was the slide film stock used back then, had a very warm tone, towards the red end of the spectrum. The images are beautiful, but if looking for color "accuracy", just be aware.

 

Then there is the "color" that your monitor "sees". Whole 'nother issue.

 

Bill

 

 



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